Unresolved questions for the second half

[+robardin he/him]

1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

They should be able to run caravans more efficiently than Nalthians. They don't need to carry victuals, don't sleep and can use cognitive beasts of burden.

Ah, you mean Nalthian caravaneers. I was thinking of the fact that Nalthis was already kind of a nexus for interplanetary trade via Shadesmar, even having a "customs office" of sorts at their Perpendicularity, and how a flood of Rosharan spren suddenly able to travel the cosmere might affect that.

Exactly because spren don't need to eat or sleep, though, invites the question as to why they would engage in trade like that. I think for the most part they'll stay in or close to the spren cities (like Lasting Integrity) that they've had long established in the area around Roshar, as long as they feel safe (i.e., New Oathpact guards them from being "Retributioned").

If that's the main concern, after all, I doubt fleeing to another planet would help. I'm thinking Retribution would have enough Connection to all the spren of Roshar to absorb them through the Spiritual Realm regardless of their physical (or cognitive) locations.

So mainly, I would expect spren to be traveling the cosmere more out of curiosity than anything else: for the novelty of it, or because (like "12124") they have been rejected or cast out in some way by their own kind. Notum might have fit this description, were he not now "stuck" with Adolin and Co. in Azimir.

[RedBlue]

8 hours ago, robardin said:

Until such time as they Return again... which would be triggered how?

I assume any of the New Heralds can trigger a Return at will. It would be similar to ‘breaking’ under the old system, except on their own terms and without the torture.

As for when they would choose to do this, it would likely be when the situation changes such that the spren are no longer in immediate danger of being absorbed by Retribution. Since their minds are in the Spiritual Realm, it’s likely possible for Ishar or one of the others to get updates on what’s happening on Roshar.

[TheOneKEA]

Just now, RedBlue said:

I assume any of the New Heralds can trigger a Return at will. It would be similar to ‘breaking’ under the old system, except on their own terms and without the torture.

As for when they would choose to do this, it would likely be when the situation changes such that the spren are no longer in immediate danger of being absorbed by Retribution. Since their minds are in the Spiritual Realm, it’s likely possible for Ishar or one of the others to get updates on what’s happening on Roshar.

I think that's exactly how it will work!

[+robardin he/him]

14 minutes ago, RedBlue said:

I assume any of the New Heralds can trigger a Return at will. It would be similar to ‘breaking’ under the old system, except on their own terms and without the torture.

As for when they would choose to do this, it would likely be when the situation changes such that the spren are no longer in immediate danger of being absorbed by Retribution. Since their minds are in the Spiritual Realm, it’s likely possible for Ishar or one of the others to get updates on what’s happening on Roshar.

But Kaladin said the reason Szeth should not become a Herald was that the purpose of the Heralds was to fight (and to kill), and Szeth deserved to be able to stop doing that.

What will they fight and kill if they come back when there is LESS or no threat to what their New Oathpact is protecting?

And listeners/singers needed to take in a spren to their gemheart in a highstorm to change into other forms. Now what? Stand out in the everstorm at midnight (when their spheres infuse with warlight via petition to Retribution)?

[RedBlue]

Just now, robardin said:

What will they fight and kill if they come back when there is LESS or no threat to what their New Oathpact is protecting?

Presumably, the long term plan is to find some way to neutralise Retribution permanently, which will involve fighting (and protecting the rest of Roshar from) Retribution’s armies. 
 

6 minutes ago, robardin said:

And listeners/singers needed to take in a spren to their gemheart in a highstorm to change into other forms. Now what? Stand out in the everstorm at midnight (when their spheres infuse with warlight via petition to Retribution)?

Sounds like as good a guess as any. If they’re all just stuck in their forms until further notice, Singer society won’t function well, which would be detrimental to Retribution’s goals.

[coolsnow7]

Some more questions (apologies if these have been raised further down in the thread):

“We killed you” - still don’t know what this means, even after getting Honor’s death from his own perspective.

El’s Powers & Backstory - why is he so important, why did we hear so much about this guy? What kind of Fused is he anyway? How does he have a Shardblade? And why did he turn from being the Singer most opposed to Odium, to being the most fervent supporter of his philosophy?

