WoR Chapter 84 code

[israel8491 she/her]

I don't think that the 'th' sound would be two separate numbers. If we're going by the Alethibet, then sounds like 'th', 'sh', and 'ch' would all be one character and therefore one number.

[Krenn]

 

Edit: Ah, I've found your thread abouth Thaylen script and Alethi glyphs. Very nice job there.

 

link?

[Harakeke]

@ Pattern: Yeah, that's how the numbers work -- except I think you have them upside down. The tattoo illustration also shows us a bit of how to write hundreds and thousands.

 

I renamed the thread when it became evident that there was more to it than just a map...

http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6487-thaylen-and-alethi-glyph-translation-spoilers/page-2

Edited March 9, 2014 by Harakeke

[Krenn]

I tried using the number pairs to reference chapters, and trying to construct sentences using the chapter titles. nothing intelligible.
Tried using the first letter of each chapter title. nothing intelligible.
taking the first letter of chapter titles, and reading odd or even characters. nothing.

[Armless writer he/him]

Didn't Brandon or Peter say there was a key in the book that could help us solve this? We might just need to comb through Mr. T sections and mentions of the diagram. Because remember Mr. T would not need to be as smart to resolve it and read his code.

[Carcinios he/him]

I am not mathematician or cryptographer but 16 unique palindromes seems extremely Cosmere significant to me.

[Aminar]

I have a thought process going on, and I'm going to flesh it out as much as I can.

Here is a piece of Shallan's art.  it's clearly a drawing of Pattern.  What's interesting, as I pointed out above is the bottom right watered out note, that suggests she saw something similar in Kharbranth(Or K something, but I'd guess Kharbranth)

 

http://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/6471-spoilers-interior-art/#

Here is a quote from the Way of Kings.

"Shallan couldn’t help but admire the beauty of the doors; their exterior was carved in an intricate

geometric pattern with circles and lines and glyphs. It was some kind of chart, half on each door. There

was no time to study the details, unfortunately, and she passed them by."  This is her description of the entrance to the Pallinaeum.  I could see the doors being reworked as the solution to the cipher, although admittedly it's a stretch.  I couldn't find any other evidence of Shalln seeing a solution to a cipher during her time in kharbranth, but I might have missed it, as I was skimming a Kindle search for words like Pattern.

 

Now, if any characters within the book have seen the pattern cipher other than the people involved, it would have to be Shallan or Jasnah.  Szeth may have as well, but I don't think we've ever seen much from him about Taravangian...

Edited March 10, 2014 by Aminar

[Harakeke]

@Aminar: Great observation!  I just got to that part recently in my WoK re-read (I know, I'm slow...) and was wondering about that door. It seemed important.

 

I'm not sure how that would help with the code though...

[Satsuoni he/him]

Isn't that the Void or KR chart from WoK?

[Mileswasbestcharacter]

what about the sequence 10111?

This sequence is repeated often, but maybe it's nothing, just thought I'd contribute something that may get someone else a thinking.

 

[Mileswasbestcharacter]

also could the code be related to the calendar system? and maybe broken down phonetically from there?

[thdl]

I've been following this thread excitedly since I finished the book on Saturday.  This thing is a real stumper.

Here is a piece of Shallan's art.  it's clearly a drawing of Pattern.  What's interesting, as I pointed out above is the bottom right watered out note, that suggests she saw something similar in Kharbranth(Or K something, but I'd guess Kharbranth)

I've seen this mentioned several times, so I dumped the high res picture into the GIMP and played with the Brightness (he he he...) and contrast levels.

 

Here's what I get:

It appears to be made up of lines..? They're not exactly tendrils or tentacles, they don't grasp or reach... they just keep dividing and multiplying and combining into different patterns

The lines always seem to be connected, either at(?) the central root of the Pattern or by dividing off from a root line, duplicate shapes mix and \????? (overlap?) and reduce by multiple \????? (dimensions?).

