Djarskublar

I had a thought the other day, so here is a mini-theory regarding it. Let me know if you think it has any merit. I think that the reason Selish magic is so heavily location based is because the Dor is in the CR, rather than the SR where it belongs. D&D may influence where it all comes from, but because the CR does have location as a dimension, I can see it causing the magic to be location oriented as well. Well, that's basically it.

One thing you forgot about. It's not something mathematical. It is the fact that there are still things you can do in those 50 years. I had this idea while reading your post and it legitimately made me laugh out loud. You basically set yourselves up in a museum in the meantime. I am sure there are plenty of people who would pay good money to see people that were last aware of what has been going on years ago. It would be like paying to see Captain America while he is still in ice. At a conservative estimate, you should be able to make, say, $10 a day on average from the outset (simplified, I know, but math is hard). So if we add in daily contributions to the account in the form of $10, then your final value after 52 years of 8% interest from $5000 a person compounded annually comes out to $194,790 made honestly with your $10/day, while your total account balance per person is $2,620,812 plus change. That is almost as much as all 10 people get in your example. On the other hand, I can see your value as a museum attraction fluctuating a lot over time. You would probably experience a huge burst at first as everyone comes to see the idiots, but then nobody would be interested any more for a few years. Over time though, a small interest would build up again because now you are a lot further behind the times. I could see an anniversary thing going on every year (preferably before the compound date, I'm not sure how that would work) where some people come to see you. Around the 50 year anniversary, people would start coming in droves again because of how much sheer time you have been out. You would be truly fascinating. I would pay 10 bucks right now to go see someone who experienced the last 50 years in a few seconds. This means that your principle would effectively be much larger, but you would get much lower payments until the very end where they matter a lot less. To make people more amenable to seeing it, you could pass it off as a scientific inquiry. Think of the applications for linguistics and anthropology! This would let you get away with this investing scheme more easily. If you want to let it a solid couple minutes instead (and reduce the margin of error) you could bring a scientist in place of one of your pulsers. To go back to the original topic, tin born (either type, though Feruchemical tin might be better) could be quality inspectors. They can look for minute problems that would escape the normal eye. A low Feruchemical zinc tap would also help you process what you are seeing to make you better at finding problems. If we include other planets in this, making another Nightblood-esque object that isn't so... broken would be really cool. Say, for example, the plow that never stops plowing. While it might not be a terribly powerful method, using those Aon plates that emit light that are all over Elantris, you could put them face down on a solar panel. Then you can stack those up and put them literally anywhere, even underground. As a therapist, you could tap Connection to a person to get a better understanding of them. If you upgrade the primer cube tech and use zinc/brass on it, you could have a long lasting short range emotional boost. This could treat all kinds of mental disorders. I just realized something else as well, could you use zinc to flare determination in someone, then have them store it kinda like compounding? Pewter/Cadmium Twinborn would make excellent free divers. Feruchemical chromium would be excellent for investors. Put up a paper full of different stocks, and tap luck while throwing a dart at the paper.

One thing I would be wary of in the trailers: don't put in things like 'I write these words in metal...' since they are kinda too spoilery. That's the big one. The trailers are really great, but I think they might not really convey a sense of what is going to happen well. They are kinda all over the place. Maybe cut some of the arcs and just concentrate on two or three. TFE trailer was by far the best of them.

Okay I think I have a handle on where you are coming from better now. To answer your bolded question, that isn't how I see it, but I guess I forgot to explain that bit fully. What I think is happening is about what you are saying for normal ranges. It shifts you around and you have an end neutral shift in your ratio of intelligence to compassion. At some point though, you have no more to shift over, but you still need to be more compassionate or intelligent based on how the 'dice' fell that day. That is when you have Investiture added. If you have a super intelligence day, then you have zero compassion long before reaching that point, and the extra intelligence just appears. On the other hand, on a particularly stupid day, you go down to the base intelligence necessary to be capable of compassion, then receive extra compassion. Does that explain it better? I haven't read SH yet, but I have been reading spoiler tags for it since it is so important. The way the three realms are described there does give merit to your idea that they are moved closer to the other two realms, but there is a problem with how you are deducing he got the information. You can't just grab info from a collective conscious. Think about Shallan's trip to Shadesmar. Sadesmar/CR is similar to the physical realm, but has only cognitive aspects of physical entities and space is compressed so you can actually walk from planet to planet. Could she have accessed or affected cognitive aspects of things that are a few miles away in the physical realm? Maybe, but not something in Shinovar that is a continent away. Ditto for Mr T. He isn't going to mind read the Shin or Listeners from his castle. On the other hand, there is no such thing as distance in the Spiritual Realm, so there is no problem with examining anything in the entire cosmere there. Besides that, what could he really have learned about the Listeners from the CR even if he could access them? Their forms were still relatively recent discoveries and therefor not well understood, even with the songs to guide them. Assuming the super day was years ago, but after Gavilar's murder, he may have been intelligent enough to extrapolate some of the things he knows, but all the widely varying things he learns couldn't have come from scant legend and smarts. On the other hand, it could easily come from seeing the SR and understanding Roshar's portion of it. I may not be entirely right about how he gets more Investiture. You bring up good points about that. I will still maintain that for him to have made the Diagram, he had to have accessed the SR while superintelligent. How is up in the air, and him getting more Investiture kinda like Wax did was merely a plausible explanation for how that would work. I am open to suggestions about how he accessed the SR.

