Quick Fix 75: The Tower's Pressure

[StrikerEZ he/him]

2 minutes ago, Aster said:

i do not like that proposal

i said this to kas in dms but i'll say it again - that works great if we know exactly who's maf, but we don't. in fact, my suspicions are very weak here due to lack of activity, and i think having a lot of CWs is far better than consolidating on one person. one of the trains has to be wolf, after all

I mean, I understand your disagreements, but also we have forever votes to deal with now. That complicates things. 

I also don’t agree that one of the trains has to be wolf. We could have 5 trains and they all be villagers for all we know.

EDIT: Anyway, I’m about to head to bed so I’ll see what happens overnight and decide what to do with my vote in the morning.

Edited May 22, 2025 by StrikerEZ

[Aster]

right, but it's far more likely that five trains contain one wolf than that one train contains one wolf

frankly i think consolidation is a terrible idea particularly this early on - it removes a big chunk of vote analysis from the game and doesn't give wolves any time to be scared that their friends are gonna die

[The Unknown Medallion he/him]

38 minutes ago, StrikerEZ said:

I can vibe with a vote on KaladinsSenseOfHumor. Looking back, there was little explanation for the vote. While that’s not necessarily uncommon right now, it’s good in my opinion to put more pressure on another candidate. See if that brings people out of the woodwork. (Also I always love the potential for ties )

Ties scare me in this game. They were specifically a point I brought up with Jo, and while I accepted his reasoning, they could have big consequences. 

In other news my name is Alvron and I will be your tiemaker this game (if I can at rollover and it doesn't involve people I like)

27 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

I'm divided on how I feel about this tbh.

I kind of half did my thoughts on this in a PM with Aster and one with TUN but I was considering the extent to which it would really suck for the Village to be dealing with major CW votes carrying over to the next cycle and make things easier for the Elims. I'm now weakly convinced the costs of forcing early consolidation are too high and we just gotta live with it. I think the CW thing might just be something to watch going into endgame as we don't want to be blindsided by a rogue train then.

But yeah tldr; I agree with Spirit after further reflection RE: votes but think we can't sacrifice the ability to force Elims to respond to CWs now.

Will PM you about this, but a personal theory of mine maintains that exing the counter train being more likely than usual is a good thing. 

Just realized though that the elims could hammer earlier if certain factors align. Might need to keep an eye on that.

2 hours ago, Lord Spirit said:

V takes in the room curiously. It seems like complete chaos. Aside from the old guy Kalhaver, it seemed like very few people had any experience. It’s almost people who got involved with murderers had a higher chance of dying off. Not that V would know anything about killing someone.
N̶o̶w̶ ̶X̶ ̶o̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶o̶t̶h̶e̶r̶ ̶h̶a̶n̶d̶…

Well, if the people want to be random, V’s only caution would be to remember that votes last forever, so random votes now could be game critical later, so be careful. 
 

Aster, Cuz why not?

Lord Spirit is V confirmed

In case I somehow don't make it in time for rollover (I really should but who knows, I forgot about it this morning), IcedOutPenguin because their not random #7 vote from a mysterious other person is the closest thing I have to a suspicion, and, contrary to popular opinion and previous statements, I do not want to die. (I just made a game where no one dies the least you can do is let me not die this game)

[Kasimir he/him]

See, my main thoughts here RE that are:

• Village absolutely needs vote analysis. This is a vote-heavy game. The Elims have powers that are all vote-centric so NKA is gonna be more vote analysis.
• Elims have no kill. This means they are essentially required to force a favourable exe regardless. Just by overall distro rules, CWs are likely to be villager-dominant and to carry into next cycle (logically, if you're a competent Elim and your buddies are all on CWs, this is not a good EoD for you. I agree the Soothe might change things a little though. I forgot to account for how much that might shift things.)
• It's hard to ask for convergence in a game as distributed as this. We can worry about trailing votes, but realistically, convergence probably happens about now, or earlier, which drastically kills time we can spend discussing and doing actual meaningful thread things. (This is the part that makes me lean the most against it.)

Edited to add:

1 minute ago, The Unknown Order said:

Will PM you about this, but a personal theory of mine maintains that exing the counter train being more likely than usual is a good thing. 

I'm interested in what this means about your reads this early  But I know it's not out of character for you.

[The Unknown Medallion he/him]

6 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

I'm interested in what this means about your reads this early  But I know it's not out of character for you.

Non existent as usual. I even reread, which I rarely do, and nothing pinged me. Aside from Penguin's thing which I don't actually care about all that much, just enough to earn a d1 (and d2, and d3, and oh well I have to vote someone and I know I'm v) vote.