It almost seems to phase in and out between two and three-dimensional space. I think it prefers a surface to connect with, but I have seen it move (?) through the air on rare \?????? (occasions?).

It certainly presents \??????? (ex....?) of depth, but the Pattern doesn't appear to possess and consistent dimensions in terms of size.

I am almost certain that I have seen this Pattern somewhere before. It shares some resemblance with the creatures I observed in Kharbranth but without the body and those strange robes (?). Is it possibly a child (?) or \?????? (servant?) of theirs?

I put (?) after words I was pretty sure but not certain of. I put \???? for words that I could not read at all, though I tried to approximate the length. My guesses from context follow these.

Today I learned that Gaussian Blur >> JPEG artifacts.

It doesn't seem like she's referencing this Pattern as some sort of key, but as connected to the symbolheads (I think she only saw these in Kharbranth). I think this could mean Pattern and the symbol heads are related somehow, but I think it also means that Pattern isn't reminding her of a cipher (directly at least). I have questions about the symbol heads, but that's probably for another thread.

Other thoughts:

That chart on the Pallinaeum sounds promising, but I don't think we have access to it (do we?).

I liked the "The key is in the book" info. It sounds like it's either a book key or there's some sort of xor/addition in place that goes on (the latter would pretty much have to be the date string). The best candidate I see is fictional Words of Radiance - we have lost of chapter and page info about it, and Mr. T certainly could have known about it. Treating 10's as a single character gives 141 = 3*47 characters, which allows triplets, but isn't terribly promising.

Putting it in pairs and newlining every 11 pairs results in 12 34 being in the same place on lines 6 and 7 as well as 51 21 being in the same place on these same lines. The chi-2 for line pairs doing this gives p~.05, so it may or may not be random. If it is not random, the it suggests sentences of parallel structure to me.

Question's

1)What is Mr. T's goal in using this code? If it's to condense for efficiency, that's good, but it disallows things like needing to add or subtract a "key value" - that's needless obsfucation (and wastes his time).

2)Raising the question: Did Mr. T make the diagram? He doesn't remember doing so, though he claims to somewhat recognize the handwriting. If his advisers are evil, they easily may have let someone or something else produce the diagram on one of his bad days. Also, misleading statistical reasoning of his advisers not withstanding, the fact that it was such a massive outlier makes it suspect. I'm not sure how likely this is, but the answer changes that books/keys the author had access to and also their motivations.

EDIT: embarrassing typos, and I probably didn't get all of them....

Edited March 10, 2014 by thdl

[Windrunner he/him]

If the chart on the Palanaeum is anything but the Radiant table, I'll be shocked.

[Pattern he/him]

@thdl: I have sorted the epigraphs containing stuff from the fictional WoR from beginning to end. Luckily I have safed the fun.

 

But as for Ishi’Elin, his was the part most important at their inception; he readily understood the implications of Surges being granted to men, and caused organization to be thrust upon them; as having too great power, he let it be known that he would destroy each and every one, unless  they agreed to be bound by precepts and laws.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 2, page 4

 

And thus were the disturbances in the Revv toparchy quieted, when, upon their ceasing to prosecute their civil dissensions, Nalan’Elin betook himself to finally accept the Skybreakers who had named him their master, when initially he had spurned their advances and, in his own interests, refused to countenance that which he deemed a pursuit of vanity and annoyance; this was the last of the Heralds to admit to such a patronage

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 5, page 17

 

As to the other orders that were inferior in this visiting of the realm of the spren, the Elsecallers were prodigiously benevolent, allowing others as auxiliary to their visits and interactions; though they did never relinquish their place as prime liaisons with the great ones of the spren; and the Lightweavers and Willshapers both also had an affinity to the same, though neither were the true masters of that realm

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 6, page 2

 

 And now, if there was an uncut gem among the Radiants, it was the Willshapers; for though enterprising, they were erratic, and Invia wrote of them, “capricious, frustrating, unreliable,” as taking it for granted that others would agree; this may have been an intolerant view, as often Invia expressed, for this order was said to be the most varied, inconsistent in temperament save for a general love of adventure, novelty or oddity.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 7, page 1

