Yumiya Posted August 4, 2022 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 50 minutes ago, Rabbit Unmade said: Does it ever say the radiant recording stuff on the emerald was a Truthwatcher though? Emeralds are the Truthwatcher polestone. It is thought the stones in the library related to the order of the person recording. Of the stones we see, only two orders are missing. Bondsmith and edgedancer. This lines up with one of the recordings: Quote "The Edgedancers are too busy relocating the tower's servants and farmers to send a representative to record their thoughts in these gemstones. I'll do it for them, then. They are the ones who will be most displaced by this decision. The Radiants will be taken in by nations, but what of all these people now without homes?" Also, one of the other emeralds has this quote: Quote "I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers." Maybe the Truthwatchers had noticed some of their order being corrupted. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbit Unmade Posted August 4, 2022 Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 Ah, okay. I guess that makes sense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted August 4, 2022 Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 17 hours ago, Nameless said: We don't even know that the stigma against futuresight ran that deeply back in the day. Modern-day Vorinism has mangled quite a few things. We do in fact know it existed back then, because in one of the Visions Honor says "to see the future is forbidden." 17 hours ago, Nameless said: This epigraph from WoR: What other powers are there on Roshar besides Surges? Shards being splintered can have dramatic effects on the landscape. In fact if I've heard correct, back when the Shattered plains were in Dragonsteel they were the location of the Shattering of Adonalsium. 17 hours ago, Nameless said: No, he said it was about as useful as that for everyone besides a Bondsmith, who can manipulate them.. That's not what he said at all. Melishi never implied that they could be manipulated. 17 hours ago, Nameless said: Honor is about oaths. Not about needlessly binding everything. He is very much about restrictions. 17 hours ago, Nameless said: Again, source? Dawnshards are dangerous, yes, but necessary for planetary destruction? I dunno about that. 17 hours ago, Nameless said: Because it's not capable of planetary destruction while bound. Dawnshards we're necessary for the greatest feats of Surgebinding. What greater feat has ever been accomplished than the Cataclysm of Ashyn? And additionally what planet has ever been destroyed without the Dawnshards? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NameIess Posted August 4, 2022 Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 1 minute ago, Frustration said: We do in fact know it existed back then, because in one of the Visions Honor says "to see the future is forbidden." We don't know that the stigma was so deeply ingrained in society that any mention of predicting the future is completely taboo. 6 minutes ago, Frustration said: Shards being splintered can have dramatic effects on the landscape. In fact if I've heard correct, back when the Shattered plains were in Dragonsteel they were the location of the Shattering of Adonalsium. That's non-canon currently, and I doubt Honor's shattering had that effect. 8 minutes ago, Frustration said: That's not what he said at all. Melishi never implied that they could be manipulated. The Stormfather did: Quote "the Connection exists, but isn't something that can necessarily be exploited. At least not by most people. A Bondsmith though..." RoW ch. 66 p. 769 And seeing Connections is part of a Bondsmith's ability to manipulate them. 14 minutes ago, Frustration said: He is very much about restrictions. Evidence? 14 minutes ago, Frustration said: Dawnshards we're necessary for the greatest feats of Surgebinding. What greater feat has ever been accomplished than the Cataclysm of Ashyn? The creation of Scadrial? Basically any act of a Shard? 15 minutes ago, Frustration said: And additionally what planet has ever been destroyed without the Dawnshards? Do we know that they used the Dawnshards to destroy Ashyn? Why is Dalinar considered so dangerous by literally everyone who knows what a Bondsmith can do? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted August 4, 2022 Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 9 minutes ago, Nameless said: We don't know that the stigma was so deeply ingrained in society that any mention of predicting the future is completely taboo. When the guy the entire planet believes to be God says "this is forbidden" I would expect it to be an even bigger stigma than it is currently. 10 minutes ago, Nameless said: That's non-canon currently, and I doubt Honor's shattering had that effect. But you recognize the possibility? 