Ah that's right. It's in a different thread. Here you go. The OP in this thread is what you are looking for.

He is a king. How much time does he really have for serious scholarly study like Jasnah does? There also probably aren't any books in his library that speak knowledgeably about Honorblades, let alone Listeners. The chances that he has read the books in question, if they exist, is truly dismal. Jasnah certainly didn't find those books. I am not associating knowledge with Investiture, but intelligence. It is an attribute that can be spiked, presumably. It is a human attribute after all. This means that it is theoretically possible that his spiritweb is being manipulated into having more 'human intelligence.' BoM spoilers: If he is peeking into the SR and has super intelligence, he can do things that couldn't be done otherwise. He can look at the Listeners social structure and form mechanics, then deduce they will use Stormform. He can look at the Shin and see that they have the Honorblades. Also, your example of Nightblood doesn't correlate. It isn't exactly all that intelligent. Those breaths are going into awakening it, then making it intelligent, and powering it. Holding 1000 breaths doesn't make you smarter, it just brings you to the 4th Heightening or so. Different effects from different Investitures. Breath isn't something that can be spiked anyway, so it wouldn't contribute to intelligence, just senses and aging etc. via the Heightenings. One thing though, when did this day take place? Before or after Gavilar's death? If it was before, does that make Gavilar a potential Diagrammist? I thought he was a Son of Honor or something. If it was after (I bet this is the case) then there was already a Truthless out there to use, and he realized it. Another point that has been brought up is that he was basically a supercomputer for the day. That doesn't add up to being able to predict years in advance. Supercomputers can't see every possibility for a game of chess, and that is a game with 32 pieces (that get removed over time) with discrete movement options. The entirety of a continent has more than 32 significant pieces, and they are acting continuously in tandem with each other. That is orders of magnitude harder to calculate. However, if he gained an understanding of every person on Roshar via the SR, he has virtual imperfect information cascade level understanding. That is much more feasible. If that didn't make sense, Wikipedia information cascades. The way humans interact on a continental scale is an imperfect action cascade. I can see Mr T being able to calculate possibilities within an information cascade.

Or she could just cause the flesh to sluice off the item like it was super hydrophobic. (that is one... juicy image XD)

Granted. You still have no idea how to use it since you have always had the ability to doodle in books. Your bane is that whenever you use this power, you feel a desperate need to sneeze, but you never do. I wish I was a gold/gold Twinborn with access to plenty of gold.

To expand on my points a bit now that I have read your replies and thought more, I still think my explanation makes the most sense. I would like to clarify first that I believe he is gaining/losing Investiture every day. Gain some in a way that increases his intellect, and lose some in compassion or vice versa. There are some thing he learned that he couldn't have learned any way other than peeking into the SR and seeing some information. He did work similarly to a mentats then, but he was way beyond their level. He was just ridiculous. He has accurately predicted how things will go for years now. That isn't something you can do no matter how smart you are. You simply don't understand enough about everyone that is a major player on a fundamental personality level. If he is looking at their spiritwebs, though, I could see him having gained enough knowledge to extrapolate probable major events. Another thing, he made the Diagram deliberately hard to translate. He knew how fast the people involved would translate it. He made it so that they would only learn more from it as needed. Also, how do you explain his knowledge regarding the Listeners and Shin? He probably knew fairly accurately how the Listener forms worked, and he also figured out that the Shin have the Honorblades. There is no way he could even have known of the Honorblades, let alone where they were located. There is absolutely no way he could have learned of the mechanics of the Listeners without seeing their Spiritual make-up. I can see an argument that he had met one of the Listeners before, but that doesn't expand to understanding their forms AT ALL. It is something they barely understand at all themselves. Unless Venli had already discovered Stormform back then, which I doubt greatly, and he just saw the connections in her mind that allowed him to understand they would use the form. I think it more likely that he saw their Spirit in its entirety and with his now massive intelligence figured out exactly what they were capable of, and what would happen when they bonded any particular spren. He probably saw all the different kinds of spren as well. He also understood exactly what the parshmen are as well. Another point, even on highly intelligent days where he can't make policy, he doesn't have the sheer ability to understand where this stuff all came from. This is because he doesn't have the Spiritual Connection necessary to do so any more. The explanation that he was tapping the CR doesn't make sense. The CR is location based. It isn't possible that he could see and understand his entire world to the point where he can predict Highstorm dates perfectly years in advance. Einstein couldn't instantly predict what all natural laws would be based on his experiences, and so I think it safe to say that merely being superintelligent is not enough to explain all that he knows. On the other hand, gaining enough Investiture to peek into the SR and having enough intelligence to understand what he sees makes sense.

