The biggest challenge facing the new Knights Radiant

[Aleksiel]

There are plenty of men with as much war experience as Adolin has, including darkeyes and bridgemen are supposedly more muscular than he average soldier. All someone had to do is get close enough to Sadeas in order to push him on the ground and stab him. Getting close to Sadeas wasn't impossible, it's not like Adolin hugged him before attacking him. Anyone claiming to be a messenger could have done the same imo, so let's just agree to disagree on this. 

 

edit: spelling

Edited July 4, 2014 by Aleksiel

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

I'm willing to agree to disagree on this, but I do feel like I need to make a few more points before that. On the first point, I agree there's probably as many soldiers who are Adolin's equal in war experience, but Adolin still has advantages over them. First of all, he's more practiced in one on one battles, from his dueling experience. I admit the experience doesn't directly carry over, but fighting in a group against a group is much different than fighting just one opponent. Then, there's the fact that Adolin has been working with a full weapons master since he was 10. That's a huge advantage for anyone, but Adolin's experience is even better considering who that weapons master is. A weapons master that's had hundreds of years to perfect his craft, and is known for using any trick he can to achieve victory. That's where Adolin's advantage comes into play. It's be next to impossible to find any darkeyes who could match Adolin for that reason alone. Maybe even anyone on Roshar.

Also, any darkeyes approaching Sadeas would be very suspicious. Shallan was stopped by guards before she could reach Amaram as a messenger. Even Lighteyes can't just get an audience with Sadeas whenever they please, it would have to be a chance encounter for a Lighteyes to ignore that sort of propriety:

Navani folder her arms impatiently. Perhaps she should have taken a palanquin, as her attending ladies had suggested. Several of them, looking beleaguered, were just arriving at the staging area. A palanquin would be faster in the long run, they had explained, as it would leave time for messengers to be sent so Sadeas could receive her.

WoK 69 Justice

A messenger wouldn't have been able to find Sadeas in that spot either, so the story would be suspicious. The messenger would go to one of Sadeas's officers who would either take the message, or make the messenger wait for them, and Sadeas would most likely not take the message directly from the messenger on his own. He's a Highprince, and above such things. Propriety has its place in Alethi society.

Edit: spelling. I need to just not iuse my phone on these lol.

Edited July 4, 2014 by EMTrevor

[Aleksiel]

The story with the messenger was just an example, may be an alethi soldier could have came up with a better one. Sadeas didn't see Adolin before he showed himself, so the killer could have jumped on Sadeas from the shadows, pushing him onto the ground and killing him.

 

While Adolin definitely had some advantages over common soldiers, he was injured when he killed Sadeas, so he wasn't using his full capacity, thus someone not so practiced could have achieved the same. The skills he used were more wrestling than dueling, and wrestling is considered for lower classes, thus a darkeyes would have had more experience.

[Fatebreaker he/him]

I think Nightblood will probably cause some problems. Wonderfull, hilarious, destructive problems. 

[Shaggai]

But how many of those non-shardbearers would just toss a Shardblade out a window carelessly? If the killer was someone without a Blade, they'd find a way to hide it better, and retrieve it later to bond in secret. Maybe a week sick in bed like Dalinar did. Leaving the Blade there points to a Shardbearer, who'd be the only one who could afford to not care what happens to a Blade, since they already have one. 

But the fact that the killer used a knife points to a non-Shardbearer. Possibly an assassin, one who wouldn't expect to be in any sort of position to retrieve the Blade later. 

[Guest]

I'm willing to agree to disagree on this, but I do feel like I need to make a few more points before that. On the first point, I agree there's probably as many soldiers who are Adolin's equal in war experience, but Adolin still has advantages over them. First of all, he's more practiced in one on one battles, from his dueling experience. I admit the experience doesn't directly carry over, but fighting in a group against a group is much different than fighting just one opponent. Then, there's the fact that Adolin has been working with a full weapons master since he was 10. That's a huge advantage for anyone, but Adolin's experience is even better considering who that weapons master is. A weapons master that's had hundreds of years to perfect his craft, and is known for using any trick he can to achieve victory. That's where Adolin's advantage comes into play. It's be next to impossible to find any darkeyes who could match Adolin for that reason alone. Maybe even anyone on Roshar.

