DrakeMarshall

Wow, like 15 posts since I last checked, you guys really aren't messing around. Which, is good. Keep it up If humongous D1 threads aren't a trademark of this game, they definitely should be. Okay, here it is: Vote Tally Ventyl (3): Biplet, Matrim's Dice, Szeth_Pancakes Experience (2): Archer, DrakeMarshall Matrim's Dice (2): manukos, Araris Dannex (1): Flyingbooks im sorry I can't think of a legit summary pls forgive me Yay you're here. Not gonna lie, it's kinda hard and time consuming to make fake reads as an elim Now that MR43 is fresh in my mind I'm remembering that I put off posting any reads for the longest time and it almost got me killed by the village. That said, I hope the next time I am an elim I will have learned from that mistake, but hey, not gonna argue with somebody leaning village about me. Yeah, I guess that's a completely fair observation. From where I'm standing, I have a bunch of PM conversation to supplement my read of Szeth with, but probably if I only had their posts in the thread I would put them in a similar category as Ashbringer, you are right. As for the contents of those PMs and why I read it as village, well, some of it was gut reading and some of it was me asking some questions that I think an elim would have not have wanted to answer as quickly as they did. Idk that's pretty much it, I wouldn't particularly blame you if this wasn't a concrete enough reason to persuade you to trust Szeth. I'm guessing this is probably well over 200 words by now so I'm gonna hit submit reply and continue in a new post.

Rays of reddish light filtered through the windows as the sun touched the horizon, casting the meeting hall in sharp focus. The meeting hall of Garmet was basically always in disarray, but what with the tension between Elendel and Garmet representatives, plus all of the bustle over the whole rebellion thing, it was even more chaotic than usual. Folks standing up and yelling at each other til they were red in the face, scraps of paper and quiche crumbs that only accumulated after the sweeper had apparently abandoned them to their fate following an unfortunate incident with a juice puddle, and several overturned tables. The problem was, everyone was just shooting each other's ideas down. Walk to Elendel? They said incredulously. Preposterous! Too far away, not enough supplies, risk of exposure, the tide of complaints just never seemed to end. These people had no appreciation for genius. None at all. Well, that was on them. Juno was patient. She would keep on suggesting good ideas until somebody finally had the good sense to follow them. "We should just rebuild the train tracks. How hard can it be?" "We should order twice as many refreshments tomorrow." "We should try bribing the kandra." "We should barricade the meeting hall against intruders." "We should execute an absentee." Wait. That last one actually has support? What.