 

They also, when they had settled their ruling in the nature of each bond’s placement, called the name of it the Nahel bond, with regard to its effect upon the souls of those caught in its grip; in this description, each was related to the bonds that drive Roshar itself, ten Surges, named in turn and two for each order; in this light, it can be seen that each order would by necessity share one Surge with each of its neighbours.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 8, page 6

 

Now, as the Truthwatchers were esoteric in nature, their order being formed entirely of those who never spoke or wrote of what they did, in this lies frustration for those who would see their exceeding secrecy from the outside; they were not naturally included to explanation; and in the case of Corberon’s disagreements, their silence was not a sign of an exceeding abundance of disdain, but rather an exceeding abundance of tact.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 11, page 6

 

Malchin was stymied, for though he was inferior to none in the arts of war, he was not suitable for the Lightweavers; he wished for his oaths to be elementary and straightforward, and yet their spren were liberal, as to our comprehension, in definitions pertaining to this matter; the process included speaking truths as an approach to a threshold of self-awareness that Malchin could never attain.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 12, page 12

 

Now, as each order was thus matched to the nature and temperament of the Herald it named patron, there was none more archetypal of this than the Stonewards, who followed after Talenelat’elin, Stonesinew, Herald of War: they thought it a point of virtue to exemplify resolve, strength and dependability.  Alas, they took less care for imprudent practice of their stubbornness, even in the face of proven error.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 13, page 1

 

But as for the Bondsmiths, they had members only three, which number was not uncommon for them; nor did they seek to increase this by great bounds, for during the times of Madasa, only one of their order was in continual accompaniment to Urithiru and its thrones.  Their spren was understood to be specific, and to persuade them to grow to the magnitude of the other orders was seen as seditious.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 16, page 14

 

And when they were spoken of by the common folk, the Releasers claimed to be misjudged because of the dreadful nature of their power; and when they dealt with others, always were they firm in their claim that other epithets, notably “Dustbringers,” often heard in the common speech, were unacceptable substitutions, in particular for their similarity to the word “Voidbringers”.  They also did exercise anger in great prejudice regarding it, although to many who speak, there was little difference between these two assemblies

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 17, page 11

 

When Simol was informed of the arrival of the Edgedancer, a concealed consternation and terror, as is common in such cases, fell upon him; although they were not the most demanding of orders, their graceful, limber movements hid a deadliness that was, by this time, quite renowned; also, they were the most articulate and refined of the Radiants.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 20, page 12

 

 

Yet, were the orders not disheartened by so great a defeat, for the Lightweavers provided spiritual sustenance; they were enticed by those glorious creations to venture on a second assault.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 21, page 10

 

These Lightweavers, by no coincidence, included many who pursued the arts; namely: writers, artists, musicians, painters, sculptors.  Considering the order’s general temperament, the tales of their strange and varied mnemonic abilities may have been embellished.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 21, page 10

 

There came also sixteen of the order of the Windrunners, and with them a considerable number of squires, and finding in that place the Skybreakers dividing the innocent from the guilty, there ensued a great debate.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 28, page 3

 

The considerable abilities of the Skybreakers for making such amounted to an almost divine skill, for which no specific Surge or spren grants capacity, but however the order came to such an aptitude, the fact of it was real and acknowledged even by their rivals.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 28, page 3

 

So Melishi retired to his tent, and resolved to destroy the Voidbringers upon the next day, but that night did present a different stratagem, related to the unique abilities of the Bondsmiths; and being hurried, he could make no specific account of his process; it was related to the very nature of the Heralds and their divine duties, an attribute the Bondsmiths alone could address.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 30, page 18

 

In short, if any presume Kazilah to be innocent, you must look at the facts and deny them in their entirety; to say that the Radiants were destitute of integrity for this execution of one of their own, one who had obviously fraternized with the unwholesome elements, indicates the most slothful of reasoning; for the enemy’s baleful influence demanded vigilance on all occasions, of war and of peace