 

 

 

While Adolin definitely had some advantages over common soldiers, he was injured when he killed Sadeas, so he wasn't using his full capacity, thus someone not so practiced could have achieved the same. The skills he used were more wrestling than dueling, and wrestling is considered for lower classes, thus a darkeyes would have had more experience.

 

I have to agree with Aleksiel here. Other soldiers could have taken down Sadeas the way Adolin did it.

 

Adolin has practice in one on one fights, true, but his experience is mostly limited to duels, shows of grandeur and butchery on the battle field. How much wrestling training does he have? Did Zahel really teach him such thing? I was more under the impression he was mostly taught swordsmanship and control of his shards, pretty much like Renarin is currently learning.

 

And he was injured. His right wrist was broken and he was black and blue all over. He had trouble mustering enough strength to plunge the knife into Sadeas. With his left hand alone, he couldn't do it: he had to pull in his injured hand to help. I just cannot believe someone like Teft could not have pull out the same or Rock or Skar or any of the bridgemen! Or any other experienced soldier....

 

However, I do agree with EmTrevor a regular darkeye would have had trouble finding Sadeas and approaching him. I'd like to point out no one knew Sadeas had arrived yet. Adolin stumbled on him by accident. He did not know Sadeas was planning on joining them in Urithiru, let alone he was already there! How could an assassin know? How could anyone planning to kill Sadeas know for that matter? Impossible. It had to be a chance encountered and the way Sadeas was killed suggest a fight.

 

I guess Adolin could get away with it by claiming he was attacked and had to defend himself.... No one would know except Adolin does not strike me as a good liar...

[Pathfinder]

How is this for a conspiracy theory when everyone finds the murder scene. It was Ialai! She arranged the assassination! Before anyone states weight categories, i stress, she ARRANGED the assassination. She would know Sadeus's where a bouts, her seal would allow any "messenger" the ability to get close. Not wanting to share power with a husband who has bungled taking out his chief rival numerous times, she has the motive. She is intelligent, has the resources, the know how, and  the connections to make it happen. Obviously it was not her, but if you want to talk about capabilities of replicating the murder by another person, it practically screams her. 

Edited July 4, 2014 by Pathfinder

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

I think I'm being misunderstood a bit. I'm not trying to say it's not possible for the someone else to have killed Sadeas in such a way, but that it's very unlikely given the circumstances. If I was on the investigation for the murder, here's what I'm presented with: 

A Highprince, and Shardbearer is found dead, with a knife to the eye, seen moments before by both his wife, and soldiers. He's lying face up, knife sticking out of his eyeball. There's obvious trauma to the back of his head. On the wall, there is a strange scrape mark.

 

So, first thing any investigator asks is: is there anyone who would have a reason to kill Highprince Sadeas?

 

Random person: Sadeas was a scumbag, everyone hated him. I can tell you a thousand people who wanted to see the ol' scumbag die. Kinda wish I had done it myself truth be told.
 

Me: Ok...is there anyone who has would want to more than others, or who has been vocal about it lately. 

 

Random Person: The whole Royal Family most likely hates him. They deserted them on the battlefield a bit back. Come to think about it, Prince Adolin just won a duel, it was great you should have been there. four on one! And a darkeyed spearman saved the Prince! But anyhow, after it ends, the King, see, he grants him a favor, anything he wants within the King's power. You know what that Adolin goes and does? Challenges Sadeas to a storming duel for the things he did to them. Brightlord Sadeas managed to sneak away thanks to the spearman saying them things about Brightlord Amaram. 

 

So I talk to Adolin, he claims he was scouting another part of the city, and points to a squad of scouters he was with at the time. I bring them in for questioning.

 

Me: You were with Prince Adolin at the time of Sadeas's death. 

