DrakeMarshall
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Everything posted by DrakeMarshall
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If I am wrong, I am sorry. The fact that I am fairly certain about this doesn’t necessarily mean I have not given the alternatives fair consideration, though. If you are a villager, today’s lynch won’t cost the village the game, I’m pretty sure. It’ll be using up our last possible mislynch, which is a not insignificant setback, but also not game over. Do you at least acknowledge that incorrectly naming my role is fairly suspicious, though? Because I wouldn’t honestly expect a villager to fight so hard against legitimately fairly incriminating evidence that fell against them just due to bad luck.
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Also, because I apparently forgot: Aman.
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Please take note of Aman's edit in the post you quoted, in which he both rescinded the statement you are centering your argument on and doubled down on suspecting me. Forgive me if I am off base here, but reading this, I suspect that basically, you want Aman to be good. Because, you are stretching to provide an argument that by your own admission, doesn't actually really leave you very convinced. Which, I can definitely relate to, having done that more often than I care to admit. Now, I might be wrong about you, in which case you may freely disregard everything I am saying, but, if I am right: please pay attention to that dissonance and why it exists. When things don't feel like they add up, it's usually because they don't. Any one of the reasons to suspect Aman can and are being explained away, but there are also kind of a lot of them, not to mention that some of them haven't really been considered.
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No. You have my utmost respect, but I don't even slightly believe you. I didn't foresee the particulars, but I very much did expect this. To everyone else: Independent of anything regarding Aman's claim, I arrived at legitimate suspicions of Aman by two completely separate means of analysis. That alone is probably sufficient grounds to lynch him, and nothing has been said so far that invalidates any of it. The direct response to my accusation was a maneuver that would have cleared Aman. Do you truly believe this to be coincidence? Not only that, but he was continually supporting suspicions against me until I delivered my accusation. If he had known I was a villager, why would he keep bringing up lynching me? In the very least, he would have certainly backed off quietly on those suspicions. ...and then there is the fact that his scan claim was incorrect, which, even if you believe his excuse might be true, you must acknowledge is still significantly fishy. Aman is now presenting a source of reasonable doubt. I am willing to listen to reasonable doubt, but frankly, the fact that it is coming from Aman is likely reason to do everything in our power to kill him and not look back. That may sound extreme, but, is it not justified? There are some for whom slipping the noose like this is a big huge red flag, and Aman and Alvron are foremost in that group. I will have cause to seriously reconsider my approach if I am wrong about this, but, I don't think it's going to happen. For these reasons, it might not be certain that Aman is evil, but I sincerely do believe that there is overwhelming evidence for it. I don't usually go all-in on something like this. Subtlety really isn't my forte, and I don't honestly expect that I can be more persuasive than Aman, but I am telling you with as much emphasis as I how, because then at least I will know I did everything that I could. Aman, of either alignment, tends to be pretty confident in his ability to guess roles. And for good reason. He's really good at it. I don't know for sure, but I know I wasn't trying that hard to keep my role secret, and I can think of two things that might have given it away: 1. Firstly, this post: I already said I haven't really read the rules all that closely, so the fact that I already knew exactly how the soother/rioter mechanics worked is potentially a pretty big tell. Also, there is the fact that I am focusing inordinately on the role of vote manipulators in the game in the first place. 2. Secondly, the fact that I insisted we "pretended to have a lynch". This action makes a lot more sense in light of the fact that I had control over more votes than just my own as a way to cancel a D1 lynch last-second. Those are what I could think of. I have no idea if I would have been able to piece it together, but the signs were there. Settling into college again as well. Regardless of my doing my darnedest to kill you in this game, I wish you good luck
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Not for the sake of future sessions, no. The Inquisitor does not have Seeker powers, so if Aman was able to substantiate a Seeker claim, that would soft-clear him of being the Inquisitor. Considering I had just made a case against Aman, it was really quite an intelligent maneuver on Aman's part to attempt to shut down any emerging suspicions against him, even though it happened to backfire. Ah, I should clarify. I didn't sooth a vote off of Rath. That was someone else, probably Rath themself. Nevertheless, I am also a Soother. Good point. If Aman had gotten clarification that the Inquisitor is scanned by a Seeker as a vanilla (which is quite possible, because they don't have access to any allomantic powers until they spike themselves), then implying that he was vanilla would make a lot of sense for Inquisit!Aman. ^this. I'm fairly sure Fura's calculations say we can handle at least one more mislynch, so if I turn out to be the one lying, you can just lynch me the next cycle.
