Ryan he/him Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 Oh, duh. I'm slapping my forehead now. There's a hole in Wax's theory about the baddies gathering allomancers. What good are unwilling captives in a war? But if they are hemalurgists... This was a brilliant chapter. A wonderful, beautiful chapter. I usually count myself among the ranks of the theory nuts, but this time, I find myself not caring to pick apart the mechanics at all. I just see a lovingly crafted fictional religion and a lovely portrayal of one of its devotees. I know that Brandon always puts religions into his books, but this is the best I've seen from him yet. I also know that he usually has a goal in mind for his use of religion; for example, IIRC in Elantris he wanted to use the terror of religion misapplied. Might we now be able to speculate on what his goal is in this book? My personal theory is that he is simply writing a parallel of the state of religion in the real world. Or, well, a parallel of the Mormon view of the state of religion in the real world. We have the Path, which is a true religion worshiping a real god the way he wants to be worshiped; and then we have a number of other religions, the Survivorists being the only one we've yet seen, which have a portion of the truth but have been distorted by the philosophies of men. So far it's exceptionally well done—the first trilogy (and, indeed, the entire cosmere) have set the stage for a portrayal of religion that would be hard for other books to match, but it exists as subtext that a non-religious person could miss entirely and still enjoy the story. I could go on gushing about how great this all is, but I should stop before I derail the thread into a discussion of religion. Also: probably only interesting to me. In conclusion, LOL at rational and effective tin foil hats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truthless he/him Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 Anyone else picture this: when reading this? “Your house needs you. Thousands of families rely upon you. They need your leadership and your guidance. You did not ask for this, I understand. But the mark of a great man is one who knows when to set aside the important things in order to accomplish the vital ones.” The butler left, closing the door behind him. Fell Yes, this! So much this. I was actually watching Batman Begins just last weekend, and this is exactly how I picture Tillaume Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guinevere she/her Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 Anyone else picture this: when reading this? “Your house needs you. Thousands of families rely upon you. They need your leadership and your guidance. You did not ask for this, I understand. But the mark of a great man is one who knows when to set aside the important things in order to accomplish the vital ones.” The butler left, closing the door behind him. Haha! Absolutely I did. I could practically hear Michael Caine's voice coming out of my screen. Oh, Alfred...I mean, Tillaume. And it doesn't really help that Christian Bale could play Waxillium in a heartbeat. It's a sad state of affairs when I have to ascribe Hollywood faces to characters because I don't have the imagination anymore to form my own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zas678 he/him Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 Also, Brandon posted an in-world broadsheet on twitter: http://twitpic.com/5po9qi. Anyone have any ideas on what breaknaught might be? Also, could we be seeing the freshly regrown atium crystals in the Pits of Eltania? Could explain how Tan was able to intercept the bullet without having the whole scarcity of atium problem. That's one thing that I noticed. In Final Empire, when Kelsier "destroys" the Pits of Hathsin, he says this line: "I pretty much ended atium production in the Final Empire for the next three hundred years or so." How long is AoL after the original triology? "Three hundred years after the events of the Mistborn trilogy, Scadrial is now on the verge of modernity, with railroads to supplement the canals, electric lighting in the streets and the homes of the wealthy, and the first steel-framed skyscrapers racing for the clouds." I'd imagine that Sazed could stop it if he wants to, but it is something to keep in mind. And I don't think Sazed is reading his mind. I think he is pushing stuff into his mind, but unless there is something really odd about that earring (whether hemalurgical or not), I think the reason why the advice is so general is because that's all he dares say. Use your talents, something seemed to whisper inside of him. You’ll figure it out.That made him smile ruefully. He couldn’t help wondering why, if Harmony really was listening, he didn’t give more specific answers. Often, all Waxillium got from prayer was a sense of encouragement. Keep going. It’s not as difficult as you feel it is. Don’t give up. Those sort of comments are always applicable. Keep going, do your best, etc, etc. The point of the metal is to send up a "flag" to Harmony saying "Hey! Give this person inspiration!" Oo! Idea. What if the earings are hemalurgically charged- but not by humans? What if animals were sacrificed to Harmony in order to speak with him? On second thought, no, that wouldn't work. First of all, it would be a Tenet of Pathism, and second, sacrifices don't really fit with the setting that he's going. Nix that idea. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChimeraRuin Posted July 14, 2011 Report Share Posted July 14, 2011 (edited) In this instance Wax put the Earing in with the Intent of communicating with his god. maybe thats the reason why Sazed he can hear his thought, because Wax is addressing them to Sazed specificly. Vin original never knew to try to send thoughts to Ruin and then when she found out about it, never wanted too.. Edited July 14, 2011 by NeverKnowsBest 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBobs he/him Posted July 15, 2011 Report Share Posted July 15, 2011 Oo! Idea. What if the earrings are hemalurgically charged- but not by humans? What if animals were sacrificed to Harmony in order to speak with him? On second thought, no, that wouldn't work. First of all, it would be a Tenet of Pathism, and second, sacrifices don't really fit with the setting that he's going. Nix that idea. You could charge the spike . . . at a slaughterhouse! This would sidestep the sacrifice issue. Also there's this http://www.timewastersguide.com/forum/index.php?topic=6655.msg129235#msg129235 . Piercings and Hemalurgy were used in the past to communicate with deities. But are the piercings required to be charged? