Kurkistan

Actually, he's close-mouthed about that too. I can't find it, but I could have sworn we recently (very recently) got a RAFO on the composition of spikes.

Well you know what they say: You can't make Frodo a Jedi without giving Sauron a Death Star. And by Death Star, I mean Catquisitor. Having an even more over-powered worldhopping cat following him to try and get revenge/spike out his super-Bronze/toy with him like a mouse might raise the stakes. Just a thought. I'm not a fanfic writer, I just want to mention Catquisitors whenever possible. 'Cause they're awesome.

Just FYI: I didn't actually spend all that time drawing those two ships. Mostly thinking about the theory behind them, compiling quotes and evidence, thinking some more, typing it up, eventually defending and then defenestrating it, etc. I'm not that slow at ASCII art (that said, those ships did take a surprisingly long time to get right).

Lol, didn't even make that connection.

That's an intriguing idea, Darnam.

For shame, good sir/madam! I, for one, find great enjoyment in spending a dozen hours drawing ASCII art of impossible ship designs that later turn out to be based on a demonstrably false theory, disproved by no less than three separate inarguable foes: Science, Brandon Sanderson, and Myself. I started writing that out as a joke, but I actually did enjoy that, and look back at it fondly even now... ... I'm weird. ... Please continue about your day.

*Double-checks thread to make sure it wasn't his fault* I'm sorry to hear that, Weiry. We're a small enough bunch that I think it sad to split up Brandon's fandom like that.

Okay, just checking. You might not be giving uber!Seeker enough credit, actually. Vin could detect Ruin and the Well and skilled Seekers (or Vin, when she cheat with Duralumin) can determine the exact emotions Rioters/Soothers are aiming at. I think an uber!Seeker could Bronze-ify at that mug and know immediately that it was Invested, and perhaps even some details about the type of its Investiture. All on the level of the conscious mind, rather than relying on intuitions.

@Darnam That's interesting, though note that no one really "sees" with Allomantic bronze, so it'd be a matter of really good "hearing" of pulses. @Pech Actually, Scadrial has relatively low amounts of Investiture floating around, cosmerically speaking.

Another good source of "fanon" information is the signatures of most of the older members: Any theory you see in multiple "Espoused Theories" sections is likely to have a fairly strong following. P.S. Do not include mine in this metric, as I am a madman.

I wasn't really trying to make a positive claim, but okay: More of the main POV characters than you'd expect will not become KR. -GUTSY Version: Fewer (inclusive) than half of the POV characters will become Radiants.

Okay, fine. Feruchemical copper. Feruchemical zinc. Feruchemical steel. Feruchemical gold even, as it obviously stores something beyond just what you'd find in a healthy body, what with its limb-growing abilities and all. Are those better? The point is, all kinds of Feruchemy store Investiture into their metalminds without any real energy input from the outside. Feruchemical aluminum just seemed the most obviously powered by the soul and nothing but the soul, so help me soul. So you're narrowing down the definition of end-neutrality to the mechanism of Feruchemy, rather than the source of the power? That may be a path to making Feruchemy uniquely end-neutral, but I think the language of the AoLAA suggests that neutrality is more about power sources than anything else, what with it saying that end-positivity is about the power source being external. As to everyone else on the planet also having these power sources: Yes, but it's about how you use it. A Breath sitting in a normal Nalthian isn't lifting weights or anything: you have to throw in some magic system so that the Power of Creation there is doing something abnormal. --- A real problem I see with your formulation, though, is that if you strip down every magic to just its mechanism and consider the process of getting the energy as "entirely independent" of the utilization of it, everything starts looking end-neutral. We don't have any reason to believe that Allomancy wastes/adds energy from/to that gotten from Preservation, so is it end-neutral? The source of the energy is "entirely independent" of its use, since it's not even really Allomancy until it's filtered through the Allomancer's spiritweb, so it seems that, so long as nothing is added on or taken away by the Allomancer during the process, Allomancy suddenly becomes end-neutral. Once again, our given definitions of the various "ends" specifically talks about the source of the energy being external to the user. The internality of the source is an important point, then, I would think. No, actually, I do not say that. Okay, some quick facts: All Shards hold some part of the Power of Creation: they do not channel it, they embody it. -Power comes from the Shards themselves, not some outsourced soup of "Power of Creation." -Shards are pieces of the PoC. Preservation gave some part of his power over permanently to empower humanity, weakening himself. Humanity on Scadrial, then, is endowed with a part of Preservation's power. The Power of Creation. Preservation does not lose power when he fuels Allomancy. It returns to him "like water through a turbine" and so he can use it again without ill-effect. This power is the Power of Creation. -- So, in short, souls generate their own energy (or non-entropicaly utilize existing energy, if you prefer) specifically because they are made of the Power of Creation. Just as Preservation's "power is spontaneously generated without fuel," so too is the power of the soul in the Cosmere. So, in sum: souls are made of "the very Power of Creation itself," the one and only energy source you're willing to accept. Does this mean that I win? Beyond that, I would think that the existence of various Invested objects that do not, at least at first blush, look to draw upon external sources of power at all times (Nightblood, Shardblades...) is evidence on its own, even if I wasn't backed up by various quotes about the Shards and PoC. Because it needs a lot more power than that? It takes dozens or hundreds or Breaths to get anything done in Awakening. Also the power of people's souls isn't exactly "geared" towards Allomantic effects. It's sitting pretty doing its thing, and people normally have no way to get at it and try to rejigger its functionality. Unless you have Feruchemy, of course... Also, maybe people can sense bronze pulses...