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Yes. Aman claimed to be a Seeker who scanned me as a Rioter. This was an intelligent guess, but I'm not a Rioter. Thus, I know for certain that Aman is evil. I am asking you to take my word for it, but, consider: If I were lying, well, that would almost certainly mean Aman is telling the truth. But Aman just claimed that I am cleared, since both Inquisitors and converted persons would not come up as a Rioter on a scan. Ergo, I probably can't be lying.
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Hah. Nice guess, but no. Even if you did have an accurate scan on me, which you don't, you wouldn't have waited to disclose it, since you already suspected me. You were really close, though. I'm seriously impressed with how close you got to clearing yourself. I'm pretty sure I know what gave me away as a vote manipulator. I'm a Soother though, not a Rioter. @everyone, I am now 100% certain Aman is evil. I don't say that lightly. Aman just lied about being a Seeker, and unless the GMs step forward and announce that they have made a mistake, I cannot conceive of any possible way Aman is anything but evil. Aman being evil doesn't guarantee that he is the inquisitor (who is obviously a higher priority lynch target), but given that it was stuff he said last cycle that was setting off my suspicions in the first place, which prompted him to take a stab at guessing my role, it's still extremely probable that Aman is the inquisitor.
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Why? Either this is a fairly reckless intuitive leap or there are reasons I haven't perceived yet. Your theory is probably correct, due to the proportion of active players who voted, but I'm not sure it's useful, because I can't think of a reason why the inquisitor in particular would benefit more from voting than anyone else does. Good catch. A point in Fura's favor. Huh. At the risk of sounding biased on the issue (which, I probably am), your accusation against me sounds quite disingenuous. "I noticed several players finding mixed signals in his posts" If I understand you very well at all, you are not naturally inclined towards leaning on other people's arguments. In the exceptional cases that you do, you are generally not nearly as vague about citing those arguments. The wording just feels manipulative. What the wording actually accomplishes, is not that it gives an actual reason, it is encouraging anyone for whom your vague wording might apply to vote for me. This kind of approach sets off alarm bells, specifically, the exact same ones that were going off in LG56. When you tried to get me mislynched. "Generally if a player is a Villager and posts enough times as Drake has, it should be fairly easy to determine their alignment." I am fairly certain that you are also aware that generally if a player is a Villager and posts as often as I do, it is fairly easy to find inconsistencies and nitpicks. I wouldn't expect this to excuse me from suspicion, but I kind of would expect it to be a consideration. Also, for what it's worth, I guess I don't think it should be that hard to determine my alignment? You yourself have said you have not had the opportunity to read my posts carefully, so it is rather unclear that I am at fault if you are experiencing difficulty in determining my alignment. "Any amount of doubt could equate to their "guilt" bleeding through." Again, this feels much more like an encouragement for those who have a bad gut read on me to vote than it is an actual reason. "Like with Fura and their read of me, I'm concerned about this being a potential pocket." I do not find this point particularly suspicious, but I do disagree with it wholeheartedly, on the grounds that I literally can't remember the last game I've played as a villager where I haven't been accused of pocketing. Literally the only game in the recent past where I haven't been accused of pocketing en masse was the one where I actually was playing to an evil win con. I was online briefly to skim the thread. I didn't notice Venture's claim. I probably still would have considered killing Venture on account of them being all but confirmed. Why Stick in particular? Independent of my alignment, this rhyme pleases me We don't have many tries, so it's time for some analysis. I feel pretty confident that if the reasoning I made was valid last cycle, that it is still valid. The only call I made that was particularly questionable was trusting Stick, and I am happily willing to bet the game on Stick being a villager. So, going off my narrowed-down suspect list from last cycle: Furamirionind Rathmaskal Butt Ad Venture Amanuensis Removing Venture on account of being dead and Fura on account of me adjusting my read of her. Also, adding CadCom, who was removed from my list last cycle mainly because I didn't feel like voting on them twice in a row. Amanuensis CadCom Rathmaskal My suspicions more or less follow in that order. I am somewhat less suspicious of Rath due to the probability that they are a soother. Both by hunting for guilt and by independently using PoE on those I don't think are guilty, it would seem that I have converged on Aman.