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 32, page 17 

 

Twenty-three cohorts followed behind, that came from the contributions of the King of Makabakam, for though the bond between man and spren was at times inexplicable, the ability for bonded spren to manifest in our world rather than their own grew stronger through the course of the oaths given.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 35, page 9

 

Now, as the Windrunners were thus engaged, arose the event which has hitherto been referenced; namely, that discovery of some wicked thing of eminence, though whether it be some rogueries among the Radiants’ adherents or of some external origin, Avena would not suggest

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 6

 

 

That they responded immediately and with great consternation is undeniable, as these were primary among those who would forswear and abandon their oaths.  The term Recreance was not then applied, but has since become a popular title by which this event is named.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 6

 

 

 This act of great villainy went beyond the impudence which had hitherto been ascribed to the orders; as the fighting was particularly intense at this time, many attributed this act to a sense of inherent betrayal; and after they withdrew, about two thousand made assault upon them, destroying much of the membership; but this was only nine of the ten, as one said they would not abandon their arms and flee, but instead entertained great subterfuge at the expense of the other nine

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 20

Edited March 10, 2014 by Pattern

[marianmi]

 

So Melishi retired to his tent, and resolved to destroy the Voidbringers upon the next day, but that night did present a different stratagem, related to the unique abilities of the Bondsmiths; and being hurried, he could make no specific account of his process; it was related to the very nature of the Heralds and their divine duties, an attribute the Bondsmiths alone could address.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 30, page 18

So Melishi wanted to destroy all parshendi, but during the night had a better idea: destroy their bonds to the spren. This has something to do with the Bondsmith abilities probably.

 

 

 

In short, if any presume Kazilah to be innocent, you must look at the facts and deny them in their entirety; to say that the Radiants were destitute of integrity for this execution of one of their own, one who had obviously fraternized with the unwholesome elements, indicates the most slothful of reasoning; for the enemy’s baleful influence demanded vigilance on all occasions, of war and of peace

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 32, page 17 

 

Kazilah did not agree with this and eliberated the 12th legion of the parshmen. He was executed, because parshmen are an enemy even in peace.

 

 

 

Twenty-three cohorts followed behind, that came from the contributions of the King of Makabakam, for though the bond between man and spren was at times inexplicable, the ability for bonded spren to manifest in our world rather than their own grew stronger through the course of the oaths given.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 35, page 9

 

A war started between the radiants, and the King of Makabakam took one side, sending (23k?) soldiers.

 

 

 

Now, as the Windrunners were thus engaged, arose the event which has hitherto been referenced; namely, that discovery of some wicked thing of eminence, though whether it be some rogueries among the Radiants’ adherents or of some external origin, Avena would not suggest

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 6

 

As the windrunners were fighting, probably against the Makabaki (from twok recreance vision: "they should be fighting the devils on the front lines", where devils = dark skinned makabaki) - when a betrayal happens. also note from same vision: "they can't have gotten through our lines, not with the radiants fighting..." - the radiants fighting (as in among themselves)...

 

 

 

 

That they responded immediately and with great consternation is undeniable, as these were primary among those who would forswear and abandon their oaths.  The term Recreance was not then applied, but has since become a popular title by which this event is named.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 6

 

 

 This act of great villainy went beyond the impudence which had hitherto been ascribed to the orders; as the fighting was particularly intense at this time, many attributed this act to a sense of inherent betrayal; and after they withdrew, about two thousand made assault upon them, destroying much of the membership; but this was only nine of the ten, as one said they would not abandon their arms and flee, but instead entertained great subterfuge at the expense of the other nine

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 20

 

so while the radiants were fighting, this act of great villainy happened, and was done by a secret society (amarams? ghostbloods?)

even if the radiants were fighting among themselves, they all felt betrayed, and some of them withdrew from this fight.

then,  about 2000 of them attacked the society and (almost) destroy it. then they dropped their blades and severed their bonds, except for the skybreakers.

