Suinomancy?

[+Oltux72 he/him]

Why are they keeping pigs? Food taboos can persist more or less forever, so there is no need to explain why pigs on Threnody are not eaten. But they do not keep them as pets. They don't ride them. They don't eat them. So why do they keep them? These people are living a hard life. They don't have resources to spare on useless animals.

So the pigs must have or must have had until recently a use. That makes me wonder. If you can bond birds and worms inside them, why not pigs. Suinomancy, anyone?

[The Sovereign]

On 2/16/2019 at 8:31 AM, Oltux72 said:

Why are they keeping pigs? Food taboos can persist more or less forever, so there is no need to explain why pigs on Threnody are not eaten. But they do not keep them as pets. They don't ride them. They don't eat them. So why do they keep them? These people are living a hard life. They don't have resources to spare on useless animals.

So the pigs must have or must have had until recently a use. That makes me wonder. If you can bond birds and worms inside them, why not pigs. Suinomancy, anyone?

I'm pretty sure Silence outright says that pigs tend to keep Shades away. That seems like an excellent reason to keep them around on Threnody.

Quote

"Silence liked to keep a healthy stock, though of course not for eating. Pigs were said to ward away shades. She used any tool she could to make the waystop seem more safe." 

 

Edited February 27, 2019 by The Sovereign
Relevant quote added.

[+Oltux72 he/him]

But why are Shades repelled by pigs? They can hardly be predominantly Muslim or Jewish. It is likely that there is an arcane reason.

[+Invocation]

2 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

But why are Shades repelled by pigs? They can hardly be predominantly Muslim or Jewish. It is likely that there is an arcane reason.

Actually, I think it probably does have something to do with Threnody's whole Jewish inspiration thing.

[Scion of the Mists]

Quote

"Pigs were said to ward away shades. She used any tool she could to make the waystop seem more safe." 

They might not actually repel Shades - it could just be superstition.  

[The Sovereign]

3 minutes ago, Scion of the Mists said:

They might not actually repel Shades - it could just be superstition.  

This is likely the case, but as long as people believe it Silence can cash in on it.

Alternately, if enough people believe it, it may actually become true. We could be seeing something similar to how Spren can change if human perception of them changes.

[Karger he/him]

Shades are sort of pushed away by humans which is why you are not in danger if you walk slowly in the forest.  If pigs have the same effect then keeping some around would actually ward away shades.  Also the amount of forage available to fatten the pigs indicates that Silence can wait and  then sell them to the fort folk where they can be slaughtered and eaten safely. 

[+Oltux72 he/him]

10 hours ago, Karger said:

Shades are sort of pushed away by humans which is why you are not in danger if you walk slowly in the forest.  If pigs have the same effect then keeping some around would actually ward away shades.

But why do pigs do that, but other animals which could be milked, like goats or sheep, do not?

[Calderis he/him]

31 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

But why do pigs do that, but other animals which could be milked, like goats or sheep, do not?

Because it's loosely based of Judaism 

[Karger he/him]

17 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

But why do pigs do that, but other animals which could be milked, like goats or sheep, do not?

Perhaps because pigs are smarter and or more lively then goats or sheep.  Also they are likely better suited to the climate.

[+Oltux72 he/him]

On 3/2/2019 at 7:55 AM, Calderis said:

Because it's loosely based of Judaism 

That is the motivation for Brandon to write the novella, but hardly the in-world explanation.

13 hours ago, Karger said:

Perhaps because pigs are smarter and or more lively then goats or sheep.  Also they are likely better suited to the climate.

Yet shades of animals are supposed to exist. And while it s logical, it does not explain why they are not eaten. Nor while a few more people wouldn't be a better way to spend the resources.

[Calderis he/him]

1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

That is the motivation for Brandon to write the novella, but hardly the in-world explanation.

Sorry, I didn't mean for that to come across as flippant as it did. 

I mean that the pigs don't have to actually be special so long as people believe that they are. 

[Karger he/him]

4 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

That is the motivation for Brandon to write the novella, but hardly the in-world explanation.

Yet shades of animals are supposed to exist. And while it s logical, it does not explain why they are not eaten. Nor while a few more people wouldn't be a better way to spend the resources.

Pigs are eaten at fort cities where it is safe to kill them Silence just doesn't eat pork because it is to expensive.  Pigs are smart enough to learn the simple rules instinctively so it makes sense that they would be used in the forest.  They are also hardy and able to eat almost anything themselves as well as a good source of hide. 