Excellent, thank you for posting so I can make another 200 word post. We should have more debates in the thread, this is very profitable. Okay so maybe we have gotten into the game enough that I can start trying my hand at a reads list, huh? Can't let you have all the fun. By necessity, the degree of confidence / magnitude of my reads on people are quite small, this early in the game. Here is my color key of reads: Village Read Slight Village Read Very Slight Village Read No Read Very Slight Elim Read Slight Elim Read Elim Read And here is my read on the player list: Ashbringer - Has mostly been involved in RP, and also responded to my poke. The RP is great and entirely NAI, so my read is close to neutral. But I'm just a little wary of a player who is active enough to be doing game discussion but whose main game discussion post was responding to a vote. Biplet - My read on them was neutral. But then I read back their initial post, and I have a slight village read from how they said it would make sense for the elims to have 3 players if one of them was a thug or bloodmaker or something. I figure an elim might be less jazzed at the idea of only having 3 players, extra life or no. Szeth_Pancakes - Basically they just seemed village in our PM. I sorta asked them a lot of questions. Matrim's Dice - They lead the votes for a while and nobody tried to hard to shift the vote, and they have been more forthcoming than most about reads. Lotus - Has made an RP post and a one-line question post. Not much to go on. Araris Valerian - I approve of raising the stakes by placing a second vote on somebody, but I am fairly sure Araris would do this no matter what alignment. I'm a wee bit suspicious of the comment about vote manips, because of how it was framed. Almost assuming that the elims wouldn't have any vote manips, only the village might, which could be a case of TMI. But I am also inclined to trust the impulse to mix things up with the votes when nobody has really spoken up to contest them for a while, so... Yeah IDK. The Unknown Order - Their name is accurate. @The Unknown Order care to comment on the game any? DrakeMarshall - I cannot analyze myself for you This one's in your court. Jondesu - It is common for players to give advice on how to use roles, cuz it is early in the game and hey, not much else to talk about, right? This is something both village and elims do. But, I kind of like that their advice was literally just for everyone to use their roles. Because, literally just not using the roles we have is honestly a legitimate problem the village can run into. In my experience, this isn't as much a thing to worry about for the elims. Archer - I have sort of a conflicted gut read on them, and I'm not seeing much in their posts that tips it one way or the other. Ventyl - So far they have just asked for a summary, which I would call NAI. Hopefully the flashbacks from LG66 do not unduly bias me into thinking they are an elim. Experience - Has not posted. @Experience are you around? Devotary of Spontaneity - Has not posted. @Devotary of Spontaneity how bout you? Azmine_king - Has not posted. @Azmine_king what bout you? Mist - Has not posted. @Mist how bout you? |TJ| - They have said some analysis posts that look good, but I don't really have an alignment read yet. manukos - I would call it mostly NAI to not request special treatment, although some may disagree. Dannex - A bit of commentary on kandra, and has expressed an intention to focus a lot on PMs. If that is where their focus is, I am hoping to get a better read off of our PM eventually. Flyingbooks - Non-RP content consists of a poke vote on Dannex and a request for PMs. Like for Dannex, I am hoping to get more of a read from our PM. So... Yeah. That's where I'm at. I reckon I could either vote on one of the yellow-orange peeps I have very slight reasons to suspect (who, oddly, are people I already voted on once?), or I could try and vote one of the people I have no real read on and just see what happens. Welp, that's D1 for you I guess. Also Biplet just ninja'd me and voted for Experience. Hm. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

Yay people posted that means I can reply again. Mindmelds in specific cases is a good reason to trust somebody, bc if you're indeed a villager then you assume other villagers will think along some of the same lines as you, but from there is always hard not to fall into "I agree with what they said so they must be good." Not saying that's the case here, but, from how you described, it sounds like neither of you guys were actively searching for a change in playstyles among players, it's just sorta a thing you noticed about me. And while intentionally cross-referencing players to find something like that is definitely villagey, just sorta noticing a thing is more something that an elim can do too. Just in general, I'm kinda wary of arguments of the form "X is a thing a village would do" or "X is a thing an elim would do" because they don't always cut it, it's gotta be "X is a thing a villager would be more likely to do than an elim" or "X is a thing an elim would be more likely to do than a villager". The reads rainbow is pretty and I approve of it, even if for some reason I'm on the bottom of it. Seriously, I've already said something like this in my PM with matrim but this is really for everyone: posting reads lists, even without much justification (and even if they're sometimes wrong), is a good thing for the village, full stop. Matrim's kinda ahead of the game posting one this early, but this is really something we all should be doing. I very appreciate this. I played in LG66 and there are still things in here I didn't know about Mhm. It's all part of my master plan to make everyone focus on PMs so I can get all da boxings in the thread With all due respect, I rather resent the statement that yours is the only actual vote But really, I mean it. I don't think you've explained your vote on me much better than anyone else has explained their votes. And at the end of the day, I'm pretty sure what constitutes an actual vote is the willingness to see the person you voted for actually be removed. And if nothing changes, I really do believe Experience is the best place for my vote to be for the rest of the cycle. I am pretty sure Araris had some real intent behind their vote as well. This is sensible. I would only invest a very small amount of trust in those voted because of it, but even so, we might have better luck mixing things up and voting for new people. Do you have any suggestions?