Soldier: We ran into Prince Adolin in another part of the tower sometime that night. It's hard to tell time in the city.

 

Me: Did you notice anything unusual about the Prince?

 

Solider: Well, come to think of it, his uniform was missing the cuffs. I wouldn't notice a thing like that normally, but Prince Adolin is normally perfectly presented. 

Me: I see. Did you happen to see if he had his sideknife on him?

 

Solider: I didn't notice either way sir.

 

 

So, at this point, there's a solid lead, and you can question Adolin again, and ask about the cuffs. Adolin has a Shardblade, he could have scraped the wall, but there's the mystery of Oathbringer. If it is found by someone, and they are caught with it, they'll tell them they found it on a terrace. A terrace with a window above it where the Prince was murdered.  Someone ditched the Shardblade, hoping no one would find it. If they didn't care about the Blade, they'd leave it there for someone else to find, take, and be assumed the killer, or to be taken by the family. But Adolin might do something like that, if he thought it wouldn't be found. 

 

Or maybe no one finds it and it remains a mystery. Adolin is the best lead I'd have, and I'd sure think that the Shardbearer would have to be taken by surprise head on for that sort of fight to happen, and Adolin could do it. Combine that with the lack of a solid alibi, and the mussing cuffs. I'd certainly not be investigating anyone else. 

[Pathfinder]

Only problem with this, is based on the last time the Kholin's have been investigated, it is pretty much guaranteed no soldier will say there was anything unusual about Adolin

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

At the very least it confirms Adolin was on the same level of the tower as Sadeas when he was murdered.

[Aleksiel]

Me: Ok...is there anyone who has would want to more than others, or who has been vocal about it lately. 

 

Random Person: The whole Royal Family most likely hates him. They deserted them on the battlefield a bit back. Come to think about it, Prince Adolin just won a duel, it was great you should have been there. four on one! And a darkeyed spearman saved the Prince! But anyhow, after it ends, the King, see, he grants him a favor, anything he wants within the King's power. You know what that Adolin goes and does? Challenges Sadeas to a storming duel for the things he did to them. Brightlord Sadeas managed to sneak away thanks to the spearman saying them things about Brightlord Amaram. 

 

So I talk to Adolin, he claims he was scouting another part of the city, and points to a squad of scouters he was with at the time. I bring them in for questioning.

 

Me: You were with Prince Adolin at the time of Sadeas's death. 

Soldier: We ran into Prince Adolin in another part of the tower sometime that night. It's hard to tell time in the city.

 

Me: Did you notice anything unusual about the Prince?

 

Solider: Well, come to think of it, his uniform was missing the cuffs. I wouldn't notice a thing like that normally, but Prince Adolin is normally perfectly presented. 

Me: I see. Did you happen to see if he had his sideknife on him?

 

Solider: I didn't notice either way sir.

 

 

Adolin has a motive and the ability, but so did all other soldiers you just questioned and all of them would claim to have been together instead of letting you know about the cuffs and the missing time - when Dalinar's men was questioned about the attempted murder of the king, they didn't say a thing and everyone hates Sadeas and likes their prince. No way you'll get information easy. Now what? 

 

Mind that Adolin's wrist was broken at the time, so it's not obvious whether or not he could have knifed Sadeas. Also, the duel challenge point that the Kholin's wanted to deal with Sadeas in a legal manner. After finding Urithiru, their position is strengthened, Dalinar is no longer considered a mad man and is more or less rehabilitated in society. The Kholin's aren't facing an opposition, Sadeas's greatest ally sided with Dalinar. Overall, from a political view, there no longer are urgent reasons for the Kholins to deal with Sadeas. Adolin is supposed to know that and someone less politically aware is more suitable for a suspect.

[Guest]

Adolin has a motive and the ability, but so did all other soldiers you just questioned and all of them would claim to have been together instead of letting you know about the cuffs and the missing time - when Dalinar's men was questioned about the attempted murder of the king, they didn't say a thing and everyone hates Sadeas and likes their prince. No way you'll get information easy. Now what? 

