Unoathed vs. Mistborn

[Frustration]

Well I've been saying for years that I thought that someone with living plate and blade could take a mistborn.

 

Now we actually have a group of people who have these living Shards without surges.

 

So let's say some Chthulu alien monster from the beyond grabs an era 1 mistborn, gives them a set of sixteen metals and some coins, and a trained unoathed and dumps them in an arena across from each other.

That same alien fills them with an overpowering lust for blood.

Fight.

Edited December 17, 2025 by Frustration

[First of the Tide He/him]

Well, then we need to know what the arena looks like. A mistborn has much more manueverability, but an unoathed has clear advantage at close quarters. Also, can unoathed summon their shard blade in any shape and/or while not in contact with it? if so, how far away can they summon it I can't remember.

[WordOfBrandon]

A mistborn could likely aways escape an Unoathed, but let's say they both need to fight, and can't run away.

In close combat, I can't see how the mistborn could do more than survive using Atium, then it would run out.  What weapon do they have to crack plate?

Really the question is could a mistborn's gun, normal steel pushing, or steel pushing with duralumin crack plate?  If multiple shots would then could they hit the same spot against a moving opponent consistently?

I think if an unoathed has a shard bow, then a mistborn has little chance of doing more than dodging.  Looking at all the allomantic metals most only have a chance to do anything with duralumin.

Edited December 17, 2025 by WordOfBrandon

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

I feel like The Unoathed punches the mistborn twice and the mistborn dies

so mostly the fight would be the mistborn's evasion

and the mistborn using long range attacks

With a proper anchor, mistborn could probably at least crack a plate, although no one knows how good Unoathed would be at dodging, and how well the mistborn would be able to evade long enough to take the shot (the unoathed just kinda jumps)

[First of the Tide He/him]

38 minutes ago, WordOfBrandon said:

A mistborn could likely aways escape an Unoathed, but let's say they both need to fight, and can't run away

sure, but that's why I asked about the size of the arena. If a mistborn can stay out of range, and send consistent projectiles, I don't see why they can't break shardplate.

38 minutes ago, WordOfBrandon said:

In close combat, I can't see how the mistborn could do more than survive using Atium, then it would run out.  What weapon do they have to crack plate?

Actually, atium isn't one of the 16, but I could totally see a mistborn surviving in close combat if they have decent skill with speed(and slow) bubbles. And any decent force can crack plate after enough hits.

38 minutes ago, WordOfBrandon said:

Really the question is could a mistborn's gun, normal steel pushing, or steel pushing with duralumin crack plate?  If multiple shots would then could they hit the same spot against a moving opponent consistently?

E1 mistborns don't have guns. Again, any sufficient force. And, you don't have to hit the same place, just the same piece, which seems relatively easy if you've got some space.

 

38 minutes ago, WordOfBrandon said:

I think if an unoathed has a shard bow, then a mistborn has little chance of doing more than dodging. 

Actual shardbows are not made from spren, as far as I'm aware, but this is part of why I want to know the stuff about unoathed shardblades. If the unoathed can consistently get a ranged attack, it's a lot more dreary for the mistborn. 

38 minutes ago, WordOfBrandon said:

Looking at all the allomantic metals most only have a chance to do anything with duralumin.

What? let's go by pair. Copper/Bronze - Useless, you're right

Iron/Steel - manueverability with the coins AND the rosharan has a good chance of having some metal on their person somewhere that can be pushed, and it's probably under the Shardplate, where it'll take a long time to get off. At the very least, a mistborn can put their opponent off balance a few times, in emergencies.

Aluminum/Duralumin - Not really individual so not relevant, you're right again. Yay.

Zinc/Brass - CONTROLS someone's EMOTION. doesn't Adolin say at one point that the most important thing on a battlefield is morale. What if they suddenly start feeling really sad, huh? or more reckless? or less confident? or resigned?

Nicrosil/Chromium I give you this WoB: (and we don't know how either of these interact with Shardplate. also this WoB is for dead Shardblades)

Spoiler

Questioner (paraphrased)

If a Leecher was holding a Shardbearer and burning [chromium], would the Shardbearer be able to summon their Blade?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

No.

Warsaw signing (March 18, 2017)

Gold/Electrum - lets you use a somewhat-futuresight to see which ones of you die, depending on your action

Cadmium/Bendalloy - lets you change how time works (slow down shardbearer, or speed up yourself)

Pewter/Tin you're super strong (maybe enough to break shard plate w/ your bear hands?) and can sense anything coming at you significantly better.

