[Full book spoilers] Hidden heralds in WoR?

[Everstorm]

So, it is not implausible that WoR too had lots of instances of hidden heralds, just like WoK. Darkness/Nalan was pretty much out in the open, so let's not count him.

 

The only blatant hint of a hidden herald I found was something Wit says about their being "only one woman his age" in the camps. Unless this is another world-hopper, I would put my money on it being a herald. And among the characters we are introduced to, Sebarial's mistress ( I forgot her name) seems to be the most suspicious. 

[PorridgeBrick]

So, it is not implausible that WoR too had lots of instances of hidden heralds, just like WoK. Darkness/Nalan was pretty much out in the open, so let's not count him.

 

The only blatant hint of a hidden herald I found was something Wit says about their being "only one woman his age" in the camps. Unless this is another world-hopper, I would put my money on it being a herald. And among the characters we are introduced to, Sebarial's mistress ( I forgot her name) seems to be the most suspicious.

The woman his age is probably Cultivation. Who else was before the Shattering? If any of the Heralds were that old, they'd likely ALL be, and Wit would in fact have six women his age.

Dunno about Sebarial's mistress. She seems normal to me, in a way.

[deddinty]

I actually interpreted Wit's comment as referring to Cultivation. edit: ninja'ed

 

As for hidden Heralds, I think it's pretty clear Shallan draws Shallash, and I'm wondering if it's not part of her abilities with the illumination surge, which might be shared with Renarin's order.  

Edited March 8, 2014 by deddinty

[Gamma Fiend]

I think the woman being Hoid's age is Cultivation. I believe Hoid is much older than the Heralds, since Honor and Roshar and such were the results of Adonalsium splintering, which we know Hoid was present for.

Do we know if any of the other Worldhoppers are from Yolen as well, or are they all people from other subsequent Shardworlds?


Edit: :ph34r: Dang. Got Ninja'd twice. :ph34r:

Edited March 8, 2014 by Gamma Fiend

[happyman]

Does Lift noticing the vandalized artwork in the palace count?  It's very much second-hand, but I'm guessing it's the trace of an (already-seen) Herald.

Edited March 8, 2014 by happyman

[Natans]

Nalan appeared plenty have his Skybreaker (two interludes and inthe end)

 

Shallash appeared again in Shallan "random drawings" (What are a odd thing why this happened?)

 

I think that I noticed one reference about a person talkingin "Perfect Alenthi" but my memory are a little bit blury.

 

Side note: Some of the ghost bloods are suspect in the next re-read I will try fish out something of there, the woman in mask looked especially suspicious.

[Everstorm]

Yeah, Shallash was alluded to a lot in this book, but I don't think we ever saw her at work. I knew Hoid was old, but I didn't know that he was present at the shattering , I should really read all the other Cosmere books. Still only midway through Mistborn, other than Stormlight.

[Scott]

One hint I picked up was the ardent working in Taravangian's hospital.

[Carfax]

There was a woman mentioned. Sivi i think...... Her name was thrown in too casually. She's in one of the warcamps. Looks suspicious to me

[Chlehrma]

I actually interpreted Wit's comment as referring to Cultivation. edit: ninja'ed

 

As for hidden Heralds, I think it's pretty clear Shallan draws Shallash, and I'm wondering if it's not part of her abilities with the illumination surge, which might be shared with Renarin's order.

 

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I thought Shallan was drawing a metaphor for Jasnah making a simulacrum of herself.

[taveren]

talik in the rysn interlude didn't have a hint of an accent so maybe

[Guest Edonidd]

The ardent swordmaster with eyes way too old was an obvious one to me. I think he was described something like aged anywhere between 35 and 70. But from his eyes even that may not be old enough. Something like that, I'm too lazy to play actual quote fu.

Him having a special soft spot for Kaladin helped that impression, and his almost throw away line about Renarin being more or better than anyone thought too. Which really made sense once Renarin was a KR at the end.

[Cromptj]

The sword master is Vasher.

[Guest Edonidd]

Vasher is something besides a herald? Is this more of that Cosmere junk?

[SmurfAquamarineBodies]

Vasher is something besides a herald? Is this more of that Cosmere junk?

 

Yes it is more of that cosmere junk ( as you so eloquently put it ). Vasher is from the book warbreaker.

[taveren]

it also occurs to me that if he still has his breath he could tell kal was filled with stormlight no matter how little he had in him and we can assume he has at least 1000 since he could tell kal was outside his door

[Argent]

talik in the rysn interlude didn't have a hint of an accent so maybe

 

That has to do with his own backstory, I believe. 

[Releaser]

In the Lift interlude, after Lift is pardoned at the end, Nalan (Darkness) says " 'Praise Yaezir', he said 'Herald of Kings. May he lead in wisdom. If he ever stops drooling.' "

 

So there is a clue as to who one of the Heralds be.