Edited May 22, 2025 by The Unknown Order

[Kasimir he/him]

3 minutes ago, The Unknown Order said:

Non existent as usual. I even reread, which I rarely do, and nothing pinged me. Aside from Penguin's thing which I don't actually care about all that much, just enough to earn a d1 (and d2, and d3, and oh well I have to vote someone and I know I'm v) vote.

I'm mainly considering the adage you shouldn't PM anything you're not willing to have said to the Elims so you might as well do it in the thread, barring a read. And then I did the necessary "is 3 pages enough to form a read, is this Elim TMI" moment  

[The Unknown Medallion he/him]

3 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

I'm mainly considering the adage you shouldn't PM anything you're not willing to have said to the Elims so you might as well do it in the thread, barring a read

This thread has had enough philosophy without me adding to it. You'll understand when you read it.

[OoklaApologist She/her]

47 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

I kind of half did my thoughts on this in a PM with Aster and one with TUN

Wait, PMs are open!? Smh, I should read things

40 minutes ago, Aster said:

CWs

I forget what this means lol. Can someone refresh me so I can read y’all’s analysis right?

Gah, I’ve gtg, going to leave the vote on myself bc a uninformed vote is probs worse, gn

[Kasimir he/him]

4 minutes ago, The Unknown Order said:

This thread has had enough philosophy without me adding to it. You'll understand when you read it.

*grumbles in "I taught this to undergrads, don't make me watch people on the Internet do this"*

4 minutes ago, KelsierApologist said:

I forget what this means lol. Can someone refresh me so I can read y’all’s analysis right?

Countertrain. Say in a game with a lead train of size 4, your CWs are probably the trains at size 3, maybe the lone size 2 train. (This is overly specific and may or may not emerge from experience.) Basically CW is shorthand for "this person might realistically get exed instead."

PMs are 1-on-1 only btw.

[The Unknown Medallion he/him]

50 minutes ago, KelsierApologist said:

Wait, PMs are open!? Smh, I should read things

Reading things is overrated. I didn't know they were open until Kas PMed me. I also didn't know (well I did approve the ruleset so really I forgot but close enough) the elims had the one time exe stall into Kas PMed me about that.

45 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

grumbles in "I taught this to undergrads, don't make me watch people on the Internet do this"*

I assure you we are all much more qualified than you

46 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

PMs are 1-on-1 only btw.

When would Polly ever open a multi player PM without first checking the legality of such a PM. Polly would never

56 minutes ago, KelsierApologist said:

going to leave the vote on myself bc a uninformed vote is probs worse, gn

This is actually wrong no matter how you cut the cake btw. 

[Kasimir he/him]

7 minutes ago, The Unknown Order said:

Reading things is overrated. I didn't know they were open until Kas PMed me. I also didn't know (well I did approve the ruleset so really I forgot but close enough) the elims had the one time exe stall into Kas PMed me about that.

I approved the ruleset and I forgot the Soothe existed or that ties kill everyone. I think it happens

8 minutes ago, The Unknown Order said:

When would Polly ever open a multi player PM without first checking the legality of such a PM. Polly would never

Someone did  I'm not mentioning who because I don't need to shame them in thread for it  

8 minutes ago, The Unknown Order said:

This is actually wrong no matter how you cut the cake btw. 

1 hour ago, KelsierApologist said:

Gah, I’ve gtg, going to leave the vote on myself bc a uninformed vote is probs worse, gn

Yeah. But it does show a certain dgaf about votes on her. It's not big yet, but it's something I'm noting, especially because my vote is currently also on Polly.

[Negative_Null They/Them]

Ciris walked out of the laboratory where they had been working (definitely not sleeping.) The ardent noticed that they seemed to be late for some kind of meeting, what was going on again? They rifled through their memory, thinking...

Oh yeah, there was a mystery! The group seemed to be discussing philosophy rather than the mystery though, and even though Ciris was an ardent, they weren't that kind of ardent and they were lost pretty quickly.

They raised their hand and said quietly, "I know I'm late, but I think that we should avoid eliminating someone if we can, but it seems TJ already has a lot of votes and I can't change that. I'll vote for  The Unknown Order, since he seems to be  experienced in this kind of espionage, and to maybe force a tie, since I think that's good for the defenders"

(OOC: I usually play pacifist for the first round because I feel it allows for the villagers to get their feet under them and feel out the factions. I mostly understand the custom rules here but I think we'll all see soon how that will impact the game)

 

Edited May 22, 2025 by Negative_Null

[The Unknown Medallion he/him]

1 minute ago, Negative_Null said:

Ciris walked out of the laboratory where they had been working (definitely not sleeping.) The ardent noticed that they seemed to be late for some kind of meeting, what was going on again? They rifled through their memory, thinking...