I am reasonably happy with how this game is launching, but you know, I think there are two things we need right now. First of all, come on guys, the activity rewards are fairly generous in this game! We can do better than three pages, right? Second of all: Vote Tally Araris Valerian (1): DrakeMarshall DrakeMarshall (1): Matrim's Dice Experience (1): Archer Matrim's Dice (2): manukos, Araris Dannex (1): Flyingbooks Azmine (1): Szeth_Pancakes The voter turnout is decently good, for which I am grateful, but the cycle is more than halfway through and there is literally only one person with more than a single vote on them. I also don't think it's a great idea to remove literally the only player so far who has shared more than one or two reads, regardless of if those reads are wrong. I know it's D1 and lord ruler knows I don't have much to go on rn, but as the end of the turn draws near we do need to start taking the vote seriously. Therefore, Experience, you have been nominated to share the chopping block with matrim until such a time as you speak up or somebody else breaks the tie. No hard feelings, but if I want to follow my own advice and not spread the vote between like 6 players, my choices are: one of the most active players in the game who hasn't done anything particularly sus, two players I have never played with before and would like to get a chance to meet, and a player who still hasn't posted anything.

Typically I use the line thingy for posts that combine both RP and analysis, but I would also be down to do italics for RP or something to that effect if we want to establish a particular convention.

LG66 I remember, I should hope, since it's the game that this one is a rerun of. But what was MR43? Ohhh that was the murder mystery one with unreasonably bloodthirsty RNG and a crazy number of kills and protects flying around towards the end, during which I repeatedly insisted I was a village scanner and somehow didn't get knifed before the curtain dropped. Good times Anyways what I wanna say is that if you look at my playstyle across more than just those two games (have we really only played two games together btw?) you might see something a little more nuanced. And by nuanced I mean wildly chaotic and generally just slightly confusing to myself as well as to others. I can definitely remember elim games I've played that were uncharacteristically passive (actually, that probably tended to be one of my biggest tells, at least at the beginning of my career as a dirty no-good eliminator). And I can definitely remember a lot of games I've played as a villager where others might have called my playstyle "proactive" or even sometimes "aggressive" Idk on the scale of LG66!Drake vibes and MR43!Drake vibes, I guess I'd say I feel somewhere in the middle vibes today? Like, I probably am having less chill in this game than I did in LG66, but I'm also probably being generally more facetious and less focused than I was in MR43. Not sure if there's a good comparison for a game I've played similarly to how I am playing this one, but I guess my playstyle in this one is by definition part of village!Drake's playbook But yeah honestly this is fine, waiting and seeing is good. You should have no deficit of information on me in the meantime, and I rather hope my voting patterns will eventually speak for themselves. Anyway, in the spirit of asking people stuff, I wouldn't mind if you further explained the read on Archer. Although if it's just village reading somebody on account of their sharing any sort of read this early into the game, I suppose that is more or less valid. Also, Line of Duty. Nice.

such as convincing enough players to support caravanning to Elendel?

See, I thought that might be it Your ability to fly under the radar is manifesting in new and powerful ways, much to the dismay of my bot, and on D1 of a game no less.

Yes, this analysis is entirely correct and without error You are in absolutely no danger whatsoever because we are clearly both eliminator teammates and I would absolutely never dream of throwing a teammate under the bus. When have I ever done anything like that? Also, while we are here, would you mind explaining what manner of eldritch magicks you used to place your vote on matrim? My poor vote tally bot can't seem to detect the vote no matter how much fiddling I do with its parameters, and I'm beginning to suspect I might have to, y'know, actually debug it. For anyone who wants to know, the vote tally should be this: Vote Tally Araris Valerian (1): DrakeMarshall Experience (1): Archer Matrim's Dice (2): manukos, Araris Valerian Azmine (1): Szeth_Pancakes But it keeps missing your vote I don't particularly want to see matrim voted up, but seeing as I clearly don't have any better ideas, and in any case I doubt the votes at the end of the cycle will much resemble what they are now, I see no reason to change my vote yet. On another note, I have not noticed any obvious gaspers yet, which is interesting. It is one of the easier roles to detect (or for that matter to impersonate), and when I was a gasper in the last game it became public knowledge very quickly. I was kinda hoping to PM any gaspers that cropped up this time around Most likely, I figure this means that anyone who has the role has a different action they would prefer to take on this cycle, which is sort of interesting. Or the role doesn't exist. Or it's user(s) just aren't that active.