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

3 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Iron/Steel - manueverability with the coins AND the rosharan has a good chance of having some metal on their person somewhere that can be pushed, and it's probably under the Shardplate, where it'll take a long time to get off. At the very least, a mistborn can put their opponent off balance a few times, in emergencies.

I personally believe, (and i might be wrong) that shardblade acts somewhat like aluminum, in that it would conceal any metal directly on the person

4 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Zinc/Brass - CONTROLS someone's EMOTION. doesn't Adolin say at one point that the most important thing on a battlefield is morale. What if they suddenly start feeling really sad, huh? or more reckless? or less confident? or resigned?

See above, and

1 hour ago, Frustration said:

That same alien fills them with an overpowering lust for blood.

Key word: Overpowering

Still, fair point if I'm wrong.

5 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Nicrosil/Chromium I give you this WoB: (and we don't know how either of these interact with Shardplate. also this WoB is for dead Shardblades)

  Hide contents

Questioner (paraphrased)

If a Leecher was holding a Shardbearer and burning [chromium], would the Shardbearer be able to summon their Blade?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

No.

Warsaw signing (March 18, 2017)

That's fair, but the Unoathed would probably already have their blade out, and this is still unknown if it works with unoathed.

6 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Gold/Electrum - lets you use a somewhat-futuresight to see which ones of you die, depending on your action

Fair, pretty helpful.

6 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Cadmium/Bendalloy - lets you change how time works (slow down shardbearer, or speed up yourself)

You do have to be in the time bubble, and there are no reinforcements, so either both you and the shardbearer are in the time bubble, or you are setting up your shot (due to the nature of guns in time bubbles)

8 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Pewter/Tin you're super strong (maybe enough to break shard plate w/ your bear hands?) and can sense anything coming at you significantly better.

I love pewter and tin and all, but shardbearer strength and speed would definitely outmatch that of a pewterarm. Sensing things is fair, but I don't see how helpful it would be.

And I will say, that shardbearers can kinda just... jump. Very far. Very fast. Very high. Very quickly. And are very strong, with near-impenetrable armor that can only be cracked by a weapon that cuts through stone like butter.

Revising my original statement, the shardbearer just has to jump at the mistborn and kill it, but the mistborn would have to have great knowledge of its powers, use everything to it's full advantage, and repeatedly chip away at the unoathed. And all of that can only work if the mistborn is a big big big battle field.

[Trusk'our he/him]

1 hour ago, Frustration said:

Well I've been saying for years that I thought that someone with living plate and blade could take a mistborn.

 

Now we actually have a group of people who have these living Shards without surges.

 

So let's say some Chthulu alien monster from the beyond grabs an era 1 mistborn, gives them a set of sixteen metals and some coins, and a trained unoathed and dumps them in an arena across from each other.

That same alien fills them with an overpowering lust for blood.

Fight.

What does the arena look like? How much metal does the Mistborn have, and can they conceivably grab more (i.e. go out of bounds to snag a stash, can they use Ironpulling to steal metal trinkets from the audience)? 

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

27 minutes ago, Ookla the Dokja said:

I personally believe, (and i might be wrong) that shardblade acts somewhat like aluminum, in that it would conceal any metal directly on the person

See above, and

Key word: Overpowering

Still, fair point if I'm wrong.

That's fair, but the Unoathed would probably already have their blade out, and this is still unknown if it works with unoathed.

Fair, pretty helpful.

You do have to be in the time bubble, and there are no reinforcements, so either both you and the shardbearer are in the time bubble, or you are setting up your shot (due to the nature of guns in time bubbles)

I love pewter and tin and all, but shardbearer strength and speed would definitely outmatch that of a pewterarm. Sensing things is fair, but I don't see how helpful it would be.

And I will say, that shardbearers can kinda just... jump. Very far. Very fast. Very high. Very quickly. And are very strong, with near-impenetrable armor that can only be cracked by a weapon that cuts through stone like butter.

Revising my original statement, the shardbearer just has to jump at the mistborn and kill it, but the mistborn would have to have great knowledge of its powers, use everything to it's full advantage, and repeatedly chip away at the unoathed. And all of that can only work if the mistborn is a big big big battle field.

To wrap up my argument, shardbearer strong

There is a small chance the mistborn can keep the shardbearer from summoning their shardblade (but then crush skull because of how close the mistborn is). And the moment the mistborn lets go, the unoathed can summon the shardblade again.