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squallor he/him Posted July 15, 2011 Report Share Posted July 15, 2011 And I don't think Sazed is reading his mind. I think he is pushing stuff into his mind, but unless there is something really odd about that earring (whether hemalurgical or not), I think the reason why the advice is so general is because that's all he dares say. I don't agree with that. The advice he gives is too specific to be mere coincidence or general "encouragement." It's more of the line "You'll figure it out." If Wax prays every day, along with all Pathians, then each time they prayed/pondered, they would need to be facing some sort of question that has an actual answer, as opposed to some generic philosophic question, like "what is the meaning of life." Also, I take it for granted that the events of this book have some large scale impact to the world of Scaladrial, mostly due to the fact that all of Brandon's books focus on world changing events, though this may be different since this books was kind of made up on the spot so to speak. If whats going on is of great import to the world, we also know that Sazed will try to interfere/meddle just due to his personality. He was never the type to sit and wait for things to play out, and I don't think has changed since his ascension. The counter to the argument could just be that Sazed is just pushing his emotions, as we know this is a power of the shards on Scaladrial, and Wax came up with the words himself. To me it just seems a little to coincidental. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyRioter she/her Posted July 15, 2011 Report Share Posted July 15, 2011 I don't think Saze's advice requires any mind-reading, especially if he knows Wax and knows the kind of situations he gets himself into, which he may well do, seeing as Wax is a leading member of what seems to be an important house, and Saze probably keeps tabs on such people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squallor he/him Posted July 15, 2011 Report Share Posted July 15, 2011 (edited) I don't think Saze's advice requires any mind-reading, especially if he knows Wax and knows the kind of situations he gets himself into, which he may well do, seeing as Wax is a leading member of what seems to be an important house, and Saze probably keeps tabs on such people. True, it doesn't necessarily require mind reading, however, Sazed clearly is taking a heavy interest in Wax's activities. Edited July 15, 2011 by Squallor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos he/him Posted July 15, 2011 Report Share Posted July 15, 2011 Sazed might not be mind reading. It is a possibility, but it feels more like mind reading to me. Like, "oh you now have the spike, now I can hear your prayer and give you some vague help." I don't think Sazed is taking "heavy interest in Wax." It seemed like a pretty typical, run-of-the-mill prayer. He has higher Cognitive faculties now. Just because Sazed answered doesn't mean he is taking a heavy interest. He can surely give general encouragement to a great many people at any time. Remember atium? Your mind expanded to comprehend the data. Well, Sazed is now like that, only he's in that state all the time, to a far greater extent than atium could provide. I would say that after three hundred years of practice, he could listen to many people's thoughts and answer them generally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silus - Shard of Flame he/him Posted July 16, 2011 Report Share Posted July 16, 2011 (edited) And you have to take immortality into account. Sazed has now lived longer than any human, and has observed people throughout their entire lives, including the ones that are praying to him. Leaving the mind reading part alone for a second, don't you think, that if you had a few centuries to observe people and how they work, and watched a specific person their entire life, that you would be able to know what's going through their mind at any given time? Even without major indicators like his obvious indecision regarding his loyalty to his house and his draw to the robberies? Edited July 16, 2011 by Silus - Shard of Flame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zas678 he/him Posted July 16, 2011 Report Share Posted July 16, 2011 I don't know. Ruin didn't, after centuries upon centuries of observing. He had good guesses, from what the people were saying and acting, but he didn't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finallity he/him Posted July 16, 2011 Report Share Posted July 16, 2011 Haha! Absolutely I did. I could practically hear Michael Caine's voice coming out of my screen. Oh, Alfred...I mean, Tillaume. And it doesn't really help that Christian Bale could play Waxillium in a heartbeat. It's a sad state of affairs when I have to ascribe Hollywood faces to characters because I don't have the imagination anymore to form my own. Brilliant! We're getting a batman begins - mistborn fusion book! Also, count my vote in favor of Sazed simply knowing the right thing to say. I don't think he's mind hacking just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silus - Shard of Flame he/him Posted July 16, 2011 Report Share Posted July 16, 2011 I don't know. Ruin didn't, after centuries upon centuries of observing. He had good guesses, from what the people were saying and acting, but he didn't know. That's because his Shard and its intent created a large disconnect between himself and normal people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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