[OB] Questions to answer

[WhiteLeeopard she/her]

1 minute ago, Arch said:

As far as why we haven't seen the spren yet, you have to remember that Szeth didnt actually speak his 3rd ideal, until after the battle. So during the fight he was just a squire (thats also why he couldnt use division). Perhaps Nightblood changes things, but so far I see no reason to believe szeths highspren won't show up soon.

I think he swore the third ideal at the start of the battle. Thats why he went to ask what Dalinar wanted of him. 

That however brings up another question. How could he use gravitation before swearing the 3rd ideal, when his KR was probably over 50 miles from him and would likely mean he was out of range? 

 

[Toaster Retribution he/him]

5 hours ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

Are the Sons of Honor finished or will they reappear? What was the grudge the Ghostbloods had with them about?

R.I.P Amaram. They will reappear though. Restares is still around doing shady stuff. As for their grudge with Ghostbloods, probably the same as with Jasnah. They had conflicting goals.

[Arch he/him]

9 minutes ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

I think he swore the third ideal at the start of the battle. Thats why he went to ask what Dalinar wanted of him. 

No by then he already saw Dalinar as his master, but had not yet said the words.

Chapter 121 (his last talk with Nale)

Quote

“The law is made by men, so it is not perfect either. It is not perfection we seek, for perfection is impossible. It is instead consistency. You have said the Words?”
“Not yet. I swear to follow the will of Dalinar Kholin. This is my oath.”

Nale is both a Herald and a radiant. He can take squires too.

Edited November 22, 2017 by Arch

[WhiteLeeopard she/her]

I have a feeling many of the questions can be answered after a re-read or four . I missed that he didn't speak the words till after the battle, seems I was going full speed reading by then.

[emailanimal he/him]

4 hours ago, rjl said:

Pretty sure he only did the 3rd ideal; his fourth will require the completion of a crusade - his planned cleansing of the Shin.

He named it, so technically he spoke it. "These words are accepted" isn't coming for a while, but we did hear what his Ideal/Oath is.

[Lightning he/him]

Another two questions:  Why was Taln's healing only temporary?  Why did Ash try to get him away from Dalinar, if Dalinar was the reason he came out of his stupor?

[thejopen27 he/him]

6 hours ago, Arch said:

He's definitely bonded to Nightblood, but thats not where his surge binding is coming. The way Skybreakers work is that they dont get their spren until their 3rd ideal (before then theyre just acolytes then later squires). When the senior Skybreakers explain this to him they speak as if they fully expect him to attract a highspren eventually.
 

As far as why we haven't seen the spren yet, you have to remember that Szeth didnt actually speak his 3rd ideal, until after the battle. So during the fight he was just a squire (thats also why he couldnt use division). Perhaps Nightblood changes things, but so far I see no reason to believe szeths highspren won't show up soon.

IS he though? He is holding Nightblood. Nightblood is communicating with him, but I don't think part of nightblood is bonded to Szeth. 

 

[thejopen27 he/him]

6 hours ago, Toaster Retribution said:

R.I.P Amaram. They will reappear though. Restares is still around doing shady stuff. As for their grudge with Ghostbloods, probably the same as with Jasnah. They had conflicting goals.

I think Restares is either Ishar or a high ranking member of the Vorin church, who excommunicated Dalinar. I think this will come up again. My money is on Ishar, who I think is serving Odium. 

[teknopathetic he/him]

What 'really' happened with Mr.T's confrontation with Odium.

Mr.T knew Odium would come, and Smarty Pants Mr.T knew that Odium would come and read it, so Mr.T made portion of the Diagram not glow in Odium's light (almost all the words were glowing in Odium's power, but not a certain section that stayed black, and that Odium didn't seem to see).

Mr.T exclaims to himself "Renarin", and then hides that fact from Odium as Mr.T negotiates with Odium. This is after the Renarin reveal and the big battle, so what is Mr.T hiding regarding Renarin? Why were the Truthwatchers targeted for corruption? Why were the predictions about Renarin wrong? What is up with that dude?

[thejopen27 he/him]

1 minute ago, teknopathetic said:

What 'really' happened with Mr.T's confrontation with Odium.

Mr.T knew Odium would come, and Smarty Pants Mr.T knew that Odium would come and read it, so Mr.T made portion of the Diagram not glow in Odium's light (almost all the words were glowing in Odium's power, but not a certain section that stayed black, and that Odium didn't seem to see).

Mr.T exclaims to himself "Renarin", and then hides that fact from Odium as Mr.T negotiates with Odium. This is after the Renarin reveal and the big battle, so what is Mr.T hiding regarding Renarin? Why were the Truthwatchers targeted for corruption? Why were the predictions about Renarin wrong? What is up with that dude?

Is it possible Smart T has lied in the diagram to manipulate himself into taking certain actions? This seems likely. I wonder how he is hindered by not understanding the greater Cosmere and Odiums larger threat. 