Maybe the mistborn can dull or heighten the shardbearer's emotions (but the lust for blood is overpowering)

The mistborn would have to be constantly evading the shardbearer with steel and iron, using bendalloy to set up shots, use duralumin and plenty of good anchors to shoot repeatedly for just about the whole time until the magic almost-unbreakable armor breaks (a little bit) and then kill the shardbearer through the small slit they created. All while avoiding the shardbearer's constant giant leaps and devastating blows, where even the smallest scratch could kill the mistborn. All of this is only possible if the field is big and has easily available/makable metal anchors.

6 minutes ago, Trusk'our said:

What does the arena look like? How much metal does the Mistborn have, and can they conceivably grab more (i.e. go out of bounds to snag a stash, can they use Ironpulling to steal metal trinkets from the audience)? 

I second these, as they would drastically change the outcome from almost definetly impossible to definitely impossible or unlikely or even possible

The main variable besides the situation (I will ping @Treamayne to see if there is an answer):

1. To what extent can the shardplate block investiture? I will specifically cite these:

47 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

the rosharan has a good chance of having some metal on their person somewhere that can be pushed, and it's probably under the Shardplate, where it'll take a long time to get off. At the very least, a mistborn can put their opponent off balance a few times, in emergencies.

47 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Zinc/Brass - CONTROLS someone's EMOTION. doesn't Adolin say at one point that the most important thing on a battlefield is morale. What if they suddenly start feeling really sad, huh? or more reckless? or less confident? or resigned?

And I definetly second all of @Trusk'our's questions.

[First of the Tide He/him]

Yeah you're right about it blocking allomancy. Found a WoB. My bad.

-Speed bubble around just you

-Coin in front of you

-Steel push with duralumin

enough power to send MULTIPLE HORSES FLYING BY THEIR HORSESHOES

coins are smaller than horseshoes, and so go faster

no way this doesn't break plate

Pewter-duralumin punch the broken section (super fast, high reaction time, super strong. I'ma say like 20x all of the natural human (normal is 2x, and flaring is 3x, but it's based on how large the reserves are)this is as strong as someone in plate (I think a WoB says as strong as 20 men but I can't find it) and much faster)

Unoathed is down before 2 seconds have passed

Also second Trusk'our's questions

I'm just Devil's Advocate here. I'm kinda turning this into can the Allomancer win, with perfect knowledge. I think Unoathed wins without perfect knowledge almost certainly.

[Frustration]

Okay some interesting questions I was not expecting.

On bloodlusting thay was more to force our two individuals to fight rather than just sit there confused, not to nullify emotions.

 

Let's say the arena is the size of a football field. Let's say it's perfectly round, and is also magic enough to move so that the combatants stay relatively centralized to avoid them getting pinned against a wall. To keep it fair we'll say both sides have standard equipment we have seen within the books, and cannot resupply.

 

A few WoBs for reference

Spoiler

Trae Cooper (paraphrased)

Why are Invested objects like metalminds and Hemalurgic spikes able to be Pushed and Pulled on, but Shardblades and Shardplate, which are also invested, are not susceptible to Pushing and Pulling?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

There were a few concepts that he outlined in answering this question.

1.) The ability to Push/Pull an Invested object is predicated to the amount/power of the Investiture.

2.) Further, Invested objects also gain resistance to pulling/pushing based on proximity to soul possibly via the soul. An example given is that a Hemalurgic spike touches the blood of the person, and from there is now part of both the Spiritual Realm and the Physical Realm. This provides what Brandon termed a kind of "soul interference," based on its proximity to the soul.

This further explains why Vin required more than normal power to Push/Pull the metalminds from the Lord Ruler, because of their proximity to his soul, via the Spiritual Realm.

3.) The amount of Investiture is relatively low on Scadrial, whereas worlds like Sel and Roshar are pushing around "high power" according to Brandon. I interpreted this to mean that Hemalurgic spikes and metalminds have low amounts of Investiture compared to Shardplate and Shardblades.

Brandon said that theoretically you can Push/Pull Shardblades and Shardplates but you would need to wield an incredible amount of power. One example he gave that could so such as a thing is that if you were a Mistborn wielding the full power of the Well of Ascension, you could Push/Pull Shardblades/Plate.

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/152/#e2801

BasakaIsTheStrongest

Does Shardplate provide protection against emotional Allomancy?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. Don't dismiss your helmet when you're around an Allomancer.

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/498/#e15717

 

 

 

 

 

I'd personally back the unoathed here for one reason: margin for error.

 

An unoathed can basically fumble through the fight, taking large hits, swinging wildly and they are still a threat to be reconed with. A mistborn on the other hand MUST play everything perfectly.

Moash accidentally shattered Kaladin's ribs in WoR, that's a game ending blow right there.

