Long Game 24: The Godless City

[STINK he/him]

If I'm on that list I'll be sad

[Sart he/him]

The Young Bard:

1. Poke votes Eolhondras
2. Hadn't gotten any PMs at beginning of day one.
3. Banters with Eol, changes his vote to Silverblade
4. Slightly bigger posts on the lynch targets, I'll break it up again.
   1. Does not like Elenion's suicide plan
   2. Is neutral on Emerald
   3. Trusts Stink a tad bit
   4. All his suspicions are extremely minor. Useful for an eliminator to hide with.
5. Asks Mailliw to explain why his last post was "off" Mailliw's not sure.
6. Another longish post:
   1. Retracts his vote on SilverBlade.
   2. He requests a scan on Elenion, to be revealed in thread if possible.
   3. Votes on Straw to solidify the lynch. Odd, considering he suspects Elenion.
   4. Wants to do an OOG PM with STINK. Clearly crazy.
7. Has a parrot that can say PAFO. More banter.
8. Fine with letting Mailliw see his death scene.
9. Laughs that Mailliw will see his vote as suspicious. Farewells from all.
10. Votes for Elenion, since Elen had claimed Pirate in a PM.
11. Oh crap, he made a player list. This won't take forever to analyze...
    1. Paranoid about Alvron
    2. Believes Aman is innocent.
    3. Mentions that Lopen distrusts Aonar
    4. Suspects Rae is lying about being neutral
    5. Wants Burnt dead for quick links. Mostly joking.
    6. Not paranoid about Conq, even though he and Alv have the same roles
    7. Suspects Elb due to PM activity
    8. Abandons Elenion train after Aman's post
    9. Thinks Emerald's case is overstated
    10. Doesn't have a read on Eol.
    11. Suspects Kipper a lot.
    12. Lopen is his second-best village read
    13. No opinion on Orlok or Silverblade
    14. Frustrated by Ren
    15. Suspects Silverblade due to Rae, and posts his vote on her.
    16. Has no idea about Wilson
    17. Denies that there is a Jeskeri faction, saying we don't know what faction is out there.
    18. Wants a PM if he missed something.
12. Angry that people aren't voting, and apologizes for not voting. Because he trusts Aman, he votes for Ren.

You may be asking yourselves, "Why did Sart post an analysis of Bard?" I just chose a player who didn't have a role claim. Bard was at the bottom of the list, and I hadn't considered his alignment. Reading through his posts, I'm guessing he's the other Chay-Shan practitioner. I could be totally wrong, but that's my read on him. Obviously, I was hoping to find a Jeskeri, but this is still an interesting result. I doubt that the Practitioner has another role besides Practitioner. Therefore, I think it's a good idea to concentrate on finding that role first, by checking in with the people who haven't claimed anything yet. If I have time, I'm going to do an analysis on Aonar.

[Jo and the Bush all/any]

2 hours ago, Arraenae said:

@The Only Joe, if someone is attacked by both the CSP and the JP, how is the kill listed in the writeup?

Only the successful attack is posted. If three people attack the same player, only the successful one is shown in the write up.

[Arraenae]

10 minutes ago, The Only Joe said:

Only the successful attack is posted. If three people attack the same player, only the successful one is shown in the write up.

What do you mean by "successful attack?"

[Sart he/him]

2 hours ago, Elenion said:

Another bulletin: I want to start making an in-thread list about who's claimed what. We can't have a player with 2 roles (as far as I know), so any player who has verified who they are is not a candidate for being a Practitioner, Acolyte, Philosopher, or the Elim!Duke.

Player Name: Claimed Role

• Alvron: Pirate
• Amanuensis: Dula
• Aonar: Unclaimed Aman claims that Aonar claimed Beggar => Bodyguard
• Arraenae: Beggar => ?
• Burnt Spaghetti: Unclaimed
• Conquestor: Pirate
• Elenion: Duke
• Emerald: Bodyguard
• Eolhondras: Unclaimed
• Kipper: Unclaimed
• Lopen: Chay-Shan
• Orlok: Unclaimed
• Sart: Unclaimed
• Stink: Neutral with Defense Ability
• The Silver Dragon: Noble
• The Young Bard: Unclaimed

If there have been any other public claims, please let me know.