So I was thinking about how insanely intelligent Mr T was on the day he made the Diagram. This is a fairly crackpot theory, but it makes sense, and explains some things that didn't make sense to me. I think that on his intelligent days, he actually has more innate Investiture, and less on his stupid days. Hear me out on this. The first thing that made me think about what could be up was how he knew/figured out so much. It simply didn't make any sense to me. I don't care how smart you are, you don't simply deduce that much about the Radiants and Shin. You can't predict the effects of the Stormfather's visions on Dalinar years in advance like that. He simply gained knowledge that was literally impossible to aquire by simple superintelligence. I thought then about the Band's effect on your sight and how people's minds expand on Ascention. The two then connected in my head. What if the boons/banes affect your spiritweb to manipulate you into experiencing a cognitive effect? Magic is performed through Investiture manipulation, so why not this? If, then, Mr T is experiencing a change in his Investiture that directly impacts his intelligence and compassion, what happens when he has an incredibly high day? He gets some low level sight into the Spiritual Realm like you get with the Bands, coupled with the intelligence necessary to truly understand it. Also, since it stems from Cultivation, he may be better at predicting the future. It also appears fairly end neutral since his intelligence is random centering around average intelligence. Since distance is a non entity in the SR, he can figure things out in distant Shinovar and predict who the Stormfather would send visions to etc. To me, this is a satisfactory answer to why he knew so stinking much that day. On a side note, if he had an incredibly bad day, would he die of stupidity? He could potentially not have the base intelligence necessary to keep his heart beating and breath in his lungs.

I get your stance @maxal, but in all honesty, there isn't much to Adolin. I like characters like him. They frequently have hidden depth. But with Adolin what you see is about what you get. He will feel guilty about the murder, but not much. He had good reason to do it. It was arguably self defense, and so it will be easy for him to rationalise his actions. For Kaladin to rationalize, he would have to, say, kill Elhokar and then try to justify it to himself. That was not a justified killing. If I was in Adolin's shoes, I would have killed him too, and not even try to hide it. Amaram got away with killing Kal's men, and while they are lower rank, Adolin can get away with a far more justified killing. I love reading Adolin too, but I agree that he is just support cast. He may get lots of screen time, and even some POVs but he isn't important. Adolin was interesting at the beginning of WoK, but he has matured enough now that I dont think that his murder or the fact that he is no longer the big man on campus will affect him that much. He (and Dalinar) got a plenty large dose of humble pie from fighting Szeth. He was vindicated in his suspicion of both Kaladin and Sadeas. He got the pants scared off him by the disadvantaged duel, and he had an interesting fight with Eshonai. He isnt the arrogant nice guy he was. He is now a man who has some literal skeletons in his closet, but is strong enough to deal with it. I don't feel he has the same potential for growth that other characters do.

I have to say I agree with Brandon on this one. I never really felt there was much to Adolin. He is a nice dude, even when nobody is watching. I honestly don't think he will have much emotional fallout from Sadeas. He will just rationalise it in his mind, and Dalinar will be the one having to confront what happened. We will also likely see Dalinar murder someone in flashback that will affect how he treats Adolin quite a bit. Lift is a fascinating character. Reading her interludes was greatly interesting for more than worldbuilding reasons. I hope she gets over her boon/bane but keeps the metabolism power. As she is now, she is doing something similar to Shallan. She is hiding her past by literally running away. Newsletter spoilers here, but not major:

Ummm this isn't a constructive comment. It was already implied in the other posts anyway... On a different note, anyone want to bet there are 256, 512, or 1024 Hemalurgic bind points?