 

 

I am pretty sure that, if interrogated, most soldiers would lie to protect Adolin... Teft was on guard duty at the wine house, when Sadeas goated Adolin and Adolin responded by claiming he would gut him before all this was over. Afterwards, Teft noted and gave Adolin a sign of respect. If asked about the event in order to prove Adolin has been professing threats to Sadeas, he may very well claimed he never heard such a thing. In fact, I would be surprised if he told the truth.... There is a quote in WoK when Dalinar reflects on Adolin's potential as a future highprince where he thinks on how the men loved his son. Besides, killing Sadeas will turn Adolin into a hero from the common men's perspective. Already, he defeated 4 shardbearers, he won an astronomic number of shards in a short time span, he gave one set to a darkeye, he wins most of his battle, I wouldn't be surprised to see him growing more in fame as the story goes.

 

 

Mind that Adolin's wrist was broken at the time, so it's not obvious whether or not he could have knifed Sadeas. Also, the duel challenge point that the Kholin's wanted to deal with Sadeas in a legal manner. After finding Urithiru, their position is strengthened, Dalinar is no longer considered a mad man and is more or less rehabilitated in society. The Kholin's aren't facing an opposition, Sadeas's greatest ally sided with Dalinar. Overall, from a political view, there no longer are urgent reasons for the Kholins to deal with Sadeas. Adolin is supposed to know that and someone less politically aware is more suitable for a suspect.

 

The wrist may gave him away... I mean, he was not wearing a cast on it, which is strange or maybe it is Roshar does not have the technology to make one. Anyway, it does not look like his wrist was stabilized in any meaningful way. Now, I am not a doctor, but I am pretty sure pushing a knife using force on a broken bone who does not have proper support is not quite good... Especially if the injury is recent (a few days). Bottom line, I wouldn't be surprised to learn he hurt it even more by doing that, which may be suspicious. However, I do not think anyone will think the broken wrist really is enough to stop Adolin from knifing anyone.... not after all the fights he's won recently.

 

The issue I have with someone of lesser rank being the culprit is the fact no one knew Sadeas was actually there. It is impossible for this murder to have been premeditated. It had to be a murder of opportunity and I just cannot see the random soldier passing by, seeing Sadeas and knifing him nor do I believe anyone will think it really happened this way. A soldier of lower rank would plan such an action, it would not act on an impulse, not for something as big as murdering a highprince.

Edited July 5, 2014 by maxal

[Aleksiel]

I am pretty sure that, if interrogated, most soldiers would lie to protect Adolin... Teft was on guard duty at the wine house, when Sadeas goated Adolin and Adolin responded by claiming he would gut him before all this was over. Afterwards, Teft noted and gave Adolin a sign of respect. If asked about the event in order to prove Adolin has been professing threats to Sadeas, he may very well claimed he never heard such a thing. In fact, I would be surprised if he told the truth.... There is a quote in WoK when Dalinar reflects on Adolin's potential as a future highprince where he thinks on how the men loved his son. Besides, killing Sadeas will turn Adolin into a hero from the common men's perspective. Already, he defeated 4 shardbearers, he won an astronomic number of shards in a short time span, he gave one set to a darkeye, he wins most of his battle, I wouldn't be surprised to see him growing more in fame as the story goes.

 

I agree.

 

The wrist may gave him away... I mean, he was not wearing a cast on it, which is strange or maybe it is Roshar does not have the technology to make one. Anyway, it does not look like his wrist was stabilized in any meaningful way. Now, I am not a doctor, but I am pretty sure pushing a knife using force on a broken bone who does not have proper support is not quite good... Especially if the injury is recent (a few days). Bottom line, I wouldn't be surprised to learn he hurt it even more by doing that, which may be suspicious. However, I do not think anyone will think the broken wrist really is enough to stop Adolin from knifing anyone.... not after all the fights he's won recently.

 

It's not like he had a sign saying how bad his wrist was, most people wouldn't know it suddenly got worse.

