hypatia

@Darvys The Aimian on the Back Cover seem to be the same opinion as Taravangian "For those secrets will crush him (the King/Dalinar?) as they did the Knights who came before" (cum grano salis) Secrets that will crush Dalinar - now this can't be the death of Honor or the lie with the Last Desolation - both does he know and I don't see him crushed. Perhaps the other way round - what is Dalinar planning to do what the Radiants of old also have done?

@Dragos Hello and welcome I was worried about it too - but with your help I have found a solution for me. Adolin acts like someone who "found a solution, a way to fix things and had recognized the deed" - all this, but not to his father. Has anyone notized that he shows the same body language as Elhokar in the last chapters?

"...had suddenly gone mad with anger and rage." Sounds like the Thrill, only with a longer time of influence.

@WhiteLeeopard May I try? Adonalsium creates Roshar with the Listener, perhaps even the Aimian and the Shin. He is splintered, which has an effect on the magic. (WoB, Leipzig Qu.: Had the splintering of Adonalsium an caused a breakdown of the magic on other planets? A.: There was an effect. Breakdown might not be the exact phrase, but it could fit.) Two aspects of Adonalsium returned - Honor and Cultivation and brought human to Roshar. Cultivation took partly responsibility for the Listeners. (WoB Are the Parshendi of Cultivation? Not orginally) The next is unsure what came first - the arrival of Odium or the founding of the Heralds and the Radiant Orders with the spren leaving the Listeners. And it is also unsure, whether this perhaps has the Listener left open for the Odium Spren.

I have a serious problem with the Radiant. Whereas Veil or any other persona Shallan impersonates don't have altered the Shallan within, the Radiant is seen as a real person apart from herself. It is a new lie, a way to go back instead of working with the trauma. It's understandable - for the first truths Patern was a neutral 'psychoanalyst', but within the memory of killing her mother, Pattern is a part of the memory itself. She will need someone else to speak with, someone , who is able to understand.

@Darvys I haven't thought for Kaladin to let them down , he is too Windrunner-y to forget about the Parshendi. And I also feel he will see the parallelism to his own cultural problems with the caste system. He will probably lead them, but to the Listener who survived - Rlain, perhaps Thude, Eshonai, whoever the auther will give them.

The Parshendi (in lack of a proper word and because this is what they are at the moment - Parshmen who speak") reminded me of children, imitating the world around them. Like little children, who write a "letter" for their parents - they copy the motions, but don't have actually the ability. Perhaps this is the proto/childform of the Listeners? And yes, I don't think Kaladin will be the right one to lead them, not because of 'white savior', because of "wrong parent". They are Listeners and to learn the Rhythms, the culture they need someone who is able to teach them. I don't want them to become pseudo-humans.

There are so many questions: In the good old times, before Honor and Cultivation - how many Listeners lived on Roshar? Did they inhabit the whole continent? Where were their centrals - their cities? What happened with the arrival of humans? Perhaps we see the story too much out of the eyes of humans.

@Elena @Darvys I also positivly surprised about this Elhokar and I think third time is catchy time and Kaladin will train him as a leader. Next I'm looking what he will decide as the team for this mission - the squires from Bridge 4 would be my guess, because they are more usefull with Kaladin around. Adolin - I would like to see the dynamics with princeling/kingling and bridgboy aka the hero. Rlain - perhaps they have to communicate with the 'whatever Parshmen'. And perhaps, yes there can be time to came in the open - Elhokar with Roshone, Kaladin and his role in the assassination attempt and Adolin with Sadeas. I'm all for the next generation - and if Mr Sanderson will make me espacially happy he will send Jasnah to Kholinar (with Hoid).

@Frostlander Yes and opposed to this picture of the king - how many people see Dalinar as the one who has killed their families? Many of the Alethi people nowadays were these crying children and women - they have probably seen him only as the Blackthorn and then never again. I don't think they know this Dalinar we were presented in the first two books.

@ParadoxicalZen Thank you, this is like I remember, but I wasn't sure. So there is nothing that indicates that Elhokar is manipulating Dalinar in giving him the Honorblade. And I was confused because the text says Elhokar will wait for Kaladin as a way to fly and to open the Oathgate device in Kholinar. Does anyone - except of us via WoB - know about the possibility to activate the Oathgate with a Honofblade?

Now I'm a little bit confused - where is Dalinar considering to give the Honorblade to Elhokar? Does Elhokar even know about it?

