TwiLyghtSansSparkles she/her Posted February 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 I have been taking your concerns seriously, and altering things where I think they need to be, I just think that I tend to not change things if, from my point of view, they already meet your criteria. I really do want to create a character that can fit into this, but I've seen some characters that can do amazing things, and I don't want my character to be less cool than them in my mind, so I guess I'm kinda competing against them to try and make my character cool, while not making him too OP from my point of view, while sticking to my original vision of him. But after this long, and so many concerns about his balance, I don't think I can manage all of those, and I might end up coming up with a new char, and leaving this one behind. If anyone that's seen this part of the thread wants to pick him up and try to make him work, you're more than welcome to, and I'd love to see him come to be a reality, but I'm not sure I can make it happen. A youthful master of one or two weapons is plenty cool. That is amazing. Most people can only dream of reaching that level of mastery. Making him an expert at dozens of different weapons types just felt over-the-top, when he would've been cool with expertise at one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Citadel16 he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 I have been taking your concerns seriously, and altering things where I think they need to be, I just think that I tend to not change things if, from my point of view, they already meet your criteria. I really do want to create a character that can fit into this, but I've seen some characters that can do amazing things, and I don't want my character to be less cool than them in my mind, so I guess I'm kinda competing against them to try and make my character cool, while not making him too OP from my point of view, while sticking to my original vision of him. But after this long, and so many concerns about his balance, I don't think I can manage all of those, and I might end up coming up with a new char, and leaving this one behind. If anyone that's seen this part of the thread wants to pick him up and try to make him work, you're more than welcome to, and I'd love to see him come to be a reality, but I'm not sure I can make it happen. Edit: I'll also be making my next character sword related as well, just to warn you. I'm getting the feeling that you're a bit frustrated. You're doing fine. we all have been through this before. you should see the arguments I made for my first character, the hunter, who was originally so badchull that everyone said no. just work with it. it is a really good idea, it just needs some realism. (fortunately, on the questions forum, Realism does not come as a slap to the face.) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elithanathile he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 A youthful master of one or two weapons is plenty cool. That is amazing. Most people can only dream of reaching that level of mastery. Making him an expert at dozens of different weapons types just felt over-the-top, when he would've been cool with expertise at one. I'm getting the feeling that you're a bit frustrated. You're doing fine. we all have been through this before. you should see the arguments I made for my first character, the hunter, who was originally so badchull that everyone said no. just work with it. it is a really good idea, it just needs some realism. (fortunately, on the questions forum, Realism does not come as a slap to the face.) I was increasing his age by quite a bit, which gave him a lot more leeway with them, while still trying to keep him writable for me. I also decreased his weapons by a large amount, he was basically left with daggers, longswords, broadswords, rapiers, katana, and a pistol sword. (Because that's cool. He can't use it hardly at all. He has no training in guns at all, he basically just uses it as a pistol to use a short range that comes with a blade if he needs to parry while using it.) I could probably remove the estoc as well, as that's a bit trickier to use, but that leaves him with maybe 10 different enough weapons to require separate training, and saying that he's been training for 30 years, that gives him 3 years per weapon, which I think is pretty realistic, so I'm not quite sure what else I could change without taking out even more weapons. (Which will make me cry a little. These weapons are seriously cool, and I was really looking forward to using them.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RippleGylf she/her Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Sure. Any ideas for the character itself already? Well, I was thinking of maybe seeing how family relationships would work while there's Epics around, so perhaps a couple of twins? Would that be alright? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles she/her Posted February 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 I was increasing his age by quite a bit, which gave him a lot more leeway with them, while still trying to keep him writable for me. I also decreased his weapons by a large amount, he was basically left with daggers, longswords, broadswords, rapiers, katana, and a pistol sword. (Because that's cool. He can't use it hardly at all. He has no training in guns at all, he basically just uses it as a pistol to use a short range that comes with a blade if he needs to parry while using it.) I could probably remove the estoc as well, as that's a bit trickier to use, but that leaves him with maybe 10 different enough weapons to require separate training, and saying that he's been training for 30 years, that gives him 3 years per weapon, which I think is pretty realistic, so I'm not quite sure what else I could change without taking out even more weapons. (Which will make me cry a little. These weapons are seriously cool, and I was really looking forward to using them.) I'm kind of torn here. On the one hand, I want you to be able