Stark

In theory, I like the idea behind this thread. In practice, I worry that it will very rapidly become disorganized and difficult to track. I would almost want to suggest opening a new section to the forums - and divide the RAFOs by subject. Maybe subsectioned by series, cosmere, shard or specific character. So we would have say, a Stormlight RAFO board, a mistborn one, etc, etc. But Also a RAFO board for each shard, silverlight, organization, or specific items/characters that cross over, like Nightblood. Or we could pin the series specific RAFO pages in the forum for that series. Otherwise, this could quickly become a nightmare to sort. But I really like the idea to group the omissions together to look for patterns.

Thanks for the reminder, I'd forgotten about that memory. So traumatic, but not as traumatic as a broken Oath. And I guess we can infer that Syl's previous host died before the Recreance, or after, but kept their Oaths?

What happens to a Spren whose Nahel-bonded Radiant dies of natural, or unnatural causes, with all the oaths intact and unbroken? Does it make a difference if the Spren is in physical form at time of death?

The Pits of Hathsin and the Kandra Homeland were the exact same thing. That was one of the big reveals in Hero of Ages. The geodes are far more interesting, because after Kelsier destroyed them, it was mentioned he had shut down Atium production for approximately 300 years. Which is the time difference between Era 1 and Era 2. Which makes it super interesting as the Lost metal may well be Atium. But Harmony could change that. I think that is the direction Brandon set us up to look in. Which makes me inclined to look in other directions partly because he likes to fake us out, and partly out of sheer contrariness. But on a similar vein - Has anyone ever asked what the allomantic properties/potential would be of God metal alloys? And I don't mean Malatium, or any other alloy of God metal and the base 16. I mean, Atium-Lerasium Alloys. Or Atium/Lerasium-Ettmetal Alloys. Or Atium-Ettmetal-Lerasium. Edit: Though if Wax used Allomancy at all during the escape through the caverns, he would have ruined any new Atium buds that had developed, wouldn't he? And when does Wax ever not use Allomancy in a fight?

Interesting theory. But I think what she was reading, and how scandalous/embarrassing it was had more to do with her being so focused than anything else, right? I think you've mis-read the situation entirely, in a very interesting fashion. Though I could be wrong as well.

At this point, I'm kinda hoping @Chaos will lock this subject down again. We're spinning in circles and not going anywhere. We do have some people who are evolving their arguments and bringing new points to the table, but we also have people who are copy pasting their own previous responses in response to the new responses to their previous responses. The whole thread is starting to feel a bit redundant. It is not my place to settle disputes, or decide when a given subject is done, which is why I'm attempting a summoning of someone who has that authority, to try to close this portal down. But at the end of the day, I think we can all agree that we all love Brandon's work. It is why we are here. Are we all going to love everything he does all the time? No. I definitely have my favorites among his works, and I have others that get re-read far less often. I also have some personal views on some subjects that I'd love to see any author explore in the context of their world. And that is okay. Do I think Brandon needs to incorporate Harlequin Romance elements to make the relationships and interplay between characters more real? Not really. There is a reason why most people keep their intimate moments private, and that is cool. Maybe one day Brandon will write a character who likes to be a bit more of an exhibitionist, or is up front and vocal about their inhibitions, or lack thereof. But I do not see that with any current characters. Can we go back to theorising on upcoming plot twists, easter eggs, Cosmic motivations, who the Kandra worldhopper is (currently) and what Hoid is up to?

A few questions here, on two subjects: If an Awakener travels to Roshar and uses the proper Commands to one-breath revive a Chasmfiend to make the most terrifying Lifeless ever, would that one breath contain sufficent Investiture to replace the function of the Spren that departed at the time of its death? Or would it collapse on itself and be useless? Or would it take more breath to Awaken it to a functional standpoint? On a similar vein, making a lifeless uses the body's colour, but shardblade killed limbs are already greyed out. Would awakening a shardblade killed corpse require colour from more sources? Would the shardblade killed limbs function? Finally on this vein, what would be the result of this hypothetical: If as an Awakener, you store all your Breath in a vessel. Then a dying person gives you their own breath before they expire. If you then use that one Breath to turn the person's body into a Lifeless, is there a fucntional, or Cosmere significant difference to using a person's own Breath to re-animate their own corpse? [Edit: I could totally see this situation being the basis for some sort of Idranian Frankenstein type horror story - where the mad Awakener/Scientist traps a loved ones soul in its own undying body for all time.] Next subject: It has been asked what would happen if you tried to summon a Shardblade on Sel, and that got RAFO'd interestingly. What would happen if a Listener worldhopped to Sel and managed to bond a Seon? Is that possible, and would that create a new form? Would the form reflect the Aon at the core of the Seon?

