DeTess

And this cycle is over!

Oh, I actually forgot about this: To be able to perform any sort of action, you need to have posted at least once in the thread that cycle.

All role PM's should have been send out now. If you haven't gotten yours, do please send me a PM and I'll aim to correct that.

The report started with the names and cover-identities of the agents tasked with infiltrating the Set, and the reasons for the operation. She skipped over all that. She knew who she’d sent and she could dream the justification for the operation. Before going over to the next chapter, she picked up a heavy black pen and censored the names of teh agents. Irrespective of what followed next, that was information that’d have to be restricted. The next couple of chapters detailed the initial infiltration work. Individual contacts, slow but steady progress up into the organisation, as well as the occasional arranged incidents to help the agents climb up quickly. The details of those incidents were quickly censored too. Knowing that her agency had taken such steps was enough. Knowing the exact details wouldn’t help anyone at this point. And then something had gone wrong. The report provided several theories for the cause, but didn’t provide a definitive conclusion. All that was known for certain was that one of her agents had been found floating face-down in the canal separating Elendel’s 5th and 6th octant, and the Set had started their hunt the next day. *** Laurent Ervine has died. He was an EBI agent and an Array within the Communications Subset. *** Welcome to LG 63 everyone! Let me quickly repeat the publicly known rules: There are two factions, the ‘Elendel Bureau of Investigation Agents’ and ‘the Set’. Either faction wins by either eliminating the other faction entirely, or by reaching a position from which it would be impossible for them to lose. There are no other factions involved. This game consists of a 48 hour day-cycle and a 24-hour night cycle. There is a Lynch during the day-cycle, with no vote minimum and ties settled by random chance. Every night cycle the EBI agents can arrange for the arrest (read: ‘elimination’) of a player. There are no open PM’s, but some roles might allow for the creation of PM’s. The Set is organized in several specialized cells, known as subsets. To be able to submit any sort of action, you need to have posted at least once in the thread that cycle. This cycle will end Wednesday 6PM EST. player list: Role PM's are being send out. if you've received none within an hour or so of the cycle going live, please send me a PM.

@EXPERIENCE_THE_SHARD, I quickly wanted to apologize for responding so grumpily. Redoing the same work three times in a row kinda wears me down XD. Anyway, welcome to the Shard, and welcome to SE! If you haven't yet, take a look at the general rules here: If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask them, and I or others will try to answer them.

... yeah, sure, that's fine. But you're the last one, as I kinda need to redo role balancing every time someone new joins, and that takes a bit.

Alright, signups are closed. The game should start in an hour or so, once I've gotten everything in order that needs to be put in order.

Awww. Ah well, good luck with whatever made you suddenly busy!

And once again, the power of puppy dog eyes reigns supreme! I mean, thanks for joining, you three! We've got enough for the minimum, so the game will start as scheduled. If you're still considering joining, please don't hesitate to speak up though, as the more the merrier!

It's about 36 hours till the game starts, but I'd really like to have at least 12 players (and preferably more, of course) so if necessary I might delay the start a bit. If anyone was still thinking about signing up, please do so!

No, I am (or at least, should be) aware of all the rules.

Have you read mistborn era 2 yet? Otherwise, RAFO

It was late at night in the city of Elendel. Though some would argue that the city never truly slept, the commissioner of the Elendel bureau of Investigations knew better. This late during a working day, the city would be quiet, and all sensible people would be asleep, preparing for another long day. She liked to think of herself of sensible as well, but unfortunately her work couldn't wait, at least not tonight. The report had arrived only minutes ago, making it several hours late. She hoped that it contained good news, something that she could take to the senate and governor. 'Tea and medals for everyone.' She muttered, a wry smile on her lips. The moment of good humor didn't last. Just as likely, she'd have to make the report disappear and pretend the operation never happened, while at the same time arrange for letters to be send, and funeral costs for good officers to be reimbursed. With a sigh, she opened the report and started reading. *** Welcome to LG 63, a game about a brave group of Elendel bureau of investigations agents infiltrating the shadowy organisation known as the Set. Or maybe it’s about the visionary organisation known as the Set trying to rid themselves of infiltration by foolish and short sighted EBI agents. This is a semi-blackout game, which means there are rules which will not be revealed in advance. The rules of any individual’s role are revealed on their removal from the game, but some other information might not be. The following information is given in advance: There are two factions, the ‘Elendel Bureau of Investigation Agents’ and ‘the Set’. Either faction wins by either eliminating the other faction entirely, or by reaching a position from which it would be impossible for them to lose. There are no other factions involved. This game consists of a 48 hour day-cycle and a 24-hour night cycle. There is a Lynch during the day-cycle, with no vote minimum and ties settled by random chance. Every night cycle the EBI agents can arrange for the arrest (read: ‘elimination’) of a player. There are no open PM’s, but some roles might allow for the creation of PM’s. The Set is organized in several specialized cells, known as subsets. Other housekeeping info: I'm fairly sure @Araris Valerian is my co-gm. The IM will be announced when I know who it is. The game will start a week from now on Monday the 24th, 6PM EST. Player list: FAQ: Quicklinks:

