Brightlord M. Alhstrom

One thing to add for the Shardic discussion on new Odium (if there is one). While Sazed was able to move planets and stuff, and his learning was limited, remember that he did dump his entire coppermind collection as he was ascending. The reason that he didn't repeat TLR's mistakes with the moving of the planet is because he was able to draw on that knowledge. So while he would still be very new at being a shard, he would still have a bit of a head start, plus about 300 years of learning, if a little limited by others. New-Odium wouldn't have that, would be a very new shard, and prone to make mistakes alike to Vin or TLR when they ascended. And by Vin's mistakes, I mean those situations where what she did was helping Ruin more than it was helping her, so Ruin would let her, etc. I could see how an experienced shard (even one with only Sazed's experience) would be able to weave loops around a new Shard. The only reason Sazed didn't have this issue as much is because he had a little bit of a head start, and he is a dual-shard so most shards wouldn't want to mess with him.

Where are you guys at? (BTW, I'm the guy with the newsie cap and the brown leather jacket)

Anything I should look for in particular when trying to find you guys? Particular colored shirts? Large stacks of Cosmere books? 6 pizzas stacked one on top of another? That one guy wearing a top hat?

I agree that at the very least, when Scadrial becomes widely Cosmere aware, that they will adopt Silverlight's cosmere standard. What I'm wondering is if the worldhoppers at Silverlight might find ways to push the cosmere standard into the different societies prematurely.

Wednesday and Friday work for me.

About the aluminum bullets/swords/spears, as well as brains, here is my theory: When you have a physical body, your Cognitive aspect is tied to your body, and limited by it, which is part of why you can't do a bunch of stuff that Cognitive Shadows can do. If you die, that bond is severed, and your Cognitive Aspect is no longer limited by your physical aspect. Which is why I think that if your brain were crushed, or otherwise in a braindead situation, but you didn't die, your mental capacities would be limited by the physical condition of the brain, while not being free (you aren't dead). Otherwise, brain diseases would be impossible, and being lightheaded or drunk wouldn't affect your mental capabilities, as your Cognitive Aspect isn't affected directly by alcohol, etc. So were the sword/bullet/spear comes in is that you can't heal wounds around aluminum. So if you can leave some aluminum (like some bullets, or just holding a sword) in a critical part of the brain that leaves the gold compounder braindead and unable to control his limbs, then Gold-Compounding-Savanthood might keep them healing, but it wouldn't matter, as they would be completely trapped, being unable to act. Actually, it would be worse than death, as you wouldn't even move on. It would be like a coma that you'd only wake from if someone removed the aluminum, or if you'd run out of healing and died.

Has anyone ever considered that Nicrosil Compounding could compound just raw Investiture? Like, if you had some stormlight, or breath, you could store it, and then compound it?

One thing to mention, I wouldn't trust that article completely. I'm Canadian and we definitely do not use the mile. The only remains of the imperial system is when measuring height/weight and food quantities. (cups/tablespoons). There might be a couple others, but they are isolated.

That should work for what I mean. However, what are people's thoughts on the Gold-compounding savant thing? Do you think I'm right? Is it possible that Miles might have had instinctive compounding, which would mean that even being braindead wouldn't work?

How about just stabbing an aluminum sword through his head? Then you know it's cutting through the important parts of the head. And you can hold it in place until his body dies. The only possible problem: I figure that by the end Miles was a Gold Compounding Savant, which might mean higher healing rates, higher burning rates, lower burning rates, or even instinctive compounding. If the latter, then even braindead miles should be able to heal as soon as shrapnel is removed, as long as he doesn't run out of gold (which could take a LONG time if savantism increases the rate of compounding.) As for losing his memory, I'm fairly sure that realmaticaly he wouldn't, seeing as how people don't loose their memory after they die. (Think of Kelsier). While the sword is in his head, he might be braindead, but I think that once the sword came out, the gold would heal his mind, and the memories would stay.

I can see why you'd think that. Just that from the language of the books, as well as some of the WoB, it feels more like Voidbringers are a specific species. Maybe Parshendi, maybe not. Or maybe it really is all of the desolation species. Or 10 Deaths, or whatever. I figure we'll know more after Oathbringer.

I'm not sure I'd consider it a side effect. After all, if the purpose of the change is to influence the Physical aspect, then I would consider it the primary effect. Just like how pulling the trigger might kill someone, you wouldn't consider the murder to be a side effect of pulling the trigger, even if the trigger only interacted with the rest of the gun, and it was the gun that killed the person. Just like how you wouldn't consider a transformation to be the side effect of using a stamp in Forging. The transformation is the primary effect.

