Stark

The way I see it, there are five options for how it plays out. 1)Odium win, doesn't matter hows - Bad option, but not the worst. 2)Odium is forced into a champion battle, his champion loses. He retreats for a time, and is pissed. Comes back after humanity has had time to forget and tries again. Most positive option. 3)Rayse himself is drawn out and killed. Cultivation splinters the shard, covering Roshar in splinters of hate. Hoid's "I would see this planet burn" scenario 4)Rayse is drawn out and killed. Someone else takes up the shard. New devil. Could be worse, could be better, but eventually the intent of odium will rule out. But whether that means actively trying to kill everything or not could depend on the bearer. Potentially best option. 5)Rayse dies, Cultivation absorbs the shard to create a new dual shard to try to contain it and prevent it from returning. Either succeeds, or becomes cultivated hatred (Dark Galadrial) and spreads hate across the Cosmere. Best or far worst option depending on her control. Sanderson seemed to imply in the December 2016 seattle thingr that this was not likely. He seemed puzzled by the question and his response implied that this wasa terrible plan that would not happen.

Well, as longs as she's honest about. "Pattern, I am a serial killer." "This truth is accepted" "I am using the trophies I collect to make my own special ink for portraits of my new persona's based off my victims. I choose my victims for the traits they have I desire. Using them to craft my illusion makes it stronger." "This truth is... deeply unsettling. Terrifying and gross. And.., storm it, accepted, but only because I have no choice. Seriously, get some help, or go divide by zero with that nice swordsman who wields my cousin's corpse. You're starting to scare me." I don't feel that there is a moral code to Lightweavers, as long as they honor the truths they have admitted to their spren.

Pretty sure the first second on screen Truth from her that we see is "I am a murderer." So killing dudes would confirm that her oath is true, while deeply unsettling Pattern as to what she would do with the corpse. Use it as a chair, or food, or a sword, or something. Thanks to @Dreamstorm for the correction. "I am a murderer" is the second truth she spoke to Pattern, to reveal herself to Jasnah. I had completely missed that she spoke two truths in Way of Kings. I think I overlooked the first one because it was so seemingly minor.

Yeah, I actually think it might be an Aimian. We have seen that they watch everything. No one would take note of a cremling while committing murder. They have an agenda, both from the back cover blurbs, and from the preview interlude we saw. They seem like they would be capable of perfectly imitating another's actions. And appearance, so the witnesses would have seen Adolin and Ned look alikes doing their own copy cat work. I feel an Aimian hiding in Urithuru, trying to keep the Alethi off balance and from looking towards Aimia, with the 10th oathgate would fit their motivations, such as we've seen so far, quite well. Much better than one of the Unmade doing it. The Unmade are spren. They have no physical form unless bound. They may be influencing the murders, but they are physically incapable of doing the deed themselves. People screaming 'The Unmade did it' need to flesh out that theory a lot more before I am willing to buy into it. Random other thought, Dalinar's hiding spot may not be as good as he thinks it is. I get the impression that poopspren are terrible gossips.

I really hope that Navani doesn't Marie Curie herself with all her self testing... Dalinar can't make her a squire to stormlight away any of the radiation damage she may be doing to herself in her unprotected experiments. I'll grant yo, Stormlight seems less radioactive than other energy sources, but still. Very little good comes to those who use themselves, their friends and family as guinea pigs. But hey, she did make him a pretty sweet watch. Wonder how often it needs to be infused??

