[OB] Oathbringer chapters 22-24

[Toaster Retribution]

6 minutes ago, dendrophobe said:

He's already a badass if he can get through the perpendicularity on First of the Sun! Khriss said that none of the expeditions from Silverlight had returned... Which I assume is why the Ones Above eventually came via space instead of the CR.

Hm. He got the power to dress like a gentleman then.

[dendrophobe]

1 minute ago, What's a Seawolf? said:

I'm going to get a little tinfoil hatty, but it involves Sixth of the Dusk spoilers.

  Hide contents

Mraize's bird itself it NOT from Patji.  It's from Roshar.  Mraize went and got the plant/flower that grants the birds the ability, and fed it to his Roshar bird.  Thus, the bird's ability is more Roshar specific.  And from a story perspective, would be something that gives Mraize a nice advantage against Radiants, specifically the one he is directly working with and doesn't like him much.

I'll go out on a limb and say his bird somehow interferes with the bonds between people and spren.

 

Spoiler

It's a worm, not a plant/flower. It's a parasitic and/or symbiotic relationship. 

But yeah, that could be a good way of flying under the radar. Although chickens are weird enough to most of Roshar, I don't know that most people would really notice if the bird was one that wasn't from Roshar.

But yeah, that could be a good way of flying under the radar. Although chickens are weird enough to most of Roshar, I don't know that most people would really notice if the bird was one that wasn't from Roshar.

[Erunion]

The Spren that kal talks to is definitely a voidspren. It felt the everstorm coming in time to hide the parshfolk (keeping them from becoming true voidbringers eh? I see more of their Odious plan). 

Calling it now: I bet it’s a Spitespren. It seems more spiteful than raging. 

Mraize continues his ‘recruit Shallan’ plan. 

Dalinar is threatening to return to the Blackthorn. Bonding is not the cause, Stormlight as the cause is still possible - strengthened by the limited recovered memories and the lack of further recovery. Points go to ‘memory switch’ and ‘painrial’ as both of those seem more likely culprits now - sadly   

Mr. T cleverly shows up stupid and emotional. 

 

Veeerrrrryyyy interesting chapters. 

[Nymeros]

Whoah, a wild Dustbringer has appeared!!!

Aaaaannnndddddd, it's some random 50 year old woman......okay.

 

Evil!Syl interests me greatly. 

 

Truly it never  occured to me that Syl would have standard Alethi features......

 

Shallans chapter bored my. Mraize and his parrot do not interest me. I would have been happy with this being a pure Adolin chapter.

 

Adolin is a great liar.

48 minutes ago, Blacksmithki said:

I mean in terms of the small details, like weeks ago there was a discussion about something that had not come up in the book, and the next chapter answered it (renarin and his powers), or the discussion about spanreeds needing stormlight. This week the main theories about Dalinar's memory had to do with his bond in some way, there wasn't much in the way of discussion about any other causes (only the occasional comment) and this week we learn otherwise. Almost every theory getting a ton of information the very next week.

Yeeeppppp.

2 hours ago, PunSpren said:

The fact that the voidspren was at eye level due to a upthrust spear of stone under her is telling of how her type of spren interact with the world!

Im curious, what did it tell you?

Edited October 17, 2017 by Nymeros

[StormingTexan]

10 minutes ago, What's a Seawolf? said:

I'm going to get a little tinfoil hatty, but it involves Sixth of the Dusk spoilers.

  Reveal hidden contents

Mraize's bird itself it NOT from Patji.  It's from Roshar.  Mraize went and got the plant/flower that grants the birds the ability, and fed it to his Roshar bird.  Thus, the bird's ability is more Roshar specific.  And from a story perspective, would be something that gives Mraize a nice advantage against Radiants, specifically the one he is directly working with and doesn't like him much.

I'll go out on a limb and say his bird somehow interferes with the bonds between people and spren.

 

I thought this too..