Just to clarify things: Shards exist in all three Realms. In fact, I'm fairly sure that almost all entities do (minus Cognitive Shadows, and Spiritual Shadows, if there is such a thing). Most everything has a physical aspect, with a couple noted exceptions. They also have a Cognitive aspect, but then even a stick will have a cognitive aspect. And we know that they have a spiritual aspect because Forging affects the spiritweb of an entity. Anything that can be stamped, needs to have a spiritweb. And I'm assuming that the Spiritweb is in the SR. Shards exist in all three realms, while also being able to deliberately see and interact with all three realms. The difference is that most of their power/Investiture is stored in the SR. As for it being hard to interact with the physical realm, I thought that that was just because of how Ruin was locked up, Preservation was braindead, and then after that because Shards can counter each other. I mean, if you can create a Volcano, and move the entire planet, I'm fairly sure you can do some of the smaller things. However going back to the original question, I think that it would be possible for someone completely in the SR to interact with and hurt a human being in the PR. Why? The aforementioned Forging. It implies that the Spiritweb can be changed, and that if it is changed, the Physical aspect will also change. So I think it would be possible for an entity completely in the SR (if such a thing were possible) to find the Spiritweb of an individual, and change it. And several of these changes could be deadly. They got cancer 6 years ago. Their bones all splinter. etc. You get the idea. I'm not saying that anyone in the SR could do it, I'm just saying that interaction with the Spiritweb could be very harmful to the Pysical aspect of an entity.

Not really. You find destructive/black/smoky things in almost every story. Midnight Essence in Stormlight Archive. Skaze in Elantris. Nightblood in Warbreaker. Shades in Shadows for Silence. Many things can be evil and destructive without being of Ruin.

Well, from the books I gather that Voidbringers are a specific species that come during desolations. So, like Thunderclasts are creatures of desolations, but aren't Voidbringers. (Personally think Parshendi => Voidbringer). So, with that, I'd refer to Voidspren as the spren that Parshendi use. Like the stormform spren, or smokeform spren. While Desolationspren could refer to any spren that bonds to a desolation species. Which might also be called the 10 deaths. I'm still going through the books to get those terms straight. So to recap: they are typically used interchangeably, but over time, it might become such that voidspren are a subgroup of desolationspren.

I know at least one is used in the books. The other might have been also from the book, or maybe just came into being on this forum. If the latter, then I'm fairly sure they are considered the same thing. I've been using the term desolationspren myself, though I'd like it if a spen expert would shed some light.

OK. Need to appologize. It's actually Sun and the Stars, not sun and moon. Not sure where that came from.

I think most any evening should work so far, though that might change. But it should be the case at least for the first week.

My theory? This is the same religion as Trelagism from Mistborn. Mistborn as well as White Sand spoilers: Anyways, all that to say that I think we might be dealing with a Shard based religion here once again.

This makes me think of how the shin only buy soulcast metal. Thus the reason Urithiru is fine might be because it was soulcast stone. That is if it was soulcast stone. I can't remember if we ever had that confirmed. OK. Here comes a crazy half baked idea: whay if the reason they don't mine stone or walk on it is because of how some of the desolation species came from stone, like the thunderclast. So they avoid stepping on or digging out stone, unless it's is soulcast, seeing as the desolation species don't come out of soulcast stone. Taking it one step farther, what if Urithiru was built completely of soulcast material because that way it would be a guaranteed safe haven during the desolations? Thoughts?

I always thought Adonalsium was Uncle Andy.

That or just the constant radiation poisoning.

One last thing to mention: they worship both the sun and the moon.

At the same time, the Truthwatchers are described as a more secretive and aloof Order, (at this is explained not as arrogance, but as tactfulness) so it would make sense if the fact that they have future sight wasn't commonly known. Also, I'm thinking that the "watchers" in "truthwatchers" might be a hint to their being able to watch the future. Come to think of it, that could be the corelation between Bondsmith and Truthwatchers: If they are the two orders who have abilities unrelated to the surges. Bondsmith to binding people with Oaths (or something to that extent) and Truthwatchers with having visions of the Future.

OK, I'm going to revive this. I think the spirit of the stones are the Heralds, because they are the ones who promised that the Desolations were over. Somehow in the Shin religion, the Heralds were associated with Stone, which makes a lot of sense, considering that they worship both Stone and Heralds. That's my best explanation for that passage. As for why Stones are holy, or are related to the Heralds, I think it's a single answer for both questions, but I don't know yet. It might be the honorblades, but I doubt it. Though I think the whole "don't walk on stone" aspect has to do with how Shinovar doesn't have stone. Maybe something that developed over time, that the only people who walk on stone are the warring outsiders. This would also explain why they don't leave Shinovar, as they'd need to climb a mountain to do it. As for the whole, no war because the Heralds told us no, I think it fits really well. And that would explain why Szeth suggesting that the Heralds lied, and that a Desolation is coming would be blasphemy to the Shin. My only problem is with the description of how you get Truthless. From one of the interludes in WoK, we know that all soldiers in Shinovar have oathstones. What I suspect is that because of their traditions, they reserve the worst punishment to those who commit religious crimes. Except that instead of a painful death, to the Shin, the worst punishment is to 1. be cast down to be the lowest of the low (the lowest among warriors) and be given an oathstone, 2. to be given an honorblade, to make one a perfect killer, 3. to be forbidden of ending one's own life and 3. by giving the oathstone to an outsider to guarantee that the Truthless will be used, and thus forced to kill. The worst punishment is to be forced to spend the rest of your life killing, over and over and over. The Honorblade is just a guarantee that 1. they will be used for killing, 2. they will be able to kill many, and 3. they won't die easily, so their miserable lives will continue for a very long time. Now, I agree that it's a bit of a stretch, and definitely harsh from a people who abhor killing, but when you think about it, this is exactly what Szeth describes as being the life of a Truthless. He even goes on to describe how on his death there are processes in place for the Shin to retrieve the Honorblade.