The bold change is mine. So, with that claim out of the way, there are six people who haven't claimed roles. I know I'm innocent, so that narrows it down to five players. In addition, we know through the thread that several roles have been claimed to Aman. Namely, there is a second Legionnaire, as well as a third Chay Shan claim. So, that narrows the list down to three players for Aman to scan. In addition, there is a second Duke running around. While they could be Jeskeri, I doubt they are the Practitioner. It seems likely that the second Duke, if they are village, would be either Eol or Bard, since they both voted for Ren. If one of them has already claimed to Aman, which I suspect has happened, then the other one is most likely a Duke. That doesn't tell us about their alignment, but it narrows Aman's scanning targets. As long as the practicioner hasn't fake claimed (difficult to prove, especially if a teammate has covered for them, "proving" their role), then Aman should only have three targets to scan. I don't know who those targets are, but Aman does. He could scan me, but I'm innocent, so I wouldn't recommend it. That leaves two juicy targets for him. I recommend scanning one of those two.

[TheMightyLopen he/him]

11 hours ago, Amanuensis said:

I didn't claim you're an eliminator. I said probably. I also didn't claim the eliminations only have a kill every 3rd cycle. I reiterated what Joe said in the D4 write up. I also don't believe your claim of ChayShan because the only players you've said you've attacked are "Straw" and "Elodin", the first another ChayShan has since said they were responsible for and the second the write up said the Practitioner killed. 

I claimed to you on D2 as ChayShan(or D3, I can't remember). That would be asking to die if I hadn't actually killed Straw or I couldn't actually kill anyone. It would be so stupid to claim that. Oh, I think I'll lie about my role. How about a kill role, because I'm sure that'll be super easy to fake! No. In the scenario you're suggesting, you're saying that I would claim to be ChayShan and have killed Straw while I'm saying I have a pretty good village read on you, when, if I was lying about my role, that would make it that much more likely Straw's killer would reveal to you. You even revealed that the player who killed Straw(me) revealed to you in the thread, so if the player who 'actually' killed Straw saw that, they should have immediately revealed and called me out. Did Elodin do that? No. There's also the fact that apparently when Elodin claimed to whoever told you about him attacking Straw, it appears he didn't claim to have killed Straw, but worded it in a manner that makes it impossible to tell, while if he had actually killed Straw, he most likely would have just said "I killed Straw on N1."

Anyways, to the people asking, I've already said who I'm attacking. There is no list. I'm attacking Aman.

Edit: And I still stand by asking for the kill role who killed Alvron to attack Aman with me. It's vital we kill a Cultist and not a villager this Turn and I don't want to take any unnecessary risks.

Edited August 9, 2016 by TheMightyLopen

[Amanuensis he/him]

2 minutes ago, TheMightyLopen said:

 

I claimed to you on D2 as ChayShan(or D3, I can't remember). That would be asking to die if I hadn't actually killed Straw or I couldn't actually kill anyone. It would be so stupid to claim that. Oh, I think I'll lie about my role. How about a kill role, because I'm sure that'll be super easy to fake! No. In the scenario you're suggesting, you're saying that I would claim to be ChayShan and have killed Straw while I'm saying I have a pretty good village read on you, when, if I was lying about my role, that would make it that much more likely Straw's killer would reveal to you. You even revealed that the player who killed Straw(me) revealed to you in the thread, so if the player who 'actually' killed Straw saw that, they should have immediately revealed and called me out. Did Elodin do that? No. There's also the fact that apparently when Elodin claimed to whoever told you about him attacking Straw, it appears he didn't claim to have killed Straw, but worded it in a manner that makes it impossible to tell, while if he had actually killed Straw, he most likely would have just said "I killed Straw on N1."

Anyways, to the people asking, I've already said who I'm attacking. There is no list. I'm attacking Aman.

Edit: And I still stand by asking for the kill role who killed Alvron to attack Aman with me. It's vital we kill a Cultist and not a villager this Turn and I don't want to take any unnecessary risks.

