CMac716 Posted March 13, 2023 Posted March 13, 2023 I just finished my third play-through of the WoK. My focus was trying to piece together the important 'big picture' stuff. First, we have Kabsal. The odd man out for Ghostbloods we've seen. Virtually every other one has had access to some sort of invested arts. Lin Davar may or may not have been a member, but his steward definitely was and had the Soulcaster fabrial. Kabsal however, just seems to be a random guy that's halfway decent at infiltration. Second, Tanavast... In Dalinar's last seen vision, his first, he sees a figure that claims to be the Almighty. The problem? He's wearing all gold and claimed to have created mankind. We know humanity wasn't created by Honor as the Roshar system was populated before him and Cultivation ever showed up. Gold is also Odium's color, Honor uses Vlue everywhere else. Why the gold, and why claim to have created mankind? I'm not saying it's Odium influencing things, but it doesn't seem like the Almighty either.
Stick The Savant Posted March 13, 2023 Posted March 13, 2023 I don't think that there is any need for ghost bloods to use invested arts. It is probably a pretty good qualification, but definitely not needed. The part about seeing the almighty could be referring to Adonalsium. But I'm not sure. The Storm Father has been wrong in the past
CMac716 Posted March 13, 2023 Author Posted March 13, 2023 I'm not saying ghostbloods have to bee invested individuals, I'm just saying that all confirmed members we've seen have been, except Kabsal. The Ado connection I could absolutely see. He did make this planet specially, gotta have some deeper connection to it.
alder24 Posted March 13, 2023 Posted March 13, 2023 41 minutes ago, CMac716 said: Second, Tanavast... In Dalinar's last seen vision, his first, he sees a figure that claims to be the Almighty. The problem? He's wearing all gold and claimed to have created mankind. We know humanity wasn't created by Honor as the Roshar system was populated before him and Cultivation ever showed up He didn't claim to create humanity, he told "The one you call the Almighty, the creator of mankind.". Poeple call him that, he didn't. It's just a religion title people gave him. People call him that, he didn't. It's just religion title. The problem with Odium interfering in early Dalinar's vision is that Stromfather would know this. Odium's interventions were very brutal and straightforward. Stormfather would notice it. 36 minutes ago, CMac716 said: I'm not saying ghostbloods have to bee invested individuals, I'm just saying that all confirmed members we've seen have been, except Kabsal. Mraize? Iyatil? Other members that were sometimes in proximity of Mraize when meeting Shallan? We don't have enough information about Roshar's group to know how many of the use invested arts, most seem to not. 2
CMac716 Posted March 13, 2023 Author Posted March 13, 2023 6 minutes ago, alder24 said: Mraize? Iyatil? Other members that were sometimes in proximity of Mraize when meeting Shallan? We don't have enough information about Roshar's group to know how many of the use invested arts, most seem to not. Mraize has at least got an Aviar and Iyatil will have medallions at the bare minimum. The rest we didn't get a good enough look at to say any which way. It just seems strange to me that such a secretive group would invite people in unless they would be really useful. Also, iirc, the carriage gets burned to ashes in the middle of a downpour. This could easily be a clue they didn't use normal means. The whole Tanavast/Honor vs 'The one you call Almighty' thing really bothers me for some reason... like, it's always said that way. Even Odium refers to him that way. 'The one you call Almighty.' Are we just saying that the Almighty is Ado and people have simply given the incorrect name to Honor? Or that those in the know refer to him that way to point out that the person they're talking to is ignorant of mankind's real origins?