to write a character you'll enjoy writing and have fun with. On the other hand, making him an expert at different weapons for the sake of coolness….doesn't seem like a good idea to me. And a good point was made earlier about muscle memory—if he had three years for each different weapon, with his focus being on that weapon and not any weapon he previously trained with, his proficiency with the earlier weapon would decrease when he went back to it. Broadswords and rapiers utilize very different movements, and katanas are a different beast entirely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChickenPlague he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Quick question. How long after the Calamity does the RP take place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Citadel16 he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) I was increasing his age by quite a bit, which gave him a lot more leeway with them, while still trying to keep him writable for me. I also decreased his weapons by a large amount, he was basically left with daggers, longswords, broadswords, rapiers, katana, and a pistol sword. (Because that's cool. He can't use it hardly at all. He has no training in guns at all, he basically just uses it as a pistol to use a short range that comes with a blade if he needs to parry while using it.) I could probably remove the estoc as well, as that's a bit trickier to use, but that leaves him with maybe 10 different enough weapons to require separate training, and saying that he's been training for 30 years, that gives him 3 years per weapon, which I think is pretty realistic, so I'm not quite sure what else I could change without taking out even more weapons. (Which will make me cry a little. These weapons are seriously cool, and I was really looking forward to using them.) most weapons of the same segment (Swords or guns in general) usually translate directly into each other. if you can aim a weapon, its because your hand is steady, and you have good timing and understand wind and stuff like that(eloquent, I know). swords are the same. you train with one, you understand them all. Very few swords would violate this rule, and most of the ones that do are custom made. if you are a sword master it wouldn't matter what type of blade you would use, you would know how to use them because that's how you trained. Quick question. How long after the Calamity does the RP take place? I have been wondering this as well. Edited February 9, 2016 by warriormark16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Quick question. How long after the Calamity does the RP take place? About 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Citadel16 he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) About 10 years. wait. so this is happening around the same time as Steelhearts death?(is my time table right? I lent the book to my brother in law and I haven't seen it since... that was two month ago...) Edited February 9, 2016 by warriormark16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwiLyghtSansSparkles she/her Posted February 9, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 wait. so this is happening around the same time as Steelhearts death?(is my time table right? I lent the book to my brother in law and I haven't seen it since... that was two month ago...) No, it's two years prior to Steelheart's death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze1616 he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) most weapons of the same segment (Swords or guns in general) usually translate directly into each other. if you can aim a weapon, its because your hand is steady, and you have good timing and understand wind and stuff like that(eloquent, I know). swords are the same. you train with one, you understand them all. Very few swords would violate this rule, and most of the ones that do are custom made. if you are a sword master it wouldn't matter what type of blade you would use, you would know how to use them because that's how you trained. Please don't take this as rude, but this is so wrong it actually hurts. Have you held different types of swords? A Claymore vs a Katana vs a Rapier? I can't speak to gunplay, but swords are massively different. Even not accounting for which edges are bladed, the varying weights of the blades is enough to make them completely different. I didn't bother looking up any of the weapons that Bridge Boy listed, but if we're being realistic, by the age of 35 a person who has dedicated their lives to swordplay would be "master level" in one or two, but likely proficient in three or four. Edited February 9, 2016 by Blaze1616 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elithanathile he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Please don't take this as rude, but this is so wrong it actually hurts. Have you held different types of swords? A Claymore vs a Katana vs a Rapier? I can't speak to gunplay, but swords are massively different. Even not accounting for which edges are bladed, the varying weights of the blades is enough to make them completely different. I didn't bother looking up any of the weapons that Bridge Boy listed, but if we're being realistic, by the age of 35 a person who has dedicated their lives to swordplay would be "master level" in one or two, but likely proficient in three or four. I know that this wasn't pointed at me, but this is a good opportunity to mention that I understand that many swords handle very differently. (Sadly, I have never held any kind of sword, just researched them and read books ) There are some swords that are similar enough though that they do handle the same, but have different traits. Like a rapier vs. flamberge. A flamberge is a rapier that has a "wavy" blade that rattles the opponents blade while parrying, and can throw them off. But it still handles the same as an actual rapier, just with a different trait. So there are enough like that in his collection that I feel he could have proficiency in the different types after 30 years with him being a prodigy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Swan Dragon he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 To the players of Corvallis, could you take a look at my character, ThunderSpear, and help me find a way for him to join in? He would most likely be taking something from someone, and if anyone has a good target/other idea, I would love to hear it. I'm really bad at character intros... Thanks! Bai! ~Wpx ((Does this seem good, Edgedancer?)