[First of the Tide He/him]

But Pewter can heal passively too, as well as nullify some pain. Obviously not as well as stormlight, byt maybe good enough. Also, do we know where Unoatheds' plate's power comes from? Dead plate has gems, and Radiants are based on the Radiant's stormlight, but what about Unoathed? Is it depletable?

[Frustration]

4 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

But Pewter can heal passively too, as well as nullify some pain. Obviously not as well as stormlight, byt maybe good enough. Also, do we know where Unoatheds' plate's power comes from? Dead plate has gems, and Radiants are based on the Radiant's stormlight, but what about Unoathed? Is it depletable?

It comes directly from the spiritual realm. Probably wouldn't heal very fast, but it makes it usable.

And pewter is great and all, but it can't deliquify your head, or put your soul back in your body after a shardblade passes through your spine.

[Aliroz-The-Confused]

<petulantycomplaining>Well, this is entirely silly.  Not only do we have bloodlusting meaning that the non-physical attack of emotional allomancy probably doesn't work, that darn Word of Brandon means that Shardplate functions as aluminum but only in ways that exclusively advantage its wearer and disadvantage allomancers.  Do copperclouds get to block shardblades or dissolve shardplate or dispel lightweaving or anything cool like that?  No, of course not.  What a scam!<nolongerpetulantlycomplaining>

Only way I'm seeing the mistborn win in an intuitive and not-requiring-unusual-knowledge way is by exploiting speedbubbles + Atium + iron and steel to go fast, plant dynamite, and get out of explosion range while avoiding all attacks and debris.

[Immortal Platypus]

4 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

But Pewter can heal passively too, as well as nullify some pain. Obviously not as well as stormlight, byt maybe good enough. Also, do we know where Unoatheds' plate's power comes from? Dead plate has gems, and Radiants are based on the Radiant's stormlight, but what about Unoathed? Is it depletable?

it heals passively, but not at a fast enough rate to matter. The fight will be over (either one is dead or the Mistborn is out of metals) by the time pewter heals anything important. 

I think Unoathed plate is kind of a cross? It doesn't regenerate using the wearers stormlight (like true living plate) but it doesn't stop functioning without Stormlight (like dead plate). 

 

I do think a mistborn has a small chance. They would need to close the distance, and dodge the shardblade for long enough to Duralumin Pewter punch the chestplate and break it (if it doesn't break it, I think they're screwed, unless it puts it on the verge of breaking). Then the need to get the heck out of there, and try to push/pull a coin through the Unoathed's now-exposed chest. Unoathed don't have healing, so, that should work fine. Outside of that situation, I don't see a great win-con

[First of the Tide He/him]

1 minute ago, Aliroz-The-Confused said:

<petulantycomplaining>Well, this is entirely silly.  Not only do we have bloodlusting meaning that the non-physical attack of emotional allomancy probably doesn't work, that darn Word of Brandon means that Shardplate functions as aluminum but only in ways that exclusively advantage its wearer and disadvantage allomancers.  Do copperclouds get to block shardblades or dissolve shardplate or dispel lightweaving or anything cool like that?  No, of course not.  What a scam!<nolongerpetulantlycomplaining>

Only way I'm seeing the mistborn win in an intuitive and not-requiring-unusual-knowledge way is by exploiting speedbubbles + Atium + iron and steel to go fast, plant dynamite, and get out of explosion range while avoiding all attacks and debris.

Umm no Atium(only the 16 metals as indicated by the prompt) and no dynamite(not an every day kit, and E1 Scadrial has suppressed the development of gunpowder )

[Aliroz-The-Confused]

13 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Umm no Atium(only the 16 metals as indicated by the prompt) and no dynamite(not an every day kit, and E1 Scadrial has suppressed the development of gunpowder )

Ah, I get it now.  Frustration said "a set of sixteen metals" in the original post, without specifying WHICH set of sixteen metals, and I assumed the prompt was structured to allow us to pick which metals.  Mea culpa.

You're right about the dynamite, though.  Darn, I thought an intuitive and relatively straightforward win was possible for a second there.

Edited December 17, 2025 by Aliroz-The-Confused

[First of the Tide He/him]

11 minutes ago, Aliroz-The-Confused said:

Ah, I get it now.  Frustration said "a set of sixteen metals" in the original post, without specifying WHICH set of sixteen metals

Hmm. I didn't think about it that way. But if we can pick whichever metals we want, then I can practically choose any power I want because of that one thread. (Burning Adonalsiumium-Chromium, which lets me eat time, hence I win)

Oh Shoot. Mistborn is super screwed. Unoathed shardplate can rearrange (see end of WaT)

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

1 hour ago, First of the Tide said:

Yeah you're right about it blocking allomancy. Found a WoB. My bad.