Oh yeah, there was a mystery! The group seemed to be discussing philosophy rather than the mystery though, and even though Ciris was an ardent, they weren't that kind of ardent and they were lost pretty quickly.

They raised their hand and said quietly, "I know I'm late, but I think that we should avoid eliminating someone if we can, but it seems TJ already has a lot of votes and I can't change that. I'll vote for  The Unknown Order, since they seem to be  experienced in this kind of espionage, and to maybe force a tie, since I think that's good for the defenders"

(OOC: I usually play pacifist for the first round because I feel it allows for the villagers to get their feet under them and feel out the factions. I mostly understand the custom rules here but I think we'll all see soon how that will impact the game)

 

Yeah, actually, do I know you? From like years ago back when I actually participated outside of SE? I recognize your name.

[Negative_Null They/Them]

2 minutes ago, The Unknown Order said:

Yeah, actually, do I know you? From like years ago back when I actually participated outside of SE? I recognize your name.

I was big into roleplay like, 3-4 years ago. Haven't changed my name or profile picture since. If you were part of like, The Fellowship of the Thing era we definitely saw each other

[Kasimir he/him]

I am a simple man. I see RP, I upvote RP

In terms of actual reads: I kind of E!lean TJ, although I agree it's D1 as usual, and it's gonna suck if I'm wrong which is...objectively pretty likely. The more I think about it, the more I don't like his entrance vibes - he's kinda deflecting a bit, I'm not a fan of, especially compared to Striker just owning it.

Striker can keep the V credit for the moment. I want to give Aster credit for the pushback but /shrug as well.

Excluded: Striker, Spirit, Aster, TUN, Penguin, Polly, Triple B

PoE: Anyone not mentioned in the first category.

Edited to add:

I can kinda maybe see TOW being a Citizen (V!TOW for those who aren't used to the shorthand) in a V!TJ world.

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

14 hours ago, |TJ| said:

Also, why is TUA doing his best me-impression from his game? Do you have a secret eliminate yourself win-con???

This is my reason.

Also, I said it was mostly determinism, but that doesn't matter as quantum mechanics is random anyway.

So no free-will. It's all a fabrication. Consciousness is merely a tool Natural Selection gave us.

Also why is everyone voting for me I did nothing wrong. I have a 50% chance of being executed 

EDIT: You know what, I have an idea. We vote so that everyone has one vote, so then in future rounds when we have more information, the votes then can actually change stuff. However, Talinele is selfish and values his survival. So if someone unvotes him, he'll vote for someone who hasn't been voted for.

EDIT 2: I re-read the rules and I have a 100% chance of execution unless the votes change.

Talinele realises that he is doomed as no one around him is awake to take back their accusations. Why, timezone difference?

Edited May 22, 2025 by KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren

[Kasimir he/him]

3 hours ago, KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren said:

Also why is everyone voting for me I did nothing wrong. I have a 50% chance of being executed 

Ties kill everyone involved. There is no 50%. Also I voted TJ so TJ is currently in the lead.

Edited to add:

My bad, I did not actually vote TJ yet. Now I'm gonna think about it

[Negative_Null They/Them]

6 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

Ties kill everyone involved. There is no 50%. Also I voted TJ so TJ is currently in the lead.

Edited to add:

My bad, I did not actually vote TJ yet. Now I'm gonna think about it

Ah, that's not good. So we are forced to kill at least one person a round, then. Maybe I'll change my vote then so we don't have a tie.

Edited May 22, 2025 by Negative_Null

[Kasimir he/him]

4 hours ago, KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren said:

EDIT: You know what, I have an idea. We vote so that everyone has one vote, so then in future rounds when we have more information, the votes then can actually change stuff. However, Talinele is selfish and values his survival. So if someone unvotes him, he'll vote for someone who hasn't been voted for.

I'm trying to decide:

A. If E!TJ is comfortable with carrying three votes on him into the next round.
B. If E!Kaysoh's teammates let him make a suggestion like this.

Edited to add:

Pivot, maybe?

Edited to add 2:

31 minutes ago, Negative_Null said:

Ah, that's not good. So we are forced to kill at least one person a round, then. Maybe I'll change my vote then so we don't have a tie.

Low key wanna slightly give Null mild village points for this. If in Null's head, it was gonna be a tie before this, then E!Null should be flipping a chull.