 

The issue I have with someone of lesser rank being the culprit is the fact no one knew Sadeas was actually there. It is impossible for this murder to have been premeditated. It had to be a murder of opportunity and I just cannot see the random soldier passing by, seeing Sadeas and knifing him nor do I believe anyone will think it really happened this way. A soldier of lower rank would plan such an action, it would not act on an impulse, not for something as big as murdering a highprince.

 

Adolin didn't know, but he wasn't paying attention anyway. Any hired assassin would have had his sources and taken the opportunity. Alas, knife in the eye socket doesn't scream 'professional' murderer.

Edited July 5, 2014 by Aleksiel

[Guest]

It's not like he had a sign saying how bad his wrist was, most people wouldn't know it suddenly got worse.

 

Most people no, but family, yes. What if it does get worse or what if pushing on the knife made the bone moved? Then it would swell, it would hurt and Adolin may try to hide it. If he does not and goes to the surgeon, then he may wonder why is it the wrist he set 5 days ago suddenly got worst? He would ask questions... What have you been doing with that wrist? You were not supposed to use it for anything. Did you put weight on it? No it didn't go bad on its own, you must have done something... The surgeon may talk afterwards on how the prince's injury got worst without any satisfying explanation. Words may get to the wrong people's hears...

 

Or he may try to cover for it. To think naively it'll just heal on its own. Eventually though, it would become apparent it is not healing properly. Dalinar for one is bound to notice and if it occurs during the murder investigation, then Dalinar may start to wonder how is it his son is hiding an aggravated injury.... It's not like if he just bump himself, he broke a bone. If he unset it while wrestling and putting weight on it, it will show at some point. Bones who are not set right do not heal right.

 

Adolin didn't know, but he wasn't paying attention anyway. Any hired assassin would have had his sources and taken the opportunity. Alas, knife in the eye socket doesn't scream 'professional' murderer.

 

Well it is safe to assume the casual darkeye soldier would not know either. As for the professional assassin, I dunno, but I agree the murder does not scream "assassin". Too lowly, too amateur and nobody would send an amateur against Sadeas.

Edited July 5, 2014 by maxal

[Aleksiel]

Most people no, but family, yes. What if it does get worse or what if pushing on the knife made the bone moved? Then it would swell, it would hurt and Adolin may try to hide it. If he does not and goes to the surgeon, then he may wonder why is it the wrist he set 5 days ago suddenly got worst? He would ask questions... What have you been doing with that wrist? You were not supposed to use it for anything. Did you put weight on it? No it didn't go bad on its own, you must have done something... The surgeon may talk afterwards on how the prince's injury got worst without any satisfying explanation. Words may get to the wrong people's hears...

 

Or he may try to cover for it. To think naively it'll just heal on its own. Eventually though, it would become apparent it is not healing properly. Dalinar for one is bound to notice and if it occurs during the murder investigation, then Dalinar may start to wonder how is it his son is hiding an aggravated injury.... It's not like if he just bump himself, he broke a bone. If he unset it while wrestling and putting weight on it, it will show at some point. Bones who are not set right do not heal right.

 

 

Dalinar had so much on his mind, I doubt he knew how good or bad Adolin's wrist was. Adolin can always he was trying to hide how bad it was in order to not worry his family.  

 

Well it is safe to assume the casual darkeye soldier would not know either. As for the professional assassin, I dunno, but I agree the murder does not scream "assassin". Too lowly, too amateur and nobody would send an amateur against Sadeas.

 

It seems lowly, which in favor to Adolin. As a prince, he's supposed to have good self-control and he had nothing political to gain from Sadeas death, and to lighteyes politics is everything.

Edited July 5, 2014 by Aleksiel

[Guest]

Dalinar had so much on his mind, I doubt he knew how good or bad Adolin's wrist was. Adolin can always he was trying to hide how bad it was in order to not worry his family.  

 

Yeah but how can he not notice his son is unable to use his right hand a few weeks after the fight? How can he not noticed him not being able to grab anything, let alone hold his sword? Adolin is not foolish, this is sword hand, a long-term injury to his sword hand must pretty much be one of the worst prospect for a duelist. To try to cover it up has to hide something and Dalinar is really dense if he cannot make the link.

