Wall Climbing

[Mailliw73]

So, something I've been wondering for a while: does Lift actually climb up Wyndle when she climbs walls in the palace or is that her increasing her friction? Wyndle notes that he doesn't know why she can touch him, but it feels more like the Friction surge to me. Is that her way of understanding what she does?

Edited July 21, 2014 by Mailliw73

[Edgedancer]

I´ve wondered the same thing. My first impulse was also Friction-Surge but Wyndles reaction makes it seem as if it has to do with her condition.

[kaellok]

I´ve wondered the same thing. My first impulse was also Friction-Surge but Wyndles reaction makes it seem as if it has to do with her condition.

Exactly this.

[Kobold King]

I got the impression that she was actually using Wyndle, a spren, to alter the world around her. Which if you think about it is quite a big deal. I mean, from an outside perspective, Lift is climbing a nonexistent vine up a building simply by believing it is there.

At the moment she is only able to manipulate reality very slightly in this manner--it all depends on perception, so climbing up a vine is probably easier than Soulcasting, for instance. But the implications of her having this ability are huge, as Wyndle tries to stress to her.

Edited July 21, 2014 by Kobold King

[Moogle]

It's probably not a use of Friction. Lift doesn't summon her awesomeness when climbs him, and we don't even know if she can become anti-Slick.

 

I think she's just able to touch Wyndle, and because Wyndle is a vine, he actually provides a semi-decent handhold. Combined with the fact that Lift is small and nimble, and she can climb up using him pretty effectively.

[Argent]

I thought the book was rather clear on this - Lift uses Wyndle himself to climb. She, for one reason or another, can either pull him more into the physical realm (because people can occasionally see the "dust" Wyndle's vines turn into), or can reach into the cognitive herself and grab a hold of him there.

 

Wyndle sighed, but obeyed, creeping up the wall in a wide, looping pattern. Lift hopped up, grabbing the small handholds made by the vine, which stuck to the surface by virtue of thousands of branching stems with sticky discs on them. Wyndle wove ahead of her, making a ladder of sorts.

 

Of course, no matter how I manifest, nobody can touch me, as I barely have any substance in this Realm.”

“Nobody but me,” Lift whispered, inching down the hallway.

“You shouldn’t be able to either,” he said, sounding troubled.

 

[Aleksiel]

I thought she used friction, but because she is partly in the Cognitive realm she sees Wyndle as a vine and a not-so-awesome Edgedancer would do the same without realizing they were using their spren and just call if friction. Like surgebinders actually always use their spren when they surgebinding and only Lift can see it. I admit it this is against the Occam's razor and not textually supported either, however it was what I originally thought the first time I read it.

 

The best explanation is she used Wyndle without any surgebinding (she didn't become awesome when climbing as moogle pointed out) and Wyndle wouldn't have commented on her strange ability to touch him otherwise.

 

edit: spelling

Edited July 21, 2014 by Aleksiel

[Newan]

I wonder what it is like when Lift touches other spren.  A vine-like spren is easy to imagine, but what about Pattern?  He's a shifting fractal made of thin lines.  Could Lift grab him?  What would it feel like?  Maybe like a squirmy sea anemone? 

 

If she grabbed onto a flying spren, could it carry her?  Could she wrestle spren into doing her will?  Could she grab onto Stormfather's nose and make him carry her across the continent? 

[Argent]

I don't think Lift can touch any other spren. 

[PeterAhlstrom]

I don't think Lift can touch any other spren. 

I don't actually know the answer, but I wouldn't bet on that.

[Argent]

Times Argent has been correct about stuff: ???

Times Peter has personally quoted Argent's replies and called them (most likely) wrong: 4 (I think? 5? Maybe more?)

 

Being paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you...

---

 

But you are on, Peterman. When I proven right in... Book 6 or something... I don't know. We'll see then. 

[Savanorn]

I got the impression that she was actually using Wyndle, a spren, to alter the world around her. Which if you think about it is quite a big deal. I mean, from an outside perspective, Lift is climbing a nonexistent vine up a building simply by believing it is there.

At the moment she is only able to manipulate reality very slightly in this manner--it all depends on perception, so climbing up a vine is probably easier than Soulcasting, for instance. But the implications of her having this ability are huge, as Wyndle tries to stress to her.

Well, maybe. But I disagree, I think Wyndle exists irrespective of her belief in him, and just as a flamespren or any other spren...and as such she's definitely doing something weird, crossing realms and interacting with something that should have negligible mass and ability to support her. 

 

To me, this is like claiming that Shallan can make people hear Pattern's voice by simply believing he's speaking. 

[Swimmingly]

I'm thinking that what she's doing is something almost identical to what happens when a spren moves more into the Physical, but not so much and in the opposite direction. Through the Nahel bond, spren gain the ability to interact with small things in the Physical realm - soundwaves for Pattern, manipulation of small objects for Syl. She can touch things between the realms - but they have to meet partway. So, I imagine that she has a lot less ability to affect natural spren that don't have much Physical presence, but she can probably grab Nahel spren (or anything that's partway between the Realms) and yank their noses around.

So Stormriding by grabbing the Stormfather's nasal protrusions is a real possibility, given his presence in the Physical - both by Nahel bond and sheer power.

That's why she can climb the wall: Wyndle comes toward her (metaphysically) through the Nahel bond, and she moves toward him with the Nightwatcher's shenanigans. They meet in the middle, still more in the Physical than Cognitive, and climb physical walls together.

[Pathfinder]

I thought it was explained in the book pretty succinctly. Lift interacted with Wyndle's mother who we assume is the Nightwatcher and Lift received a boon. Wyndle comments that what she does by touching him is unusual which states to me that no other edgedancer, or at least it is not COMMON among other edgedancers, regardless if the edgedancer knows what he or she is doing. The boon is that Lift exists partially in the cognitive realm and allows her to metabolize stormlight and interact physically with her spren. 

[Mailliw73]

I guess my biggest issue is that we've never seen Lift blatantly increase her friction. I feel like this May just be the way she interprets it. Since, Wyndle is a vine and she's awesome, she can climb him.

But I also see the other side and I think it may also be a special gift. Though what the curse was, I don't know.

[Lumen]

Can Lift obtain stormlight from outside of herself?  Or can she only manufacture it?  Maybe her curse is that she can only use stormlight that she metabolizes herself (however that works).

[WhiskeyJackDaniels]

The ability to touch spren could be her curse or her boon, I can see it both ways. Obviously it is an advantage being able to touch and climb Wyndle, but when she runs into voidspren it might be a distinct disadvantage that spren can physically touch her.

Same problem with metabolizing food into stormlight, it is advantageous because food should be more prevalent than stormlight, especially during a time like the weeping, but it also seems like a much slower way to get your stormlight, and potentially pretty dangerous to your health.