[teknopathetic he/him]

Just now, thejopen27 said:

Is it possible Smart T has lied in the diagram to manipulate himself into taking certain actions? This seems likely. I wonder how he is hindered by not understanding the greater Cosmere and Odiums larger threat. 

I think Smarty Pants T knew that dumb Mr.T would collaborate, and Smarty T has more planned. Mr.T is touched by Cultivation, and Cultivation needs to up her game, and she seems to be doing so (Lift, for instance, or the pruning of Odium's Champion: Dalinar). I am so glad we know that mr.T isn't getting power from Odium; his sight seems to be unique in the cosmere (no fortune involved)

[Calderis he/him]

2 hours ago, thejopen27 said:

IS he though? He is holding Nightblood. Nightblood is communicating with him, but I don't think part of nightblood is bonded to Szeth. 

Per the Warbreaker annotations, if he hadn't done so before, he became bonded to Nightblood when he killed the prison warden. 

If you draw Nightblood and survive, you are bonded to him. 

Quote

I think Restares is either Ishar or a high ranking member of the Vorin church, who excommunicated Dalinar. I think this will come up again. My money is on Ishar, who I think is serving Odium

Ishar is Tezim. This was confirmed between Dalinar and the Stormfather the first time we see the ahariatiem vision, in the cave around the Honorblades. 

Quote

Mr.T knew Odium would come, and Smarty Pants Mr.T knew that Odium would come and read it, so Mr.T made portion of the Diagram not glow in Odium's light (almost all the words were glowing in Odium's power, but not a certain section that stayed black, and that Odium didn't seem to see).

@teknopathetic this is precisely why I'm convinced Cultivation is directly involved with the Diagram. In that setting, Odium projected the written words of the Diagram for both himself and Taravangian to see. For any part of that to be hidden another shard had to be actively blocking him. There is no way that Taravangian could have hidden his writing from a Shard. 

Edited November 23, 2017 by Calderis

[Ari he/him]

21 hours ago, Leyrann said:

Malata wasn't in attendance, but there's a theory that Ash will become a dustbringer.

Thanks for the correction, I had assumed she was simply unmentioned.

19 hours ago, Fifth of Daybreak said:

She directly states to warn him that she's looking for him. I don't even think we need to assume at this point.

 

Well, she doesn't actually say that she's looking for him in connection with Nightblood's transport, but it's a reasonable implication. It's not 100%, but it is well over 90% IMO.

[TheGoddessBeyond]

On 11/21/2017 at 6:57 PM, Lightning said:

- Who was the 10th person who was missing when the 3 realms were unified by Dalinar?

The people present were Kaladin, Shallan, Dalinar, Szeth, Jasnah, Renarin, Lift, Taln, and Ash. That exactly matches nine of the flashback characters, so I think the person missing was ... Eshonai. 

Why would it be that when those nine stand together they instinctively feel both connected and like one person is missing? If it were just about having all ten orders of KR represented, it seems like an awful coincidence that they also all happen to be flashback characters.

And if the missing person really is Eshonai, does that mean there is an in world reason the ten people flashback characters are important?

 

[Leyrann]

15 minutes ago, TheGoddessBeyond said:

The people present were Kaladin, Shallan, Dalinar, Szeth, Jasnah, Renarin, Lift, Taln, and Ash. That exactly matches nine of the flashback characters, so I think the person missing was ... Eshonai. 

I think we can consider Eshonai and Venli to belong together as far as this goes. Dalinar just didn't realize he should could Venli as the tenth.

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

55 minutes ago, Ari said:

Well, she doesn't actually say that she's looking for him in connection with Nightblood's transport, but it's a reasonable implication. It's not 100%, but it is well over 90% IMO

18 hours ago, Govir said:

Based on the wording "I'm looking for him," I'm hopeful that she's just looking for him for information. I don't think he's the one who brought Nightblood to Roshar.

Based on the fact that she says to 'warn him' that she's looking for him, I don't think we have any choice but to assume negative connotations. Given that we don't have any other likely candidates to have brought Nightblood over, it just feels unrealistic to assume anything else.

[Calderis he/him]

Thought this might be considered relevant. 

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/31/#e1714

Quote

AllomancerSam (paraphrased)

Were Vasher and Nightblood were separated before or after coming to Roshar?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

After hesitating for a minute, he said that they were separated after.

 

[Toaster Retribution he/him]

5 hours ago, thejopen27 said:

I think Restares is either Ishar or a high ranking member of the Vorin church, who excommunicated Dalinar. I think this will come up again. My money is on Ishar, who I think is serving Odium. 

I doubt that Ishar is Restares. For all his faults, Amaram was a Vorin fanatic. Ishars behavior is heresy. So Amaram following Ishar would make no sense.

High ranking church guy is possible.

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

19 minutes ago, Calderis said:

Thought this might be considered relevant. 

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/31/#e1714

 

Thanks. I think we can about lay that to rest then. Pretty conclusive.