 

Elodin and I don't exactly have a good repertoire going, and given what he pulled the last night turn, there's no way we can apply logic or strategy to anything he's done so far this game. Either way, it doesn't really matter that much. If you're not lying we'll know in a few hours, either because you killed the second / last Dula in the game or because a Bodyguard blocked the kill and announces it in thread. Otherwise I'll survive without any attempt being made on me and I'll have a scan to reveal if you're an eliminator or not.

To the other ChayShan, I recommend you don't attack anyone tonight. The Philosopher is going to attack someone and they're likely going to die. That will likely leave us with 10 villagers, 4 Jeskeri and 1 SK who's working with them, if the kill on Elbereth is any indicator. It's about to be the fifth cycle and there's not a single Jeskeri dead. We cannot afford to be anything else but careful at this point, or the Jeskeri might soon overwhelm us, and as the only surviving Dula I'm the best chance we have at finding them without risking the lives of any more villagers. This game is getting way too close for us to take blind risks like that.

[TheMightyLopen he/him]

10 hours ago, Amanuensis said:

1. As far as we know there are 3 ChayShan, yes, and all three of them claimed to attack Straw on D1. Lopen told me at the end of D2, a second ChayShan claimed to Wilson and said they failed the same turn, and Elodin also claimed to attack Straw (but did not clarify if he succeeded or not). If he had told me I would have asked if he actually killed him or just attacked him, but sadly the player who he claimed the attack to never asked the question themselves, so I can't say for sure. What I do know is that there has only been undeniable evidence of two ChayShan kills at once. The attack on Straw, the attack on Alv, and the attack on Me and Araris. Three ChayShan claimed to have attacked Straw. Only one (Wilson's) claimed to have attacked Alv. Elodin attacked me, which is what resulted in his death, so that means that Wilson's had to be the one who killed Araris. I for one know the identity of the ChayShan who attacked Alv, and at this point in time I trust them a lot more than I trust Lopen.

2. Lopen claimed Bodyguard early on, supposedly to discourage him from being attacked. But when I brought up in thread the sheer number of Bodyguards in the game and that one of them was likely evil, he suddenly started to sing a different tune. I was not aware that Elodin was a ChayShan, or that he attacked Straw N1, until last turn. Since the player who he told could not tell me if they were successful or not, I assumed Lopen was telling the truth. But then he started making up all of these "paranoid theories" about me. Right now he's trying to get Wilson's ChayShan to attack me "in case of protection" when I really just think he wants someone else to kill me while he knows for sure I'm vulnerable, or otherwise waste their kill rather than remove him or another one of his teammates.

3. In light of that. Aonar. Lopen. I believe he started trying to implicate me when he made that post about players pretending to be Arrested on N2 (his goal was to cast doubt on anyone who wasn't posting at night). At the time he had no ground to stand on to attempt a direct confrontation, so he attempted something less risky, to which Wilson shut down immediately. And then all of a sudden I'm attacked by the Jeskeri and multiple players die. I should have thought it suspicious that instead of posting in thread about it like Ren did, he went to players privately, likely to gauge how they felt about it and maybe persuade them to think I was somehow evil because I got attacked. But then he seemed to be willing to hear me out while Ren kept pushing it, so I favored the latter being evil. Then towards the end of the turn, he and Aonar attempt to reignite the lynch on me and almost succeed in making it a tie, which would have resulted in us losing two villagers, something we cannot afford right now.

4. At the very least, I believe Aonar and Lopen are on a team together. And it's mainly because of this "theory" right here:

If Aonar and I were on a team, why would I tell people he's evil and try to lynch him? That makes absolutely no sense. I would tell the thread he's innocent so that people continue to ignore him while we team up to take another villager down. I believe now that you know Aonar is evil because you're evil with him, and therefore know that I'm telling the truth about my role and that there's nothing you can do to stop me from scanning him short of killing me (which you can't actually do because you're not a ChayShan), hence you openly asking the other ChayShan to attack me.

5. What I noticed, too, is that your sudden assurance of me being evil changed when I started telling people my actual role. You yourself said before I claimed that you figured out Elb was the Dula, too. I think someone on your team got in contact with the Philosopher and had him attack her the same night your Practitioner attacked me so that the only Dula in the game wouldn't be alive to find you. Obviously you didn't anticipate there being a second one, and now you're getting desperate when your entire plan is about to crumble because you can't kill me for another two cycles and I'm about to out your teammate. That way if I succeeded in getting him lynched you could still accuse me.