[+Oltux72 he/him]

On 3/3/2019 at 6:09 PM, Karger said:

Pigs are eaten at fort cities where it is safe to kill them Silence just doesn't eat pork because it is to expensive.  Pigs are smart enough to learn the simple rules instinctively so it makes sense that they would be used in the forest.  They are also hardy and able to eat almost anything themselves as well as a good source of hide. 

Good luck at herding pigs a long distance. And if you want to keep to the simple rules, why keep animals who can run at all? Or naturally herbivorous animals?

[Karger he/him]

It might also be that cows and goats did not survive the crossing.  In several island nations only pigs are kept.

[Will Arbit]

On 3/7/2019 at 6:01 AM, Oltux72 said:

Good luck at herding pigs a long distance. And if you want to keep to the simple rules, why keep animals who can run at all? Or naturally herbivorous animals?

What animals are you thinking of that can't run? Turtles? I don't think I know of any societies with majorly domesticated tortoises, and they tend to be small outside the tropics anyway. All domesticated animals I can think of can run, even if they look stupid doing so. (Chickens always look silly.)

You do have a point about pigs being omnivorous, and therefore inclined to eat animals, thus shedding blood -- at least I assume that's what you meant by saying pigs weren't naturally herbivorous -- but pigs mostly don't hunt like cats or dogs. They're scavengers. They eat what they find, including their own poop. (ew) Pigs will eat almost anything, including things that are poisonous to us, so they're easy to feed. They don't need to be hunting down things and shedding blood.

Also what Karger said:

On 3/7/2019 at 11:37 AM, Karger said:

It might also be that cows and goats did not survive the crossing.  In several island nations only pigs are kept.

Cows are fussy, fragile animals, and goats get into trouble. Sheep, which Karger didn't mention, are just dumb.

 

Are pigs really that hard to herd?

 

As for why pigs repel shades:

Pigs hearts are used in our world to study the human heart because they're pretty similar and much easier to get. Maybe there's something unusually humanlike about pigs? And once people think they repel shades, they will because Cognitive nonsense.

 

Why to keep them instead of getting more people:

They're easier to feed and can be sold. Also, you don't have to pay them.

[+Ark1002]

On 2/27/2019 at 5:57 AM, The Sovereign said:

I'm pretty sure Silence outright says that pigs tend to keep Shades away. That s

That's a strange qoute

[Will Arbit]

On 4/22/2019 at 6:32 PM, Ark1002 said:

That's a strange qoute

Why do you say so?

Edited April 24, 2019 by Will Arbit
fixed typo

[John Flamesinger he/him]

So, I hate to turn gruesome (Stop reading if you are about to eat any pig product but bacon), it is said that Humans taste like pork. So maybe shades don't like the taste of pork and that's why they stay away from Humans and Pigs?

[Karger he/him]

18 hours ago, John Flamesinger said:

So, I hate to turn gruesome (Stop reading if you are about to eat any pig product but bacon), it is said that Humans taste like pork. So maybe shades don't like the taste of pork and that's why they stay away from Humans and Pigs?

But shades do occupationally kill both.

[John Flamesinger he/him]

Yeah, but they tend to drift away from humans, don't they?

[Karger he/him]

13 minutes ago, John Flamesinger said:

Yeah, but they tend to drift away from humans, don't they?

Sure but I don't think they actually eat either.

[Shaukan-son-Hasweth he/him]

This was kind of said before.
But maybe pigs replace dogs on Threnody.

Dogs are omnivores in theory but mainly carnivorous. Feeding them would not be viable.

Pigs are very smart and can be thought tricks just as well as dogs and ear basically anything. Also domestic pigs come from wild boars which makes them suited to live in a forest.

They have a very good sense of smell and are really dangerous if aggressive. So maybe they are used as guard pigs. Or for tracking smells.

 

When we see them in the novella they are locked in. But that's at night time. Maybe they locked them in so they don't run at night breaking the simple rules.

[Honorless he/him]

Suinomancy from 'sus'? Why not Porcomancy from 'porcus'? 

[Lunu’anaki he/him]

If every human who becomes a shade believes shades are afraid of pigs, every new shade becomes afraid of pigs. This could even be an explanation for why shades hate fire, spilled blood, etc.