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Huh. Looks like I almost got lynched. In the future, please go about trying to lynch me when I am online (in fairness, I probably could have been online at the end of the cycle if I had tried harder, as it does work reasonably well with my timezone) It also looks like Snipexe got lynched, for reasons I don't fully understand, considering they only made a single and rather sparse post. On the bright side, we now have evidence of at least two village vote manipulators (looking at the rules, the inquisitor could not have soothed the vote off of Rath), which means Fura's calculations may not be as bleak as they originally seemed. On the less-than-bright side, one of them is now dead. Not particularly more inclined to trust Rath judging from their response to my vote, although I also don't really suspect them more than I already did, either. For the record, my original plan was to just pretend to have a lynch and then retract my vote, but Fura's math changed my mind and I decided I would be pushing for a real D1 lynch after all. ...and yeah. I don't think I have anything else to say right now. Runs off to barricade the doors for the night and pray.
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It is debatable whether you should count me as "opposed to a D1 lynch", considering my vote is currently the only one that actually meets the voting minimum required to lynch another player. Anyway, you found a rather interesting correlation. Why do you think that is? My take is that there are two rather different groups of people who haven't expressed confusion at the rules: On one hand, you have those who read the rules carefully, and so do not misunderstand them. These are people who are deliberative, so it makes sense that they would be opposed to a D1 lynch, as per your observation. On the other, you have those who just aren't primarily interested in the particulars of the rules. I suspect myself and Sart both fall into this category, which makes it less clear that there is a correlation within this subgroup. I'm no more eager than you are to dredge up the exact posts, but I will say this: I've said my piece about D1 lynches in pretty much every game I was in where it came up. Notably in LG56 (which you participated in), where I advocated an extremely similar approach to the one I am taking right now (in the case of LG56, my plan failed rather spectacularly, but that is besides the point I believe the theory was sound, though the implementation was clearly not). Is there a particular reason for this? Reading between the lines, this seems to be on the grounds that I am opposed to a D1 lynch, which is 1) not exactly true and 2) in context, pretty consistent with my thoughts in previous games as a villager.
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Much better. Ah, how I've missed being able to type on a computer Fura's calculations are somewhat disheartening for the prospects of the village, but if I understand them correctly, it is actually in the village's interest to have a D1 lynch. And either way, I am still pretending we are going to do one. Down to business: 1. Furamirionind - Neutral. Behaving a little differently in terms of asking so many questions and doing calculations on the game duration, but I am willing to call that NAI for the time being because Fura is the type to intentionally tweak their playstyle in each new game. 2. Cicada - Welcome aboard I swear we don't bite most of the times 3. Xinoehp512 - Hasn't posted. 4. DrakeMarshmallow - Me! 5. Stick - Village read. This particular post strikes me as fairly sincere: 6. CadCom - Neutral, following their response to my vote. I also appreciate the reads list. I also appreciate that their RP character likes to hoard all the shiny boxings 7. Rathmaskal - ??? good rap though 8. Shanerockes - Doesn't appear to have said much. 9. Butt Ad Venture - Voted for Stick for reasons I don't fully understand and then retracted. Did some neat RP. Neutral. 10. Devotary of Spontaneity - Slight village read due to unspecified particulars of their mechanical analysis. 11. Amanuensis - Neutral. I don't really expect any easy tells here, at least not in the timeframe of the first cycle. 12. Sart - Slight village read. Generally it feels like where Sart is coming from in this game is the same as village!Sart usually. 13. Snipexe - Hasn't posted yet. Eliminating inactives, people I trust, or people I am otherwise unwilling to vote for: Furamirionind Rathmaskal Butt Ad Venture Amanuensis That's not even a very big group. This is workable. I arbitrarily select Rath, mostly on the grounds that they already have a vote. @Rathmaskal I don't suppose that you could convince me otherwise?
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The explanation makes sense, even if I don’t fully agree with the methodology. Cadmium. Those calculations are concerning, to say the least. Seems like we don’t really have many chances to get it right. I can imagine a few ways for an inquisitor to exploit that. Hrm.
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Yay, a reasonably active thread I have classes to get to right now, but for now, Snip. My poke appears not to have worked, which is really quite unfortunate, but I don’t think keeping my vote there will be constructive. In the interests of continuing to pretend that we are going to lynch somebody, Cadmium @Cadmium Compounder. I am not in principle opposed to randomness to choose votes, having done so myself once or twice, but your use of it seems mildly suspect. You don’t want a lynch, but you feel you ought to vote anyway because you believe a lynch is inevitable, and you can at least direct the outcome. This is well and good. I can get behind that. But if that is where you are coming from, why vote according to RNG? What RNG voting accomplishes is pushing for a lynch without any particular direction, which is almost exactly the opposite of what you said you wanted. Probably I am simply misunderstanding your thought process, but I would be grateful for an explanation.