Ultimately that depends on whether or not Joe let the RNG handle role selection or if he hand picked / tweaked the rolls. But there's a pretty big downside to being a vocal player, and it's that you're almost always a priority target for the eliminators. That's why I was so careful in the beginning. I knew that the Dula could only scan eliminators, not Neutral-Evils, so I didn't want to rely on the ability too much, and with there being so many players at the time, using it would be like trying to find a needle in a haystack, especially with very limited reads on people and no idea how the eliminator team would be balanced. My goal from the beginning was to survive until the late game when there was more content to analyze and less players to verify. Right now I've got a lot of good leads and a small enough pool to pick from that I'm confident I'll snag an eliminator soon.

As for voting for the scan. The only way the eliminators can ruin it is if they were to kill whoever I verify (assuming that player isn't also evil), which they can't do unless they have a ChayShan. As for them leading the vote away from one of them, I think that any attempt to do so is extremely valuable information, just like the lynch votes during the day often tell us who is evil based on who they try to save. I also am against Stink being attacked. He finally told me yesterday the full extent of his win condition, and it's a lot more believable than "I just need to Survive until the end and I have no abilities to help me get there." Plus he helped save my life. If he was actually a Jeskeri I severely doubt he would have helped me when I asked. He would have probably told me "Sorry m8, I'm Neutral" and left it at that.

Numbered to respond easier.

1. 4 kill roles. 1 of which is the 'Philosopher.' Here's how the attacks look.

Me: N1 - Killed Straw. N2 - Didn't attack. N3 - Attacked Elodin, but failed.
Killer 2: N1 - Attacked Straw, but failed. N2 - Attacked Alvron, took his extra life. N3 - Attacked Araris.
Elodin: N1 - Attacked Straw apparently(failed). N2 - Attacked Emerald maybe? N3 - Attacked Aman, died.
Philosopher: N1 - Killed Ecthelion. N2 - Attacked Conquestor, took his extra life. N3 - Killed Elbereth.

2. I claimed Bodyguard to multiple people to try and protect myself yes. When you revealed that there were a lot of Bodyguard claims, I decided to tell you the truth, because at that point, I had a village read on you and figured it would be best to tell you the truth so that 1. I would be accountable for my Actions and 2. Given you had a lot of claims, you could maybe figure out how role distribution looked and we'd be less in the dark about the game.

3. Okay, this point is ridiculous. My suggestion that players pretending to be Arrested were suspicious didn't include you at all. You had actually been arrested, or at least had claimed to be, so that in no way was pointed towards you and you suggesting it was is just plain unbelievable. You're making connections where there aren't any. Same as the last part of that paragraph. Every single person saying you're suspicious is an elim? That's not plausible.

4. I admitted that was a paranoid theory.

5. If I was an elim that was in contact with the Philosopher, again, I'd have a kill at my disposal, so there'd be no reason to be desperate because my "plan" was about to crumble. This is basically the same slip up you made earlier(that no one else seems to believe is a slip up because my claim isn't completely verified). Either my team is in contact with the Philosopher or my team only has the Jeskeri Practitioner as a kill. You suggest both as a possibility, which can't be the case and so your arguments are invalid, and, I should add, completely fabricated to suit your needs.

[Amanuensis he/him]

10 minutes ago, TheMightyLopen said:

 

 

 If I was an elim that was in contact with the Philosopher, again, I'd have a kill at my disposal, so there'd be no reason to be desperate because my "plan" was about to crumble. This is basically the same slip up you made earlier(that no one else seems to believe is a slip up because my claim isn't completely verified). Either my team is in contact with the Philosopher or my team only has the Jeskeri Practitioner as a kill. You suggest both as a possibility, which can't be the case and so your arguments are invalid, and, I should add, completely fabricated to suit your needs.

It's not a storming slip up. Joe said it plainly in the write up.

