To spike or not to spike... That is the question.

[Tamriel Wolfsbaine]

Okay.... I was hanging around another thread and the question popped into my mind whether spiking attributes would steal away the magically boosted attributes if stolen from a being in the cosmere currently boosting said attributes.  

Please assume the answer is yes for this question: 

Would you rather use Lerasium to become a mistborn... or as a spike to spike a mistborn.  

Would your answer change if that mistborn were filled up with pewter / tin and some identity blanked metalminds that you could nicroburst them as you are staking them to steal all of that compounded mental speed / strength / senses?  

Would you require any specific things be stored before the spike is worth it?  I figure you have to give up so many perks from burning metals but if you had some tin minds with steel sight / atium sight / bronze along with some zinc metalminds you are forcing the mistborn to burn all at once... in combination with strength and other base senses you could totally make a monster NPC with a single Lerasium spike and the mistborns stomach size is truly the only limit here.  

[IlstrawberrySeed]

I personally would rather get a lerasium spike with all the known magical senses than become a mistborn without access to the other magical sences, in the current point of the timeline. Axi sight from Steel/Iron, bronzesence, lifesence detecting invested objects, Aviar visions, SoD CS senses (fire, blood, R@N), connection vision, Enlightened horneater, shadesmar vision, and presumably more if you could get nightblood, spren, or seons to fill/be spiked.

[Trusk'our he/him]

Even though Hemalurgy is pretty cool, I'd probably go with burning the Lerasium.

Even if you got a bunch of enhanced attributes, it seems that attributes bestowed by Hemalurgy turn humans into Hemalurgic constructs, such as Koloss, Chimera and the like. I don't really want to be a mutant, flesh-warped creature, even if I have permanent super-attributes.

Plus, I don't know if you can Hemalurgically steal the Invested enhancements provided by Allomancy and Feruchemy, with the exception of spiritual Feruchemy since it may actually change your Spiritweb temporarily.

IF you could get a Lerasium spike to enhance your abilities without major changes to your physical aspect, and IF you could supercharge the attributes in a way that could be transferred to the Hemalurgic spike reliably, I would go with the Hemalurgic aspect of Lerasium because heightened memory, intelligence, strength, physical speed (which is I believe is actually included in iron Hemalurgy), senses, and innate Investiture (I think that it's an attribute?) all would be too good to ignore.

[IlstrawberrySeed]

The thing is, the only limit with Lerasium hemalurgy is the amount of investiture that can fit in an already invested material. Allmost all stolen attributes can be stored inside of metals for a massive compression right when you spike them.

[kenod]

Pretty sure a Lerasium spike steals passive abilities, stuff like strength, senses, mental ability, as well as probably the more magical passive stuff, like what the shapeshifters in Stormlight can do.

So burning is very likely much better, since using it as a spike can give you a boost to a specific ability, while burning it makes you into a Mistborn.

(To be honest, it shouldn't be much of a surprise that Lerasium is more useful for burning than Hemalurgy, it'd be weird if Preservation's own metal was a gamebreaker in the magic system directly opposed to his)

[IlstrawberrySeed]

@kenod, It isn't any ability, it is all abilities. And "passives" are specifically powers. Some powers augment abilities, but fuerochemistry (for the most part) stores abilities. So if you spike with lerasium, you get enhanced speed, strength, senses and mental acuity, among other factors. The big downsides of a lerasium spike are not being able to burn it (and getting other spikes) and diminished efficiency (compared to other spikes). Since there are no other spikes, and the main guy mentions boosts to abilities (which are already presumed true by association with stealing steel sight) means that the efficiency is no longer a problem. Also, it isn't a huge game changer, since it is better to burn it and use other spikes. But other spikes aren't available. Also, it requires huge workarounds involving allomancy, fuerochemistry, and other magic systems to be worth more than burning.

Edited January 24, 2023 by IlstrawberrySeed

[alder24]

35 minutes ago, IlstrawberrySeed said:

@kenod, It isn't any ability, it is all abilities. And "passives" are specifically powers. Some powers augment abilities, but fuerochemistry (for the most part) stores abilities. So if you spike with lerasium, you get enhanced speed, strength, senses and mental acuity, among other factors. The big downsides of a lerasium spike are not being able to burn it (and getting other spikes) and diminished efficiency (compared to other spikes). Since there are no other spikes, and the main guy mentions boosts to abilities (which are already presumed true by association with stealing steel sight) means that the efficiency is no longer a problem. Also, it isn't a huge game changer, since it is better to burn it and use other spikes. But other spikes aren't available. Also, it requires huge workarounds involving allomancy, fuerochemistry, and other magic systems to be worth more than burning.

No. The same way Atium steals any power, but one spike can steal only one power, and you can't have all Mistborn powers in one spike, Lerasium steals all abilities, but one spike steals only one ability, and you can't have more in one spike. So one Lerasium spike can steal only enhanced strength or speed or sense etc, not all of them.  

[IlstrawberrySeed]

1 minute ago, alder24 said:

Lerasium steals all abilities, but one spike steals only one ability

Where do you get that?

The hemalurgy table clearly uses all vs any, and the definitions of all can include any, but when used in a technical application as such, (usually) is clear about not meaning any, especially in the presence of an any.

[alder24]

1 minute ago, IlstrawberrySeed said:

Where do you get that?

The hemalurgy table clearly uses all vs any, and the definitions of all can include any, but when used in a technical application as such, (usually) is clear about not meaning any, especially in the presence of an any.

Ok, if this is the case, then I'm wrong.