When you get "cut" with a shardblade, the affected limb goes grey. When cut with Nightblood, the wound is blackened and drained of colour. Does this have to do with Nightblood being more heavily invested, or is it to do with Nightblood's artificial nature?

It's okay, I had another one to add. I have nothing else to add to this thread. Happy Thursday everyone!

Fair enough. I could argue that we can consciously choose to accelerate our breathing and hyperventilate our selves, or to hold our breath, until we pass out. Both both of those options are bad, as they have negative consequences which I would not see the Shard having. It was not a perfect analogy, but the base of it was that I think a shard investing in an area is unconscious, but they can actively influence the rate, or reverse it, by taking conscious control of the process. Breathing was just the first unconscious process that came to mind that could also be consciously controlled to a degree. I think I may have done better with the apple, as you can reverse the heating of it by putting it back in the fridge, or accelerate it by adding more heat.

If I keep running with my analogy, the shard that is floating around in space, is well, floating around in space. There is no planet for the natural Investiture of the Shard to radiate into and take hold of. I don't think that it is the case that the Shard decided not to invest. It feels more accurate to me that the Shard is just hiding in the void. As a consequence, there is nothing for the Investiture to permeate. Shardic equivalent of holding your breath while in hiding, so the villain can't hear you, I guess. On a human scale, we'd die in that case - no air, the far below zero temperatures, the vacuum of space, etc. But the Shard doesn't have those issues to deal with. Another way to look at it, for that specific shard, take an apple out of your fridge and Hold it in your hands. The longer you Hold it, the more of your body heat the apple will absorb until it matches your temperature. And, if that happens to be warmer than the ambient, it will radiate heat itself into the void of your kitchen. If we keep this going with you being the shard, the apple a planet, and your warmth being the investiture, well then the unattached Shard has no apple. So nothing gets invested. Its not necessarily a decision to not invest, it is just that there is nothing around them to accept that investiture. That shard is hiking some back country road, living off the grid, with no fridge nearby to provide an apple. Or something along those lines, it got away from me a little bit at the end there. This is all specualtion of course, but this is how I visualize the function of Shards investing.

Investing in a location may be as unconscious for them as breathing is for us. They do it unconsciously, automatically upon entering an area. For us, breathing is an autonomic function, that with some conscious effort we can control, and with targeted training, we can control to a great degree - but the default is still automatic at a steady rate whether conscious or not. And, the longer we are in a given area, the more the inside of our lungs exchange with ambient particles of the environment, leaving its mark on us, and ours on the environment. Gross though that visual may be, that's how I see Investiture on a shardic scale. The longer a shard is present in a given area, the more deeply they exchange their metaphoric breath with the environment (possibly literal on Nalthis) and the more deeply their investiture permeates the area. And of course, with some conscious effort they can direct it better, like Preservation did on Scadrial. Does that seem like an appropriate analogy?

@Rockobar Welcome to the shard. I think that there is a lot of value to the opinions you have expressed. I think what is causing the majority of the backlash against you is the tone you have taken in expressing it, and that you have shared what seems like the opener to a private conversation in a very public forum. I did take the time to read your full letter, which I fully admit is not something I usually do. No offense to many of the wordsmiths on the site, but many of us, myself included, tend to get overly verbose and lengthy in our replies. I personally found your tone to be overly condescending, and maybe a little pretentious. In other situations, it may have qualified as what is currently being called Man-splaining. Telling an artist who has been successfully hitting some of the top laurels in their field that they are not doing it the way you like, and that you have some pointers for how they could do better is not, well, very diplomatic. I know it would put me on the defensive, and from the numerous reactions you've received, a lot of people seem to feel this was more an attack than a conversation opener. I think you may have been better served to open a topic along the lines of "Things I'd like to see explored in more depth in the Cosmere" If you had posted there a few topics you'd like to see Brandon explore or expand on, like sexuality, or meaningful death (I'll give you, after a few of the latest entries in the Cosmere, I have been questioning whether death has lost all meaning in the Cosmere) or the place of religion, you may have ended up with a far more positive discussion. It definitely does not help that some of these topics are sensitive, hot-button type subjects. But at the end of the day, I think the core of the reaction you've received comes down to this: Unless you are the mentor/teacher of a given artist, or a contemporary colleague who has been asked specifically for advice, telling an artist how to art is not cool. Whether it be a writer writing, a sculptor, painter or actor. That said, I really do hope to see some more of your thoughts and opinions in the future.