Quote

 

 

The Secret Faction The Jeskeri Cult has been revealed. They are eliminators. They have a Doc. They do not have a group or nightly kill. Their goal is to outnumber the Citizenry and kill all other Eliminators.

The Secret Role Jeskeri Practitioner has been revealed. Jeskeri Practitioners may target one player every 3rd night. That player is killed, as is Every player that player targets, and every player that targets that player. If the Practitioner dies, a Jeskeri Acolyte ascends to become a Practitioner.

Emphasis mine.

[TheMightyLopen he/him]

The slip up is not that you're saying the Jeskeri only have the Jeskeri Practitioner as their kill, but that you keeping saying that I'm a Jeskeri and I have no way to kill you, when I'm ChayShan and the second scenario you give includes that I have the Philosopher working with me!

So, yes, it is a slip up. The second one being more conclusive than the first, given it's completely clear to see because it doesn't rely on my claim of ChayShan.

I'll explain it as clearly as I can.

1. Aman suggests I'm a Jeskeri and my team worked together with the Philosopher to kill El.
2. Now, when Aman reveals he's a Dula, he suggests I'm panicking because I have no way to kill him for 2 Cycles.

But he just said my team was working with a kill role that can kill each Night Turn. It's a direct contradiction to what he said in the previous sentence. It's like an admittance that he knows I'm not working with the Philosopher because he knows I'm not evil, hence, I call it a slip up.

[Amanuensis he/him]

5 minutes ago, TheMightyLopen said:

 

The slip up is not that you're saying the Jeskeri only have the Jeskeri Practitioner as their kill, but that you keeping saying that I'm a Jeskeri and I have no way to kill you, when I'm ChayShan and the second scenario you give includes that I have the Philosopher working with me!

So, yes, it is a slip up. The second one being more conclusive than the first, given it's completely clear to see because it doesn't rely on my claim of ChayShan.

I'll explain it as clearly as I can.

1. Aman suggests I'm a Jeskeri and my team worked together with the Philosopher to kill El.
2. Now, when Aman reveals he's a Dula, he suggests I'm panicking because I have no way to kill him for 2 Cycles.

But he just said my team was working with a kill role that can kill each Night Turn. It's a direct contradiction to what he said in the previous sentence. It's like an admittance that he knows I'm not working with the Philosopher because he knows I'm not evil, hence, I call it a slip up.

 

Every kill the Philosopher makes is discernible from a ChayShans. If you had the Philosopher attack me it would be the same thing as you proving to everyone that you're not a ChayShan. I'm sorry that I didn't clarify something that was glaringly obvious earlier.

[Elenion he/him]

2 minutes ago, TheMightyLopen said:

The slip up is not that you're saying the Jeskeri only have the Jeskeri Practitioner as their kill, but that you keeping saying that I'm a Jeskeri and I have no way to kill you, when I'm ChayShan and the second scenario you give includes that I have the Philosopher working with me!

So, yes, it is a slip up. The second one being more conclusive than the first, given it's completely clear to see because it doesn't rely on my claim of ChayShan.

I'll explain it as clearly as I can.

1. Aman suggests I'm a Jeskeri and my team worked together with the Philosopher to kill El.
2. Now, when Aman reveals he's a Dula, he suggests I'm panicking because I have no way to kill him for 2 Cycles.

But he just said my team was working with a kill role that can kill each Night Turn. It's a direct contradiction to what he said in the previous sentence. It's like an admittance that he knows I'm not working with the Philosopher because he knows I'm not evil, hence, I call it a slip up.

I also find it interesting that Aman claims Lopen is a Jeskeri but yet accuses Lopen of being unable to kill him, despite Lopen being a claimed Chay-Shan. I don't find it suspicious enough to kill based off of, but that's something I'll definitely keep in mind.

Also, between Aman and Lopen (two strong village reads for me) I have to say that Lopen's argument sounds more village-like right now.

[Amanuensis he/him]

Just now, Elenion said:

 

I also find it interesting that Aman claims Lopen is a Jeskeri but yet accuses Lopen of being unable to kill him, despite Lopen being a claimed Chay-Shan. I don't find it suspicious enough to kill based off of, but that's something I'll definitely keep in mind.