 

I have been reading on broken bones. Basically, for the first two weeks, we are talking swelling and inflammation. It does not start to heal, to mend, until the 4th week or so. Therefore, at the time of the murder, the said wrist was nowhere near heal. If he put weight on it, he must likely disrupt it even more, especially since it was not properly immobilized. If it is badly aligned, it just won't heal or it'll heal wrong. He won't be able to use his hand, for anything.

 

I think we should not underestimate the injury or its guiltiness potential.

 

 

It seems lowly, which in favor to Adolin. As a prince, he's supposed to have good self-control and he had nothing political to gain from Sadeas death, and to lighteyes politics is everything.

 

True. Except that Adolin is known to be brash, impulsive and not to have a good self-control..........

[Aleksiel]

Yeah but how can he not notice his son is unable to use his right hand a few weeks after the fight? How can he not noticed him not being able to grab anything, let alone hold his sword? Adolin is not foolish, this is sword hand, a long-term injury to his sword hand must pretty much be one of the worst prospect for a duelist. To try to cover it up has to hide something and Dalinar is really dense if he cannot make the link.

 

I have been reading on broken bones. Basically, for the first two weeks, we are talking swelling and inflammation. It does not start to heal, to mend, until the 4th week or so. Therefore, at the time of the murder, the said wrist was nowhere near heal. If he put weight on it, he must likely disrupt it even more, especially since it was not properly immobilized. If it is badly aligned, it just won't heal or it'll heal wrong. He won't be able to use his hand, for anything.

 

I think we should not underestimate the injury or its guiltiness potential.

 

Let's not get ahead of the plot, he might be able to use it. After all, he cut his cuffs and used his Blade, so he didn't disable his wrist. When it gets worse, he can always pretend he fell while exploring or injured himself while practicing too soon.

 

 

 

True. Except that Adolin is known to be brash, impulsive and not to have a good self-control..........

 

We know this, because we've been in his head. His public image is different.

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

Adolin has a motive and the ability, but so did all other soldiers you just questioned and all of them would claim to have been together instead of letting you know about the cuffs and the missing time - when Dalinar's men was questioned about the attempted murder of the king, they didn't say a thing and everyone hates Sadeas and likes their prince. No way you'll get information easy. Now what? 

 

I talk to Adolin first, Adolin most likely will not lie, and say that he was in the area, and ran into them later on, but was alone for a small time. I question the soldiers one at a time when it comes time to question them, asking them all specific questions, and making sure the group wasn't allowed together to talk until they'd been questioned separately.  Now the big question is, do any of them tell the truth, and more importantly, are all of them telling the same lie. All it would take is one soldier saying Adolin was with them the whole time, which contradicts Adolin's story, or two soldiers telling contradicting stories, and in present day, I'd say that would qualify enough to detain him on charges of second degree murder. He had the motive, the opportunity, and his alibi isn't holding up under scrutiny, with some attempts to hinder the investigation. That would only make his guilt more apparent, which is something Dalinar himself worried about in that scenario you referenced, and he wasn't even guilty. 

[Aleksiel]

I talk to Adolin first, Adolin most likely will not lie, and say that he was in the area, and ran into them later on, but was alone for a small time. I question the soldiers one at a time when it comes time to question them, asking them all specific questions, and making sure the group wasn't allowed together to talk until they'd been questioned separately.  Now the big question is, do any of them tell the truth, and more importantly, are all of them telling the same lie. All it would take is one soldier saying Adolin was with them the whole time, which contradicts Adolin's story, or two soldiers telling contradicting stories, and in present day, I'd say that would qualify enough to detain him on charges of second degree murder. He had the motive, the opportunity, and his alibi isn't holding up under scrutiny, with some attempts to hinder the investigation. That would only make his guilt more apparent, which is something Dalinar himself worried about in that scenario you referenced, and he wasn't even guilty. 

