duladen

This is how I see it playing out, even if it is cliché. In Shallan, Adolin is finally going to meet a girl that tames his relationship ADD. Also Adolin is like Wit's biggest fan, he's going to love all of Shallan's funny remarks. I think Renarin will be attracted to but intimidated by Shallan's intelligence.

Wanted: Somebody to go into the future with me. This is not a joke, I can't keep waiting for Words of Radiance. You'll get paid after we get back. Must bring your own weapons. Safety not guaranteed. I have only done this once before. Safety Not Guaranteed

Gotcha, thanks @Moogle! Is this WOB, or did I just totally not pick up on this from AoL? I had assumed that there were Seers, but they were unaware because there was no atium available.

Hey y'all, this might be a silly question, but it's been a bit since I read AoL and I couldn't find an answer searching on this site: Can a compounder consciously choose to burn the stored feruchemcial traits/abilities and not the actual metal? I think the answer is yes, or Miles would be going nuts all the time. Also, I'm pretty sure I remember passages from his viewpoint that would indicate he can burn his Feruchemical gold for super healing without being constantly reminded of what could have been...

I completely agree. This makes me think that the 10 orders have the same basic abilities, but they each can be accessed by 3 varieties of spren. I believe it has been confirmed that bonded spren are usually a mix of Honor and Cultivation, but leaning toward one or the other, and I have seen it speculated that there are Odium-corrupted spren. So, 10 orders of magic x 3 Shards to provide investiture to access this power? I think the lack of effect of Szeth's lashings on shardplate could either be because of how he accesses the power, or because he is using Windrunner surges on shardplate of a totally different order. Maybe Windrunner surges have a strong effect on Windrunner shardplate, a diminished effect on orders that share abilities with Windrunners, and no effect on all others. I use the term "windrunner" in reference to the abilities that Kaladin and Szeth share, not the order of the KR.

Late comer to this thread, but I just had a thought... Could Feruchemical aluminum be involved in worldhopping? Perhaps those that can increase their sense of self are better at using Shadesmar. In Way of Kings, Jasnah warns Shallan that entering Shadesmar without enough stormlight is dangerous. Perhaps, similarly, it is dangerous for a Scadrian to enter the Cognitive Realm without a strong sense of one's self. I don't think that Feruchemical aluminum is the key to world hopping, but I think it makes sense that Aluminum Feruchemy could make someone much more adept at navigating the cosmere. Before seeing the atium idea shot down, I thought it might be cool if an Allomantic atium/Feruchemical aluminum Twinborn would be the best worldhopper. One other thing to point out - the OP says that there aren't Godmetal mistings under normal circumstances. What about all the Seers in HoA? Edit: didn't do the spoiler thing correctly

I probably should have prefaced that with a "wild speculation" disclaimer. I don't actually believe we'll be seeing someone pick up one or both of the shards on Sel. As for the off-topic part:

I think mine might be obvious. Understand?

I find it a little inconceivable that the Rose empire is both above Teod and below Jindo - encompassing the entire back side of the map.

Interesting - I hadn't read it that way but it's a solid point. What, then, was Gavilar doing that would bring back their gods? Does it have to do with that black sphere?

I'd say it increases your relative power or perceived power, but not your absolute power. When Odium splinters shards, he doesn't actually become more powerful, it just makes their group more elite.

Couldn't the intent of his Shard eventually limit his cunning? Blind him with hate? I'm guessing the Shaod kept taking people because the spiritual power of the Shards was still invested on Sel, just without a Cognitive focus

Upvote! I think there's a lot of sense in this - I can totally picture Odium as a rabid dog that Bavadin has unleashed on the Shardholders, and the Oathpact might be the leash he uses to contain Odium. Continuing this metaphor, Odium sounds close to Odie... the dog from Garfield... I'll stop. I don't know if we'll be able to answer these questions until we get the published version of White Sand and/or Dragonsteel. Although perhaps the Elantris sequel will give some hints that "someone" has picked up the splintered shards on Sel...

Okay so I don't know what time zone the post clock is on but it does not make sense. Drinking at 10:30pm is a lot more normal than 8:30am...

I'm going to join the position that the Parshendi gods are not the KR. Voidbringers, Unmade, or the so-called Voidspren (or Odiumspren to oppose Honorspren?) makes more sense. This is the second instance of someone thinking surge binding and/or a Knights Radiant renewal would lead to a desolation. Darkness seems to be hunting down surgebinders to stop this from happening. So the Parshendi didn't kill Gavilar because he was directly bringing their gods back but because a KR renewal would lead to their gods return. It's probably related to the Oathpact. If Honor has his champions, Odium gets his.