I'd expect some changes to the kandra role, although it'd be really funny if it were literally just exactly the same hidden under a guise of "secret rules" Anyway, whether or not it's changed, most kandra themed roles in SE games have tricksy powers relating to dying and/or alignment flips, so I stand by the general guideline of not letting one's guard down even if it looks like a kandra died. Hey, my brain power recently got freed from college too, high five. Anyways, seeing as you've answered my questions, the retraction of my vote would be in order, Ashbringer. I dunno if connectors are powerful in combination with stuff so much as they're just powerful, period. Almost too powerful to give to an elim team due to the effects on parity, but there isn't a lot I would rule out completely with Striker. I do think the role distribution is almost certainly done by hand, though, because yes just like in the last game there are some combinations that are either obviously under or over powered (soulbearer+coinshot would be awesome, though ). Examining the new rules, a bloodmaker might be one of the hardest players to kill in any way, at least so long as they don't die early while storing up charges. I love the sheer potential for chaos created by sliders and pulsers Yes, it would not be terribly inconceivable for there to be both an elim and a village tineye. On the other hand, seeing as that's what happened last time, maybe it would be terribly inconceivable For what it's worth, I have known eliminators to say stuff like that at the beginning of a game, and I would personally not consider it alignment indicative either way. I'm fairly transparent about my strategy except when I'm not I would argue that redirecting pressure is basically the whole point of the vote discussion, whether you are village or elim. I am very likely to attempt to redirect the course of at least one vote in this game, and I will not apologize for doing so. That said, if you are referring specifically to creating tied votes, that is a strategy I prefer to reserve for the earlier parts of the game, when I would generally rather have information than the ability to predict the outcome of a vote. I respectfully disagree with the notion that my 300+ word post was stretching and padding to get over the 200 word mark, and I am hurt by the very implication of such What's this?? This post looks suspiciously like a justification!!! Araris

Juno smiled beatifically as the room around her exploded in outrage. Walk to Elendel?? They said. Preposterous! "No, no, really, think about it. It's the last thing our enemies will expect. We've got to be daring to get out of this fix, and what would be more daring than walking to Elendel? Clearly these rebels have made plans around this city, so what better way to throw a wrench in that then hitting the road?" Her audience did not look impressed. The opposite, in fact. Downright disrespectful of them, booing the principal member of the illustrious Garmet Board of Somethingorother like that. Downright disrespectful. "And, and! It's not as bad as you think! Judging by the distance..." Juno stared blankly for a moment, engrossed in mental calculations... "It's about five days journey, give or take. Some of you could probably manage less than even that if you went on ahead." Nothing? Rust and ruin, there was no pleasing these people today. She made a put-upon expression at the crowd. "Look, all's I'm saying is think about it. There's no reason we can't root out the traitors in our midst while we're on the move. Maybe we can put it to vote or somethin." Juno retreated back to her seat, absconding with a second quiche from the refreshments table. Those things were storming tasty. Better than this ungrateful crowd deserved, and that was the truth.

Okay so game time. First thing's first, it is my duty as a villager to vote for a random person!! Except not necessarily completely random because there are already some people with some votes. And I'm not quite ready to put somebody in the lead for votes, not yet. Even by the end of the cycle ideally I want there to be a two-way tie in the votes. Go go tallybot: Vote Tally Experience (1): Archer Matrim's_Dice (1): manukos Azmine (1): Szeth_Pancakes Ashbringer (1): DrakeMarshall Ashbringer (@Ashbringer), congratulations you have been picked!! So... Idk what do you think about the game? Any interesting potential strategies a village or elim could use with all of these shiny roles? Personally, I was considering pretending to be a slider if I got to be an elim, bc you could pretend to have redirected an elim kill, and bc it would throw doubt on any scans made against you. I'm not even sure if players are informed if their actions are redirected, though. My preliminary thoughts for the game setup: Factions: I wouldn't worry too much about differentiating kandra and elims at this point: if we can manage to catch either today we're already doing quite well It goes without saying that I wouldn't let my guard down even if a dead player flips "kandra" Roles: There are a lot of them I hope nobody is literally just an aluminum gnat We must keep tineyes alive at all costs!! In addition to letting us talk amongst each other, they account for a quite substantial fraction of Garmet's economy! They represent two easily earned boxings given to each player every turn!* *Unless all tineyes are evil, in which case I will be sad, but we should probably kill them. Boxings: I want all of the boxings and don't have any If you have more boxings than me I might stab you Death will not stop me from obtaining boxings, and if there isn't a betting pool in the dead doc I will make one if and when I get there That is all, thank you for coming to my Ted-Talk. Also, feel free to PM me, I feel like using PMs more in this game