Edited May 22, 2025 by Kasimir

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

8 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

I'm trying to decide:

A. If E!TJ is comfortable with carrying three votes on him into the next round.
B. If E!Kaysoh's teammates let him make a suggestion like this.

Edited to add:

Pivot, maybe?

Edited to add 2:

Low key wanna slightly give Null mild village points for this. If in Null's head, it was gonna be a tie before this, then E!Null should be flipping a chull.

So... please vote TJ? I don't want to die...

Oh, and votes can be vetoed by Elims, sooo... if TJ's an elim, he might live, depending on whether his team is alright with revealing one of their members.

Of course, the same applies to me. If either of us are elims, you might know next cycle. I'm contemplating Kas being an elim. But I can't worry about that now. I'm going to die...

4 hours ago, KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren said:

EDIT: You know what, I have an idea. We vote so that everyone has one vote, so then in future rounds when we have more information, the votes then can actually change stuff. However, Talinele is selfish and values his survival. So if someone unvotes him, he'll vote for someone who hasn't been voted for.

C'mon, do you seriously think an elim would write this?

[Kasimir he/him]

So here's the thing. Sometimes, individual player tendencies mean they are particularly opposed to dying and it is your first game. At the same time, if a player is particularly opposed to dying and radiating desperation, I also immediately tend to ask why, because in general, it is way worse for an Elim to die than it is for a Villager to die - it hurts your team more.

2 minutes ago, KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren said:

Oh, and votes can be vetoed by Elims, sooo... if TJ's an elim, he might live, depending on whether his team is alright with revealing one of their members.

They get a oneshot Mercy shot, and that still kills you. Vote vetoing doesn't tell us if a player is Elim, it just gives us an IKYK analysis to do.

My problem is I might be leaning to now thinking both of you are Village, in which case I'd want a pivot, but I also have issues because even if a pivot happens, you're both carrying those votes into the next round.

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

11 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

So here's the thing. Sometimes, individual player tendencies mean they are particularly opposed to dying and it is your first game. At the same time, if a player is particularly opposed to dying and radiating desperation, I also immediately tend to ask why, because in general, it is way worse for an Elim to die than it is for a Villager to die - it hurts your team more.

They get a oneshot Mercy shot, and that still kills you. Vote vetoing doesn't tell us if a player is Elim, it just gives us an IKYK analysis to do.

My problem is I might be leaning to now thinking both of you are Village, in which case I'd want a pivot, but I also have issues because even if a pivot happens, you're both carrying those votes into the next round.

Alright. There is 3 and a half hours left.

I'll be leaving in 10 mins and be back in ~1 hour.

So, who is actually awake and online?

EDIT:

I need to know how many votes can be redistributed. @RoyalBeeMage, @StrikerEZ and @IcedOutPenguin voted me. Myself, TJ himself and @ThatOneWorldhopper voted TJ. I can retract my vote if I won't die doing so. 

The fact that TJ didn't vote can mean three things:

• 1) He's village and forgot
• 2) He's elim and forgot
• 3) He's elim and trying to make it seem like he's village by voting himself

I think 2) is unlikely as his team would ensure that he votes.

EDIT 2: Roy lives in South East Asia and should be awake.

Edited May 22, 2025 by KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren

[Negative_Null They/Them]

24 minutes ago, Kasimir said:

Low key wanna slightly give Null mild village points for this. If in Null's head, it was gonna be a tie before this, then E!Null should be flipping a chull.

Aw... thanks? Unless you're secretly an Elim trying to ingratiate yourself with the noobs 

14 minutes ago, KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren said:

So... please vote TJ? I don't want to die...

Oh, and votes can be vetoed by Elims, sooo... if TJ's an elim, he might live, depending on whether his team is alright with revealing one of their members.

Of course, the same applies to me. If either of us are elims, you might know next cycle. I'm contemplating Kas being an elim. But I can't worry about that now. I'm going to die...

C'mon, do you seriously think an elim would write this?

That's also a good point, that we can see who will be saved by the Elims. Regardless, after checking the spreadsheet, I'll keep my vote for Unknown. Sorry, Spren but I can't do anything for you

[KaladinsSenseOfHumourSpren He/Him]

20 hours ago, A Jo in the Bush said:

@KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren Talinele, who hails from somewhere in Russia, Australia, or anywhere in that Latitude, probably.

Where'd you get Russia from? I thought it was obvious the name comes from Talenelat'Elin. They aren't even the same latitude

[Negative_Null They/Them]

5 minutes ago, KaladinsSenseOfHumorSpren said:

Where'd you get Russia from? I thought it was obvious the name comes from Talenelat'Elin. They aren't even the same latitude

I'm sure they meant longitude