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mestiv he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 I understand why Twi and others are against a character that is a master of so many weapon types, but let's be honest: is his mastery going to be shown during the game anyway? Will he have access to all those weapons? I think his sword abilities are similar to Kenshin's and if it was up to me, I'd let him have them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 To the players of Corvallis, could you take a look at my character, ThunderSpear, and help me find a way for him to join in? He would most likely be taking something from someone, and if anyone has a good target/other idea, I would love to hear it. I'm really bad at character intros... Thanks! Bai! ~Wpx ((Does this seem good, Edgedancer?)) Essentially the idea is to get him started by breaking in by someone else. Maybe by Drainer or Gelliton? Mestiv Mashadar, what do you say? I understand why Twi and others are against a character that is a master of so many weapon types, but let's be honest: is his mastery going to be shown during the game anyway? Will he have access to all those weapons? I think his sword abilities are similar to Kenshin's and if it was up to me, I'd let him have them. I dunno, given that that's pretty much the crux of Kenshin's powers the comparision seems a bit lacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mestiv he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Sure, he can break in to Drainers house but during the day? Because Drainer will be busy after around 9 PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elithanathile he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) I understand why Twi and others are against a character that is a master of so many weapon types, but let's be honest: is his mastery going to be shown during the game anyway? Will he have access to all those weapons? I think his sword abilities are similar to Kenshin's and if it was up to me, I'd let him have them. His sword abilities are actually worse than Kenshin's. He's not supernaturally gifted with the ability, just very good at what he does. Which is swords. And yeah, he kinda does have access to them. He has a portal hooked up to an underground vault that's usually unlinked, so in a battle, he could open a portal to there, reach in, and grab the weapon of his choice. But he usually only has about 4-6 weapons on him at a time. Something I thought of when I read up on Kenshin, I don't know if you've done this before, but if she can sense where attacks are coming from, couldn't she just make a sword appear in that direction to block, without even having to look, and then remove it once the shot or whatever had been removed? Just something I came up with, not sure if you've used it before or want to use it. Edit: The "You" I'm referring to there is the owner of Kenshin, who I believe is Edgedancer. But the paragraph before that is aimed at Mestiv. Edited February 9, 2016 by Bridge Boy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Something I thought of when I read up on Kenshin, I don't know if you've done this before, but if she can sense where attacks are coming from, couldn't she just make a sword appear in that direction to block, without even having to look, and then remove it once the shot or whatever had been removed? Just something I came up with, not sure if you've used it before or want to use it. Edit: The "You" I'm referring to there is the owner of Kenshin, who I believe is Edgedancer. But the paragraph before that is aimed at Mestiv. Yes and no, her danger sense is specifically there to help her defend against suprise attacks, snipers and the like and she can create blades as a means to block attacks but her danger sense isn't the most accurate, so if she simply makes a sword pop up between her and the attack there's still several things that could go wrong, ranging from a bullet shattering the blade and the shrapnel piercing her to the impact of the attack just crashing it into her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze1616 he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 To the players of Corvallis, could you take a look at my character, ThunderSpear, and help me find a way for him to join in? He would most likely be taking something from someone, and if anyone has a good target/other idea, I would love to hear it. I'm really bad at character intros... Thanks! Bai! ~Wpx ((Does this seem good, Edgedancer?)) My biggest issue: Why is he in Corvallis? Corvallis is a city already owned by a High Epic, and so other High Epics coming to town would likely only do so because they want to take over. To my knowledge we haven't really met a canon High Epic who didn't want to rule, aside from Obliteration whose only motive was to get stronger. Now here's the list of High Epics in Corvallis: -Rainmaker (owns the place) -Bubbles (by some definitions a High Epic due to PI, but has zero offensive powers) -Jumpdrive (same as Bubbles, no offensive but has PI) -Converter (want to overthrow Rainmaker) -Phoenix (wants to overthrow Rainmaker) -Iconoclast (wants to overthrow Rainmaker) -Argon (odd man out, just wants a place to relax for the rest of his days) There might be others that I've forgotten or we don't know enough about (Insight), so my apologies to those players. Anyways, aside from Argon and the two without offensive powers who only meet High Epic status due to PIs, everyone's there to own the place. So why is Thunderspear there? He's a crazy powerful High Epic, so I feel this is very important to know to figure out how you enter the city (as well as when you entered). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 My biggest issue: Why is he in Corvallis? Corvallis is a city already owned by a High Epic, and so other High Epics coming to town would likely only do so because they want to take over. To my knowledge we haven't really met a canon High Epic who didn't want to rule, aside from Obliteration whose only motive was to get stronger. Now here's the list of High Epics in Corvallis: -Rainmaker (owns the place) -Bubbles (by some definitions a High Epic due to PI, but has zero offensive powers) -Jumpdrive (same as Bubbles, no offensive but has PI) -Converter (want to overthrow Rainmaker) -Phoenix (wants to overthrow Rainmaker) -Iconoclast (wants to overthrow Rainmaker) -Argon (odd man out, just wants a place to relax for the rest of his days) There might be others that I've forgotten or we don't know enough about (Insight), so my apologies to those players. Anyways, aside from Argon and the two without offensive powers who only meet High Epic status due to PIs, everyone's there to own the place. So why is Thunderspear there? He's a crazy powerful High Epic, so I feel this is very important to know to figure out how you enter the city (as well as when you entered). Nightwielder, Firefight, Newton, Fortuity, Mitosis. Granted, for some of these you could argue that they simply bowed to the greater power but saying we haven't seen High Epics that are satisfied without being ruler seems a bit extreme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze1616 he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) Nightwielder, Firefight, Newton, Fortuity, Mitosis. Granted, for some of these you could argue that they simply bowed to the greater power but saying we haven't seen High Epics that are satisfied without being ruler seems a bit extreme. I would consider all of those except Mitosis as rulers. Just because you're not head honcho doesn't not make you a ruler. Edit: And maybe Fortuity, but he was somewhat lacking in offensive powers to make him a threat to the ruling High Epics. Edited February 9, 2016 by Blaze1616 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Well, I was thinking of maybe seeing how family relationships would work while there's Epics around, so perhaps a couple of twins? Would that be alright? Sounds good to me. Any family besides the twins around or just those two trying to stick together? I would consider all of those except Mitosis as rulers. Just because you're not head honcho doesn't not make you a ruler. Edit: And maybe Fortuity, but he was somewhat lacking in offensive powers to make him a threat to the ruling High Epics. Fair point. Although, in both books our protagonists have been specifically seeking out the Epics in leadership positions, so our data, with the exception of Fortuity and mitosis, is pretty heavily biased. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze1616 he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Fair point. Although, in both books our protagonists have been specifically seeking out the Epics in leadership positions, so our data, with the exception of Fortuity and mitosis, is pretty heavily biased. Very true, but they also comment that they don't pick fights with rulers to not rock the boat, as well as David commenting in Steelheart that the Reckoners could target High Epics but they don't. Combined I felt like the implication was High Epics naturally seek out positions of power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Swan Dragon he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 My biggest issue: Why is he in Corvallis? Corvallis is a city already owned by a High Epic, and so other High Epics coming to town would likely only do so because they want to take over. To my knowledge we haven't really met a canon High Epic who didn't want to rule, aside from Obliteration whose only motive was to get stronger. Now here's the list of High Epics in Corvallis: -Rainmaker (owns the place) -Bubbles (by some definitions a High Epic due to PI, but has zero offensive powers) -Jumpdrive (same as Bubbles, no offensive but has PI) -Converter (want to overthrow Rainmaker) -Phoenix (wants to overthrow Rainmaker) -Iconoclast (wants to overthrow Rainmaker) -Argon (odd man out, just wants a place to relax for the rest of his days) There might be others that I've forgotten or we don't know enough about (Insight), so my apologies to those players. Anyways, aside from Argon and the two without offensive powers who only meet High Epic status due to PIs, everyone's there to own the place. So why is Thunderspear there? He's a crazy powerful High Epic, so I feel this is very important to know to figure out how you enter the city (as well as when you entered). I was thinking Corvallis after a discussion with Edgedancer about joining Astoria, because there are more people that he'd be able to take stuff from. He doesn't care about ruling--he thinks it's too much effort. Instead, he just floats through an area, taking what he wants then moving on. However, after whatever happens when he heads into Corvallis, he would be sucked into staying, probably because Rainmaker & co. want to beat him up. Sure, he can break in to Drainers house but during the day? Because Drainer will be busy after around 9 PM. During the day is fine. What kind of stuff does Drainer have? Thanks! Bai! ~Wpx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgedancer he/him Posted February 9, 2016 Report Share Posted February 9, 2016 Very true, but they also comment that they don't pick fights with rulers to not rock the boat, as well as David commenting in Steelheart that the Reckoners could target High Epics but they don't. Combined I felt like the implication was High Epics naturally seek out positions of power. Wasn't it that they only target High Epics but not those that are too important? Otherwise him predicting their attack on Fortuity (a High Epic) would make very little sense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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