Juno watched as the constables escorted a woman into the meeting hall. Isendwel, was it? It was. One of the poor sods that made up the entourage for the Elendel officials. Unremarkable except for the fact that she was apparently conspiring against Elendel. And, really, who could honestly blame her? Elendel wasn't all that. Juno had half a mind to speak up for the girl, only she held off, because blowing up Garmet's railways was bloody inconsiderate of these revolutionaries. Did they seriously have any idea how long it would take to repair those? Juno's wooden chair creaked in protest as she leaned back on it and propped her feet on the desk in front of her. This was gonna take a while. Whispers and then louder voices filled the hall. The constables looked on edge, bless their souls, like they actually expected the folks in charge to have a handle on the whole "revolution" thing. One of the dandies from Elendel suggested torturing Isendwel for information and got shouted down by his peers. Another wanted to negotiate with the rebels and got accused of siding with them. Eventually Goren managed to get things in order, and convinced everyone to more or less agree on killing the rebels. Problem solved. Well then. Juno stood up, stretching her legs and snatching one of those little quiche things from the refreshments table to nibble on as she walked. She made her way to the front of the hall, smiling blithely at the Elendel and Garmet officials amassed in front of her. She cleared her throat. "I have a proposal. The solution to our present dilemma is obvious. Why don't we all just walk to Elendel?"

Quick! Everybody reading this sign up and ruin Striker's role distribution!