While it is true Idranian Returned only live a week, it is also possible that they returned to accomplish a task within that one week. We can't assume that they failed because they gave up their breath. It is possible that the effect they were to accomplish came from the week's worth of interactions they had before expiring. Another good example of this is Blushweaver. I think the only thing we can assume is that Endowment has really, really good future sight. Sometimes her returned are there to give a breath and do something spectacular. Other returned may only be there to step on a butterfly to make sure it doesn't cause a hurricane by flapping its wings. So theoretically, Denth, Arsteel and Sharshara Returned knowing they would become who they became and die how they died, but the lives they lived would have a latter arriving positive effect on the Cosmere as dictated by Endowment. I really don't think that we can categorically say a Returned who dies without bestowing their breath failed to accomplish their purpose in Returning. Unless they were killed by a Worldhopper with no Connection to Nalthis or Endowment, then you have some random chance added to the system.

See, I thought Cannon indicated that you could not Awaken living things, or use living colour for Awakening (Nightblood colour draining having his own rules). Yet apparently Brandon has enough Breath to command you anyway. So how much breath do you need to override a person's will and have them act in accordance with your Commands? I'd assume far more than it took to bring Nightblood to life. Does it require less breath if the command does not run counter to the person's normal action, or temperament (Ie: trolling the s**t out of us) and it was something they would have done anyway if just a request? And ow did it feel being Awakened?

What if not on another world, but on one of the moons? Or it's location follows the orbit of the specific moon. I remember some mention of the Orbit of the moons being special, important, and artificial. Does anyone remember if Rock's story about seeing Hoid emerge from a shardpool specified time of day, unless it was specifically Cultivation's pool?

If anyone gets a chance, I have a Nightblood question that I'd like to ask, for the next event, though it is a bit extensive. I'd also like to see the thoughts of the minds here. We know that Vasher an Shashara tried to base Nightblood's awakening on the Shardblades they had seen on Roshar. Is there a reason they chose the command "Destroy Evil" rather than modeling the command on the ideals of one of the Radiant orders? And as a follow up, if the command had been given in "Ideal" format (Ie: Value Journey before Destination, Choose Life before Death, Show Strength rather than weakness, Protect those who cannot protect themselves, protect even those you despise, so long as it is right, etc, etc), and assuming it worked, would Nightblood have developed a personality more similar to that of the Spren-type the Ideals bond too? An artificial Honorspren, or other, as it were? And if yes, on Roshar, would a bond to Nightblood give the user access to that Radiant order's Surges?

Sadly yes. Which is why we will sadly never get to see the "Survivor of Hathsin and the Chamber of Secrets" published. However, I did hear a rumor that if you ask nicely, team Sanderson may send you the prose version.

In other news along the same vein, Brandon has announced a new partnership with Stephanie Meyer, to help groom her to take over the Cosmere should he be unable to complete it. Their first collaboration will be a cross over novella featuring a double date between their iconic couples involving an ageless immortal romantically involved with a much younger mortal woman. Look out for the epic meeting of Siri, Susebron, Bella and Edward next spring. Also please be careful not to confuse the romantic comedy "10 Shades of Stormlight" featuring Amaram with the survival/horror/romance "50 Shades of Threnody". One of those is a spin off written by neither of the Authors. In other news, I completely fell for that troll, and was contemplating avoiding the forums like the plague for the next 20 or so years. Thanks for that.

@Who Sharded? I don't think so. Thanksgiving is a North American tradition, and I don't think it is celebrated in Mexico. So you have the Canadian one in October and the US one in November.

October 9th-ish - depends on where it falls relative to the weekend. I figure we usually get the first five chapters, one a week, in the six weeks before release. So depending when in November the release date is set for, we may start seeing sample chapters as early as late September, or as late as early October. If Tor follows the same pattern they have used for the last few Sanderson releases. They did that for WoR, and BoM. SoS too. I don't remember if Tor published the Reckoners, but I do remember sample chapters for those too. Its not the full book, and a chapter a week does not last long, but better than nothing, right? Edit: Just saw release date is slotted for November 14th. So if pattern follows first sample chapter will be October 10th. Right after thanksgiving, so I know what I'll be thankful for this year!

I would assume, seeing as they talk about making sure to burn off all your metals before too long to avoid metal poisoning, that it disappears. Which comes to an interesting point - If the metal is disappearing, is Allomancy finite? Eventually they will run out of accessible metals on the planet. Will certain misting types cease to be relevant (until space age allows for discovery of new extra-terrestrial mines) as their metal stops being available on Scadrial?

One thing that partially sustains me is the knowledge that the first five chapters will most likely be released in the weeks leading up to the publishing date. So While everyone is saying November, I'm hoping Canadian thanksgiving will be when we first start getting our fixes.