Singer religion and ideology - the Singers and Fused were committed to this ideology focusing on Passion and such. How does that change now that Odium is gone and Retribution is the new sheriff in town? Seems nontrivial to reorganize Singer society around a new religion

A bunch of unresolved Deathrattles - self-explanatory. I mean we got the good ones, but there are others left over. Speaking of which, in what way is Retribution “the Broken One”? I believe this is still to be revealed. 

Some unresolved Unmade questions - we still have never encountered Chemoarish. We got a tantalizing hint about Dai-Gonarthis but nothing more. What’s the deal with Sja-Anat - what does her enlightenment entail, why are early Radiants so afraid of her spren?

What do the Ghostbloods want, and why is Hoid so opposed, anyway? - still no answer here at all. We just know Iyatil thought that with BAM they could somehow manipulate Shards, but that Kelsier didn’t see things that way.

Gavilar - this is less a question than a complaint: we got all this Gavilar backstory and basically no payoff. Seems unlikely that Brandon is just going to drop him now. But I have no idea how or why he’d make a new appearance.

Why are Surges so dangerous - still nothing in this book suggests how unbound surgebinders could destroy a planet. Indeed we hear that with the Honorblades alone that’s a possibility. Not a clue why.

How did Odium take over Shinovar? 

Who betrayed the Oathpact? - in RoW, we see evidence that one Herald (and not Jezrien) has betrayed the Oathpact, kind of the opposite of Taln upholding it. Who specifically? Oh and, uh, we saw Battah sign up to Odium’s team, and yet she also showed up for the new Oathpact. Having a traitor/double agent on Team Herald seems to be setting us up for, uh, problems in the back half.

The Dog Who Became a Dragon - did Ishar write this story too? 

11 hours ago, robardin said:

Until such time as they Return again... which would be triggered how?

I think the implication is they can Return on their own terms now. 

Edited December 10, 2024 by coolsnow7

[Nef]

• There's still a lot of mystery around how Taln lost his honorblade and his return from Braize in general. 
• I don't think we got much explanation on why Ishar couldn't foresee Kaladin.
• I feel like a bit more of explanation of what Ishar was doing with Shinovar is forthcoming, for example what/why is the "spren stream" that Ishar caused.  

Edited December 10, 2024 by Nef

[Qianweilian He/him]

On 12/9/2024 at 10:28 AM, robardin said:

I guess that happened too quickly even for her to tap gold to recover, which is something we somehow never saw in Mistborn, LOL.

I read it as she was overconfident. In Alloy of Law, we see Miles heal from shots to the head. Is it possible tapping steel made her injury occur faster? If she tapped zinc, I think she would likely have time to heal.

[+robardin he/him]

7 minutes ago, Qianweilian said:

I read it as she was overconfident. In Alloy of Law, we see Miles heal from shots to the head. Is it possible tapping steel made her injury occur faster? If she tapped zinc, I think she would likely have time to heal.

As a gold Compounder, Miles was just constantly tapping gold, non-stop. So he'd heal as soon as the beginning of the head injury/blow occurred that would otherwise knock him unconscious.

TLR probably had something similar going on. So much constant tapping of a goldmind that they were actually savant in it, whatever that results in.

A "regular" Feruchemist, even a full one, could only tap whatever they stored in it, and thus would be accustomed to tapping at need, like Sazed and Wayne. Which requires being conscious. Which means, a really quick path to unconsciousness (and especially a surprising one, as in self-inflicted) could get by.

Yes, with southern Scadrian "Excisor" technology that the GBs surely had access to, they could create unkeyed goldminds filled externally, like Kelesina's Really Invested Bracelet that Wayne ended up using for a while. But even that didn't save Kelesina in time before it was taken off of her momentarily "killed" body, and then shot in the head again, because "prepackaged and really filled-up goldmind" is still not an "essentially infinitely available goldmind" that allows for constant tapping.