 

so there were several betrayals, no doubt very well orchestrated. 

 

 

anyway, that;s my take on the events.

[Bloodfalcon he/him]

My immediate assumption - though not well thought out because I only just finished the book last night (Woo!) - was that the code was a scale, 1-10. We see that every 0 is preceded by a 1, so it looks like a 10 is possible but not a 0. I had several quick ideas ...

 

Perhaps Mr. T was able to predict his intelligence levels or something of the sort. I believe he mentioned that he took the tests and was then graded on a scale (did he say 1-10?). The only thing was that I think he mentioned they were fairly even between smart and stupid, and I'm not sure there would have been that many 10's...

 

There are so many possibilities because the number 10 is so common on Roshar. It could have something to do with the Radiant Orders and predicting where Radiants would come from or something of that sort. Perhaps that is how Nalan is finding himself in all the right places (though he is a Herald, so who knows).

Just thought I would throw my ideas on to this already massive thread. 

[boggsj]

Hey, new guy here. Been lurking around since finishing WoR, curious to see if anyone was making progress figuring this out.

I'm no cryptographer, amateur or otherwise, but something has occurred to me, and I haven't seen anyone make mention of it.

It seems to me that Taravangian created his "codes" as a way to store data efficiently, rather than just confusingly, so it may be that this "code" in chapter 84 is some sort of compression algorithm rather than/in addition to encryption.

I don't know if compression is implicit in some of the crypto methods you guys have been exploring - if so please disregard

 

Also, Greetings fellow fans xD

Edited March 10, 2014 by boggsj

[Satsuoni he/him]

Hey, new guy here. Been lurking around since finishing WoR, curious to see if anyone was making progress figuring this out.

I'm no cryptographer, amateur or otherwise, but something has occurred to me, and I haven't seen anyone make mention of it.

It seems to me that Taravangian created his "codes" as a way to store data efficiently, rather than just confusingly, so it may be that this "code" in chapter 84 is some sort of compression algorithm rather than/in addition to encryption.

I don't know if compression is implicit in some of the crypto methods you guys have been exploring - if so please disregard

Also, Greetings fellow fans xD

Welcome, welcome

Compression is implicit in some of the algorithms, though it is very primitive.

The thing is, distribution in the code is very far from uniform , so compression during its creation is unlikely ( uniform distribution has the largest information density, iirc )

[fin]

OK so this forum didn't like me putting in code to generate frequency, so I'll skip that.

EDIT: attached script instead.

If it is a word substitution, it would likely have to go like this:

1 11 8 25 10 11 12 7 12 4 9 15 12 10 10 11 14 10 21 5 11 7 11 2 10 11 12 17 13

4 4 8 3 11 10 7 15 14 25 4 14 3 4 10 9 16 14 9 14 9 3 4 12 12 25 4 10 10 12 5

12 7 10 15 19 10 1 11 23 4 12 5 5 11 5 2 5 12 15 7 5 5 11 1 23 4 10 1 11 2 9 15 1

2 10 6 15 3 4

FREQUENCY:

1: 5

2: 4

3: 4

4: 10

5: 8

6: 1

7: 5

8: 2

9: 5

10: 13

11: 11

12: 10

13: 1

14: 5

15: 6

16: 1

17: 1

19: 1

21: 1

23: 2

25: 3

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letter_frequency

Edited March 10, 2014 by fin

[Pattern he/him]

Well, likely is a bit too optimistic. There really a lot of possibilities to parse the code. I still guess the best observation until now were the palindromes. They are too long to be just random. And Brandon confirmed that the key is in the book. damnation the thread gets too long. I look for quotes, could take a while...