 

Going directly to Adolin would be a great insult, I'm doubtful if it'll be socially acceptable. Who would dare to point a finger at the son of (probably) the most powerful men in Roshar? Lighteyes are about appearance and reputation and Adolin's is spotless so far. Considering their stereotypes, I'm doubtful anyone except Ialai and Dalinar would dare to suggest this.

 

Sadeas's men (and wife) would be denied the right to question Kholin men like last time. There's no acting Highprince of Information, any Kholin men taking the investigation would be ridiculous and no doubt rejected. Who'd take the investigation and would do that person think of Adolin and Sadeas's murder? Kind of hard to find a neutral highprince for this job. Surely Ialai would be against any ally of Dalinar taking over it and Dalinar wouldn't let Sadeas's men in his camp questioning his men; it's a matter of principle. 

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

I find it hard to believe Dalinar would interfere with the investigation. With the man he is, and the relationship he had with Sadeas before Gavilar's death, he might head the investigation himself. I would think these "matters of principle" would not mean nearly as much once it's murder and not attempted murder. That kind of resistance would be a political nightmare. It would pretty much validate any lie Sadeas was telling, turn him into a martyr, and make it seem like a political assassination.

[Guest]

We know this, because we've been in his head. His public image is different.

 

Is it really? How is it Sadeas called him in WoK again? A firebrand? He laugh at Dalinar's legacy since he has one useless son and one son who cannot control himself. We have other quotes from Sadeas and Ialai where they think of Adolin in such terms: impulsive, brash, little self-control. All the other young lighteyes seem to take pleasure trying to push Adolin's buttons as well. Like when Reshi (or Reki I cannor remember their names correctly, but the two cousins from Ruthar's house) asked Adolin if Dalinar had start spoiling himself yet due to his increased senility just to provoke a reaction and probably forfeit the duel his cousin just agreed to do.

 

I would think Adolin reputation in the matter is quite done. They know his weakness, they know if they goat him enough they may shatter his self-control, especially is Dalinar and Renarin are not around.

 

 

Going directly to Adolin would be a great insult, I'm doubtful if it'll be socially acceptable. Who would dare to point a finger at the son of (probably) the most powerful men in Roshar? Lighteyes are about appearance and reputation and Adolin's is spotless so far. Considering their stereotypes, I'm doubtful anyone except Ialai and Dalinar would dare to suggest this.

 

Sadeas's men (and wife) would be denied the right to question Kholin men like last time. There's no acting Highprince of Information, any Kholin men taking the investigation would be ridiculous and no doubt rejected. Who'd take the investigation and would do that person think of Adolin and Sadeas's murder? Kind of hard to find a neutral highprince for this job. Surely Ialai would be against any ally of Dalinar taking over it and Dalinar wouldn't let Sadeas's men in his camp questioning his men; it's a matter of principle. 

 

I agree they wouldn't question Adolin right away nor would they have the right to questions the Kohlin's men. In fact, asking to question the Kohlin's men would be a direct insult to Dalinar as it would mean they suspect one of theirs. It could also be Sadeas was murdered by one of his own....... it is not like he was well loved... everyone despised him...

 

However, Ialai may suspect something. She is clever. She would know a direct interrogation such as EmTrevor suggest would not work.

 

Now, if I were her, if I suspected young impulsive Adolin to be the culprit, then I would work a much different plan. I would have him followed, discretely. I am Ialai, I have those resources: I run an imposing spy network. I try to take note of every single quip or anomaly. I would bring in people just to taunt and goat Adolin, try to make him act impulsively, try to make talk too much. I would try to get him drunk or drug or anything to loosen his tongue. I would gather every single clues until I have a strong case and then, I would proceed to a public arrestation, right in front of Dalinar, just to psite him

 

Providing I could not gather enough or sufficient proof, I would just work to destroy him. Send in my assassins. Or put him up into another duel, one I am sure he won't win... Or if this is not possible, I would work for an "accident" on the battle field: have one of my men shoot him incognito with a shardbow or something.