Also, between Aman and Lopen (two strong village reads for me) I have to say that Lopen's argument sounds more village-like right now.

The point here is that Lopen has claimed a role that he has yet to prove. Both of the kills he said he did were carried out by multiple players. That is the point I'm trying to make. I know my alignment, and I cannot possibly fathom why a village!Lopen would be tunneling on me right now other than the fact that he's lying.

[Elenion he/him]

4 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

The point here is that Lopen has claimed a role that he has yet to prove. Both of the kills he said he did were carried out by multiple players. That is the point I'm trying to make. I know my alignment, and I cannot possibly fathom why a village!Lopen would be tunneling on me right now other than the fact that he's lying.

I specified "claimed Chay-Shan" to account for the possibility of a false role. And I can also see a scenario where you are both village and paranoid of the other, sort of like me vs El in MR15.

[Amanuensis he/him]

13 minutes ago, Elenion said:

 

 

I specified "claimed Chay-Shan" to account for the possibility of a false role. And I can also see a scenario where you are both village and paranoid of the other, sort of like me vs El in MR15.

Ah, yeah. Thing is I'm not exactly claiming Lopen is a Jeskeri. I won't know for sure until I scan him. I'm accusing him mostly because he's being so insistent that I'm evil when I'm not and trying to get other people to kill me for him. He keeps twisting everything I'm saying to make it seem worse than it is, and that just screams eliminator to me because I know it's all chulldung. Could he just be a villager who's unnecessarily paranoid and tunneling on me? Yes. It's happened before. But there's nothing I can do at this point to refute it, just like there was nothing Kipper could to prevent Hellscythe from doing the same thing in MR9. Right now I'm just praying that I'm right about him lying, that the other ChayShan doesn't listen to him, and that the player who said they became a Bodyguard (who's not Aonar) protects me, because if I am wrong and Lopen is a villager I am going to be extremely upset if I'm killed by friendly fire.

Edited August 10, 2016 by Amanuensis

[STINK he/him]

Lol if I was village I'd know at least one evil just from this argument thing.

[TheMightyLopen he/him]

22 minutes ago, Amanuensis said:

 

Every kill the Philosopher makes is discernible from a ChayShans. If you had the Philosopher attack me it would be the same thing as you proving to everyone that you're not a ChayShan. I'm sorry that I didn't clarify something that was glaringly obvious earlier.

Fair point.

Anyways, the point that you don't seem to want to admit that I'm ChayShan is what has made me so suspicious of you Aman. It's pretty obvious I'm ChayShan or at the least have a ChayShan working with me. Anything else and my actions so far would be suicide(claiming to you on D2 and revealing I'm ChayShan to the thread on N3) and you should know that.

[Amanuensis he/him]

17 minutes ago, TheMightyLopen said:

 

 

 

Fair point.

Anyways, the point that you don't seem to want to admit that I'm ChayShan is what has made me so suspicious of you Aman. It's pretty obvious I'm ChayShan or at the least have a ChayShan working with me. Anything else and my actions so far would be suicide(claiming to you on D2 and revealing I'm ChayShan to the thread on N3) and you should know that.

Maybe you are a ChayShan. I don't know. I'm not a role scanner. I haven't seen you claim any kill that is undeniably proven yours. When I see it, I will believe it. I did not think you were suspicious until you kept trying to cast doubt on me. I tried to do something honestly good for this game and generate discussion by proposing a scan vote, and you attempted to shut it down and make it look like if I did scan Aonar and found out he was a Jeskeri, it would just be a ploy to make me gain more trust, which I shouldn't even need to do right now because there's no evidence to suggest I'm evil. It's got to the point where people are using "maybe the eliminators had a redirect role and controlled Wilson to defend Aman!" to try to kill me, and I think that is absolutely absurd. Yes, Joe basically told us anything is possible when it comes to eliminators. But until I see solid proof of something like that (not a single person has claimed to be redirected) I'm not going to assume it or anything like it, nor advocate that anyone does, especially if it means me dying and the eliminators getting closer to victory.

