Kaladin Zahel

This is all exciting. However, I think it has to do with Urithiru being a cosmere Mecca. During my reading of the Oathbringer weekly chapters, I keep getting the impression that Urithiru has touches of different magic systems. I feel the Warbreaker recommendation has to do with a Breath-holder/user being able to read the strata and give the new KR some epiphany that those who are Warbreaker ignorant will be mystified by. While I am sure Nightblood and more of Zahel/Vasher will be in OB, I don't believe that's enough reason to recommend reading Warbreaker before it.

I believe the cause of the recreance has to be either a failed championship or a 'successful' championship where Odium wiggled out of or instituted a couple clauses in the contract. This would explain why the Stormfather and Honor are keeping the details hidden so that they can still promote using the champion for hope. A contract would also explain the Knights Radiants and sprens making their awful decisions as well as the Listeners' accepting their plight. Perhaps the Parshendi are decendants of rebels against the contract. I also feel like the Heralds have gone the way of the Lord Ruler and have also ignored the contract causing problems.

Slavery is historically typical. And aside from Mistborn Era 2, all of the cosmere's civilizations are developmentally a millenia older than ours. Without machinery and the assembly line, manual labor is necessary for growth and advancement. And without globalized economy, capitalism, republics and so on, you can't pay everyone. So in order for there to be monarchs and/or a luxury class, there must be serfs/slaves. Also, you can't morally object to the parshmen enslavement using our context. Vorin morals strongly agrees with slavery as a form of punishment/prevention: hierarchy leads to enslaved religious figures, desolations lead to voidbringer/parshmen enslavement, and crimes/poverty lead to human enslavement. I believe Sanderson creates more than enough historical reasoning for the slavery while sympathizing with the innate wrongness of it.

Someone visiting the Nightwatcher Someone being chosen by a Ryshadium More Zahel, Hoid, Lift, and Amians

My problem with everyone disregarding the silver plating is that it doesn't make sense in-world to be there. If silver is inert and considered worthless from an allomantic standpoint than it is likely worthless as a currency and for ornamentation. So I feel the following options must be true: It was plated with a purpose It predates Era 1's economy/magic understanding It is from off-world

This is a really nice catch. I only have 3 theories personally for this. 1. Sanderson goofed and will have to explain it in the next book or an edit. Unlikely, since he is such an outliner. 2. For some reason when the recreance happens the KR all go to Natanatan using the portal. Some event happens which: causes them to close portals to Urithru, causes fallout which creates the Shattered Plains, and causes them to abandon the oaths. I prefer this theory because it makes the abandonment reactionary as opposed to premeditated. This also fits with Branderson's method of avalanches in his stories and could likely be a flashback plot yet to be written. 3. The KR do lockdown the portals intentionally, but leave one open as a safeguard in case their plan doesn't work out. Perhaps Renarin's order saw a potential future where the KR would have to reform using the method we have seen so far. The problem with this is that this would have required bonded spren to cooberate the oath breaking which is basically suicide and not the impression we get from Syl and Pattern.

This probably isn't going to be very helpful, but I don't think we can take anything we know about Shallan at face value. Her entire storyline is about her hiding from the truth. She has bonded a lie spren. Perhaps the only things we can believe with certainty are the moments where Pattern affirms her story in the present. And just like Kaladin's self doubt and depression, some things that are 'true' to an individual internally are not fact. So many of Shallan's internal thoughts, recollections, and decisions are lies that she believes or beliefs that she's created for self preservation but are not fact. Slight conspiracy and tangent. Amaram and Taravangian are heroes in their own stories but we think they are evil. We pity and like Shallan and believe she is a heroin in the grand scheme of things. Perhaps his Sandersonness is setting us up with a bait and switch here.

I think this can simply be taken as a first person expression of identity. We don't call ourselves Earthlings but rather humans. So even if we knew of other inhabited planets, but did not communicate with them, we would still self identify as humans. In most sci-fi and fantasy systems, bipedal sentient beings are usually referred to as humanoid as opposed to humans. So it would seem reasonable to think of the homeworld inhabitants referring to themselves as humans exclusive from other beings. I do also think it possible that the Diagram is indeed attempting to protect all humans in the cosmere. Odium is the biggest threat in the cosmere and is only temporarily restricted to the Rosharan system. So if Roshar fails/falls, the rest of the cosmere and 'humanity' may as well.

Thank you both for responding. I was worried that the age of the post would bury any opportunity of discourse. While I agree with the context of Adolin being stressed out, I do feel like this is very in line with Shallan's and Kaladin's ignorant/natural use of stormlight when they needed it. It just seems too coincidental in wording his success that way if there wasn't something extra going on. Also, when Shallan meets Dalinar it is obvious he is still beaten up, but the only reference to Adolin is his 'wounded leg'. Landing on his shoulder should have been noticeable if it had not healed sooner than anticipated. I'm sure I'm just being hopeful as I enjoy out of the ordinary storytelling.