alder24 Posted March 13, 2023 Posted March 13, 2023 14 minutes ago, CMac716 said: Mraize has at least got an Aviar and Iyatil will have medallions at the bare minimum. The rest we didn't get a good enough look at to say any which way. It just seems strange to me that such a secretive group would invite people in unless they would be really useful. Mraize and Aviar yes, We've never seen Iyatil use metallions in any way so we shouldn't just assume she uses them. Why would they need regular, unpowered people in their ranks? To do the dirty job. Not killings, but spying. Sending someone in the middle of nowhere just to observe one person and collect information on him for years. Guards in a safe house? There were a few of them when Veil visited them first. You need people like this who would do dirty, hard work, that isn't worthy to sacrifice their invested personal. 19 minutes ago, CMac716 said: The whole Tanavast/Honor vs 'The one you call Almighty' thing really bothers me for some reason... like, it's always said that way. Even Odium refers to him that way. 'The one you call Almighty.' Are we just saying that the Almighty is Ado and people have simply given the incorrect name to Honor? Or that those in the know refer to him that way to point out that the person they're talking to is ignorant of mankind's real origins? I see no problem with it at all. It's just religion, that's it. People like to give fancy names to gods. Braize is named damnation, Ashyn is heaven. It's just a name that developed during thousands of years of religion's existence. So it's the second option, people are ignorant, they like to give more to their god than he is capable of. 2
Sky Breaker Posted March 13, 2023 Posted March 13, 2023 Iyatil doesn’t have invested arts and idk if codenames has any powers
CMac716 Posted March 13, 2023 Author Posted March 13, 2023 Codnames definitely has something. Elantris was first chronologically, she would need some kind of help getting to this time. Iyatil having nothing strains credulity, though I will concede that we haven't seen anything on screen. She's the highest ranking member on Roshar (likely one of the highest in the organization) and comes from a nation/planet with guaranteed ways of getting the arts. I highly doubt Kel would send her off-world with such a task without something. They don't need to bring people into the Ghostbloods for simple stuff. They could just as easily hire mercenaries/specialists and not have to give up any of their secrets or risk exposing themselves. They've said that they're too small to operate in the open like that.
cometaryorbit Posted March 14, 2023 Posted March 14, 2023 17 hours ago, CMac716 said: Codnames definitely has something. Elantris was first chronologically, she would need some kind of help getting to this time. That's not quite clear, for several reasons... - Elantris's place in the timeline may not be fixed until the sequels are written, it might be moved up closer to "current" time. - Sel is probably quite time dilated since there is so much Investiture (two Shards' worth) stuck in its Cognitive. So hundreds of years might pass elsewhere but only 20 on Sel. - We don't know how people like Khriss and the Seventeenth Shard (Demoux, Baon etc) prolong their lives. Is it slowed aging from Investiture (like what Breath does), or is it something more external like spending time in highly time dilated areas or having their age reset through Connection manipulation (in which case the individuals themselves might not be especially Invested)? -- Rosharan Ghostbloods might be their own thing, almost semi-rogue. Their hiring criteria might not be the same as Kelsier's; probably aren't, IMO. 2
StanLemon Posted March 14, 2023 Posted March 14, 2023 (edited) Iyatil likely has A-Pewter or F-Steel considering she was able to outrun Amaram, someone who is likely reasonably fit and has a longer stride. Conclusive? By no means, but likely Edited March 14, 2023 by StanLemon 1
alder24 Posted March 14, 2023 Posted March 14, 2023 20 minutes ago, StanLemon said: Iyatil likely has A-Pewter or F-Steel considering she was able to outrun Amaram, someone who is likely reasonably fit and has a longer stride. Conclusive? By no means, but likely Nah, Amaran didn't even move, he just shouted and reached with his hand starting to summon his Shardblade, that was enough for Iyatil to run away. He never ran after her.
StanLemon Posted March 14, 2023 Posted March 14, 2023 11 minutes ago, alder24 said: Nah, Amaran didn't even move, he just shouted and reached with his hand starting to summon his Shardblade, that was enough for Iyatil to run away. He never ran after her. No he chased after her Quote He cried out, reaching his hand to the side, summoning his Blade. Too slow. The figure looked from him to the Herald, then scuttled away with a soft curse. Amaram chased after, leaping the rubble of the wall and breaking out into light, but the figure was moving too quickly.
alder24 Posted March 14, 2023 Posted March 14, 2023 1 minute ago, StanLemon said: No he chased after her I've missed that part
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