Lol drinking at 8am!? Or is that just my time... You're on the right track just a bit mixed up. As Weiry said, Ruin and Preservation are on a different planet. Give Elantris a read, it will give some context to the stars winking out in Dalinar's vision. Here's a good breakdown of the Cosmere and related works: http://coppermind.net/wiki/Cosmere

I also assumed that Odium was responsible for torturing the Heralds in Damnation between desolations. However, now that I think about it, I think he must have left after the breaking of the Oathpact, shattered the Shards on Sel, and then came back for Honor. Honor pointing to the stars winking out in Dalinar's vision leads me to this timeline: Furthermore, this death cry leads me to think that the Knights Radiant were around when Honor was shattered by Odium: So, if Odium came back before the Recreance, then he should have been around for the Hierocracy. Lastly, I like the bit about Odium's influence through the Thrill. I think it's a much better explanation for why the Sunmaker would make changes to Vorinism. Not because he's a direct agent of Odium. Hats off to you.

I agree with you that the 3 = Honor, Cultivation, and Odium. Especially since Shardlet convinced me that the Nightwatcher is Cultivation, I don't think there is another hidden Shard on Roshar. However, I think the "Broken One" is quite clearly Odium - based on the words that the face in the highstorm said to Kaladin. This parallel is too much for me to think that there is any other conclusion. I can't find it now, but I remember seeing a WoB quote that if a Shard leaves a world where it is invested, it would rip away a piece. We know that Odium was on Roshar, went to Sel, and has now come back (or possibly on a nearby cellestial body). This could be the meaning behind the "Broken One." Or it could be much simpler - Rayse has been completely subverted by his Shard's intent; his own will has been broken. I think the distinction between Honor being shattered and broken is important, and I'm really happy you mentioned the Shard being reassembled as I was just thinking about this. Perhaps it will take someone extremely honorable and powerful to fuse the Shard back together, and become a new Shardholder like Sazed. Maybe Kaladin? Dalinar? Taln? Guess we'll have to RAFO. Edit: caught some typos...

Thank you! I've been practicing by creating zombies and hiding amongst the other walking dead in San Francisco's Tenderloin... I agree that the Sunmaker probably wasn't working directly with Odium. (Was Odium even in the Roshar system at the time or was he on Sel?) However, since Rayse is supposed to be so cunning perhaps it was part of his plan, executed by one of his highest ranking minions. Not really any evidence for it, but I like it.

lol back to the topic! I like this theory a lot, allow me to put some thoughts down... I think it's possible that the Sunmaker was working with Odium, but also this could have just been something that Odium figured would happen. Mankind's greatest enemy was themselves. On the other hand, the name Sunmaker just sounds a lot like the nicknames we've seen for the Unmade (or even the Stormfather for that matter...). This could just be because of cultural tendencies, but it's interesting to think about - what if the Sunmaker was one of the Unmade and was furthering the schemes of Odium in preparation for the Everstorm? Regardless of whether the Sunmaker's motivations were totally personal, or specifically part of Odium's plan, I agree with the theory that he had a direct hand in changing the theology.

I agree with this line of thought. It has to do with spren bonds, and I would assumed that there is some sort of extra special bond for someone to become a Herald. Shardblades are all unique, and modern peoples seem somewhat ignorant of their ancient history and these talismans. I think it is very likely that someone has an Honorblade without knowing it. And these points about Elkohar - he was just speaking to the two presumed Heralds and has glyphs on his blade - are very compelling. I like this idea more than Szeth having one.

What a fun topic! I 100% agree with Cumberbatch as TLR. I love Fillion and RDJ and I think one should be Kelsier, the other Waxillium from Alloy. Not sure if I care which is which as long they were the 2. My choice for Vin would definitely be Chloe Moretz I think Ellen Page and Summer Glau are too old for that role. And I can't believe Tom Hardy hasn't been mentioned for Ham! I always pictured Ham looking like Hardy in the movie Bronson.

Ah, great point! I did not get that upon my first read, but he does seem to imply that they give Shardblades to some people, but not typically constables. Apologies for my ignorance here - but where do we have any indication that Honorblades are visibly different from Shardblades? Could it be that both come in a variety of shapes and sizes, and that the only difference is in their abilities and source of creation? Wouldn't it be likely that the Radiants created their Shardblades in the image of the Honorblades they saw the Heralds weilding?

I think Kalak and Jez would be equally likely. Kalak is hesitant to go along with the plan and he shows remorse for what they're doing to Taln. Also, Jez actually walks away before Kalak. But they leave in opposite directions, so either could have doubled back without the other knowing: If Darkness = Nalan, and I agree that it seems to fit (http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/4346-the-fallen-heralds/ convinced me), then there is a pretty good chance that he took back his Honorblade. No one remarks that his Shardblade looks special or different, but would any of these modern Roshar folk know the difference? I think I remember reading that most of the known Shardblades are in Alethkar and Jah Keved, so these people in Iri or Emul probably haven't seen many. Maybe all 3 of these Heralds are too obvious though, and we won't find an answer until book 5...

Thanks for the warm welcome guys! Great point. And yes, I rember that these visions are assumed to be something like "recordings" from Tanavast/Honor. The taboo of predicting the future must be much older than the Hierocracy.