On this topic, not having read secret history yet I don't know about how this turns out, but if you can anchor a cognitive entity to a physical one, could you bind a gold or malatium shadow to something? Also, Kel should end up with a body that is a suit of metal, then we can start calling him Alphonse.

And by the same token, being mistborn, even Lerasium level, is nowhere near being Susebron. And he is orders of magnitude away from being Endowment. WoB I think people have quoted above is that using Lerasium to become a savant would cause you to Ascend. The amount of Lerasium necessary to do that is larger than the entire Atium deposit in HoA. It by definition has to be. It was a significant portion of the power of Ruin because it was all he needed to get the edge over Preservation. Hoid's one bead isn't really gonna do much for his innate investiture. At best he will do as I guess and use it to rewrite himself into an Elantrian. Even if he aquires all the forms of Investiture available to him (ie some are incompatible like Elantrian + Dakhor) he still won't have sheer volume of Investiture. He will be unimaginably powerful, but that is beside the point. I can see him eventually reaching Sliver status by going back to Nalthis and buying more breath, but that is really the only way I see it happening. Look at this like a stereotypical physicist would. Your scale of drab<person<small mage<big mage<Sliver is really 1<1<1<1<100. Say that a normal Manifestation is worth ten breaths of Investiture (a generous estimate if you ask me). And say a stronger Manifestation is worth 20 (remember those are using external investiture as a power source, so they really aren't that much if any more invested than other magic users). To qualify as a Sliver of Endowment you need a Returned breath that is worth around 2000 normal breaths. If he manages to collect 90-180 magic systems (assuming he has 200 breaths) then he would qualify as a Sliver. Math. Yeah it'd be cool if he became a Sliver of Mr A, but it isn't gonna be easy. Or likely.

Pattern could have asked nicely. I agree it was a little strange, but I just rolled with it.

Well there is the fact that there were more people than blades in the vision, so combat ensued. It's may the best man win there. Be you the best warrior, the most cunning, or the fastest runner, there is going to be something about the men who ended up as bearers that make them more likely to survive. Those survival skills would likely translate to better leadership. Warrior = conquerer. Cunning = politician with some serious weapons leverage. Them realize that the weakest of those that ended up as bearers were probably weeded out by stronger people. When you suddenly have 300 shardbearers walk in to your kingdom and say they are in charge now. There isn't really anything you can do.

I figured out what's missing here: they were friends with TLR when he... Oh wait. But seriously though, speak sofly and carry a big stick. When that big stick is a Shardblade, you win. Maybe when the Shardblade rewrites you a bit to make your eyes different, it also rewrites you a bit to be more inclined to lead. Not a lot, but enough that after millenia, the lighteyes were the ones most likely to be on top at any given time. If that made any sense.

One thing: blood is easy to clean off your body without DNA testing. It's called a tongue. Almost everyone has one. I'm sure Adolin does. I bet everyone who reads this has sucked blood off their fingers after having a nosebleed. After checking his clothes for blood he just has to lick himself clean. Pretty gross, but if he can handle it, it will cleans his hands and knife quite well. Just wipe the gore on Sadeas first. Brain matter isn't as edible.

While I can't disprove you in any way, there is one problem. We already had the 'ascend to godhood to beat the enemy god' story. It's called HoA. I don't think he will recycle that plot. Non cosmere aware people will be like hey wait, you already did this... Boring.

Well I don't think they just came into power. They abandoned their responsibility. What they are saying is that the people who picked up the now dead Shardblades became lighteyes (proof: Moash) and because they had Blades they came into power. Then the lighteyes controlled the place.

The Nightwatcher gives you a blank look and a RAFO card. You have a vague sense of disappointment for the rest of your life. I wish I had more Sanderfan friends who live nearby.

Yeah good points. They coincide fairly well with my OP, but I will note one thing. I don't think the Oathpact was broken at all when most of the Heralds abandoned the Oathpact. It may have allowed him some more influence outside Roshar though. Once all ten abandon it, it will be broken and Odium will be freed. I agree that Honor survived past the Recreance.

Ya missed on my name there @The One Who Connects, but I forgive you. On both counts. Not many people can avoid misspelling this internet name, especially considering it is an onomotopeoia I made up... To get things back on track, does anyone have any suggestions on what the Oathpact could be? I would love to see other people's thoughts on this. I can't know if I'm right, but I really like my theory, or perhaps a modified version to do with how exactly it actually connects Odium in.

Necro alert! I always thought spheres were larger too.