Edited December 10, 2024 by robardin

[+robardin he/him]

11 hours ago, Nef said:

• There's still a lot of mystery around how Taln lost his honorblade and his return from Braize in general. 
• I don't think we got much explanation on why Ishar couldn't foresee Kaladin.
• I feel like a bit more of explanation of what Ishar was doing with Shinovar is forthcoming, for example what/why is the "spren stream" that Ishar caused.  

Taln’s return from Braize was the natural outcome of Chana (Shallan’s mother) returning there as well, and SHE was the one that broke to return the both of them. Since that happened several years after Shallan’s mother was killed, I guess that means Chana held out and/or avoided capture on Braize for that long.

But yeah, how could his Honorblade be “switched out” if he was still bonded to it? That’s still a question I’d have for Brandon: who and how could convince Crazy Taln at the gates of Kholinar to unbond his Blade?

I guess while he was catatonic he might never have summoned it, like that never happened? But then, when he came around at the very end to rampage through some Fused — OK, through a LOT of Fused — at Azimir, that’s when you’d think he might have summoned it, if he could have done. (And used his Stoneward Surges!) Unless he wasn’t actually “recovered” to sanity, but just triggered enough to go from Mantra Mode into Beast Mode.

As for Ishar not “foreseeing” Kaladin: I think that means with respect to his plans for Szeth and using him to replace Jezrien in a new Oathpact, except Crazy Ishar imagined it as a semi-Odium kind of pact where the New Heralds would lead his version of Fused — spren made physical, or else people like he made the Honorbearers into, eternally recycled expert fighters — to fight against not just Team Odium, but to expand the fight into the wider cosmere (as Nale descried Ishar’s plans, “Trying to build an army of physical spren and Fused, preparing for far-distant conflicts”).

All the moving pieces for that, involved the Shin shamans, Szeth’s family, or more broadly, a general “use of a Truthless with an Honorblade to kill people” in the East that was going to harden Szeth into the ultimate warrior. He didn’t expect Kaladin to come with Szeth as a “therapist”.

And even if Ishar had been using some Spiritual Realm based foresight at times, that would have been hard to foresee because it was something the Wind insisted that Kaladin agree to do. Mostly likely, most versions of Kaladin would have insisted on staying at Urithiru for the upcoming Contest of Champions, and then to fight with the Windrunners at one of the points of conflict, either the Shattered Plains or Azimir.

I don’t think we need more “explanation” about the stream of spren than we got. It’s best left to our own imaginations to fill in the exact mechanisms. The overall point was that, the Wind (and all other spren) sensed their impending doom (erasure from Roshar), and that avoiding that doom hung upon events centered at that location in Shinovar, where the Connection between Aharietiam required the forsworn Heralds to be in order to reclaim their Honorblades and Connection to Honor to be able to do the New Oathpact.

[teknopathetic he/him]

Questions I haven’t seen

1. What was up with the Greatshells that rescued The Mink? Who sent them? Did the the greatshells do it themselves? Are the greatshells a stable nation that the Sentient Honour will want to protect for 1000 years? 

2. Did Cultivation take the Nightwatcher with her? We know spren can leave because the oaths were dropped. Cultivation had tried very hard to protect her daughter from being influenced by people, and we know cultivation would prefer making a new world of her very own to create. 

3. Lift can create cultivation light. Is that going to be important? Was it part of a long term plan? 

4. is one of the heralds still working for Taravangian? Did she generally want to help reforge the oathpact or is she faking it? 
 

5. Are enlightened spren going to be able to tap into the new shard better? Will the old spren begin to convert? 

 

 

Edited December 10, 2024 by teknopathetic

[+Oltux72 he/him]

20 hours ago, robardin said:

Exactly because spren don't need to eat or sleep, though, invites the question as to why they would engage in trade like that.

Because they do not want to spend their lives naked outdoors. Much of their stuff is manifested. It will go away over time. They need a new source of Investiture.

Secondly because living under the Fused is not an idea that all of them will accept.

5 hours ago, Qianweilian said:

I read it as she was overconfident. In Alloy of Law, we see Miles heal from shots to the head. Is it possible tapping steel made her injury occur faster? If she tapped zinc, I think she would likely have time to heal.

She is a Feruchemist, not a compounder presumably. She can't afford to spend her healing power continously.