 

 

 

More patterns:

• There are only two 8s and 6s, the only commonality being 61
• There is only one 3 that's not part of a 34 (there are six of them)
• The only 7 that isn't part of a 71 (there are five of them) is in the palindrome
• There is another palindrome exactly between the first two sequences of 101121 which also starts and ends with 151

111825

-101112-71249-151-2-10-101114-10-2-151-17112-101112-

17134483111071514254143410916149149341212254101012512710

-151-9-101112-34-12-5511-52512157-5511-12-34-101112-9-151-

21061534

 

I have no clue how this gets us any closer to turning this into text, but I will keep looking for patterns.

 

Edit: added 6s

 

 

Palindromes could be.

 

- Vorin proper names (Heralds, numbers, Silver Kingdoms, etc)

- Ketek (symmetric poem), especially the long palindrome

- glyphs - I guess another day or a few and Harakeke will give us full construction laws

 

Still, there lingers the big question: Why is pattern 15 a number? I will try some stupid stuff tomorrow, more then ;-)

Edited March 10, 2014 by Pattern

[Aminar]

I've been following this thread excitedly since I finished the book on Saturday.  This thing is a real stumper.

I've seen this mentioned several times, so I dumped the high res picture into the GIMP and played with the Brightness (he he he...) and contrast levels.

 

Here's what I get:

It appears to be made up of lines..? They're not exactly tendrils or tentacles, they don't grasp or reach... they just keep dividing and multiplying and combining into different patterns

The lines always seem to be connected, either at(?) the central root of the Pattern or by dividing off from a root line, duplicate shapes mix and \????? (overlap?) and reduce by multiple \????? (dimensions?).

It almost seems to phase in and out between two and three-dimensional space. I think it prefers a surface to connect with, but I have seen it move (?) through the air on rare \?????? (occasions?).

It certainly presents \??????? (ex....?) of depth, but the Pattern doesn't appear to possess and consistent dimensions in terms of size.

I am almost certain that I have seen this Pattern somewhere before. It shares some resemblance with the creatures I observed in Kharbranth but without the body and those strange robes (?). Is it possibly a child (?) or \?????? (servant?) of theirs?

I put (?) after words I was pretty sure but not certain of. I put \???? for words that I could not read at all, though I tried to approximate the length. My guesses from context follow these.

Today I learned that Gaussian Blur >> JPEG artifacts.

It doesn't seem like she's referencing this Pattern as some sort of key, but as connected to the symbolheads (I think she only saw these in Kharbranth). I think this could mean Pattern and the symbol heads are related somehow, but I think it also means that Pattern isn't reminding her of a cipher (directly at least). I have questions about the symbol heads, but that's probably for another thread.

Other thoughts:

That chart on the Pallinaeum sounds promising, but I don't think we have access to it (do we?).

I liked the "The key is in the book" info. It sounds like it's either a book key or there's some sort of xor/addition in place that goes on (the latter would pretty much have to be the date string). The best candidate I see is fictional Words of Radiance - we have lost of chapter and page info about it, and Mr. T certainly could have known about it. Treating 10's as a single character gives 141 = 3*47 characters, which allows triplets, but isn't terribly promising.

Putting it in pairs and newlining every 11 pairs results in 12 34 being in the same place on lines 6 and 7 as well as 51 21 being in the same place on these same lines. The chi-2 for line pairs doing this gives p~.05, so it may or may not be random. If it is not random, the it suggests sentences of parallel structure to me.

Question's

1)What is Mr. T's goal in using this code? If it's to condense for efficiency, that's good, but it disallows things like needing to add or subtract a "key value" - that's needless obsfucation (and wastes his time).

2)Raising the question: Did Mr. T make the diagram? He doesn't remember doing so, though he claims to somewhat recognize the handwriting. If his advisers are evil, they easily may have let someone or something else produce the diagram on one of his bad days. Also, misleading statistical reasoning of his advisers not withstanding, the fact that it was such a massive outlier makes it suspect. I'm not sure how likely this is, but the answer changes that books/keys the author had access to and also their motivations.

EDIT: embarrassing typos, and I probably didn't get all of them....