About Elhokar's paranoia - yes, he had cut his own girth but wasn't there also someone manipulating his shardplate? And wasn't it the deal that Dalinar was made the Highprince of War for his promise "to find out who is trying to kill you"? I can't remember - do we now know who was trying to kill Elhokar before Graves and Moash?

Hasn't Elhokar the perfect job offer for the new 'Highprince Adolin'? The 'Highprince of War' isn't also occupied with Dalinar in retirement and I think Adolin would make a good figure with this.

Isn't Moash with Graves on his way to the Diagram?

I think we really, really need the other two Bondsmithes and not only because I'm nearly dying to know the ominous third one. At the moment Dalinar seems to be the last human on Roshar to unite the country, first because of his past, but also because it looks like he wants to be the only one in charge. He isn't something like a 'Highking', he is only a third of the Bondsmithes. Yes, Urithiru shouldn't be a place for.. ...genderroles ...Brightlord and co. ...Nahn and Dahn I really want him to go back in the visions, espacially 'Starfalls' and realize how it used to be. The Stormfather isn't such a help, he seems unwilling to answer crucial questions - Dalinar needs to know why the Radiants grew corrupted if he doesn't want to make the same mistakes. On the other hand he have to make sure, that no one will be able to use the Radiants for their wars. He can't have an Emuli and a Tukari Knight to side with one of these countries. There's so much to do and preferably all at the same time - mostly yesterday - that I'm beginning to despair.

You don't need the child alive, Gavilar is predicting resistance for years, BECAUSE Dalinar has killed the Brightlord and his heir. In both flashback I see a pattern, they kill Brightlords who were able to get real loyality from their people, not only with the threat of killing their family and ending as canon fodder. Another thought - how was the old Dalinar reacting to his very different sons? Adolin was a child he was expecting, but Renarin? Could this be the reason why Renarin is broken? And what this child said about fighting monsters - isn't this the same Dalinsr is facing with the voidbringer?

It's not only the higher elevation than the Horneater Homeland, all above is this tower with about 1000 m. But at the wedding at night on the highest platform I had thought they must freeze to death only in their wedding dresses. But again - nothing. Just Elhokar warming his hands.

I don't know if Urithiru is located in the CR, but there's something that drives me mad: We seem to be on a gigantic mountain array on a gigantic tower mostly above the storms, but there's no problem with the temperature or the oxigene. From Rock and his "airsick lowlanders" we know that there is normaly a difference in greater hights. Wherever Urithiru is located it doesn't have a influence on the climate.

To be frank - I really hope it was Ialai or the Ghostbloods - even Renarin. I'm frightened this could be only one of Sadeas soldiers who thought this man was the murderer and this will start a vandetta - just because Adolin doesn't confess. This would break him - being guilty of meaningless deaths because of his silence.

To Renarin I know it is said 'Truthwatcher', but he isn't anything like the Truthwatchers we know about. Fortelling is associated with Cultivation - how about him being one of the other Bondsmiths? And really, is this about people don't know about the Silver Kingdoms or a mistake? Kurth (Jasnah's guess) and Rall Elorim were in the old kingdom of Iri and they totally forget the kingdom of Rishir. I would so like a Oathgate in Herdaz.

On a sidenote: Is Dalinar able to leave Urithiru on his own? Bondsmith traditionally don't have a sprens transforming in a Shardblade and you need this for the Oathgates.

@WhiteLeeopard Yes, that's right, but in WoR he wasn't a Bondsmith. Now he is, his surges should be able to show him a new way - but he doesn't look for his new abilities. Dalinar himself should do what he said to Renarin. But all he thinks of are his old ways.

Oh Dalinar 'I WILL UNITE INSTEAD OF DIVIDE. I WILL BRING MEN TOGETHER" Now-a few days later - you are about to break your Bond. Whatever motivations, a fight against Elhokar will lead to civil-war in Alethkar. He is a Bondsmith, not a warlord. Isn't it symbolic - he doesn't have a Shardblade anymore - neither a dead nor a living one.

The rift between Dalinar and Elhokar can be really a chance - with Elhokar recognizing his problem as the first step. Urithiru isn't the place for the king of Alethkar, here he will always be in the shadow of his uncle. His responsibility are his people after the everstorm and the riots in Kholinar - preferably with the Alethi soldiers who want to be at home and help their families. On the other hand - Dalinar can't leave Urithiru at the moment, he has the problem with the other oatgates, with the other kingdoms and with new Radiants. He has to learn how to delegate...