5 hours ago, robardin said:

Yes, with southern Scadrian "Excisor" technology that the GBs surely had access to, they could create unkeyed goldminds filled externally, like Kelesina's Really Invested Bracelet that Wayne ended up using for a while.

Is she a Ghostblood? She worked for them, but is she a member or a mercenary? If she worked for them, then why were the Ghostbloods helping Odium?

43 minutes ago, teknopathetic said:

5. Are enlightened spren going to be able to tap into the new shard better? Will the old spren begin to convert?

That assumes that Sja-Anat will stay on Roshar. Why would she? I'd be as far away as possible from Roshar. Retribution will return. Sja-Anat does not want to meet him.

[BinarySecond]

On 12/8/2024 at 4:44 PM, Kardenal_13 said:

Who had a claim on Dalinar's Cognitive Shadow? I feel like I missed something cause I couldn't think of anyone.

I wonder if it was one of the pieces of Honor that split off. The power seemed intrigued and curious about Dalinar.

[teknopathetic he/him]

38 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

That assumes that Sja-Anat will stay on Roshar. Why would she? I'd be as far away as possible from Roshar. Retribution will return. Sja-Anat does not want to meet him.

I think the holdout of spren didn’t apply to voidspren. The fear was Taravangian would unmake everything and create terrible new Unmade. So think many of the voidspren and many of the unmade would still be around. If the Soren are at least a part of odium, then there is a chance they don’t get unmade. 
 

Sja Anat is a tricky one. Odium didn’t re-unmake her for some reason despite the suspected treason, and Taravangian seemed keen to keep her around too because he found her enlightening useful.
 

There’s many reasons why Taravangian might want to keep Sja Anat around in the future as well. The honour side of the new power could even potentially see harming unmade as breaking some form of oath, making Taravangian less willing to betray his former allies. 

Edited December 10, 2024 by teknopathetic

[+Oltux72 he/him]

1 hour ago, teknopathetic said:

I think the holdout of spren didn’t apply to voidspren. The fear was Taravangian would unmake everything and create terrible new Unmade. So think many of the voidspren and many of the unmade would still be around. If the Soren are at least a part of odium, then there is a chance they don’t get unmade.

A chance? You think that Sja-Anat and other Voidspren will bet their lives on a chance?

[Etedbert he/him]

18 hours ago, Nef said:

• There's still a lot of mystery around how Taln lost his honorblade and his return from Braize in general.

Taln losing his honorblade is supposed to be answered in the Cosmete RPG “Stonewalkers” Stormlight adventure module. We now know the end point of the blade, but the adventure will theoretically cover him losing it, and it’s journey to Shinovar

[teknopathetic he/him]

1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

A chance? You think that Sja-Anat and other Voidspren will bet their lives on a chance?

Sja Anat lives her whole life on chances. She’s taken many. 

[+Oltux72 he/him]

4 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

Sja Anat lives her whole life on chances. She’s taken many. 

For what gain? What is left for her on Roshar?

[teknopathetic he/him]

26 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

For what gain? What is left for her on Roshar?

Her tiny babies that are conveniently half Odium and half Honour. 

[Isilel]

8 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

Is she a Ghostblood? She worked for them, but is she a member or a mercenary? If she worked for them, then why were the Ghostbloods helping Odium?

 

Axindweth had Mraize's green Aviar with her and the red Aviar whom he had captured together with Lift back in RoW. She must be a trusted associate.

And in the prologue we learned that Kelsier was helping Gavilar cause a Desolation. Transporting voidspren to Roshar fits this goal. Chana's death was wholly unplanned, after all.

As to her Gold Feruchemy, I dunno. It would be pretty random if she was indeed a full Feruchemist and I'd expect much better combat performance from one who was a Ghostblood.

Though if she is from Mistborn era 1, she could have helped make the Bands, I guess. OTOH in such a case she would also be able to use hemalurgy for compounding, which would make her poor showing against Lift even more inexplicable. And she would have been much better employed making more copies of the Bands than running around on Roshar.