This was a fun game, and despite it's quick end it was rather close. The village started with only 3 mislynches (though Venture managed to get that up to 4 with their protections), so another cycle or so of holding out and the game would have gone the other way. Anyway, here are some random thoughts: First of all, it was very interesting to play with a bunch of new players at once, because it can result in some surprising new insights. @Zillah's comment on my playstyle was especially interesting. my first response on that in the dead doc was: And though I still stand by this way of playing as being the best way for me to bring elims to light, I do now also wonder to what degree that particular playstyle contributes to my reputation as being a hard elim to spot. Another thing that struck me while reading the elim doc was just how different the god king's tone of voice was between the thread and the doc. I lie very rarely, if at all, when I play. Depending on how you define lying, this even holds when I'm an elim, as I almost never say things I don't believe are true on some level, even if it requires a bit of doublethink regarding my own alignment. Anyway, as I said before, this was a fun game, and I'd just like to thank Elandera, as well as everyone else that played in it. In aprticular I'd like to give a shout-out to Zillah, the god king and feruchemical skybreaker, as you where all very active and involved, despite games like this tending to be a bit overwhelming for newer players.

I'm going to go almost line by line on this one quote by Zillah as there's a lot to unpack. Well, yes, that's a matter of public record. Is there anything more you wanted to add regarding my decision to vote on Venture? Disagree on your defense not making sense if you where an eliminator (also, based on your post it sounds like you're defending yourself from an accusation of being an elim, which is not what I accused you of, I merely asked for clarification on why you thought Elkanah could be an elim). You seem to already have a grasp of the tactic of bussing (more on that in a second). Another common tactic for elims is that of 'pocketing', where they go out of their way to defend a villager to try and gain their trust. And if that defense fails and the villager gets lynched, it allows the elim to say 'I told you so' and try to appear village using the argument you present here. This is true, but such credibility is generally not worth the life of an active team-mate when there are reasonable alternatives, such as Venture. Agreed, but voting against a team-mate when it's possible to make a sensible argument (and I'd say such an argument could definitely have been made against venture) is the more logical play, as later suspicion could be fought down (note, fro example, that the god king has yet to be lynched) I don't believe Elkanah is 100% cleared, but I trust them a lot more than anyone else in the game save cadcom. Lying about your role in PM's isn't unheard off for villagers to do, especially if you're trying to feel out someone's alignment. That having been said, I would be curious to learn what he claimed, as I got a half claim out of him as well. edit: I disagree with this, somewhat. Let me try to explain (I'm tired though, so this might not make a lot of sense). First some assumptions: alle else being equal, the elims would prefer not to gang up on the same player in the lynch if its going to be a mislynch. Also, let's assume that there's 2 elims left. Based on those two assumptions, there'd likely be about 1 elim in the group voting on Venture, and 1 elim among the other votes. In other words, all Else being equal, focusing one one group over the other doesn't achieve anything for the village. Now, let's look at the two scenarios that might cause the elims to gang up. First among these is if an elim is at risk of being lynched. If that was the case here, one of Elkanah or Kynedath would have to be an elim. However, neither of them voted on Venture, so this scenario clearly doesn't work. The other scenario is that the elims knew about venture's role. This brings with it two problems though. The first is about how they knew. If we assume that kidpen submitted the kill, and that both other elims had ways to determine someone's role, there's a 25% they'd pick venture in their first round of scans. These assumptions are pretty generous though, and I think it's far more likely that only one of them had a way to determine roles. The other way they could have known is if Venture had claimed to them in a PM. Cadcom mentioned that they knew, and I can see why Venture might confide in them. I don't really see why he'd confide in anyone else though (except maybe Elkanah, but as mentioned, he didn't vote on Venture). The elims could have read the PM using the translator's lenses, but that'd only work if Venture named himself in the PM in which he claimed ( @CadCom, did he?). Then there's the second problem with assuming that the elims knew, and that is 'why didn't they just kill him?' It's less risky than a lynch, as Venture could at any point have claimed his role and derailed the lynch, resulting in the same kind of suspicion a successful one would have had with none of the gains. There's also the risk of a self-protect, but that's only something to consider if they had reason to believe Venture would expect to be attacked. Reason to suspect that would have been if Venture had gone fishing in PM's with claims, but if the elims feared that possibility, heavily pushing the lynch on him would also be a bad play for the same reasons. All this is a long-winded way to say that I really don't think there's any reason to believe that all remaining elims where on the venture wagon, and the suggestion makes me suspect kynedath even more. I'm not saying we should ignore the people on that wagon, but I see no reason to limit discussion to only them. Anyway, that's it from me for this cycle.

