Toaster Retribution

*Kaladin - Ascends to take Honor. I know, very crackpot, but Dalinar doing it is too storming obvious, and someone will.

*Shallan - Dies in a spectacular and self-sacrificing fashion. 

*Dalinar - The "you will be a Fused-clause" is too ominous to not be happening. Dalinar will totally become a Fused. 

*Adolin - I have always thought that he would die eventually, so he'll probably survive, and become an important general in the back five. 

*Szeth - Will probably die. I don't think he has much to do in the back-half, and we will be losing characters. 

*Venli - No idea how she will factor into the plot, but her reuniting with Eshonai in the Beyond sounds like a great way for her story to end, so I'll say that she dies in Book 5. 

*Navani - Survives, and continues to act as the lady who gets Urithiru to work in the back five. 

*Jasnah, Renarin, Lift, Taln, Ash - Lives, will be super-important in the back five. 

*Mraize - Dies, just to show that he wasn't really that important and the Ghostbloods are a MUCH bigger threat than him (hope he lives though, but I don't think that is happening). 

*Nale - Will defy all odds and make it to the back five. Brandon is a huge Les Miserables fan, and Nale is way too much of a Javert to go down halfway through the series. 

*Rlain - Will survive and lead the Singers in Venlis stead. 

*Taravangian - Will stay Odiuos way into the back-half, and possibly longer than that. 

*Rysn - Will live and be an important supporting character in Book 6-10. She will ride a lanceryn. 

*Hoid - Will keep on hoidin´. 

*Moash - No way he lives past Book 5. He will die, and Ash will be the one to kill him, for murdering Jezrien. 

On 2020-12-10 at 5:11 AM, Hoid the Drifter said:

Also, did anyone else see zahel dropping major hints that he is from a different system, aside from fighting using Breaths?

He has his wierd color metaphors that no one gets (just like Azure) and knows about Nightblood. 

I think Oathbringer worked very well in this regard: it wasn't always a complete break, and gave interesting insights in the minds of various important characters. But I also like the "lets spend five pages on this random character you won't ever see again"-interludes. They showcase Roshar, and also lead to quite a lot of interesting discussions. The three worldhoppers from Ishikks interlude, Cusicesh from Axies, larkins and Shinovar from Rysn, Shalash and the Nightwatcher from Baxil, and so on. So yeah, I miss them. 

And if we are going to have Interludes from characters we know, I prefer it to be characters we don't see POVs from otherwise. Give us a Mraize interlude. A Nale interlude. A Leshwi interlude. 

And also, bring back Axies!

2 hours ago, Necessary Ookla said:

Unless he becomes a human Fused and comes back. Again and again and again.

Sweet dreams!

In that scenario he would die multiple days. Which, for some members of the fandom, would be very appreciated. 

On 2020-12-04 at 4:09 AM, joesleepsalot said:

Thaidakar aka K-Money is a possibility, we just don’t know yet.

Kelsier wouldn't risk his life for Taravangians sake in a fight that he has zero investment in. Furthermore, I don't think Kelsier likes Shards in general, so I doubt he would fight for any one of them unless their goals happened to align perfectly. Furthermore, Kelsier would be an out-of-the-left-field choice for everyone who hasn't read Mistborn. 

On 2020-12-04 at 9:43 AM, thorongil said:

Why not Nale? He already switched to Odium's side, so he should be quite willing and his fighting skills are pretty sublime as we have seen in RoW. Also, it could make for an intriguing setup when Szeth goes up against his former master.

Nale fights for the Singers, not for Odium. I doubt he would be willing to become Odiums Champion. Furthermore, I think Szeth and Nale has too little of a setup to work as the major climactic showdown for Book 5. His fighting skills being awesome is also an argument against him: having any of the main characters becoming that awesome at fighting in ten days would be very much a stretch. Unless, that is, they manage to restore Taln, and have him fight Nale, but then we have the same issue as with Szeth/Nale: that conflict hasnt been built up enough. 

1 minute ago, Kingsdaughter613 said:

Oh, whoops. I took off my glasses, and misread the name, lol!

Haha, I suspected something like that had happened. 

4 minutes ago, Kingsdaughter613 said:

We’re literally talking about Kelsier running the Ghostbloods here. I think wanings for Era 1 spoilers are a tad redundant, lol!

I think we can argue Elend and the entire crew, if we wanted. Or even Kell and Fuzz, in some ways. Elend and Yeden never met though.

Fair enough about the spoilers. And I wasn't referring to Yeden. I was talking about Yomen, the obligator ruler of Fadrex City in Hero of Ages. The names are kind of similar though. 

8 hours ago, Kingsdaughter613 said:

Raboniel and Navani?