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Hello. I’m actually a bit tempted to say that there being only one eliminator at the moment tips the balance away from a D1 lynch being a good idea. We gain less info in the ways of teammates trying to protect each other, not to mention the odds of guessing right are obviously lower although this isn’t the primary purpose of a D1 lynch. But, instead of derailing the conversation with the discussion of whether or not we should even have a lynch, lets for now just pretend that we are going to have one This is much more useful. @Snipexe (Snipexe) hi. How’s life? I see you viewing the thread right now so I figure this is a worthwhile poke. Do you have any take on how the conversion aspect of the game works?
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Bravo, that was quite well written. I am tempted to take one of the more open-ended options like poking around the city or starting a hobby. I strongly suspect that going about the city will reveal something interesting. Also, meeting another Returned would be interesting. It seems pretty natural for our new Returned to be questioning how each of the others deal with being enshrined as gods. Firesoul is the most clearly good Returned and probably worth talking to. Lawmaker is probably the most influential and experienced, which is also fairly important. Coinspender would also be an interesting meeting, even though I am lead to believe it would be more of a “known thine enemy” kind of meeting than anything else. Also, it might be a good idea to talk to Hera before meeting with a bunch of other Returned, because she clearly has a better idea of what is going on and also generally because having a good relationship with one’s high priest is important. Also still in favor of developing the religion of Songbearer the Wise (and accompanying songs). As far as basic tenets go... You kind of can’t beat the golden rule XD I would prefer not to just rip that off though. I’m also kind of curious if Songbearer could get away with publishing teachings about the nature of the Returned themselves. In short, many interesting options. Hopefully there will be opportunities to meet all the other Returned in the future. My picks are: [X] Talk to Hera to get some kind of basic understanding about who is who and avoid any grave offenses, as well as just generally building rapport with the person who’s job it is to put up with everything Songbearer chooses to do. [X] Research more about Returned. In particular, I am wondering if we can read about the rumored ability to change appearance, maybe start the first steps of learning how to do that, if that is allowed. The possibilities of exploring the city without looking like a Returned are very interesting to me.
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Exciting. Time to make a place for Songbearer the Wise in the ever-changing pantheon of the Hallandren gods. The robe sounds cool-looking and interestingly symbolic. However, in the interests of playing devil’s advocate, I advocate for the sculpture: We are a new Returned about to enter the political arena of Hallandren. If your name is “the Wise” you ought to be a decently good leader, even if they aren’t necessarily the most powerful member of the court. The sculpture seems to be the choice that most embraces this particular duty of the Returned. Not to mention, it’s a sculpture of Returned, which I would imagine is a subject Songbearer is interested in at the moment. Songbearer has an empty gallery. A sculpture is big and permanent, just the thing to start off an empty gallery. I like ceramics Making Returned friends sounds like a very good idea. Our Returned may not be the most charming but at least they can put in the effort. I think we should also get to work on the tenants of Songbearer the Wise’s religion. How can we earn the epithet Songbearer the Wise without having wise teachings? Preferably teachings that are put to verse in easily memorable songs In conclusion: [X] Gods at Council - Preferably with an enigmatic remark about how “the colors agree with me” or some similar vagueness. Gotta give the speculators something to do [X] Develop Religion - I suggest we start with something fairly simple. A few basic tenets with broad moral applications. However, all of the teachings should be put to song and publicized only in that form. If possible, these will be fully original melodies created either by Songbearer himself or commissioned from skilled artists. [X] Visit another Returned - Preferably someone known for actually making an effort to help their petitioners every week through mundane means. And/or a clever scholarly type so that they will potentially have something in common.
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Is your character secretly Agrajag?
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Redshift - Prologue Redshift kept a very good diary. He glanced up from the sixteenth diary, matching the waitress’ face to the picture. Her hair was different. “Alayna Reeves?” He asked. It was a slow day, and he was the only customer. “That’s me,” the waitress confirmed. “I’m sorry sir, but… Do I know you from somewhere?” “On October the 1st, 2003, you served a man named Kian Hardy who stopped for dinner on a road trip. Steak and potatoes.” Redshift met her eyes with unhinged intensity. “Uh. Maybe?” Alayna laughed nervously. “That was years ago. I don’t remember.” “You’re lying,” he said confidently. “You remember. Have you told anyone else?” “What? I’m not lying.” She was beginning to look genuinely alarmed. ”I said. Have. You. Told. Anyone. Else.” “Please— I don’t want any trouble. Who are you?” “My name is Redshift,” he growled. “And Kian Hardy is dead!!” For a moment, Redshift tapped into his power. For a moment, he was no longer a person, a collection of atoms and molecules, he was a wave of devastating force. When he reformed at the other end of the room, his destructive wake unfurled. A whirling storm of unseen blades cut into every surface along his path, shredding the flooring, the table, the chairs, and of course, the waitress. In a matter of seconds, the aftershock died down, and all was still. “I’ll have to tear the whole place down,” he spoke to himself. “Just to be safe.” . . . Redshift inspected the next page of the sixteenth diary: The Road Trip, chapter fourteen. He remembered. Kian Hardy’s next stop had been Edmonton. Some epics stopped their rendings. They extinguished a few of their closest connections, and then settled down into quieter living. Redshift had never stopped. After all, he kept a very good diary.