However, I am glad that Steel Feruchemy is shown to be dangerous if one isn't perfectly focused and coordinated. It would have been too OP otherwise.

Speaking of Chana - where are Shallan's brothers? Wit had spirited them out of the Tower for their safety from the Ghostbloods, but it was very weird that Shallan didn't wonder about their whereabouts even once, when watching memories where they appeared in SR. Also, they could be used against both herself and Chana upon her Return, if they are stuck on Retribution's territory. But if they had been in Azimir, I think that at least Balat would have fought... Unless they weren't in the capital... Hm.

Edited December 11, 2024 by Isilel

[Fallen_Ash]

• Why does everyone except for Shin have epicanthic folds? 
• What do the sleepless want?
• What does Hoid want?
• What is the moon that crashed to Roshar? Why does Odium’s perpendicularity appear underneath it?
• Who were the people hiding that Honor and Odium destroyed? 
• Why are Natans blue?
• What are Aimians and why is Axies important?
• What’s happening to Baxil and why does it matter? 
• Who was Gereh working for? 
• How did the horse and flute get back to Kaladin? 
• Who gave Kaladin the rock?
• How did Battar make Stormlight Hemalurgic spikes? Could they be used to nail a CS to the physical realm?
• What’s the deal with Nohadon?
• What’s the deal with the Iriali?
• What will happen to the Nightwatcher? 
• Why did Taln want to kill Cultivation? 
• Was Axindweth on Roshar pre-Catacendre?
• Will Jasnah have Elsecaller squires? 
• Will Lift lose access to Lifelight since Cultivation is gone? 
• How stupid does Fen feel right now? 

There are obviously lots of other unresolved things but these are my top questions. 

Edited December 11, 2024 by Fallen_Ash

[Fallen_Ash]

On 12/9/2024 at 10:28 PM, coolsnow7 said:

El’s Powers & Backstory - why is he so important, why did we hear so much about this guy? What kind of Fused is he anyway? How does he have a Shardblade? And why did he turn from being the Singer most opposed to Odium, to being the most fervent supporter of his philosophy?

My theory is that he's Elodi, the singer Jezrien was shown to be friendly with in the visions. 

[BinarySecond]

Just now, Fallen_Ash said:

My theory is that he's Elodi, the singer Jezrien was shown to be friendly with in the visions. 

Agreed.

[RedBlue]

14 minutes ago, Fallen_Ash said:

Why does everyone except for Shin have epicanthic folds? 

What do the sleepless want?

What does Hoid want?

Epicanthic folds are genetic. People have them because they have them.

Hoid wanted to make sure Odium stayed contained on Roshar. Now that the situation has changed, I expect he will want to pursue some way of removing Retribution from play entirely.

I’m not 100% sure about the Sleepless, and there may be different factions with different goals, but I think at least some of them want to protect the Dawnshard (Rysn’s) so that it can’t be abused. 

19 minutes ago, Fallen_Ash said:

What’s happening to Baxil and why does it matter? 

This is a guess, but from what I remember of his previous appearance, he probably went to the Nightwatcher and got a boon/curse situation.

 

20 minutes ago, Fallen_Ash said:

How stupid does Fen feel right now? 

I’m not sure Fen does feel stupid. There are valid reasons for her to want to be in Retribution’s empire right now, even though we disagree with her. Taravangian had a point about Thaylenah relying on trading via sea routes, and him controlling the coast.

[+robardin he/him]

2 minutes ago, RedBlue said:

I’m not sure Fen does feel stupid. There are valid reasons for her to want to be in Retribution’s empire right now, even though we disagree with her. Taravangian had a point about Thaylenah relying on trading via sea routes, and him controlling the coast.

But did she bet on living under a constant, never-ending if low key Everstorm and never seeing the sun? Can they still trade with Azir or make literal "day trips" there?

What will "trade" mean between all the Rosharan kingdoms under Retribution's control now, anyway? Aren't they all going to be dominated/run by singers, at the high level?

Fused are still around, right?

What will the currency be now? Still spheres with gems in them, but no longer glowing with Stormlight... Can humans also do the "midnight prayer to Retribution" thing to get infused spheres (of Warlight)?