True, although that dynamic wasn't really on equal terms since Raboniel was very clearly in charge with the upper hand the whole time (and Navani was constantly plotting how to betray her). I'm thinking something along the lines of Ahsoka and Maul in Clone Wars, or even (Mistborn Era 1 spoilers):

@Kingsdaughter613 That is so true! Jasnah and Polgara do feel quite similar in a lot of aspects. I dont know about Zakath and Moash though...

I am also iffy on the Spider-Verse thing. I am in general not a fan of several versions of the same character (unless that is the sole basis of the story, like it was in Into the Spider-Verse). So I would rather see a movie dealing with Peter having to hide after the events of Far From Home, than him discovering two other Peter Parkers. But it will be interesting to see wether they pull it off, and how they are going to do it. 

Foxx and Molina returning is cool though. I don't really have a relationship to Spider-Man 2 or Molinas take on Octopus, but it is interesting nonetheless. I only hope that they bring back Gyllenhaal as Beck, since he is without a doubt my favorite Spidey-villain on film (and he was way to clever to go out like he did). 

Much more interesting to me is the fact that Hailee Steinfeld is finally without a doubt confirmed as Kate Bishop in Hawkeyes tv-show, which I am incredibly excited for (that, along with Eternals, Falcon & Winter Soldier, and Loki are my most anticipated MCU-projects at the moment). 

5 hours ago, Kingsdaughter613 said:

I actually expect a big twist with the GBs. I don’t think we know much about their true goals at all. “Plots behind plots, plans beyond plans. There was always another secret.” Whatever they’re really up to, only ‘Thaidakar’ knows the truth.

We do know which side they’re on though. They aren’t truly neutral.

“Iyatil has reported to Master Thaidakar,” Mraize said, “and he has accepted—after some initial anger—that we will not be able to control the Oathgates. I explained that there at least is a calming wind in this, like the riddens of a storm. With Dalinar controlling the Oathgates, he can prosecute the war against Odium.”

“And that helps your cause?”

“We have no interest in seeing the enemy rule this world, Shallan. Master Thaidakar wishes only to secure a method for gathering and transporting Stormlight.”

They don’t want Odium winning on Roshar. In fact, they may have always intended Dalinar to use the Oathgates; they just wanted to be in control.

They have also been actively hunting the SoH, who were trying to bring back the Desolations. I don’t think that’s an unconnected fact.

It makes sense. Saze is Odium’s greatest threat so he’d likely go after him quickly, before Saze has time to master his powers. Trell (Autonomy?) is already active on Scadrial. The last thing Kelsier wants is another war of the Shards on his homeworld. If Odium looks like he’s going to get free the GBs will throw in their lot with anyone who can keep him chained.

They’re not neutral. They just want to APPEAR neutral.

Very good points. And to be honest, it would be cool to see Mraize teaming up with Shallan and Adolin. Antagonists and protagonists working together is always interesting, and not really something Brandon has been doing much of in Stormlight.

I think Taln broke. Mostly because it makes his arc that much more interesting. He is the human tank who could take torture for four milennia like a boss and then consider the act of betrayal that left him to that fate to be something amazing. It feels like Taln is supposed to be the one hero who lived up to the myths and legends. No one of the other Heralds did. Not Nale. Not Jezrien. Not Ishar. Not Ash. Only Taln. But the paradox is that Taln too failed, at the end of the day. Not even the strongest, most heroic man could stand alone forever. 

If Taln never broke, he never failed, and thus has no starting point for development. He is still "perfect". If he did break, he is human, with all the failings and weaknesses that entails. And Stormlight is, at the end of the day, a story about humans, not gods. 

You are not alone. I am not very fond of Jasnah, which I have written about quite a lot on here, on various occasions. I always feel that she has the air of someone who thinks she knows better than others. I am aware that that isn't how most people read her, but I can't help not too. Furthermore, I feel like she is too good at too much, which makes her less interesting. No matter the problem, Jasnah can probably solve it. She can do politics, magic, combat, science, history, governing, philosophy, scheming, and so on and so forth. 

But from a pure writing-standpoint, she is great. She is an extremely well-defined and portrayed character. Her atheism, her logic, her personality in general, are all very well done by Brandon. So I subjectively dislike her, but objectively recognize that she is a great character: she is just not written for me. 

23 hours ago, Ookla the Knight said:

I'd also like to bring up on the side of Moash that he is also very realistic / reasonable, speaking of the points where he says

"No, you can't kill Kaladin. Like, you physically actually cannot because the man is freakin' unkillable or something. I dunno."

Moash knows plot armor when he sees it. 

5 hours ago, BrightLord Swageas said:

Funny, I kind of see Nale as more of an anti-hero.