I'd just like to quickly note that I'm going to be significantly less active this cycle. I'll likely have one more post of substance in about 7 hours or so, and that's it.

A lot of discussion happened yesterday, which is good. Most of it happened after I went to bed, which is unfortunate (for me). So, let me play catch-up fora bit. @Kynedath, Early C2 you had this to say about Elkanah: As far as I can tell you didn't really mention much about Elkanah untill this happened: I find this vote odd (and not just yours, I find all votes on Elkanah last cycle odd). It seems to eb purely because they voted on you, which is NAI at worst, and I'd consider retaliation votes like that to be somewhat elimy, and given your earlier stance on Elkanah it looks a bit opportunistic to me. @Feruchemical Skybreaker, why did you switch to venture? @Zillah, how do you reconcile your suspicion of Elkanah with his role in the lynch on kidpen? Why do you think elim!elkanah would have done that? That's my thoughts so far. Just based on yesterday, I'm more inclined to vote kynedath right now, though I also would support a lynch on the god king.

Okay, last post of the cycle for me. @Feruchemical Skybreaker, why do you trust the_god_king? And if you absolutely had to lynch someone this cycle, who would it be? I realize that that second one is a pretty difficult question right now, but without some discussion like that it's hard to analyze the result of lynches and kills. Anyway, Devotary has answered the questions I threw at them, so they're off the hook for now. I'm going to vote butt ad venture. I've got a bunch of bad lynch targets, but the way he approached and seemed to support the rathmaskal lynch look really off to me (to summarize, he stated that Rath looked good for a lynch, but then needed to look up the actual reason). It feels like he's looking for a person to lynch, rather than a suspicion to pursue, which looks elimmy to me. In addition, several people have shared their opinions on him, so either way there'll be at least some info coming from the lynch.

The reason I backed down there was that I'd started it the 'wrong' way. A discussion between two players with mutual suspicions can be very useful, especially for everyone else, however the way I'd started it and the slightly annoyed mindset that had caused it meant it was more likely to be an actual conflict instead of a discussion, so I backed off hard to diffuse that. I might resume an actual discussion of the sort next cycle or the one afterwards if I still don't have a read on kynedath, but I'll do it cool-headed as part of a discussion, not hot-headed and unreasonably annoyed for no good reason.

And as the person that played a major role in both those busses, I'd like to point out that, as far as I can tell, the circumstances last cycle where not at all like those during D1 of the AG, so I'm relly not seeing a bus there. I'm not disagreeing on this, and I'm currently rethinking my vote on them, mostly because they're relatively new here. That brings me back to the question of who else to vote for. i think I'd end up back with but Add venture if I where to switch. I can see Zillah's argument for why venture might be village, but I'm not convinced. The other option based on my previous list would be Rathmaskal, and I'm just not particularly suspicious of them right now. I suppose I could also move my vote to one of the lower actives to try and get them to join in more. @Devotary of Spontaneity (the god king, devotary of spontaneity), who would you suspect most and least right now? Is there anything else you'd like to add? ( @StrikerEZ and @Feruchemical Skybreaker should feel free to answer those questions as well, btw).

Okay, I've stalled long enough in the hope that someone will make this easier for me, so let's see about placing a vote. Removing Cadcom, Elkanah and me from the list leaves me with eight potential candidates. StrikerEZ, feruchemical skybreaker and @Devotary of Spontaneity haven't spoken up enough yet for me to form any kind of read on them. Kynedath... oh, right, i'd meant to respond to something. Right, but Cadcom wasn't as cleared last cycle, and voting on villagers isn't something solely reserved for elims. Anyway, I'm not certain on kynedath, but they sound fairly similar to what they sounded like the last game we played together, though a skilled elim shouldn't have any obvious differences there. As they're fairly active and pushing discussion somewhat, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt for now. Zillah hasn't spoken up too much either yet, but their post in response to my question sounds a bit villagery. An elim probably wouldn't be looking fora confrontation with a very active player so early on in the game yet, at any rate. So, that leaves me with butt ad venture, the god king and Rathmaskal. Rathmaskal has certainly been riding more under the radar than they usually do. I've got a PM with them though, and there weren't any red flags there (though I'm notoriously bad at reading people through PM's). Butt ad Venture has posted a bit, but he hasn't given that many clues to his alignment yet. @Butt Ad Venture, do I understand correctly from your post just now that you would support a Rathmaskal lynch? Lastly, there's the god king. I don't like their posts around when the lycnh on kidpen formed, as it seemed like he at the same time wanted to push back against that lynch, and not make it obvious that they where specifically protecting kidpen, so i think that's where I'm going to place my vote for now. the god king.

There's two lenses that could be used to protect someone (the disguise one and the windstormer one) and the elims also get lenses. I really don't think cadcom is an elim though. @Kynedath, out of curiosity, what makes Rathmaskal's vote on cadcom suspicious? @Feruchemical Skybreaker and @StrikerEZ, neither of you have really contributed much so far, so let me ask you the same question I asked Zillah: Who do you reckon is the most suspicious right now? And is there anyone besides Cadcom and Elkanah you think is likely to be village?

Okay, so cadcom got attacked and didn't die. That further reinforces the idea that they're a good guy, but doesn't help in limiting the pool of suspects much (though it does suggest that an elim was around when the vote turned against kidpen, as cadcom is an obvious villager in light of that flip). There''s not too much to go on yet, so let's see if I can't get people to spill the beans on their alignment talk a bit more. @The_God_King, last cycle you said: What topic where you hoping to start a discussion on? I assume you had something in mind? @Zillah, one little thing I've learned is that waiting for people to say enough to solve the game tends to not really work out. You need to put in information to get out information, you know? So, in case you could use a prompt to help in speaking up, Who do you trust least right now? And, apart from Cadcom and Elkanah, who would you trust most? ( I was planning to say more, but there's some other stuff I need to go take care of now, so I'll be back in a bit)

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is why you always lynch D1 Interestingly though, no elim kill. @Elandera, would a blocked or otherwise failed kill be mentioned in the writeup? edit: So, we got two big events this cycle. First was the kidpen lynch. This one was initiated by Cadcom and pushed in the lead by Elkanah. I feel fairly good about both of them now. Elim!cadcom would have had no reason to even suggest the lynch, and the only way Elkanah could have been forced on the kidpen lynch was if they, Kidpen and butt ad venture are all evil. Incidentally, @Elandera what happens on a tie? The only one to really push back on the kidpen lynch was the_god_king, and they mostly seemed to be against the method. I can udnerstand their hesitancy, but I tihnk ti should still be noted because of how the lynch flipped. Now, the second thing is the lack of a lynch kill. @Elandera, where does the lynch occur in the order of actions. If the lynch occurs first, then the lack of kill could be down to Kidpen being the one to submit the kill, which means that those who posted after kidpen was put in the lead are less likely to be evil. IF that's nota factor, then something odd is going on, as enough people checked in that a kill could have been submitted.

Anyway, I'm just about to check out for the night, and odds are that I won't be up before turnover, so it's time for me to put a vote down. Unfortunately, most of the discussion so far comes down to three people, including me. I'm not really feeling a lynch on Kynedath right now, as any suspicions I have on them are very tinfoily. Elkanah... well, most of that discussion was about how the bastille role works exactly. No, I think I'm going to place a... I think Sart calls these 'stab' votes? Anyway, one of those on Butt Ad Venture. @Butt Ad Venture, in your post, you mention both the importance for a good start to D1 and discussion, but then you also immediately state that you're not going to vote, taking away one very important way in which you can contribute to discussion, and in which you can get others to contribute as well. So, since you stated you didn't want to vote, what other ways did you have in mind for promoting that activity you stated was very important? edit: To quickly expand on where my suspicion comes from: Stating that you're not voting D1 out of principle seems like it would be a very 'safe' thing for an elim to do if they want to avoid being part of a mislynch. That combined with the exortation to people to be active (which is another very safe thing to do if you're not actively backing that up with actions to make people more active) makes me weary of butt ad venture.