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Well, this looks fun. I’ll throw something into the hat:
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I shall sign up as Tersin Forrelken, a minor-noble-turned-obligator presiding over the Board of Livestock Quality Control. Also known as a “Veal Inquisitor”
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The beginning of something much larger
DrakeMarshall replied to Nathrangking's topic in Creator's Corner
Not totally removed, no. Just... It doesn’t line up enough to feel like it’s purely a metaphor for his conflict with those around him, and the battle scene isn’t modern enough to be a flashback or something, so I suspect there is more to it than that. Well, there were already some ominous details regarding Ms. Devlin in the prologue. Combined with imagery involving copious amounts of fire, it almost makes me wonder if this is deal is of the infernal sort. -
The beginning of something much larger
DrakeMarshall replied to Nathrangking's topic in Creator's Corner
Interesting. Do you already know the answer? I would not expect you to put something like that without having a meaning for it in mind, and yet you seem to have a more open-ended idea of where you are going with this. The battle comes across as a little too detailed, and a little to removed from the man’s own experience, to be anything purely in his imagination. The best way I can describe the battle and what comes after is apocalyptic, and not necessarily according to the modern sense of the world, more along the lines of the ancient genre. However, I don’t know at all what it is getting at. I would say that yes, the fire and ash relates to the battle. The moment he puts on the glasses, the scenes start getting scoured by continual flames. It’s ending the battle, but not in a good way. It suggests something sinister about the nature of the man’s deal. -
Ah, I see we view the sacred tradition of pact-making in exactly the same light I would not have contacted you seeking a bargain without terms already drafted in advance. I very much look forwards to dealing with you in the future
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The beginning of something much larger
DrakeMarshall replied to Nathrangking's topic in Creator's Corner
Well, I still have absolutely no idea what is going on It’s a bit refreshing to be reading something where I just have literally no idea at all where it is going, but I am still fairly sure it is going somewhere. The weaving together of seemingly two parallel narratives was pretty jarring at first, but I take it that was on purpose. At first I wondered if the battle scenery was some sort of extended metaphor for their argument, but I don’t think that checks out. I also noticed a pretty dramatic shift in the parallel descriptions once he put the glasses on. Before there was some kind of battle, but after there was just a bunch of fire and ashes, which doesn’t bode well. -
Would you really? I am hurt. And here I thought you viewed the sacred tradition of pact-making in much the same light as I do. Incidentally, your jail RP was top notch. Oof. Touche. To be fair though, I truly don’t think I was throwing out my main win condition. I agree that it is fair to call such behavior poor form (though I disagree with the sentiment that having the special win condition fall into your lap is really the only proper way to achieve it, on the grounds that I doubt it would be included in the game if that were true). I absolutely think it is important for players to generally play to their win conditions, since they are set up to make the game work and be fun, and ignoring them is a good way to break the game. I realized that without a kill, the threat that the eliminator team posed was directly in proportion to their numbers. I played most of the game as a straight villager, working with the rest of the village to hunt elims, even going so far as to try (and, sadly, fail) to hammer the corrupt constable. I planned for the village to be on the cusp of winning, at which point I would then race the village to reach my special win con. It certainly wasn’t all by my doing, but this is pretty much exactly what happened. In that last cycle, both the village and me individually would have won, I just beat them in the order of actions (clarifying that the mass-kill bribery happened before the lynch was one of my very first questions to Joe in our PM). I really wasn’t throwing away my win condition, I made pretty sure that one of my two possible win cons was inevitably going to be met. I fully believe that this in the spirit of playing to my win con. Most of what I did at least partially advanced both of my two possible win conditions. I deliberately lowered the quality of my analysis at the end, but I knew it wasn’t threatening the village win condition, just delaying it. The only purely anti-village action I took was killing Fifth, and that was because I calculated that killing Fifth would put me over 40 boxings and end the game. I wouldn’t have done that otherwise.
