Could a fullborn store excess health they generate when compounding gold?

[Archer he/him]

If a fullborn burns one of their goldminds, once they become as healthy as is physically possible, is it possible for them to store the rest of the health that’s generated?

If they can, it would allow them to fill goldminds without spending much time sick. And if they burned duralumin before burning gold, that would create a massive amounts of excess health to store, right?

Thanks in advance for your answers. My apologies if this has already been discussed elsewhere.

 

[I think I am here. he/him]

I would imagine so.

It’s like with Cadmium compounding, once you have enough air you need you can store it way, then compound it more more. Compounding would allow for basically infinite Feruchemy with no storing required. Not only that, but if you kept compounding to would get more.

Eg. Imagine you need 5 charges of Cadmium normally.

You store up one charge > compound to ten charges

store away extra five charges > compound those to fifty charges

store away extra fourth-five charges > compound those to 450 charges

Your charges would rise exponentially. So yeah, I’m pretty sure a Fullborn could store excess Feruchemical charges, or in other words, charges that aren’t really making a difference if you store instead of tap them.

Things like strength though, I think there wouldn’t be an excess because you could always get stronger, as opposed to health, for example.

[HSuperLee he/him]

What you're describing in basically what most compounding is. You get way too much out of burning a metalmind to be useful unless you store the excess. In fact, I don't think we've seen a compounder not do this.

[+Invocation]

Yeah, like @HSuperLee said, that is the vast majority of compounding just broken down to the bare essentials. Store --> Burn --> Mega-release --> Store and use at will. Even with stuff like strength, because sometimes you want to regulate the flow of your attribute.

[Archer he/him]

14 minutes ago, HSuperLee said:

What you're describing in basically what most compounding is. You get way too much out of burning a metalmind to be useful unless you store the excess. In fact, I don't think we've seen a compounder not do this.

Really? Maybe I need to reread Mistborn E2. When Miles used compounded health to heal from wounds, I thought he just swallowed metalminds with less stored health than he'd need, then compounded it up to the amount he required. I can't recall them ever storing the excess. Was this mentioned explicitly, or is it an assumed thing? 

Edit: Thanks Itiah, Invocation, and HSuperLee. Your comments were super helpful. *two thumbs up*

Edited December 8, 2018 by Ookla the Paragon

[HSuperLee he/him]

16 minutes ago, Ookla the Paragon said:

Really? Maybe I need to reread Mistborn E2. When Miles used compounded health to heal from wounds, I thought he just swallowed metalminds with less stored health than he'd need, then compounded it up to the amount he required. I can't recall them ever storing the excess. Was this mentioned explicitly, or is it an assumed thing? 

Edit: Thanks Itiah, Invocation, and HSuperLee. Your comments were super helpful. *two thumbs up*

It was mentioned that Miles had many goldmind spikes scattered across his body (spikes so as to prevent them from being pushed and pulled (not the hemalurgic kind)) that he would store health in. There's also just the math of him not being able to store enough gold in his stomach for the constant healing we see, and he's never mentioned actually eating any gold. Yes, he did burn gold at one point, but I assume that's because he keeps a small amount in his stomach for emergency compounding (like at his execution.)

[Calderis he/him]

And here's the deal with Miles. 

He is apparently constantly tapping gold to some extent. Not burning it. Compounding is what allows him to fill the metalminds so that he can do that. He doesn't need to burn constantly, he just needs enough storage to not need to actually store. 

That's the real strength of compounding, storing the excess that burning creates. Think about it for a moment, and don't think about Miles but Rashek and Marsh. It has to work that way. If Rashek had stopped tapping, he'd have died. Atium has an insanely fast burn rate, and he wasn't just shoveling atium into his mouth to keep burning (and couldn't have done so ahead of time as stomach acid destroys atium quickly) and Marsh is alive due to compounding atium as well... When all of the atium he has was a single small pouch taken from a Kandra at the end of HoA. Which is apparently enough in itself to keep him alive indefinitely. 

Quote

Kirrin

Marsh? The book doesn't mention him after he fights with Elend.

Brandon Sanderson

Marsh is alive. I changed this from when I talked to [Peter]. I realized some things about his use of Allomancy that would allow him to survive. Actually, he is immortal. He can pull off the same Allomancy/Feruchemy trick that the Lord Ruler did. (And he knows it too, since he was there when Sazed explained how it was done in Book One.) He's actually the only living person who actually knows this trick for certain. (Though there's a chance that Spook, Ham and Breeze heard about it from Vin and the others.) So yes, if there were another series, Marsh would make an appearance.

Douglas

I thought that trick required atium and involved burning the atium. With all the atium gone and Sazed not making any more, it would therefore not be possible even for a full mistborn/feruchemist. Am I wrong, is Sazed providing atium specifically for Marsh to allow a friend and valuable servant to survive, or what?