I love that Pattern and Shallan are talking to each other and trying to resolve the rift between them. So often we have these issues prolonged because characters wont talk to each other, and they aren't falling into that cliched trap. Very happy. And she DOESN'T WANT HIM TO DIE! But once again, we have a Shallan POV were it is directly referenced what she hates. She hates herself, and does not deny hating Pattern when he mentions it. If we look at characters who talk about their hatreds, and how often it comes up, Shallan is near the top. Granted, the Truth she admitted is still super fresh, but still. She admits to hating. I am more worried and convinced that she, as the most advanced Radiant we have on screen, with the most fragile sense of self, is extremely open to Odium's influence. Which would result in her being a candidate for Odium's champion. And can we talk about the Ghostblood's for a minute? Setting aside the naming convention of your average ten year old, how f^@ked up are these people? That your above standard thugs are petrified of them, and it is completely acceptable that one of them would STAB A HAND TO A TABLE THROUGH THEIR OWN HAND! And that is getting off easy! What the rust. And Shallan has not made the connection that these super messed up psychos, who admit to trying to have her and her mentor killed have her entire living family essentially hostage under the guise of bringing them to her? How can she not see that this will not end well. She asks Pattern if she killed her family and replaced them with illusions. No, Shallan, you didn't. But you may well have killed them by pulling the Ghostblood thread to see where it leads.

Worldhopper? Unlikely that a worldhopper would let themselves get taken as a slave, or made a bridgerunner. I'm thinking a cameo of one of Brandon's friends or beta readers. Just seems really odd to mouth off to the most powerful man in the world right now, even if he has a reputation for being a bit more relaxed about rank through Kaladin, right after he calls you on being mouthy... Edit: Though that may just be my personal bias. I tend to be too mouthy for my own good, and if I had been given the honor of a cameo in Oathbringer by Brandon, I would totally have asked to be in Bridge Thirteen.

Okay. Vasher being Vasher, awesome. Ardents having a crisis of faith and the total takedown of tradition for tradition's sake, brilliant. Evi's name, oh dear, what is happening? Is the stormlight healing the holes in his brain, because he does not view himself as a person who would not remember his wife? Will he also lose the counterpart to his Nightwatcher visit? So much hope and happy feels at Kaladin working to establish trust. Red clawed cremlings are poisonous, huh. Lighteyes fancy up their liquor, amusing. A literal, body doubling copy cat murderer. What the heck? I don't think we will see another Sadeas style murder, but damnation. The copy cat literaly looked exactly like the first killer. So, if someone saw the second Sadeas style murder, they would have seen Adolin killing the person! Also, Dalinar being Dalinar, and being there with his guys. Bridge thirteen's guy being a little too casual strikes me as odd. That tradition busting story has to be my favorite part of this week. Tradition for tradition's sake is one of the things that bother me the most. THe line, just because its old doesn't make it right Hits me deeply. Final thought, listener children. Good to see them. A lot of emotions come up as they discuss the reality of being born into slavery. Also, there seems to be a colour change in the patterning of the listeners as they achieve maturity, from orange-pink to orange-red. Like deer? Super cool.

Vasher looks like Vasher! Scruffy-rope-belted-breath herder is back!

Ah, the link is there on Tor's homepage, but it keeps 404ing me! Storm it!

Here's hoping for some nice long chapters this week. The Kaladin Chapter last week was awesome, both tragic and hope inspiring, but far too short. I need my fix. I can do short chapters in the actual book, not on a week to week basis. Til 9, trying to focus on all the work I won't be doing after 9...

Likely by the end of the 5th book at the latest. While SA is a ten book series, Brandon has made it pretty clear that it will be two arcs of 5 books. If I remember correctly, there wil be a 5-15 year gap between books 5 and 6, in worlds, where as each arc happens essentially back to back. So I think you can expect most of what we are seeing to wrap up by book five, with the longer lasting consequences of what happens here and now to be dealt with in the second arc, but also likely to have a different, or at least drastically changed core antagonist. Second half could be more along the lines of: All the nations united to throw of the Desolation, we are recovering. Now what? We all have our own Radiants, and none of us want to bow to the Warlord Dalinar Blackthorn Kholin. Civil war, politics and Radiant vs Radiant, plus certain autonomous external forces potentially exerting themselves. But the core idea is that this champion business will likely come to a head soon, with the Champion likely named in this book, coming to power in the next, and coming to a "final" confrontation in book 5.