 

Bottom line is, a direct interrogation of the Kohlin's men would not be my master plan and it may give out my play. Accusing the son of one of the most powerful person on Roshar, a prince nonetheless, third in line for the throne, is no small feet. I wouldn't want anyone to know my end game until everything is in place.

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

Sadeas died in a part of the tower that was being explored. Kholin men are responsible for the exploration, and Adolin is in command of those men. Even if he were not a suspect, there's no way he wouldn't be questioned. He's the one that would be able to tell you scouting party assignments, who was where, which will be absolutely crucial in an investigation like this. Yes, Sadeas was well liked, that doesn't make people forget the fact that there is a murderer among them, or less wary of that fact. I don't see how they couldn't question one of theirs, or why it would be an insult to them. It wasn't an insult for Sadeas to question his men during the investigation regarding the hunt. All those men would be questioned whether or not they were suspects, merely because they were on the same level as Sadeas during the time of the murder! This seems ridiculous to me: "These soldiers might have seen something, but I don't want to step on anyone's toes by asking them legitimate questions relating to their duties and actions that date."

[Guest]

Sadeas died in a part of the tower that was being explored. Kholin men are responsible for the exploration, and Adolin is in command of those men. Even if he were not a suspect, there's no way he wouldn't be questioned. He's the one that would be able to tell you scouting party assignments, who was where, which will be absolutely crucial in an investigation like this. Yes, Sadeas was well liked, that doesn't make people forget the fact that there is a murderer among them, or less wary of that fact. I don't see how they couldn't question one of theirs, or why it would be an insult to them. It wasn't an insult for Sadeas to question his men during the investigation regarding the hunt. All those men would be questioned whether or not they were suspects, merely because they were on the same level as Sadeas during the time of the murder! This seems ridiculous to me: "These soldiers might have seen something, but I don't want to step on anyone's toes by asking them legitimate questions relating to their duties and actions that date."

 

But there probably were other people roaming around, not just the scouting party.... And I didn't get Adolin was the one directly in charge of it. If he were, he would not have wandered off alone... I mean, if he were leading them, they would be following him, right? I was under the impression he was trailing behind, lost in his thoughts, and then took a wrong turn, then another and he ended alone, which suited his mood.

[Fifth of Daybreak he/him]

But there probably were other people roaming around, not just the scouting party.... And I didn't get Adolin was the one directly in charge of it. If he were, he would not have wandered off alone... I mean, if he were leading them, they would be following him, right? I was under the impression he was trailing behind, lost in his thoughts, and then took a wrong turn, then another and he ended alone, which suited his mood.

 

With other people roaming around, that seems all the more reason to question all of the scouting parties. They are the ones best suited to eliminating suspects off the list. 

Adolin is in command of the exploration efforts entirely, not just the one partrol:

 

 

Inside, voices echoed in the grand hall and lights bobbed as people explored, Adolin had take command of that endeavor, while Navani set up a camp to see to the wounded and to measure supplies.

WoR 87 The Riddens

 

 

Adolin will also be a big part of eliminating suspects, as he's in charge of where the scouting parties should be at what time. The responsibility ultimately falls on the Lighteyes, because it's their job to lead, so Adolin would take flak for this, even if he hadn't committed it, because it happened under his command.

[Guest]

With other people roaming around, that seems all the more reason to question all of the scouting parties. They are the ones best suited to eliminating suspects off the list. 

Adolin is in command of the exploration efforts entirely, not just the one partrol:

 

 

 

Adolin will also be a big part of eliminating suspects, as he's in charge of where the scouting parties should be at what time. The responsibility ultimately falls on the Lighteyes, because it's their job to lead, so Adolin would take flak for this, even if he hadn't committed it, because it happened under his command.

Forgot about that quote. I thought Navani had taken charge. My mistake. I guess yeah it would make sense to interrogate him, providing it does not break the protocol. Lighteyes are skirmish about such things. I wonder is Adolin would be able to get away with lies... He does not strike as a good liar. I am more under the impression he would messed up in his story at some point.