Hurrah, a wild feedback has appeared! Thank you; it is in many ways quite insightful. I am pretty sure I have come across the elim variant at some point, though I do not recall where or when. It would be valid to draw parallels between them, seeing as it is a considerable part of my inspiration for this role. However, I do believe the particulars of this role might address at least some of the issues you outlined. To speak to the first one, all of my thinking about the balance of this role has taken for granted the fact that nobody would roleclaim in such a game (at least, certainly not in the thread). It would be a tad silly of me to suggest a role that deliberately encourages an absence of roleclaiming, which then becomes broken in the event that nobody roleclaims If anything, the role becomes broken if people do start roleclaiming for whatever reason, in which case half of the serial killer's job has already been done for them. Remember that the serial killer has the ability to submit guesses for every player on every night. If the game went on long enough, they are guaranteed to eventually find everyone's role no matter what, even if nobody role claims and they are just making completely random guesses. The question is how much better than random they can do: how quickly they can manage to narrow down who is who, and how long they can survive in the meantime. And surviving while figuring out who is who is largely the premise of the game, no? This is much the same challenge one is presented with when choosing who to vote up or who to use an alignment scanner on. For other things: You are entirely correct that a game still has to be balanced if the SK dies. The deterrent to roleclaiming is conditional on the SK's survival. Or another way to look at it is that it potentially only works as a deterrent in the early game, and not the late game. The role is definitely not an effective band-aid for a game setup that would become broken if everyone roleclaimed. The idea of a deterrent from roleclaiming appeals to me more as a way to mix up the meta, not as a way to fix balance issues that are part of a game. Yeah, this is gonna be a bit of an issue for the SK role, no matter which way you cut it. While most any SK will hit more villagers in the average game (at least until the elims have taken a clear lead), that tendency is likely exaggerated for this particular SK, for the simple reason that guessing "village" alignment is much more likely to result in a successful kill. The presence of this role improves the odds for the elims to some extent, and any setup that uses it will have to take that into account, and even the scales somehow. Even so, I do not think the disparity is as dire as you may believe, because of two mitigating factors: It is decidedly not in the SK's interest to wipe out the village while leaving the elim team intact. This is especially the case because in many setups, the SK will lose automatically if the elims ever reach parity, which means the SK has to kill all the elims before finishing off the village. Even though submitting "village" for most of your guesses is definitely the best way to get early kills, I would argue that this playstyle is not always the optimal way to play the role. The role is not really limited by action economy: it can theoretically kill everyone concurrently in one night. As such, I would think that getting information is at least as valuable as getting kills, and getting to rule out possibilities for somebody's role/alignment might sometimes be as useful as killing them. Yeah, this is one of the big reasons that a game like this is needs to have some roles (or combinations of roles, if that's a thing the game does) that are not given to anyone. Such holes in the roster hopefully make a systematic approach like the one you are describing rather more unsafe, since it means any attempt at removing the high-power village roles could end up being wasted. Also, I would imagine one of the roles with the biggest targets on their backs would be protect-type roles, and if you give them the ability to self-protect, than they at least have the ability to anticipate and counter the strategy you are describing. I suppose this need not necessarily be restricted to only protective roles: any sufficiently "high-powered" role with an obvious target on their back could receive a complementary limited-use ability to self-protect. This would be yet another thing that would have to be factored into the game balance, but it's an option. At the end of the day, you're right that the role needs a very specific setup in order to work. It's a game that needs to be interesting and playable with the SK, and equally interesting and playable without it, which is no mean feat. And it's practically required that the GM who does role distribution is trolling the players In addition, a lot of thought has to be given about how many possible roles to include, since this directly impacts the SK's power compared to everybody else. As roles go, this role is undoubtedly trickier than most to incorporate into a setup whilst maintaining balance. Idk if it would ever get used in anything, but I can hope the payoff would be worth the trouble It's definitely fiddly, but a lot of SKs are fiddly, and I do think there are real gains you get from making this be an SK role and not an elim role. I think a relatively simple (at least on paper) ability that escalates in power as the game goes on is a good fit for an SK, and I hope that it creates a third party with genuinely different and interesting methods compared to the other two factions. Phew and now I've gone and made a really rather lengthy post for what was initially a pretty short role description Anyway I guess this is plausibly a good warmup for the upcoming game? Because Lord Ruler knows I like making big analysis posts* *unless I'm a Gasper again

For what it's worth when I got my wisdom teeth out it was fairly painless The recovery was more of a bother than the actual operation But yeah I was pretty nervous too

@StrikerEZ good luck with the wisdom teeth

Was gonna say the setup reminds me of the shard games. Others already pointed this out. There are parallels, what with there being planet docs and players getting abilities based on what planet they're on and stuff. But you know, the more I think about it, the more it reminds me of another game from long ago: QF21. Actually this was the first game I ever played as an eliminator Didn't end up winning that one, alas Basically, the premise of the game was that game-related discussion was banned from the thread. Everything had to be done in one-on-one PMs. Except, you couldn't just make PMs at-will. You were put in contact with 2 random other players at the start of the game. IIRC, the only ways to gain additional contacts was from the intervention of a special role, or if one of your contacts died you would inherit one of your dead contact's contacts. So it kinda resulted in this really tangled web of PMs where game discussion could happen, but a lot of the stuff you would hear would be second or thirdhand. It worked surprisingly well, all things considered. I think the setup you have in mind could also work surprisingly well. There is a possibly pertinent difference between your setup and QF21, though. In your planets setup, if you wanted to get a message out to somebody on a different planet, you would have to wait at least one cycle for people to move between planets, and potentially another cycle to receive their reply. In QF21, it was theoretically possible to have something you say reach any other player without having to wait a cycle, if enough people were interested in relaying it. You might have needed to go through several intermediaries, but everyone was reachable, and so the game discussion was still at least sorta unified. Idk hopefully this anecdote is at least somewhat relevant and/or helpful. Like you said, a possible spin on the "planets" setup is that people are given a fairly limited ability to use PMs. So a small amount of communication between planets is possible, but the quality of communication between people who are on the same planet is vastly better. I can think of maybe a few meaningfully distinct ways to do that: Everyone starts the game with 1 or 2 PMs with other players. This is maybe boring, but it ensures that connections are spread evenly and that they exist from D1. There is a role/item that confers the ability to start PMs. Possibly flavored as seons. Anyone can start PMs, but only with people who are currently on the same planet, and it costs an action. Possibly flavored as creating a pair of spanreeds and giving one half to another player. In which case, this might be the ability players get when they visit Roshar, instead of a thing you can do everywhere.