If I had to think for cruelty that could have broken her, changing her from the liar to the spy, I'm looking at Mraize and the Ghostbloods. The casual cruelty he exhibits by allowing underlings to try to kill each other, sanctioning assassination attempts. Tysn (sp) on the journey to the shattered plains. There is a lot of casual cruelty in the ghostbloods. But also among the nobility of the War camps. Navani ignored her initially before turning mother hen on her, and that can be cruel. Sadeas is a perfect example of cruelty. Yes, there was cruelty in her past, especially her father towards her brothers, and that can break people quite easily. But also more recently.

@heroofpages Ooh, good point! I can't believe I forgot about her!

@kari-no-sugata I think you are exactly right. As the characters grow and develop, their worldview and status change. Referring to Kaladin as the Slave/Surgeon, even though he may still view those brands as part of him, now that he is Captain of Dalinar's personal guard and lead Windrunner. Shallan is no longer just a Liar trying to rob the king's sister, but a Spy playing a dangerous game with the Ghostbloods and the Sons of Honor. And so on and so forth. What will be interesting to see is how these titles evolve in the next two books. Also, the Sleepless text - is it prophecy or prediction?

Would Adonalsium always have split into 16 equal shards, or were some pieces uneven? Do some shards have a fraction more power than others, or are they all equal? Also, we know a different group of sixteen would possibly have gotten a different 16 intents. But what if it had been a group of 10, or 17 that shattered Adonalsium? Would they have gotten 10, more powerful, but less diverse shards? Or 17 slightly lesser shards than the existing sixteen. If it had been a group of 8, would they have gotten 8 shards of Harmony's power level with a singular intent each (but without Harmony's divide between Ruin and Preservation), or would their 8 have been dual intent?

See for me, I figure the characters referenced in this blurb are the same that have always been referenced, just with updated titles. And those are the 5 perspective characters for arc 1. The Warlord became the King, and is Dalinar The Surgeon became the Captain, and is Kaladin The Assassin became the Stonewalker, and is Szeth (only one who has had any care about walking on stones) The Liar became the Spy, and is Shallan The Explorer became the Traitor, and is Eshonai (betrayed Venli by allowing the group to escape, and betrayed herself by being possessed, maybe. Mostly process of elimination) Disclaimer, my memory of what the original titles are is a little fuzzy. But I don't see why people are looking outside our main five POIs for the first arc for these characters. The Sleepless have always been looking at them. Moash, and the other secondary and tertiaries should not figure into it, I don't think. Hope we get an Eshonai perspective chapter, soon. Edit: Corrections, thanks to @Fulminato

Nah, super magnets. They are fun, and they mess with metalborn trying to sneak in and steal my thoughts.

I agree with you, her facing truths about herself, however painful and abrupt, will help her heal in the long term. Especially with positive influences from Adolin, and Jasnah, provided she returns. However, that healing could be slowed, halted or straight up sabotaged if an external force finds an in to twist her to its desires. And the fact that she and Pattern are making such a big deal about her trying not to hate the blade, and Pattern being willing to die so a different Cryptic can bond her truths, seems to be a huge thing. As a quick aside, Pattern dying for her would be a terrible idea. If another person, that close to her dies, and for that reason, I can totally see her spiraling. Her mother and father dead by her hand, her spren essentially committing suicide for her. Recipe for disaster. Odium, like Ruin before, finds people who are cracked to worm influence in. Odium is more subtle by necessity - he does not have hemalurgic spikes, that we know of, to exert his influence. But if we look at a family that has been under the direct influence of Odium for years, through her father, and she has this giant crack in he soul she is trying to repair. A crack that could easily lead to hatred if untended? Yeah, Odium can get in there. On her own, without a Shard influencing, I think she will heal, and faster with Adolin's help. With Odium expending effort to keep her uncomfortable around her spren and stoking her hatred, especially with the shady influence of the Ghostbloods, who seem less than altruistic.... Yeah, she can be pushed of that particular ledge and become the champion by degrees. Especially if something terrible happens to Adolin. And if nothing else, it would be compelling. A villain you can empathize with is the best kind of villain, because they are not black and white, good vs evil. It is part of why Eshonai is so tragic, she was possessed. But Shallan, who step by step slips further into darkness with a malevolent force prodding her along the way, would be terrifying. There is an argument to be made that I have been reading too much Stephen King lately... Also, it would be new. Brandon has not written a true female villain yet. I mean, we have Shan Elariel, who was minor at best. Bands of Mourning spoiler: Bavadin might be up there, but that is not clear yet. Eshonai is corrupted, and her sister is definitely Mz. Hyde, so we have had unpleasant women, and we have had women on the wrong side of the protagonists. But to have a a perspective character, one who we know and deeply care for go dark side? Kelsier probably, Hrathren did the wrong things with the best of intentions, but we do not have a female villain. And I would love to see it happen. I know it's not likely to happen, but dark side Shallan would be really neat.