-Speed bubble around just you

-Coin in front of you

-Steel push with duralumin

enough power to send MULTIPLE HORSES FLYING BY THEIR HORSESHOES

coins are smaller than horseshoes, and so go faster

no way this doesn't break plate

Pewter-duralumin punch the broken section (super fast, high reaction time, super strong. I'ma say like 20x all of the natural human (normal is 2x, and flaring is 3x, but it's based on how large the reserves are)this is as strong as someone in plate (I think a WoB says as strong as 20 men but I can't find it) and much faster)

Unoathed is down before 2 seconds have passed

Also second Trusk'our's questions

I'm just Devil's Advocate here. I'm kinda turning this into can the Allomancer win, with perfect knowledge. I think Unoathed wins without perfect knowledge almost certainly.

I feel like pewter is powerful, but is just a strength boost, and you can only use your duralumin once.

Let's say pewter can break a single section of plate in one blow with duralumin. Now what? Now you are out of duralumin and pewter, loosing you your only healing and strength boost, and your only allomancy boost. Steel push with methods previously stated, but then what? Unoathed still has all his speed and strength. Still has his shardblade, and without duralumin boosted steel they can prob block with their arm or smth. also,

32 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Unoathed shardplate can rearrange (see end of WaT)

thanks by the way, so kinda screwed yeah

and if you instead start with the steel-push, again, you dont have any duralumin left to pewter. and the unoathed still has the shardblade and gauntlets and the rest of his armor in any scenerio, so any close combat (except for maybe duralumin pewter) the mistborn is screwed. The unoathed can also just jump away if it sees trouble, and could most likely stall until the mistborn runs out.

So yeah, to quote the amazing @First of the Tide,

35 minutes ago, First of the Tide said:

Oh Shoot. Mistborn is super screwed.

 

[therunner he/him]

Few notes: 

• Shardplate and Blade resists Pushes/Pulls, even Duralumin ones (Well of Ascension is given as possible way to Pull/Push Blade/Plate https://wob.coppermind.net/events/152/#e2801)
• It also provides protection against emotional Allomancy (https://wob.coppermind.net/events/498/#e15717 )
• Shardplate also enhances strength, speed, dexterity/agility and reflexes

Wincon for Unoathed is to get in physical range (circa 1-2 meters), as single hit will take out Mistborn (either with Blade, or just punch with Plate).

Wincon for Mistborn is to break Plate and land a hit in that broken section.
 

Now, assuming regular 16 metals:

• Useless (8):
  • Aluminum, Nicrosil, Gold, Brass, Bronze, Tin, Cadmium, Chromium
    • I list Chromium as useless because it requires getting into physical range, at which point Mistborn is promptly killed by Unoathed
• Mostly useless (2)
  • Zinc, Brass
    • Useful only if helmet is broken, at which point attacking is likely the better optio

This leaves us with 6 metals that can be reasonably used: Steel/Iron, Pewter, Electrum, Bendalloy and Duralumin:

• Defense
  • Pewter should be on flare all the time to not let Unoathed have advantage in all physical attributes, it should be primarily used to assist with dodging
  • Electrum should be used to assist in avoiding attacks
  • Bendalloy should be used to keep distance and reposition
  • Steel/Iron for mobility
• Offense
  • Duralumin + Steel is the only option to try and break Plate
    • It would likely still require few hits in the same section (2-3), and Plate can reposition
    • Pewter requires getting in range of Unoathed and perfect timing they are unlikely to get

 

If Mistborn has enough vials, I think they might be able to win this? They have multiple tools to keep distance, and keep from getting hit, and Unoathed doesn't have way to close that distance. The best they have is jumping, but that leaves them open to getting nailed by Duralumin+Steel shot.

 

Assuming both fight optimally, I'd say it would be on average a wash, with slight edge to Mistborn, as each has nearly ideal defense against their opponent's offense, but Mistborn has slight edge in being able to attack meaningfully from distance.

But if Mistborn gets impatient or cocky, they would lose fast.
 

Edited December 17, 2025 by therunner

[Sophrosyne He/any]

Umm. just off the dome?

Attack
Range goes to your typical mistborn and while I’m sure you CAN fashion your plate and blade into a bow, I’m sure we all agree that’s not a normal use of the power of an unoathed.
Melee goes to unoathed. Shard plate makes striking power dangerous or deadly. I'd be open to making this a tie however cause I think I recall vin cracking a guy’s skull with dura-pewter.
X-Factor here goes to a Mistborn. Mind you shardplate should shield from emotional allomancy but if that’s overcome for any reason and that’s another tool, speed bubbles are terrifying if you’ve never seen them before and A-electrum is underrated.
Speed 
    I’m calling this a Mistborn. Flared pewter lets you move at above a sprit indefinitely, but plate does something pretty comparable. But steel and iron is where it’s at the most important factor to combat speed though, maneuverability and Mistborn have that in spades. 
    