 

Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 281018368 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 539109680 bytes) in Unknown on line 0

 

Thanks.  This pretty much demolishes my theory...  So back to the drawing board.  The more leads we close, the sooner we find this thing.  And thanks beacuse I wanted to know what those said.

[Yalb]

I was rereading the Mr.T interlude. In that they are talking about how they created a graph to measure or guage his day to day intelligence. The first time I read it I was suffering a rather large bookgasam and didnt pay close attention. But why does he go into detail about how the graph was created and the type of graph it is. So I guess in roshar they use a logarithmic scale. Does anyone else smell somthing fishy? I haven't done any investigation yet. But I wonder if there is a logarithmic cyper or code. Time to investigate!

[Eejit]

Every "holy" name in Vorin culture is a palindrome, so this could be significant!

 

Silver Kingdoms: Iri, Aimia, Sela Tales, Rishir, Thalath, Natanatan, Alethela, Valhav, Shin Kak Nish, Makabakam

 

Then: Urithiru (th=1 letter in Alethibet)

 

Further, keteks are palindromes. The one from WoR being

"Alight, winds approach deadly approaching winds alight."

and 

"Above silence, the illuminating storms - dying storms - illuminate the silence above."

"Radiant / of birthplace / the announcer comes / to come announce / the birthplace of Radiants."

from tWoK.

 

-151-9-101112-34-12-5511-52512157-5511-12-34-101112-9-151-

 

leaks perfect symmetry, so it's probably not a name (except 52512157 stands for 1 letter), but symmetrical ordered

words - a candidate for a ketek.

 

111825

-101112-71249-151-2-10-101114-10-2-151-17112-101112-

1713448311107-151-4254-14341-09-161-49-1-49-341-212-254-10101-2512710

-151-9-101112-34-12-5511-52512157-5511-12-34-101112-9-151-

21061534

 

the middle part looks awful, still

 

This is a bit unclear even to me, but could 7 represent H acting as any other letter with a diacritical mark? As with Nohadon's name. 

 

So the Palindrome could extend to 710 at the beginning with 210 at the end and the middle 7 could be replacing 52... or something.

 

 

So the numbers would be representing phonemes rather than letters, either individually or in combination. This implies that using letter substitutions would be unsuccessful, at least if we're trying to translate it as an English word as this language is phonetically irregular. 

We'd need to match numbers up to these: http://www.phon.ucl.ac.uk/home/wells/phoneticsymbolsforenglish.htm if I'm right.

Edited March 10, 2014 by Eejit

[DefiantBurrito]

I had one thought over the weekend that seems like a breakthrough. (Or I could be overthinking it...)

One of the challenges here is deciding how to split the numbers - Is 34 "three four" or "thirty four"? Are they in regular pairs, or irregular? Etc.

Well, I realized that this is a problem with OUR numbering system, only. Taravangian's assistants would not have had this problem!

If you look at how Thaylen numbers are written, their numeral system does not have this kind of ambiguity. "11" does not look like two "1"'s next to each other. In fact, 11 does not look like any other number. (Harakeke and Pattern worked this out in the "Thaylen and Alethi Glyph Translation" thread - http://imgur.com/dAVRpED).

That means that if the string "101112" for example was actually 10 11 12, it would have been immediately clear to Taravangian's assistants that it was 3 distinct numbers. So unless Brandon was being particularly mean by smushing them together AFTER converting to our numeral system, I think we can assume that this is actually a string of numbers from 1-10. (This also fits someone else's observation that we never see a "0" without it being in "10").

Since 1-10 is not enough to store an alphabet, I suspect it corresponds to 10 glyphs, or 10 Essences, or something like that.

Now, we see lots of "111"s and it seems unlikely that we'd often have 3 of something in a row, so maybe strings like that mean something special. For example, "111" could correspond to "the 3rd letter in the name of the 1st Essence" or something.

Edited March 10, 2014 by DefiantBurrito

[Argent he/him]

I like most of your idea, but I don't know whether Brandon & co. would go to such length. I wouldn't be surprised if they did, but I kind of doubt it.