Thanks @Firerust! I agree, it awkward. I'm the guy whose been at the party for a while, interacting with everyone, who only decides to introduce himself at the 5th event containing all the same people. Weird and awkward. But it is done now, so I can fade back into my normal behavior of mostly lurking and only commenting when I feel I have something amusing, or insightful, to say. That and throwing some crazy random theories at the wall and seeing what sticks.

I don't know. I think there is a really, really good reason why Pattern would be so concerned about Shallan hating him. She dislikes the part of herself that killed her parents so strongly that she cannot even touch Pattern's physical form without pain, almost as if he was already a dead blade. She must tell herself constantly that she does not hate Pattern, and must create a new persona for herself to be able to handle him. And most telling of all, Odium has been touching and affecting the Davar family for years. What if we are slowly watching Shallan begin to hate herself, and the spren bonded to her for what happened in her childhood? What if Shallan is the champion, unexpected, because Shallan, who would expect it? Familiar to Dalinar - though her eyes are black and blue, the colour of her current order is red. While we have a WOB stating that inherited lighteyes from a Radiant ancestor should stay, but that does not mean that hers won't change to garnet. And for @maxal, what if Adolin's role is to bring her out of her hatred? Or, more tragically, indirectly push her off the deep end if the result of the murder investigation should have a severe negative consequence for him? Why not both? What if she truly begins to hate herself, and then Alethi society if Adolin is banished for his crime, but he returns in a later book to help defeat her, the champion of Odium?

I may have been here longer @Toaster Retribution, but I am no where near as prolific. Congrats on the healthy post count, and interesting looking theories! Is the name a Cylon reference?