I do recognize that, Lopen. I really don't understand why you would do that. The only thing that might make sense is if you're a evil Beggar with a plan of snagging up ChayShan as soon as someone died. If that's the case, then you'd have to get it tonight, which might be a part of the reason why you asked the other ChayShan to target me. If they don't, you can say you attacked me and it failed because of a Bodyguard. If they do, you can say that I must have been protected by two. I honestly don't know. I proposed Aonar for the scan mostly because Wilson found him suspicious, and there's a few notes I've taken about him that make me think he might be evil too. I just can't get why your opinion of me would shift 180 degrees so suddenly, and that you would take his side over mine, unless you were working against the village.

Edited August 10, 2016 by Amanuensis

[Sart he/him]

Aman, Lopen, you're better than this.

Lopen, attacking Aman won't prove your innocence. He's the most likely player to be protected, so your attack will not be put in the write-up. However, since we're low on protection, attacking anyone else will probably go through. Why don't you attack a player you think is suspicious, who is not Aman? Since lynching a Jeskeri is going to be difficult, we need to get lucky with our kills. If you still suspect him after tomorrow, I'm fine with you killing him, but there are better targets right now, especially if you value your own skin.

Aman, scanning Lopen doesn't do you any good. I see four possibilities:

1. You see Lopen as good, and Lopen is good. Lopen still won't believe you're a scanner, and will actively try to kill you. He will not participate in your trust group. You will not have any leads to the Jeskeri.
2. You see Lopen as good, but Lopen is neutral evil. Then your scan would be useless. We would invite a wolf in sheep's clothing, giving him protection from the Jeskeri, and allowing him to keep killing.
3. You see Lopen as evil, and Lopen is a Jeskeri. His allies will say that you either lied about your scan, or that there is a framing ability. Or, they could disown him, and we would run out of leads.
4. You see Lopen as evil, and Lopen isn't. Then we have a framer, and you get lynched.

None of these outcomes are particularly good in my mind. While Lopen is still a candidate for Jeskeri, if he kills someone, he's much more likely to not be one. Yes, he could be a Beggar, but I doubt that, since the number of Beggar claims would be through the roof. Target one of the three people whose role you don't know. The Jeskeri won't know who you're targeting, so they'll be at a disadvantage.

Come on guys. I truly believe you're both village. If you're not, then kudos to you. But as of right now, this in-fighting has to stop. We can't afford any more mistakes, and we're doing the Jeskeri's job for them.

[Elenion he/him]

1 minute ago, Sart said:

Come on guys. I truly believe you're both village. If you're not, then kudos to you. But as of right now, this in-fighting has to stop. We can't afford any more mistakes, and we're doing the Jeskeri's job for them.

I'm with Sart on this. Put a scan or kill in on players like Eol, Burnt, Orlok, Kipper, etc.

[STINK he/him]

Or Elenion.

[Burnt Spaghetti she/her]

I think Sart puts forth a good point tbh.

The other thing is, stink said earlier that he'd given the chayshans a target that he thinks they should kill. If, Lopen, you and the other ChayShan think there could be a reasonable chance stinks suggestion is evil, perhaps that could be a better option? Perhaps leave Aman for the lynch. That way, if he's good and truly dula, he gets one more scan. 

[Amanuensis he/him]

19 minutes ago, Burnt Spaghetti said:

 

I think Sart puts forth a good point tbh.

The other thing is, stink said earlier that he'd given the chayshans a target that he thinks they should kill. If, Lopen, you and the other ChayShan think there could be a reasonable chance stinks suggestion is evil, perhaps that could be a better option? Perhaps leave Aman for the lynch. That way, if he's good and truly dula, he gets one more scan. 

Personally I would rather the ChayShan not act without more certainty. So far we've lynched 4 villagers and over twice as many have died to night kills. I don't think killing more people is the answer at this point. Not when we have me to scan people to make sure they're good or evil. This is a huge issue with kill roles in general. Just because someone has the power to kill someone doesn't mean it should be used every night. Most of the time, early kill attempts end with more village casualties than not, *glares meaningfully at anonymous ChayShan*.

[STINK he/him]

Why listen to this guy when you can listen to helpful STINK?

[Amanuensis he/him]

One option we never considered is having Lopen attack Orlok. Orlok has been Arresting himself every night since C2. He'll be able to verify whether or not he was attacked.