 I agree: Nale isn't really a villain. I'm using villain kind of interchangeably with antagonist on this thread, which is pretty sloppy of me, but yeah. But yes, I would indentify Nale as an anti-villain, and an antagonist (except in OB, in which he is more a supporting character/mentor for Szeth).

14 hours ago, Karger said:

I hope the first.

I defenitely hope the second. Mraize is cool.

11 hours ago, Theoryspren said:

Mraize can't let word of Shallans betrayal and refusal to follow Mraize get to the rest of the Ghostbloods. That is because their whole organization is about being the hunter and catching the prey. And if the other Ghostbloods know that Mraize's underlinging is now hunting him they will begin to view him as prey. He has to be worried because if he starts looking like prey any Ghoostblood might think it time to get revenge against him for something or other. The only way Mraize can save face is by quickly killing Shallan before word gets out and then present her body to show that he quickly dealt with the betrayal to show he is strong. So he will attempt to kill her as soon as possible. So I believe that one of Shallan's first chapters back in the physical realm will be an attempted assasination of her by Mraize.

One of the Ghostbloods big things is not killing eachother though. That seems to be a very important rule for them. And whoever kills Mraize will no doubt need to face Iyatils wrath afterwards, which isn't that fun. Plus, Mraize seems to be way to confident in the Ghostbloods and their rules to worry that one of his underlings would move against him. But I agree in that Mraize wont let Shallan be left alone for long. She has insulted the Ghostbloods, which is probably worse than insulting Mraize personally, so she needs to go.

1 hour ago, the winter system said:

Characters are written by people who make decisions. When it comes to sensitive topics that are unrepresented, writers need to be careful in how they portray them. The Three aren't real people, and they do not make their own choices. - Nix

True. But some people do want to integrate, and if that is the story Brandon has chosen to tell with Shallan, Veil and Radiant, then that is fair, isn't it? It will represent those who do decide to integrate. 

14 hours ago, Awesomness said:

The plan backfired when his allies came up with the idea to usher a Desolation to bring back the Heralds. So he left the organization.

Mraize refers to the Sons as "Restares cronies" in WoR, and Amaram writes him a letter in that same book. So I think Restares led them during the books as well.

Another wierd thing about Kalaks involvement with the Sons of Honor is that they seem to be enemies with the Skybreakers (Helaran, part of the Skybreakers, was sent to kill Amaram). Despite this, Kalak appears to be on fairly good terms with Nale. Either they had a falling-out or Nale actually doesn't know that Kalak is leading a secret organization. The latter alternative is certainly more intriguing. 

11 hours ago, Scout_Fox said:

The doge-until-I-position-you-so-I-can-yeet-you-off-the-ledge strat I see you too had top tier Fallen Order skills 

Indeed. Why bother with parrying and countering when you can yeet?

1 minute ago, Ookla the Sprinkle said:

Unfortunately I never played Fallen Order. 

Ah, I see. Well, they were quite scary unless you had a ledge or something to force push them down from. 

1 hour ago, Ookla the Sprinkle said:

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This was probably one of my favorite episodes so far. Boba was awesome. Grogu is going to some dark places, throwing those storm troopers around. 
Also, the dark troopers maybe the first actually threatening stormtroopers we’ve seen. Though I still can’t get the thought out of my head that they look like Bionicles.

 

Purge Troopers are pretty scary, at least if you, like me, sucked at Fallen Order. And Death Troopers were at least supposed to be scary, but I dont remember them doing a whole lot more than dying. 

As the title suggests, where do we think this plot is going? Knowing Brandon, it will tie in to the Contest of Champions and the general endgame somehow. So in what way will the Ghostbloods contribute? Will they stay neutral, or side with or against Mr T/Odium? Will Mraize hunt Shallan? Will Shallan kill Mraize, or is he making it past Book 5 and into the back half/other Cosmere stories? Will we ever see Iyatil again? And will Lift be involved somehow, given that she spent some time in their captivity in this book? So many questions...

6 hours ago, the winter system said:

Just popping in to say that plural people -- umbrella term for people with "multiple personalities," though that's a very outdated -- exist IRL and can read what you write about us. Not every system wants to integrate, and plenty of us live full, complete lives, unintengrated. 

It looks like Shallan, Veil and Radiant wants to integrate though. That is the preference of those characters. It seems like we (potentially) have another character in the Cosmere (Bavadin) who made a different choice. 

Dalinar, because his arc and story in Oathbringer is one of the greatest things I have ever read. Closely followed by Adolin, who is also all kinds of awesome. Shout-out to Elhokar as well. I liked him before it was cool (meaning before Oathbringer).

2 hours ago, Ookla the Knight said:

Alright, who voted Kaves? I didn't put him in there seriously. Please, name yourself.

Was about to ask this.

Episode 14 spoiler: