[OB] what is wit?

[mew to pew]

So I know that Wit is a World Hopper and his name is Hoid but I would also like to propose that Wit is actually from Warbreaker and is one of the returned. I mean at the end up the book he uses colours and he seems to be immortal. And on top of this I'm going to say that Azure is also from Warbreaker due to the fact that she doesn't act like a regular person from Roshar and asks for human like dolls to be made, although we never get to see the affects. We also see that the sword that Sezth has is really nightblood and it drains the colours from his arm and the sword also likes to scream "DESTROY EVIL"... so anyone else have any thoughts on this? 

[king of nowhere]

1 minute ago, mew to pew said:

So I know that Wit is a World Hopper and his name is Hoid but I would also like to propose that Wit is actually from Warbreaker and is one of the returned. I mean at the end up the book he uses colours and he seems to be immortal. And on top of this I'm going to say that Azure is also from Warbreaker due to the fact that she doesn't act like a regular person from Roshar and asks for human like dolls to be made, although we never get to see the affects. We also see that the sword that Sezth has is really nightblood and it drains the colours from his arm and the sword also likes to scream "DESTROY EVIL"... so anyone else have any thoughts on this? 

sorry if you thought you uncovered something deep, but it was widespread knowledge.

I cannot say more about the topic of azure or what hoid does in oathbringer, however, because everything concerning oathbringer goes in the specific subforum. no, not even under spoiler it is allowed outside, for another couple of months.

that said, most of sanderson's books take place in the same universe (the cosmere), and some characters can go from one planet to the other. There are several organizations of those "worldhoppers", which are hinted in the books, and they all pursue all kinds of obscure plots, generally centered on investiture (generic term for cosmere magic power, sort of like energy source in our world) or the shards of adonalsium - an ancient deific being that was shattered in 16 pieces, among whom honor, odium and cultivation. This story-behind-the-story will be gradually unfolded as more book are published, and it is one of the main sources of activity in the forums.

Hoid is one of the key players in all of it. He is not from nalthis (the planet of warbreaker) but from yolen, the original planet from which humanity originated, and he was there when adonalsium was shattered, some 10 thousand years before the current timeline. yolen is currently closed to worldhopping, and we have no idea what's happening on it.

You can learn more on the coppermind wiki: https://coppermind.net/wiki/Coppermind:Welcome

[Archer he/him]

Welcome! If you're interested in Worldhoppers, Brandon has told us that there's a Terriswoman in Warbreaker - you can spot her if you look for people who's speaking style is different from everyone else's. 

[Toaster Retribution he/him]

Welcome! Concerning Azure: you can only discuss her in the Oathbringer Spoiler Section, or in the Cosmere Section (I think). 

Concerning Hoid: he is not a Returned, but it is a good guess, and you did have ideas to back it up with.

I hope to see you around, and to see more theories from you.

Upvote!

[Scion of the Mists]

Hoid is actually present in Warbreaker, but he is not one of the Returned.  

[Weltall]

Welcome to the Shard! Enjoy yourself and please continue the theorizing, but watch out for anyone asking you to give them your Breath, or who offers you cookies...

As mentioned Hoid is not a Returned. His use of Awakening at the end of Oathbringer is because he has Breath (a fact we already knew, he mentions having obtained perfect pitch in Words of Radiance) and Brandon has told us that BioChroma is the easiest magic system to get access to and to use. All you need is someone who has Breath to give some to you and some behind-the-scenes things will make it so that you can use it right away. You don't need to be from Nalthis to do it, though you do need to be native to the world to Return.

Hoid's immortality is a separate thing and we don't know how he manages it just yet, but while his particular flavor of immortality might be unique, immortality as a concept is not, with pretty much every world having one or more flavors of it. The Nalthian variety of immortality just happens to be the easiest one to access that we currently know of. But yeah, Hoid is so old that he makes the Heralds on Roshar look like babes in comparison and he was born somewhere around ten thousand years before Vo became the first person to Return on Nalthis. Brandon has said that Hoid is the second-oldest person in the Cosmere, by a small margin. And the only person who's older is Frost who he exchanges letters with in WoK and WoR.

2 hours ago, king of nowhere said:

yolen is currently closed to worldhopping, and we have no idea what's happening on it.

Strictly speaking, this isn't accurate. It's shrouded in some way so that Khriss at the time of Mistborn Era 1 had not been able to find it but it's not cut off from travel or contact in the same way that Taldain is. She speaks of the kind of life that you will find on Yolen when comparing it to Scadrial's ecology in Arcanum Unbounded (implying that at some point she was able to obtain current information on the world) and the letters that Hoid and Frost exchange require some way of getting to and from Yolen, as Frost is living there.

Edited April 6, 2018 by Weltall

[Angsos]

Did brandon say something like Hoid isn't immortal, there's hijynx going on.

[Calderis he/him]

15 minutes ago, Angsos said:

Did brandon say something like Hoid isn't immortal, there's hijynx going on.

No. Hoid is absolutely immortal. 

Quote

Iceblade44

So White Sand [than Elantris] is earlier... Then how the heck old is Kriss then? Will we ever get an answer as to why every worldhopper is flipin immortal?

Brandon Sanderson

There is some time-dialation going on. I'll explain it eventually; we're almost to the point where I can start talking about that. Suffice it to say that there's a mix of both actual slowing of the aging process and relative time going on, depending on the individual. Very few are actually immortal.

Faera

Implying that some are actually immortal?

Brandon Sanderson

Depends on which definition of immortal you mean.

Doesn't age, but can be killed by conventional means. (You've seen some of these in the cosmere, but I'll leave you to discuss who.)

Heals from wounds, but still ages. (Knights Radiant with Stormlight are like this.)

Reborn when killed. (The Heralds.)

Doesn't age and can heal, but dependent upon magic to stay this way, and so have distinct weakness to be exploited. (The Lord Ruler, among others.)

Hive beings who are constantly losing individual members, but maintaining a persistent personality spread across all of them, immortal in that as long as too much of the hive isn't wiped out, the personality can persist. (The sleepless.)

Bits of sapient magic, eternal and endless, though the personality can be "destroyed" in specific ways. (Seons. Spren. Nightblood. Cognitive Shadows, like a certain character from Scadrial.)

Shards (Really just a supercharged version of the previous category.)

And then, of course, there's Hoid. I'm not going to say which category, if any, he's in.

Some of these blend together--the Heralds, for example, are technically a variety of cognitive shadow. I'm not saying each of these categories above are distinct, intended to be the end-all definitions. They're off the cuff groupings I made to explain a point: immortality is a theme of the cosmere works--which, at their core, are experiments on what happens when men are given the power of deity.

Shagomir

Heals from wounds, but still ages.

Would Bloodmaker Ferrings exist in this category as well? If not, what about someone compounding Gold?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, you are correct.

Shagomir

As a Bloodmaker ages what keeps them from healing the damage and carrying on as a very old, but very healthy person? Do they come to a point where they can't store enough health to stave off the aches, pains, diseases, and other things that come with old age?

This makes sense for traditional Feruchemy as it is end-neutral, so storing health becomes a zero sum game - eventually, you're going to get sick and you're not going to be able to overcome it with your natural healing ability no matter how much you manipulate it with a goldmind.

...Unless you've got a supply of Identity-less goldminds lying around. Would a Bloodmaker with a sufficient source of identity-less goldminds (or the ability to compound, thus bypassing the end-neutral part of Feruchemy) eventually just die from being too old?

Brandon Sanderson

Basically, yes. They can heal their body to match their spiritual ideal, but some things (like some genetic diseases, and age-related illnesses) are seen as part of the ideal. Depends on several factors.

source

Edit: he says "if any," but if Hoid isn't in one of those categories, it would mean he's in a category to himself. 

Edited April 6, 2018 by Calderis

[Angsos]

Thank you

[The One Who Connects he/him]

On 4/6/2018 at 11:32 AM, Archer said:

Terriswoman in Warbreaker - you can spot her if you look for people who's speaking style is different from everyone else's.

I was always under the impression that she didn't have any lines. (None that I could ever remember happening, anyway)
Guess I need to reread.

[Archer he/him]

Spoiler

Brandon confirmed it was

 

 

BIG REVEAL 

 

 

the nurse.

From arcanum:

TheHunter (paraphrased)

[Brandon Sanderson] said that someone in Poland had figured it out who the Terriswoman in Warbreaker was, and I asked him if it was Lemex's nurse.

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

He nodded and smiled. He said he had no idea how anyone figured it out, which is interesting.

 

Here's her appearance in chapter ten, from Warbreaker (with context):

Lemex coughed quietly. His aged face was streaked with sweat, his skin clammy and pale, and he occasionally gave a whispered mumble of delirious ramblings.

Vivenna sat on a stool beside his bed, hands in her lap. The two mercenaries waited with Parlin at the back of the room. The only other person present was a solemn nurse—the same woman who had informed Vivenna in a quiet voice that nothing more could be done.

Lemex was dying. It was unlikely that he would last the day.

This was the first Vivenna had seen Lemex’s face, though she’d often corresponded with him. The face looked . . . wrong. She knew that Lemex was growing old; that made him a better spy, for few looked for spies among the elderly. Yet he wasn’t supposed to be this frail stick of a person, shaking and coughing. He was supposed to be a spry, quick-tongued old gentleman. That was what she had imagined.

She felt like she was losing one of her dearest friends, though she had never really known him. With him went her refuge in Hallandren, her secret advantage. He was the one she had supposed would make this insane plan of hers work. The skilled, crafty mentor she had counted on having at her side.

He coughed again. The nurse glanced at Vivenna. “He goes in and out of lucidity, my lady. Just this morning, he spoke of you, but now he’s getting worse and worse. . . .”

“Thank you,” Vivenna said quietly. “You are excused.”

The woman bowed and left.

@The One Who Connects this should clear things up

Edited April 9, 2018 by Archer

[The One Who Connects he/him]

3 hours ago, Archer said:

this should clear things up

I knew who it was. I just didn't think they had said anything, and Brandon's "no idea how you figured it out" gave me no cause to doubt what I thought.

After rereading that scene, I agree with Brandon. The only thing that I could see as potential foreshadowing is 1) not suspicious, and 2) not dialogue.

[Weedolfin she/her]

The only clue I see there is that she bowed?? I can't believe someone made that connection! I feel like maybe they just made a random guess, and happened to be right lol

[Kramerfarve]

Plus the small point where she always talks “quietly”

[Angsos]

I'm thinking someone just did process of elimination and guessed.

[The One Who Connects he/him]

On 5/13/2018 at 10:06 AM, Kramerfarve said:

Plus the small point where she always talks “quietly”

The one whose words were described as "quietly" was Vivenna though. Wait, there's another line... I don't think Terris Servants were described as quiet voiced in Mistborn though...

On 5/13/2018 at 10:46 AM, Angsos said:

I'm thinking someone just did process of elimination and guessed.

This is exactly what happened.

Quote

Brandon Sanderson
*pauses* Why do you guess that?

DrogaKrolow
I mean they are the only females apart from the main characters who are somehow important. So I guess somewhere there because I don't think she's like in the fifth plane somewhere in the back of the alley where someone walks by.

Edited May 15, 2018 by The One Who Connects