Hello and good morning! I never actually got around to introducing myself on the site, and figured I should maybe do that before my post count hit 300 (this will be number 274, cutting it close). If I remember correctly, I was introduced to the Cosmere in 2008-ish, when a good friend of mine handed me copies of Elantris and Mistborn and the Name of the Wind and asked if I'd ever heard of Brandon Sanderson or Patrick Rothfuss. I was an instant fan, and proceeded to hunt down hardcovers of everything they had written. And I was curious who this guy was that was going to finish the Wheel of Time, which I had been reading since I was twelve, which admittedly is not as long as some others had been reading it. I repaid this friend by introducing him to Jim Butcher, with slightly more difficulty, as he claimed to not be a huge fan of Urban Fantasy(jokes on him, he has gone to see Jim numerous times in Seattle, where as I have not yet managed to find myself at a Butcher event). I had the hardest time finding a hardcover of Elantris that was in good condition, and did not cost a small number of internal organs, as I was an underpaid student at the time. My library now boasts Hardcovers of all of Brandon's works, except maybe the Edgedancer single and Dreamer, which I am hunting for, most of which are signed, as well as the two 10 year books, and a handful of softcover lender copies. Some have electronic copies too. I may have a slight literature problem. I think I discovered this site in 2010, when WorldCon was in Montreal, not to far from where I was living. I got the full pass, signed up for every Sanderson and Rothfuss event I could. (Also met GRRM, but did not line up for Gaiman, had not read anything of his yet. I regret not having met him, but I stand by mt choice to leave space in line for those who had actually read his work). In those events, and especially at the external signing for Brandon, at a local Indigo bookstore, I quickly found that there were people who knew a ton more about his universe than I did. I needed to fix the gaps in my knowledge. (my claim to happiness was when I heard he was looking for a local place with enough space to do a reading and Q&A, I went and asked the manager of that store if they hosted events like that, and emailed Brandon when I got a positive response. I got all excited that I was going to help set up a reading with my favorite author, and was only slightly disappointed when I was told Brandon had people who would take care of that. I was sad, but I started the ball rolling, and that was a Big Deal to 23 year old me) That is when I found this site. I lurked as guest here for a year, before I finally saw something that I had to respond to. I think it was some theory that I had my own insight to, or some such, and I Really Needed To Give My Two Cents. So I created my account. Which brought on the agony of finding a unique user name. There is nothing I enjoy less than finding a user name. I don't like naming myself, I always feel very self conscious about it. I eventually settled on Stark. Not because of ASOIAF, as I figure most people would assume (Though I do currently enjoy the mix of Witcher [White wolf] and House Stark references in my banner and profile image, but those are less than a year old) I chose Stark as a direct reference to a character of the same name in Farscape, a show I was quite the fan of at the time. For those that don't know, it was a sci-fi show that had costume design by Jim Henson's company. Stark was a recurring secondary character after the first season, who was quite clearly broken and mad from torture, but who never broke or revealed his secret, and ended up being more important than anyone would have realized despite his brokenness. I found something about that identifiable. And this far into the Cosmere, the idea of the broken beggar who is more than he seems comes often enough that I find it appropriate still - though I do have a different user name I use almost everywhere else post Game of Thrones. I really did not want anyone thinking my usernames on various sites were late arriving HBO fandom. Anyhow, I created my profile in 2011, logged in and replied to my very first post. And promptly went back to lurking for so long that I forgot my log in info. Over the years, I've changed (recovered)my password a dozen times to be able to single post responses to various things that have come up. I started posting in earnest in 2015, when I changed jobs to an office position that allows me some degree of internet freedom to peruse and respond to theories, even post some of my own. I seem to be able to come up with the occasional insightful thought or witty remark that people here find entertaining, or at worst inoffensive. I decide to finally get around to my introduction post, six years later, because in the last week I had my first post get a little heart thinger, indicating a fair number of you thought it was funny. And then my second, and third yesterday, which I also apparently managed to win. I did not even know winning a day was a thing before yesterday, but yeah. Go me. Thanks everyone for liking my posts! So that is me, Stark, a 30 year old Montrealer. The top shelves of my bookcase at home proudly displays Sanderson, Rothfuss, Butcher, Jordan and Martin. My kindle includes Briggs, McClellan, Andrews, Carey, Corey, Wells, Mcguire, Bishop, Sanderson (again) and many others that my wallet (and more importantly, wall space) do not allow me to own physical copies of, though I would love to have Hardcovers of some of them. I read for fun, and when I have time for a leisure activity, gaming and reading are the top two contestants, reading winning more often than not, especially when I have a new book. My online name, here at least, is Stark, and I am a Cosmere addict. It is a continuing pleasure to be among this group, to be allowed to add my insights, and benefit from the insights of many who see links I have missed and have knowledge that I do not.

Allright kids. You're now Bridge zero. Make some spears. Lets go off to the chasms to whip you into shape. The first thing to remember is that it is okay to care. Also, you're all my squires now.

I also want to see Shallan interact with some listeners in her various guises. How will they interpret her? A human who has forms? Veil is her subterfugeform, Radiant is her warform, Shallan is her artform? That could be a fascinating discussion, and I think the listeners, who change forms when they need, will be best suited to spotting the different Shallans who exist.