I'm generally good about waiting. I tend not to read book blurbs, let alone skip to the index. I just recently managed to read a non-fiction piece and not figure out its non-fictitious nature until the afterward.

Glad you're on board. I think such a categorization would be perfectly intelligible, but it simply does not match up with the given usage of the terminology. Unless Mr. AoLAAA was talking quite narrowly about just the attribute transfer mechanism for Feruchemy, our given definition of end-neutrality seems to allow for non-Shardic investment of energy; Spiritual energy, no less.

Huh. Perhaps you'd be more amenable if I withdrew to a more "turbine" model of discussion? So the Breaths don't actually "create" energy, but their existing energy is simply used in a non-destructive manner. Thing is, I fundamentally disagree that "innate investiture is just sitting there waiting to access a seemingly limitless pool of magical energy." I don't think that's what it does. I think it does its own thing without the need—and perhaps without even the basic capability—of accessing any external source. I think Nightblood (when not drawn) and Shardblades can truck along being magical by themselves no matter what. I don't think innate Investiture relies upon any external source of power. That's what makes it innate... Recall that, at some level we have energy just being "created" out of nowhere. Preservation doesn't lose power from fueling Allomancy, yet the Shards all have a finite amount of power at their disposal. Thermodynamics is deeply unhappy on several levels. I think it natural to say that we can have "self-replenishing" magics on some level beneath that of a Shard, and that (at least some kinds of) "innate Investiture" fits that bill.

An interesting thought. I wouldn't be shocked if it were the case, though we have some ground yet to cover before I'd go so far as to say that it's likely.

Well Honorspren, at least, are Splinters. And Splinters are "a blend" of the Cognitive and Spiritual. So no, it is not fair to describe spren (at least in terms of bonding-spren, or at the very lest in terms of Syl) as "cognitive-only".

Western. To claim anything else whiffs of sophistry, I must say.

You have to go to your profile's "My Settings" page and uncheck the "My timezone is currently in DST" box.

Okay, sorry for the misattribution.

Bookmarks. They save things for you.

@Isomere On "Vaporizing": I'm inclined to agree with Argent. Also, recall that Kelsier specifically warns Vin that she should burn off all of her metals before sleeping, due to metal poisoning. This tells us that burning a metal gets it out of your body, since having gaseous pewter absorbed into your soft tissue isn't exactly good for you either. So something more than sublimation to gas must be happening. ---- On end-neutrality: A good analysis on how power flows in Feruchemy. I disagree, though, that any of this analysis supports the claim that Feruchemy is unique in its neutrality in comparison to Awakening. Specifically, you say that "When the aluminum ferring's Soul generates energy that is end-positive and unrelated." What now? Recall the definitions: If the aluminum ferring's soul generates energy on its lonesome, then it's not an external source of power. Thus it's not end-positive. All the power manipulated by a Feruchemist is his own (I include Heat and Food and whatnot because they must be incorporated into the Feruchemist in some way before he can use them), with no calls to some 3rd party and no leakage. So Feruchemy is end-neutral. As it turns out, the Feruchemist can create quite a bit of power (which power is "neither gained nor lost" in his manipulation of it) in this manner, but all without spilling into positivity. So too, I would argue, with Breath and Awakening. There need not be any call to a 3rd party—so it's not end-positive—and no energy is lost during the process (normally, at the very least)—so it's not end-negative. Once we agree on those two points, that's all she wrote.

Interesting claim. I'll log a "No" on this, btw.

I'd be perfectly fine leaving Lift as our only Edgedancer, I must say. Also, you're a bit off as to what Brandon's said about the books: Source: (~32:30) "Thematically" doesn't demand that that Order be "featured." Nor, really, does "featured" demand that that one of the main characters be a member of that Order. As for definitions of "major character", we should probably start off with the flashback characters and work from there.

Kokerlii's (thought-detection-blocking bird) power works nearly identically to Allomantic copper, though perhaps on a different power-level.