Durability
    Unoathed. Handdown. MAYBE I'm missing some pewter feat but I think a shardbarer can walk through high storms and I’m not betting a mistborn can do that.

Endurance
    Assuming a normal amount of metals (albeit all 16) and stormlight. It’s the unoathed. We see shard bearers fight all day without huge concern for stormlight but it’s a common issue for a mistborn to need to top off on metals. 

I’m saying that we set battle IQ and Intelligence to equal cause of course.
This gives 3 to Mistborn and 3 to unoathed. So a tie? But in your specific scenario

8 hours ago, Frustration said:

grabs an era 1 mistborn, gives them a set of sixteen metals and some coins, and a trained unoathed and dumps them in an arena across from each other.

 I’ll take the unoathed. The mistborn doesn’t know how nearly HALF of there metals work. So it’s can a peak human with A-iron & A-Steel beat a shard bearer? THe answer is no. but. If they were an era 2 mistborn. Say Wax’s mistborn 3rd child? I’ll take the mistborn. They have more tricks and could prolly speed blitz an unprepared shard barer. That said

~Written inbetween tasks @ work so hopefully it was legible!

[Treamayne]

8 hours ago, Ookla the Dokja said:

The main variable besides the situation (I will ping @Treamayne to see if there is an answer):

Shards and Allomancy WoBs:

Notably:

Spoiler

Quote

BasakaIsTheStrongest

Does Shardplate provide protection against emotional Allomancy?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. Don't dismiss your helmet when you're around an Allomancer.

YouTube Spoiler Stream 4 (June 16, 2022)

Quote

Questioner

Would a Mistborn see the atium shadow of someone wearing Shardplate?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, they would be able to. Good question, but they would indeed be able to.

Skyward Atlanta signing (Nov. 17, 2018)

Quote

Questioner

Could you use steel or iron to Push or Pull off Shardblades or Shardplate?

Brandon Sanderson

Anything that's Invested resists, the more Invested it is the more it resists.

Questioner

Okay, so you could technically--

Brandon Sanderson

Yes.

Questioner

--if it was not charged?

Brandon Sanderson

Well-- Certain objects just have more Investiture and are more purely of the Investiture. A Shardblade's going to be really hard, but it's possible, it's just going to be really, really hard. Even more hard than an absolutely full Feruchemical metalmind because the Shardblade is being created directly out of the Investiture, it's basically all Investiture, it's not a metal that is Invested. It's going to be real hard.

Bands of Mourning release party (Jan. 25, 2016)

Quote

Questioner

If you were a Leecher, could you destroy a Shardblade?

Brandon Sanderson

I'm going to RAFO that for now, let's just say that it would be incredibly difficult if it were possible, and I'm not going to even say if it is. But that kind of power... 

Questioner

Let's just say they were burning duralumin as well.

Brandon Sanderson

Let's just say that the Investiture in a Shardblade is much greater than your average Allomancer, but... This type of thing is not unheard of in the Cosmere. The larkin, the Leechers, and Nightblood all have a similar sort of thing going on. Destroying a Shardblade would be really hard. And Investiture resists other forms of Investiture, so.

Calamity Austin signing (Feb. 25, 2016)

Quote

Podman36

How effective would a Leecher be at draining Breath?

Brandon Sanderson

They could be fairly effective.

Questioner

How significant would the difference be between Breath and Stormlight?

Brandon Sanderson

That, I'll RAFO for now, because we're actually getting the actual numbers. We have certain people working on a project for that.

Skyward release party (Nov. 6, 2018)

 

 

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

6 hours ago, therunner said:

Few notes: 

• Shardplate and Blade resists Pushes/Pulls, even Duralumin ones (Well of Ascension is given as possible way to Pull/Push Blade/Plate https://wob.coppermind.net/events/152/#e2801)
• It also provides protection against emotional Allomancy (https://wob.coppermind.net/events/498/#e15717 )
• Shardplate also enhances strength, speed, dexterity/agility and reflexes

Wincon for Unoathed is to get in physical range (circa 1-2 meters), as single hit will take out Mistborn (either with Blade, or just punch with Plate).

Wincon for Mistborn is to break Plate and land a hit in that broken section.
 