Spoiler

Because it would be easier to just grab some worms but I believe only the birds on the islands developed the abilities not sure if a Roshar "chicken" would be able to. 

 

[Sliverofnone]

1 hour ago, Pagerunner said:

I will go on record against the Ishar = Tezim theory. Ishar has said the Oathpact is broken. Why would he claim to be its bearer? The Heralds are in hiding, so I think this person isn't a Herald at all. But if it were, who would be the Herald of Heralds? Who is the King of Heralds? It's not Ishar - it's Jezrien. I can kinda see a case for Jezrien being Tezim. But not Ishar.

This was my immediate thought when I read it. We know that all the heralds have gone mad. Maybe this is what has happened to Jezrien. He has latched on to his 'king of the heralds' title and is maniacal in this interpretation. Would make sense.

[What's a Seawolf?]

Just now, StormingTexan said:

I thought this too..

  Reveal hidden contents

Because it would be easier to just grab some worms but I believe only the birds on the islands developed the abilities not sure if a Roshar "chicken" would be able to. 

 

If I remember correctly, 

Spoiler

One of Sixth of the Dusk's birds is not from Patji, but from the 'mainland' or wherever it was.  It was why (I think) no one else had ever heard of a bird with that ability.  Sixth fed it some fruit to get the worms, and voila, new ability is born.

Whether a bird from a different planet would develop entirely different abilities based on its homeworld is another story, but from a justification standpoint as to why Mraize's bird will have whatever (if any) ability it has, I think it's feasible.

 

[Harbour]

Just a single chapter and Syl-Kal-Voidspren ship has left the harbor.

[Agent34]

Just now, Harbour said:

Just a single chapter and Syl-Kal-Voidspren ship has left the harbor.

Quote

“No mating,” Pattern buzzed softly on the wall.

 

[flying_shadow]

Hmm, I like the theory that the bird is an Aviar that can sense Investiture. Mraize is, after all, a worldhopper and a collector of useful things from other planets. It would be extremely unexpected and very effective, but I'm not quite sure how Mraize would use that to his advantage. Although just knowing if someone is using Investiture would be quite useful, especially if it means he can spot worldhoppers(and maybe even hordelings? I'm seriously reaching here, but does he have the ability to know if a cremling is actually part of an Aimian? Otherwise, how did he know to kill that cremling in WOR?)

[StormingTexan]

Just now, What's a Seawolf? said:

If I remember correctly, 

  Hide contents

One of Sixth of the Dusk's birds is not from Patji, but from the 'mainland' or wherever it was.  It was why (I think) no one else had ever heard of a bird with that ability.  Sixth fed it some fruit to get the worms, and voila, new ability is born.

Whether a bird from a different planet would develop entirely different abilities based on its homeworld is another story, but from a justification standpoint as to why Mraize's bird will have whatever (if any) ability it has, I think it's feasible.

 

I hate these spoiler tags lol but..

Spoiler

No it was from a different islands but still in the Pantheon not from the mainland so not all birds on the planet could gain the abilities only from the islands not just Patji in particular.

 

[Erandeni]

23 minutes ago, DSC01 said:

So, what power do you guys think Mraize's Aviar gives him?

The power to look like a pirate.

Quote

Bridgeboy isn’t going to be happy about this.

I love it, I am going to use it every time something goes wrong.

Quote

“Hateful people,” Taravangian said. “Murdering so many worthy monarchs!”

I can't help but imagine a dumb Taravangian rolling his eyes like:

"Yes, the Shins, not me, I am a good guy"

[BlackYeti]

1 minute ago, StormingTexan said:

I hate these spoiler tags lol but..

  Hide contents

No it was from a different islands but still in the Pantheon not from the mainland so not all birds on the planet could gain the abilities only from the islands not just Patji in particular.

No, @What's a Seawolf? is correct.

Spoiler

Sak is not from the Pantheon.