[Fulminato he/him]

On 22/11/2017 at 3:57 AM, Lightning said:

Now that I'm done reading Oathbringer, I have a ton of questions, many of which will probably only be answered in later books.  This thread is for people to share the questions they have that have not yet been answered.

Here are some of mine:

- What was the third powerful black spren with Odium at the end?  [Maybe I just missed it in the avalance at the end.  I don't think it was the Thrill spren.]

It was in fact Nergaoul. the spren of the thrill.

Quote

Odium held his hands to the sides, yellow-gold power streaming behind his figure like a wind made visible. Beyond him, in the other place, that red churning power became more real. It was pulled into this realm completely, and the ocean boiled. Something came surging out. Something primeval, something Venli had felt but never truly known. Red mist. Ephemeral, like a shadow you see on a dark day and mistake for something real. Charging red horses, angry and galloping. The forms of men, killing and dying, shedding blood and reveling in it. Bones piled atop one another, making a hill upon which men struggled.
The red mist climbed up from the surging waves, rolling out onto an empty section of rock, northward along the rim of the water. It brought to her a lust for the battlefield. A beautiful focus, a Thrill for the fight.

Oathbringer Chapter 115 "the Wrong Passion"

21 hours ago, WhiteLeeopard said:

My main question is not a question as much as wanting to know if we'll ever get the scene of the chat between Szeth and Dalinar. 

Actual questions:

• How many Oaths has Jasnah said? 3 or 4?
• Is Venli a normal KR or will she have some voidy powers too?.

- if she sworn the four oath i think she wore the plate for the battle, she is (probably) a third-oath KR, like kaladin, lift, szeth and dalinar.

- she wore a form of power, so she had some void power, i think.

6 hours ago, Calderis said:

 

@teknopathetic this is precisely why I'm convinced Cultivation is directly involved with the Diagram. In that setting, Odium projected the written words of the Diagram for both himself and Taravangian to see. For any part of that to be hidden another shard had to be actively blocking him. There is no way that Taravangian could have hidden his writing from a Shard. 

Mr. T should had his day of brilliance and stupidity random, but all the day with a importance he seem have the right amount of intelligence for the task. in three book he never wreck the day. even the super genius day was needed to put in motion for the show down of the coalition in Thaylen City.

i find it high suspect

4 hours ago, Toaster Retribution said:

I doubt that Ishar is Restares. For all his faults, Amaram was a Vorin fanatic. Ishars behavior is heresy. So Amaram following Ishar would make no sense.

High ranking church guy is possible.

ishar call himself the aspect of the almighty. and his nation is in the middle of roshar,

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

1 hour ago, Fulminato said:

in fact Nergaoul. the spren of the thrill.

It's separate, most likely Yelig-Nar

Quote

Odium had retreated into nothingness, though his Fused remained, as did most of the troops, and one strange spren—the one like black smoke. Beyond it, of course, the Thrill still encompassed the north side of the landing, near the water.

119 unity

 

[Fulminato he/him]

1 hour ago, Fifth of Daybreak said:

It's separate, most likely Yelig-Nar

 

wrong

Quote

She suddenly felt something odd. Like a rhythm, but oppressive, demanding. It shook the very air, and the ground beneath her feet trembled. Lightning in the clouds behind seemed to flash to this rhythm, and in a moment she saw that the area around her was filled with ghostly spren.
Those are the spirits of the dead, she realized. Fused who haven’t yet chosen a body. Most were twisted to the point that she barely recognized them as singers. Two were roughly the size of buildings.
One dominated even these: a creature of swirling violence, tall as a small hill, seemingly made up entirely of red smoke. She could see these overlaid on the real world, but somehow knew they would be invisible to most. She could see into the other world.

Oathbringer, Chapter 115 "The Wrong Passion"

nergaoul, the red mist the man overhelmed by the thrill see.

Edited November 23, 2017 by Fulminato

[Leyrann]

16 minutes ago, Fulminato said:

wrong

nergaoul, the red mist the man overhelmed by the thrill see.

Did you even read his quote? It literally talks about the spren like black smoke and beyond that the Thrill. So black smoke =/= Thrill.

[Fulminato he/him]

12 minutes ago, Leyrann said:

Did you even read his quote? It literally talks about the spren like black smoke and beyond that the Thrill. So black smoke =/= Thrill.

he talk of the 'third' spren.

the only 'third' spren is the red smoke towering over the two tunderclast spirit/spren

Edited November 23, 2017 by Fulminato

[Blacksmithki]

2 minutes ago, Fulminato said:

he talk of the 'third' spren.

the only 'third' spren is the red smoke towering over the tunderclast spirit/spren

The thunderclasts were not Spren, they were fuzed in bodies other then listeners.

Forces we know were at that battle: Odium, Thrill unmade, gemstone supervoidbringer unmade, two thunderclasts, fuzed, third thing in the ocean that may have just been one of the two unmade mentioned.

Edited November 23, 2017 by Blacksmithki