So if Investiture follows thermodynamics, being neither created or destroyed, and Nightblood is slowly reducing the mount of Investiture in the Cosmere, that implies some fun things. For one, this is not necessarily contradictory. To be able to use investiture, you need the right identity and connection to access it, whether it be breaths, Selish geolocation or a nahel bond, you need something to connect you to the investiture to use it. Now, if Nightblood is taking in Investiture, and transforming it to another type of Investiture (corrupted), then the total Investiture of the Cosmere is unchanged, but the total accessible Investiture of the Cosmere goes down. A good example of this would be fire wood. Fire wood is full of potential energy, much of it in the form of organic compounds that would have sustained the tree that was. But, if you apply flame(Nightblood) to the wood, it is consumed, and the energy is released, being converted to heat, light and sound. No matter what you do, that heat, light and sound will never convert back to wood on its own. There are other natural processes that will use the new energy to convert other energy into useable forms for new trees to grow, but you need the other organisms to balance that equation. The cosmere does not have that. Nightblood is the invasive species with no natural predator. It will consume and consume and consume until nothing is left, and there is nothing to convert the "corrupted" Investiture back to a useable form. If Nightblood eventually consumes shard level amounts of investiture, then interesting things may start to happen, given what we know investiture does on its own. But until then, It is a drain on the system because there is no balance to the equation. So Both WoB are valid. Investiture is neither created or destroyed. Nightblood is reducing the total available Investiture of the Cosmere by coverting/corrupting it to a currently unuseable format, but not actually destroying it. Give Nightblood a couple of milenia on Roshar consuming stormlight, or let it eat a shard, and then we should start to see some really interesting things as Nightblood changes the intent of what it consumes to something new...

Not quite what I expected, but not too surprised. 44%Skybreaker With their strong emphasis on the law, Skybreakers are among the most demanding of Orders. They have a strong sense of justice that can be used to punish the guilty or to defend the innocent. They possess the surges of Gravitation and Division. Their second Ideal is, "I will put the law before all else." 34%Bondsmith Wise and trustworthy, Bondsmiths unite and lead the peoples of the world. They concern themselves with the big picture and coordinate other Radiants rather than fight on the front lines. They possess the surges of Tension and Adhesion. Their second Ideal is, "I will unite instead of divide. I will bring men together." 34%Elsecaller Proud and sharp of wit, Elsecallers are leaders among Radiants. They act as ambassadors to the spren and advisers to their fellows, granting them a reputation of great wisdom and benevolence. They possess the surges of Transformation and Transportation, and their second Ideal is unknown. 31%Truthwatcher Truthwatchers are among the most tactful and considerate of orders, taking care to think before they speak. They are private individuals, but insightful. Although not generally inclined toward combat, they are invaluable allies off the battlefield. They possess the surges of Progression and Illumination, and their second Ideal is unknown. 13%Windrunner Windrunners are the foremost defenders among the Knights Radiant, upholding honor and mercy in equal measures. They are passionate, loyal, and inclusive, noteworthy for training a large number of squires. They possess the surges of Adhesion and Gravitation. Their second Ideal is, "I will protect those who cannot protect themselves." 9%Stoneward Stonewards are loyal and dependable, the first to charge and the last to retreat. Stubborn to a fault but fiercely trustworthy, they make for unparalleled allies. They possess the surges of Cohesion and Tension, and their second Ideal is unknown. 0%Dustbringer Also called Releasers to avoid association with the Voidbringers. Releasers are often misunderstood by those they protect, but they are fierce and loyal allies. They may prefer to work apart from those who malign them, but will always be there to battle common enemies. They possess the surges of Division and Abrasion, and their second Ideal is unknown. 0%Edgedancer Edgedancers are renowned for their skills in and out of battle. Graceful, refined, and selfless, Edgedancers spread hope wherever they go--although they focus on the immediate and leave larger concerns to the Bondsmiths. They possess the surges of Abrasion and Progression. Their second Ideal is, "I will remember those who have been forgotten." 0%Lightweaver With their skill for the arts and their impressive memory, Lightweavers shine primarily outside of battle. They have a particular knack for encouraging their fellow Radiants and emphasize self-awareness and individuality above any well-defined Ideals. They possess the surges of Illumination and Transformation. 0%Willshaper Of all the Orders, Willshapers are the most varied. Often eccentric and adventurous, they defy any single definition but express a great love of the new and different. They are energetic and optimistic, if sometimes a little scatter-brained. Willshapers possess the surges of Transportation and Cohesion, and their second Ideal is unknown. Online Assessment Tool part of Easy LMS