I just stumbled on this thread via google and realize this is probably going to be a wasted response. Im doing my 3rd reading of SA and taking notes at things that interest me. I stumbled upon the oddity with Adolin's Shardblade(SB) and that's how I wound up her. I too believe Adolin has already begun reviving his Shardblade as well as producing a limited Nahel bond with it. There is am interesting scene in WoR where Adolin is practicing throwing his SB. He fails to do it correctly until 2 things occur. One, he remembers Zahel's instruction of "picturing what he needed it to do" - oddly reminiscent of awakening. And two, "Adolin let out the breath he had been holding" which is very reminiscent to Shallan's and Kaladin's experience when subconsciously using Stormlight. As for an earlier mention in this thread about SB revival requiring the same KR: Roshar's(or at least Vorin's) afterlife is a fight for the Tranquiline Halls which Odium threw its denizens out of. So to me it's very possible that all SA humans are reincarnated. It seems that all of Sanderson's works have direct links between perceived gods and the magic users who emulate them. So if the Heralds reincarnate after being tortured after each desolation, then it stands to reason that humans and KRs would undergo at least similar situations. Another grasp at this logic is that Talanel tells the Alethi that 'they' will have forgotten many things since the last desolation. You can take that as generalized or direct but it adds to the possibility.

The title refers to when Jasnah soulcasts the fallen stone blocking the room to Taravangian's granddaughter. Im reading WoK for the third time and just noticed that Taravangian has a member with a Soulcaster, the man who acquires Szeth's Oathstone. So was this a Diagram plan to verify Jasnah's true Soulcasting capability? If so, then why qive her assistance by giving her access to the library and not dealing with her immediately after? Was it a writing error which seems to be a rare Brandon occurrence? Or is there something I or we are just missing? Thanks in advance for any assistance.

@thegatorgirl00 Thank you for the suggestion. The reason I went with Humility was to stay away from an attribute as similar to Endowment as Charity or Generosity. I could maybe make the third in this segment Hubris or Pride making a segment that is more negative than positive. As for inaction, I couldn't think of a reasonable trait that would have a following or magic system attached. I'll add both in parentheses for now.

Good catch. There actually was a mutual antonym but I wasn't comfortable at the time to add. Autonomy and Dominion could have a matching shard of Subordination, Servitude, or Subservience. I like Servitude the best as it fits with most religious doctrines and intents. I'll edit my post to reflect the new potential shard. Thanks!

I really enjoyed reading this thread and wanted to add some thoughts and speculation. Brandon has said that the 17th shard forum people tend to 'overthink' his system. This led me to try some thesaurus research and this what I've noticed/perceived: Odium has an antonym to honor, and devotion has an antonym to odium. So for me the 3 are representative of 1 segment of adonalsium. Going down a rabbit-hole of synonyms, I found preservation and cultivation to share many results. And ruin was the antonym for preservation and very related to undoing/countering cultivation. This is another segment. Autonomy and dominion aren't quite antonyms but do differ greatly when described from the stand point of control. This is part of a segment but I feel we are missing a shard here. EDIT: Servitude is an antonym of both these shards so it may complete this segment. And I can see Servitude being a cosmere negative if there is not a shard balancing out its nature. For ambition, the closest I could come to a godly antonym was humility. Again I theorize this to be another part of a segment with a shard missing here. EDIT: Other possibilities being Charity(though that seems close to Endowment) and Hubris/Pride though that would possible make this segment more negative. For endowment, I figured the ulitmate God for the cosmere would have had a 'limitation' built into adonalsium and this would be endowment's antonym loosely. The thing I noticed when separating and organizing these shards was that each shard has a natural positive/negative leaning. And as I believe adonalsium was overall a good being, I think for every negative attribute there must be at least 2 positive attributes. So my shardic breakdown looks like this: Positive - Negative - Positive Honor - Odium - Devotion Preservation - Ruin - Cultivation Autonomy - Servitude - Dominion Humility/(Charity) - (Hubris) - Ambition Endowment - Limitation - ? And for the 16th shard, I feel it is both unrelated and necessary to the whole: Consciousness/Awareness If anyone would like to take a stab at completing my theory or completely tearing it down, I welcome you.

Just decided to sign up to chime in here. I think the real threat was creating a Nightblood creature as opposed to just a sword. Imagine Nightblood wielding Nightblood. Unless Im missing a mechanic this should work, but be very chaotic and destructive. Kalads Phantoms were not type IV because of the bone cheat. So if they had been made with rebar(inorganic/metal) instead youd have a Nightblood army but uncontrollable. That would certainly be worth preventing at ANY cost.