[Argent]

Yaezir is widely accepted to be Jezrien, whom some of us suspect to be the old drunkard / madman Szeth meets briefly in Gavilar's palace; the one who asks "Have you seen me?" while Szeth is passing through the hall with the Heralds' statues.

[grinachu]

 

Yaezir is widely accepted to be Jezrien, whom some of us suspect to be the old drunkard / madman Szeth meets briefly in Gavilar's palace; the one who asks "Have you seen me?" while Szeth is passing through the hall with the Heralds' statues.

 

Indeed. Szeth briefly entertains the possibility it might be Jezrien.

Interestingly there is another of the Heralds (in addition to Nalan) present at the feast.

We know from Jasnah's POV, that they are talking about Ash ("Shallash") getting worse, and how they are not supposed to get worse. It is a male voice and the description doesn't match the portraits of Ishi so I have to assume it's Kalak.

So our knowledge of the heralds is as follows....

1. Jezrien- was last seen as a drunkard/madman in Alethkar for the feast.

2. Nalan - leading the Skybreakers, seeking to prevent the Desolation from returning (although he failed in this), encouraging Szeth to destroy the Stone Shamanate for reasons we cannot infer yet.

3. Kalak - last seen in Alethkar in the company of Nalan, presumed allied or friendly with Nalan.

4. Talenel- In company of Amaram, off to hunt Honorblades. Tortured into insanity.

5. Shallash- destroying all visual representations of herself.

[Argent]

We don't actually know that Nalan's companion is Kalak - the evidence for that is even flimsier than the evidence we had for Nalan. It's a hypothesis I support, but it's far from certain.

[Trevalion]

The Heralds who broke faith have all been broken with their promises and now pursue a path nearly opposite their original one.  (Shallash destroys instead of creates, Nin/Nalan uses "justice" as a cloak for murder and Jezrien only leads by leaving an example of what not to do with your life.  So the ardent killing people in Taravangian's hospital whom Taravangian calls Dova, on page 906, is likely Veleledev, whose real name is Vedel (Taln says "Vedel will train your surgeons" in his repeated speach).  She went back to a familiar place, a hospital, like Shallash goes to art galleries and Jezrien was in a palace, but kills instead of heals, finding an excuse in the work of Taravangian.

[marianmi]

So our knowledge of the heralds is as follows....

1. Jezrien- was last seen as a drunkard/madman in Alethkar for the feast. 

2. Nalan - leading the Skybreakers, seeking to prevent the Desolation from returning (although he failed in this), encouraging Szeth to destroy the Stone Shamanate for reasons we cannot infer yet. 

3. Kalak - last seen in Alethkar in the company of Nalan, presumed allied or friendly with Nalan. 

4. Talenel- In company of Amaram, off to hunt Honorblades. Tortured into insanity. 

5. Shallash- destroying all visual representations of herself.

 

We don't actually know that Nalan's companion is Kalak - the evidence for that is even flimsier than the evidence we had for Nalan. It's a hypothesis I support, but it's far from certain.

 

I think Kalak is a good bet.

 

Mraize or his babsk (the masked woman) might be a herald? Easier than a worldhopper, and there's too many of them already.

- Mraize can only be Ishi (Kalak having better chances of being the guy with Nalan), but this looks highly improbable from his personality.

- Masked woman (since she would look too much like the statues?) - Vev?

 

From the heralds, there are many theories about the male ones, females only Shallash and maybe Palah in the Palaneum - Vev, Betab, Chach are completely unaccounted. From the guys, Ishi is missing, but I am expecting him to be the most mysterious, being the Bondsmith herald and taking part in creating the radiants.

[grinachu]

The Heralds who broke faith have all been broken with their promises and now pursue a path nearly opposite their original one.  (Shallash destroys instead of creates, Nin/Nalan uses "justice" as a cloak for murder and Jezrien only leads by leaving an example of what not to do with your life.  So the ardent killing people in Taravangian's hospital whom Taravangian calls Dova, on page 906, is likely Veleledev, whose real name is Vedel (Taln says "Vedel will train your surgeons" in his repeated speach).  She went back to a familiar place, a hospital, like Shallash goes to art galleries and Jezrien was in a palace, but kills instead of heals, finding an excuse in the work of Taravangian.

 

Great post. Can you identify a motive for their so doing? I had long suspected that Jezrien is under Odium's or one of the Unmade's influence in the Prelude to the Stormlight Archive. 

[Achilles]

Is it possible the masked woman is Shalash? Seems like it would fit nicely with Shalash destroying all her own statues. And if the heralds are pursuing the opposite of their paths training/aiding thieves and Ghostbloods seems about right for the herald of creativity and honesty. Weaving darkness as it were.