Brandon Sanderson

Marsh has the bag of Atium that KanPaar sent to be sold, as well as several nuggets in his stomach. So, I guess 'immortal' is the wrong phrase. He's got the only remaining atium in the world and can keep himself around for a long, long while—but he WILL eventually run out. Unless Sazed does something.

Footnote: Brandon had earlier told Peter that in his mind, Marsh was dead having been "burned out by the sun"
source

 

[Wandering Investor]

Compounding massive amounts of an attribute and then storing for later use is the typical way compounding is used. Compounding creates massive amounts of the attribute in question, far more than would be needed in the moment.

This is why the Lord Ruler for instance would go to his hut every three days. He would spend some time in meditation, storing youth, burning the atium with the youth, producing large amounts of youth, store that in his atium(or else he'd become a child or even younger), and then repeating till he has a nice store. He's then continuously tapping his atiumminds till his next recharge. 

Miles had a large number of gold minds on him at all times. I don't recall if we ever saw him actually compound, but we did see him tapping them. All the time. He actually mentions that tapping his gold minds is addictive, he can't stop. That's why when he is injured, the books don't mention him actively starting to tap his minds to heal, because he never stopped tapping in the first place.

 

Also, burning duralumin while compounding would actually make the effect weaker. Compounding works by storing, burning for x10, storing that, burning for x10, storing that, burning for times x10 again(effectively x1000 by this point). Duralumin would just burn the entire metal for x10, and potentially leave you without a metal mind to store the attribute in.

Edited December 8, 2018 by Wandering Investor

[+robardin he/him]

I've always wondered what would happen if the Compounder did NOT store the excess attribute into a metalmind, perhaps because there was no more metal at hand to use as a metalmind.

What would it mean for Miles to have "too much" health, if he didn't store "overflow" into goldminds? Would the Investiture somehow radiate out like an aura and its utility be lost? I mean, it couldn't actually do damage to him... It's health. And if it did do damage him, it would immediately get healed, and then stop doing damage when he no longer needed healing. (So maybe "damaging yourself due to excess health" is a problem that kind of solves itself.)

I think there's a WoB that at its upper limits, a Brute tapping a pewtermind could get so large/bulky that they were effectively immobilized, and thence imagined a humorous >Era 2 party trick where you gave a Pewterarm a vial with ground unkeyed pewterminds in it, resulting in a surprise phyiscal ballooning, a real life version of something out of a Tom and Jerry cartoon when they literally physically pump themselves up.

Edited December 12, 2018 by robardin

[BooksBeforeDeath]

Sazed explains that towards the end of The Final Empire. Sorry if I made some typos.

"If my guess is correct, he would have gained a limitless supply of youth, since he was drawing on most of the power from the metal itself, rather than his own body. All he would have to do was spend the occasional bit of time aged to give himself Feruchemal storages to burn and stay young." "So," Marsh said, "just burning those storages would make him even younger than when he started?" "He would have to place that excess youth inside another Feruchemacal storage, I think," Sazed explained. "You see, Allomancy is quite spectacular—its powers usually come in bursts and flares. The lord ruler wouldn't have wanted all that youth at once, so he'd have it stored inside a piece of metal which he could slowly drain, keeping himself young.

Brandon Sanderson, The Final Empire.

[SwordNimiForPresident the sword/that sword]

On 12/12/2018 at 2:06 PM, robardin said:

I've always wondered what would happen if the Compounder did NOT store the excess attribute into a metalmind, perhaps because there was no more metal at hand to use as a metalmind.

What would it mean for Miles to have "too much" health, if he didn't store "overflow" into goldminds? Would the Investiture somehow radiate out like an aura and its utility be lost? I mean, it couldn't actually do damage to him... It's health. And if it did do damage him, it would immediately get healed, and then stop doing damage when he no longer needed healing. (So maybe "damaging yourself due to excess health" is a problem that kind of solves itself.)

I think there's a WoB that at its upper limits, a Brute tapping a pewtermind could get so large/bulky that they were effectively immobilized, and thence imagined a humorous >Era 2 party trick where you gave a Pewterarm a vial with ground unkeyed pewterminds in it, resulting in a surprise phyiscal ballooning, a real life version of something out of a Tom and Jerry cartoon when they literally physically pump themselves up.

I imagine any excess Investiture would leek out as Mist. I know Wax and Marasi both had Mist coming out of them while they used The Bands..

[Wandering Investor]

It would likely do nothing. Depends on the attribute you're not storing. Too much strength and you balloon, too much youth and you're a baby(fascinating implications), too much health and... I don't think anything would happen actually, considering that Miles was always tapping health, while already being healthy, and experienced no noticeable side effects.