 

[frozndevl]

One item I noticed when reading through, but forgot until reading comments on the Tor.com thread were the apparently missing pillars / circles in the room. What could those be, they were too conspicuously called out to be just shapes. My first thought went to a temporary Cognitive realm bridge to allow Elsecallers and whomever else gets to transport the ability to move in / out into Urithiru. This does seem to be a special place with all of the symbols of the Orders.

Quote

Teshav had finished pointing out the strange glass panes on the inner walls that seemed like windows, only clouded. She moved on to the pairs of discs on the floor and ceiling that looked something like the top and bottom of a pillar that had been removed—a feature of a number of rooms they’d explored.

 

[Sihde]

The chicken is an Aviar. Without a doubt 

Edited October 17, 2017 by Sihde

[StormingTexan]

1 minute ago, Kalinovsky said:

Hmm, I like the theory that the bird is an Aviar that can sense Investiture. Mraize is, after all, a worldhopper and a collector of useful things from other planets. It would be extremely unexpected and very effective, but I'm not quite sure how Mraize would use that to his advantage. Although just knowing if someone is using Investiture would be quite useful, especially if it means he can spot worldhoppers(and maybe even hordelings? I'm seriously reaching here, but does he have the ability to know if a cremling is actually part of an Aimian? Otherwise, how did he know to kill that cremling in WOR?)

I think it would be useful for him to know who proto-radients are. I also think we all assumed a Voidbringer would be blatantly obvious to spot but now after we have seen Kaladin's chapters i am wondering if it will be more like what we are seeing with Radiants which would make it useful as well. 

[WhiteLeeopard]

Its curious how our expectations are been tumbled so fast. Most of the fandom here expected Adolin to be the one drowning and in desperate need of help. Turns out he is the one most capable so far and Dalinar the one that is in sore need of help (nations issues left right and center, and of course his new bff).

On further thought I think that the Diagramists arriving to Urithiru is not such a bad thing. With the Ghostbloods and the Sons of Honor running around, I expect those groups to trip each other up at least as much, if not more, than the trouble they will make for our protagonists. After all, what is the one thing power hungry societies with a long term secret goal fear more than a paragon of honor to face them? Competition. The fear of having another group steal what they want will likely be bigger than Dalinar having it. I'm sure there is much we don't know between the GB and Amaram, but I also suspect part of their issues are simple competitiveness. They are both groups scrambling for power in chaos, as such they are more likely to view their competitors in the same market with more dread than at the Radiants trying to bring in humanity together. Add in the Diagram, and hello super chaos. This would likely serve Odium nicely. 

[StormingTexan]

6 minutes ago, BlackYeti said:

No, @What's a Seawolf? is correct.

  Hide contents

Sak is not from the Pantheon.

 

But..

Spoiler

The Pantheon is the group of Islands that Patji is a part of not the mainland. Only birds from the islands can gain the powers. 

Quote

Aviar birds raised outside the Pantheon do not develop these unique powers.

 

 

Edited October 17, 2017 by StormingTexan

[Agent34]

Just now, StormingTexan said:

But..

  Reveal hidden contents

The Pantheon is the group of Islands that Patji is a part of not the mainland. Only birds from the islands can gain the powers. 

 

Spoiler

Only they fly to Patji and gain powers. That doesn't mean they're the only ones capable of gaining powers.

 

[dendrophobe]

3 minutes ago, StormingTexan said:

But..

  Hide contents

The Pantheon is the group of Islands that Patji is a part of not the mainland. Only birds from the islands can gain the powers. 

 

Spoiler

No. Only birds with the worms can gain the powers.

 

Edited October 17, 2017 by dendrophobe

[Pagerunner]

3 minutes ago, StormingTexan said:

But..

  Hide contents

The Pantheon is the group of Islands that Patji is a part of not the mainland. Only birds from the islands can gain the powers. 