Now, assuming regular 16 metals:

• Useless (8):
  • Aluminum, Nicrosil, Gold, Brass, Bronze, Tin, Cadmium, Chromium
    • I list Chromium as useless because it requires getting into physical range, at which point Mistborn is promptly killed by Unoathed
• Mostly useless (2)
  • Zinc, Brass
    • Useful only if helmet is broken, at which point attacking is likely the better optio

This leaves us with 6 metals that can be reasonably used: Steel/Iron, Pewter, Electrum, Bendalloy and Duralumin:

• Defense
  • Pewter should be on flare all the time to not let Unoathed have advantage in all physical attributes, it should be primarily used to assist with dodging
  • Electrum should be used to assist in avoiding attacks
  • Bendalloy should be used to keep distance and reposition
  • Steel/Iron for mobility
• Offense
  • Duralumin + Steel is the only option to try and break Plate
    • It would likely still require few hits in the same section (2-3), and Plate can reposition
    • Pewter requires getting in range of Unoathed and perfect timing they are unlikely to get

 

If Mistborn has enough vials, I think they might be able to win this? They have multiple tools to keep distance, and keep from getting hit, and Unoathed doesn't have way to close that distance. The best they have is jumping, but that leaves them open to getting nailed by Duralumin+Steel shot.

 

Assuming both fight optimally, I'd say it would be on average a wash, with slight edge to Mistborn, as each has nearly ideal defense against their opponent's offense, but Mistborn has slight edge in being able to attack meaningfully from distance.

But if Mistborn gets impatient or cocky, they would lose fast.
 

How does jumping leave them open? Their jumps move suprisingly fast, and I dont see how you could position a shot in time. Also, the main post says A set of 16. this means likely only 1 duralumin assisted shot. Can you walk me through more of your thought process to get to Mistborn having an edge? I dont quite see how you got to that.

4 hours ago, Sophrosyne said:

Umm. just off the dome?

Attack
Range goes to your typical mistborn and while I’m sure you CAN fashion your plate and blade into a bow, I’m sure we all agree that’s not a normal use of the power of an unoathed.
Melee goes to unoathed. Shard plate makes striking power dangerous or deadly. I'd be open to making this a tie however cause I think I recall vin cracking a guy’s skull with dura-pewter.
X-Factor here goes to a Mistborn. Mind you shardplate should shield from emotional allomancy but if that’s overcome for any reason and that’s another tool, speed bubbles are terrifying if you’ve never seen them before and A-electrum is underrated.
Speed 
    I’m calling this a Mistborn. Flared pewter lets you move at above a sprit indefinitely, but plate does something pretty comparable. But steel and iron is where it’s at the most important factor to combat speed though, maneuverability and Mistborn have that in spades. 
    
Durability
    Unoathed. Handdown. MAYBE I'm missing some pewter feat but I think a shardbarer can walk through high storms and I’m not betting a mistborn can do that.

Endurance
    Assuming a normal amount of metals (albeit all 16) and stormlight. It’s the unoathed. We see shard bearers fight all day without huge concern for stormlight but it’s a common issue for a mistborn to need to top off on metals. 

I’m saying that we set battle IQ and Intelligence to equal cause of course.
This gives 3 to Mistborn and 3 to unoathed. So a tie? But in your specific scenario

 I’ll take the unoathed. The mistborn doesn’t know how nearly HALF of there metals work. So it’s can a peak human with A-iron & A-Steel beat a shard bearer? THe answer is no. but. If they were an era 2 mistborn. Say Wax’s mistborn 3rd child? I’ll take the mistborn. They have more tricks and could prolly speed blitz an unprepared shard barer. That said

~Written inbetween tasks @ work so hopefully it was legible!

The Unoathed can jump, which at least puts them on par with mistborn in speed.

How would they speed blitz? Remember, you cant interact with the outside of the bendalloy bubble, and you have to be in it. This leaves using any sort of speed just for thinking and preparing. All they really have is Pewter (which makes them slightly stronger), Electrum (which gives them a minimal amount of future sight), Steel/Iron (which can't break plate on their own, and are good for mauvering), and Duralumin (which is a one time use metal that instantly runs out and makes actually useful only one meta).

Most of that is in the mistborn, so generally, the shardbearer sees a slightly stronger human that can kinda fly but not really.

1 hour ago, Treamayne said:

Shards and Allomancy WoBs:

Notably:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

Thank you!

[therunner he/him]

33 minutes ago, Ookla the Dokja said:

How does jumping leave them open? Their jumps move suprisingly fast, and I dont see how you could position a shot in time.

Once in air, they cannot dodge in any way shape or form. 