So a random weird game idea I just had: A Serial Killer type role but with a very nonstandard killing power based on information gathering. Every night they can submit one role+alignment guess for each player. All players whose roles and alignments were both correctly guessed on that night are attacked. Now, this would be horribly unbalanced in anything but an extreme role madness game, probably one where each player has a unique role or set of roles, and there are some possible configurations of roles that never even appear in the game. But for such a game, it might be balanced. The Serial Killer starts out extremely weak and probably unable to kill anyone on the first cycle, but gets stronger as they accumulate more information, to the point where if the other factions let them live into the late game they are a massive threat who could theoretically end the game in a single night. Serial Killers often have a much harder time hiding in the late game compared to the early game, so this sort of escalation sort of works. Also, it gives the Serial Killer quite a bit more to do than just avoid being caught. Also, it provides a significant mechanical incentive for everyone else to avoid roleclaiming like the plague, which might be desirable in some setups. Idk how well it would actually work, but I am generally rather fond of unusual SK roles that impact how the village and elims play the game.

I think Ash was also in on it? Looking back, also Elandera and Magestar. Wow, that was one ridiculous group PM. Very, very ridiculous. For what it's worth, there was some game discussion It looks like one of my last messages in there before I died was saying something about the probability of the SHOUTY SHOUT AGENCY including some eliminators (which it most certainly did). EDIT: Ninja'd by Ashbringer

Who's to say whether or not sending "Hey, how are you" is game related? Maybe such a one-line message is secretly just a really lazy attempt at pocketing Anyways, if you send me such a message, I will absolutely take that as an invitation to strike up more game-related conversation in response. I can't answer for Striker so take what I'm saying here with one more grain of salt than however many you would usually take it with, but I'm pretty sure that any PM sent to another player counts. If there were additional requirements, I think the rules would have said so.

I have been summoned. I ought to have time for this one. I'll join. RNG hath spoken and the name that I shall sign up with shall be Juno. She is an elected official presiding over the Board of Somethingorother in the city of Garmet, and for the last week or so she has been cheerfully engaging in shouting matches with Elendel officials of various stripes, enthusiastically joining in all manner of public protests (some for causes that aren't strictly speaking compatible with each other), and generally stirring the metaphorical pot. Also, as proof that I actually read the rules this time, have a minor clarifying question: Is the 5% cumulative? So if it's the third consecutive time you targeted somebody do you have a 35% chance of learning their role on that night?

I believe this is fairly realistic. Eliminating a potential threat is generally a lot simpler than determining whether or not you can trust someone. In a game like this, I'd say trust is more valuable than the removal of a potential enemy. Or at least it is if your cardinal is high. Of course, some people might not see it that way, in which case killing is indeed a more efficient playstyle. Under the current setup, pretty much everything. It is revealed that X player took Y action targeting player(s) Z. Actions that aren't covert have something in common with voting in a regular SE game. I do think it is a reasonably substantial advantage, considering that overt actions end up having nearly twice the clout of covert actions. You can get more bang for your buck if you're willing to plan ahead and let people see you coming, but there is some element of diminishing returns. I can think of several cases where an overt approach would be pretty useful, but they aren't most cases. It might be a good idea to increase the flexibility of overt actions, though. I feel there should still be some penalty for canceling an overt action, but maybe it could just be a -1 penalty to the clout of whatever action you decide to take in its place, instead of not being able to take an action. This introduces more IKYK because you can never know for sure if they are actually taking that action or just pretending, which I think is a feature. Of course, I would be pretty surprised if my best guesses for what all the base "clout" numbers should be all turned out to be correct, and that's something worth watching for if this ever got run, so you may be right about needing to increase the clout of overt actions. Yeah, I might think about ways I can work that into the rules.