 

Spoiler

That was the whole thing in the story. Birds from the Pantheon can fly to Patji and eat the worms. But Sixth brought a bird from the mainland, and it got powers. It's not the birds, it's the worms.

EDIT: Man, there sure are a lot of ninjas around!

[Sliverofnone]

I think these are definitely the most interesting chapters so far. I think that the Kaladin story line will finally go some where soon, and I can't wait for a syl-voidspren encounter. Also, confirmed that Ialai is not a ghostblood. I thought this might be the case because it seemed her interests were singularly focused on consolidating power for Sadeas. And another confirmation that the stormfather is not responsible for Dalinar's memory coming back.

The best though was the first on screen appearance of Mr T. he is definitely playing the fool, everyone assumes him to e a simpleton, and this gives him and advantage. He can say things to elicit different reactions and he will be dismissed easily. The fact that he asked Dalinar if he would seek the path of the warlord, I think, is hint that he at least is not on a dumb day. When I read this I immediately thought of the passage in the diagram that says if he seeks the path of the warlord, he could be an ally, but if he seems likely to sue for peace to remove him (don't have my copy handy, so I'm paraphrasing from memory). Of all the silly questions Mr T could have asked on a dumb day, would he have asked something that refers directly to the diagram?

I think he is probing to see where the diagram would apply, given the coming of the everstorm, Dalinar becoming a radiant, and Urithiru being discovered. This will have to lead to some tension between the two monarchs befoer they can come to any agreement, if they are able to reach one. 

Edited October 17, 2017 by Sliverofnone

[BlackYeti]

5 minutes ago, StormingTexan said:

But..

  Reveal hidden contents

The Pantheon is the group of Islands that Patji is a part of not the mainland. Only birds from the islands can gain the powers. 

 

Spoiler

The Pantheon is the name of the archipelago, i.e. it refers to the islands.

This is actually a major plot point in Sixth of the Dusk: Vathi can't figure out initially why Dusk is carrying around a bird from the mainland since they aren't aviar. It's how she eventually figures out that the abilities aren't actually tied to the birds themselves, but the the worms the birds eat. 

Edit: more ninjas than you realise @Pagerunner 

Edited October 17, 2017 by BlackYeti

[vividox]

Well, that Ialai/Mraize encounter went a lot smoother than expected. Ialai really did love Sadeas, IMO. Mraize is full of teasers. Highstorms are coming back.

Ooh, Voidspren conversation. Fun.

YAY DALINAR FINALLY! Uh oh, Taravangian. Dustbringer.

 

And like every week, it's over too soon. 

[PunSpren]

10 minutes ago, Nymeros said:

Whoah, a wild Dustbringer has appeared!!!

Aaaaannnndddddd, it's some random 50 year old woman......okay.

 

Evil!Syl interests me greatly. 

 

Truly it never  occured to me that Syl would have standard Alethi features......

 

Shallans chapter bored my. Mraize and his parrot do not interest me. I would have been happy with this being a pure Adolin chapter.

 

Adolin is a great liar.

Yeeeppppp.

Im curious, what did it tell you?

Why Syl appears as human to Kaladin, she floats/walk unsupported, sits in a chair stationary in a moving reference frame to kaladin. As leaves she flies around, or a streak she flies.

Pattern travels as raised ridges while 2d, but floats as a fractal ball in 3d.

Wyndle moves only via his growing vines, not sure we have a floating example yet for him.

The Voidspren while appearing as human at eye level had to be supported by, (sprenrock?)

Quote

"The tiny woman stood on a translucent pillar of golden stone that had risen from the ground"

This tells me that the voidsprens' internal logic/rules/etc requires that she be  supported by underneath, Not 100% sure of the implications but in basically every other way the voidspren was described as a contemporary of an honorspren with the exception of color and how she manifested. 

The fact that she was support by stone, connected to it, when she manifested as human means that stone is very important to the spren. much like wind is to honorspren, vines are to edgedancerspren (cultivation), stone is to void?