So if Mistborn is staying high (which they should), this can give Mistborn an open shot at Unoathed. They would have to react quite fast though.

Quote

Also, the main post says A set of 16. this means likely only 1 duralumin assisted shot.

Can you walk me through more of your thought process to get to Mistborn having an edge? I dont quite see how you got to that.

I interpreted that that they have a set of vials of the base 16 metals, with some redundancies. Or of sufficient sizes that they can e.g. drink only part of vial, and do duralumin shots.

I also based the assumption of it being mostly even, with slight edge towards Mistborn on Mistborn having enough vials. If they do, then they have advantage by virtue of the fact that they are far more likely to land shots on Unoathed, than vice versa.

Strictly speaking, I don't think Unoathed can realistically land a shot at Mistborn that uses their tools to full ability, if they have sufficient metal reserves.
 

[First of the Tide He/him]

30 minutes ago, therunner said:

Once in air, they cannot dodge in any way shape or form. 

So if Mistborn is staying high (which they should), this can give Mistborn an open shot at Unoathed. They would have to react quite fast though.

I interpreted that that they have a set of vials of the base 16 metals, with some redundancies. Or of sufficient sizes that they can e.g. drink only part of vial, and do duralumin shots.

I also based the assumption of it being mostly even, with slight edge towards Mistborn on Mistborn having enough vials. If they do, then they have advantage by virtue of the fact that they are far more likely to land shots on Unoathed, than vice versa.

Strictly speaking, I don't think Unoathed can realistically land a shot at Mistborn that uses their tools to full ability, if they have sufficient metal reserves.
 

Okay, but how long can an everyday's carry be burned before it runs out? and with occasional duralumin in an emergency, I think steel runs out fast, and Iron is not nearly as useful on it's own Can a mistborn do enough damage to plate before it runs out? (keep in mind that at least half of the plate probably has to break, since Unoathed can rearrange)

Also, Unoathed can just pull a Kal+Shallan and put a chestplate on the mistborn, which, if it blocks iron/steel pull/pushes like we're kind of assuming, will drop them from the sky, and there's no way for them to get away. 

[CoderDrag0n8 He/They]

4 hours ago, therunner said:

Once in air, they cannot dodge in any way shape or form. 

So if Mistborn is staying high (which they should), this can give Mistborn an open shot at Unoathed. They would have to react quite fast though.

I interpreted that that they have a set of vials of the base 16 metals, with some redundancies. Or of sufficient sizes that they can e.g. drink only part of vial, and do duralumin shots.

I also based the assumption of it being mostly even, with slight edge towards Mistborn on Mistborn having enough vials. If they do, then they have advantage by virtue of the fact that they are far more likely to land shots on Unoathed, than vice versa.

Strictly speaking, I don't think Unoathed can realistically land a shot at Mistborn that uses their tools to full ability, if they have sufficient metal reserves.
 

If they are jumping, they are most likely going for distance, which means they are in movement the entire time, which makes aiming signifigantly harder. And they can still run quite fast, and only need to land one blow to incapacitate a Mistborn to the point where the Unoathed could kill them or just kill them.

I think that the Mistborn has the incredible power to evade, but the Unoathed is incredibly powerful. Just as First of the Tide said,

3 hours ago, First of the Tide said:

Okay, but how long can an everyday's carry be burned before it runs out? and with occasional duralumin in an emergency, I think steel runs out fast, and Iron is not nearly as useful on it's own Can a mistborn do enough damage to plate before it runs out? (keep in mind that at least half of the plate probably has to break, since Unoathed can rearrange)

Also, Unoathed can just pull a Kal+Shallan and put a chestplate on the mistborn, which, if it blocks iron/steel pull/pushes like we're kind of assuming, will drop them from the sky, and there's no way for them to get away. 

The Unoathed can rearange, so assuming that it is one duralumin-steel shot to completely break a piece (which is incredibly unlikely, most likely 2-4), then our Mistborn would need constant replenishing of duralumin and steel, depending on what you mean by 'sufficient' metal reserves. Throughout this whole battle, the shardbearer is chasing the mistborn down, and has a good likely hood of getting at least slightly close.

I do think that the mistborn can evade, but the shardbearer can also survive. For much longer than the Mistborn can burn.

Also, perfect knowledge is a stretch.

15 hours ago, Frustration said:

To keep it fair we'll say both sides have standard equipment we have seen within the books, and cannot resupply.

Also, I found this. I would assume this means that the mistborn has, say 3, extra vials full of allomantic reserves, and not much more. That doesn't give much time for the mistborn to hurt the shardbearer.

I back the Unoathed here.