11 minutes ago, Nameless said: The Stormfather did: And seeing Connections is part of a Bondsmith's ability to manipulate them. Notice how he trails off. He isn't certain of that conclusion. Melishi could see the lines, but was unable to use them. Therefore it is possible to only be able to see them. 13 minutes ago, Nameless said: Evidence? That's one of the core themes of the Skybreakers. A order so aligned with Honor their spren often argue that they are the closest to him. Notum saying that there won't be enough checks on Kaladins power now that Honor is dead in Oathbringer. Multiple spren saying that Honorblades are dangerous because they aren't bound etc. 14 minutes ago, Nameless said: The creation of Scadrial? Basically any act of a Shard? Yes and those were totally done with Surgebinding. 16 minutes ago, Nameless said: Do we know that they used the Dawnshards to destroy Ashyn? What greater feat has Surgebinding ever done? 17 minutes ago, Nameless said: Why is Dalinar considered so dangerous by literally everyone who knows what a Bondsmith can do? Does anyone other than the Stormfather consider it dangerous? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NameIess Posted August 4, 2022 Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 Just now, Frustration said: When the guy the entire planet believes to be God says "this is forbidden" I would expect it to be an even bigger stigma than it is currently. I disagree. They'd have a more accurate stigma, based around actual futuresight instead of anything that looks sort of like futuresight. 5 minutes ago, Frustration said: But you recognize the possibility? Yeah, but I think unbound Surgebinding is the more likely option. 6 minutes ago, Frustration said: Notice how he trails off. He isn't certain of that conclusion. Melishi could see the lines, but was unable to use them. Therefore it is possible to only be able to see them. Was Melishi unable to use them? He bound Ba-Ado-Mishram. 7 minutes ago, Frustration said: That's one of the core themes of the Skybreakers. A order so aligned with Honor their spren often argue that they are the closest to him. Notum saying that there won't be enough checks on Kaladins power now that Honor is dead in Oathbringer. Multiple spren saying that Honorblades are dangerous because they aren't bound etc. Skybreakers are not about restrictions, they are about following a code. Honor wanted to protect Roshar from unbound Surges, thus he bound them. Futuresight is not really that dangerous. 15 minutes ago, Frustration said: What greater feat has Surgebinding ever done? Depending on your definition of Surgebinding, the shattering of Adonalsium or the creation of Roshar both qualify. 17 minutes ago, Frustration said: Does anyone other than the Stormfather consider it dangerous? Odium. Basically every spren that talks about unbound surges. In other words, anyone who knows what a Bondsmith can really do generally comments on it, besides maybe Hoid. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cometaryorbit Posted August 4, 2022 Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 (edited) I think in the Dragonsteel Prime sample chapters, the Shattered Plains were due to the non-dragonsteel-infused rock eroding (leaving canyons) while the Dragonsteel-infused rock didn't erode (leaving plateaus). That's pre-Shattering anyway so it can't be a scar from the Shattering of Adonalsium. -- I don't think Dalinar now could connect a planet to the sun, but that kind of thing might not be out of scope: Khriss calls Ashyn "the burning planet" in a roughly Stormlight era essay in AU, ~8000 Earth years after the cataclysm: even Unbound Cohesion nuclear fission wouldn't leave a planet burning that long after the fact: cratered yes, radioactive possibly (depending on what was fissioned/what isotopes were created), but not still on fire. -- There's a WoB that the Dawncities and Shattered Plains are beyond what regular Radiant Surgebinding can do but not beyond Surgebinding in general. It's not 100% confirmation but imo a pretty strong implication. Edited August 4, 2022 by cometaryorbit 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmcclure7 Posted August 4, 2022 Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 On 8/3/2022 at 3:27 PM, Nameless said: No, the epigraph could just be a Truthwatcher saying "You know, I really should have said this earlier, but I predicted that chaining Ba-Ado-Mishram would have terrible effects like this, and I stayed quiet because I knew if I said anything we probably wouldn't do it, so I didn't, and now I feel really guilty." Why would Honor keep Truthwatchers from having futuresight? Because see the future is voidbinding and it was confirmed in RoW that uncorrupted truth watchers can't. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NameIess Posted August 4, 2022 Report Share Posted August 4, 2022 35 minutes ago, bmcclure7 said: Because see the future is voidbinding and it was confirmed in RoW that uncorrupted truth watchers can't. That is my argument. Honor has no reason to restrict futuresight from ordinary Truthwatchers if it is a natural part of their powerset. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmcclure7 Posted August 5, 2022 Report Share Posted August 5, 2022 3 hours ago, Nameless said: That is my argument. Honor has no reason to restrict futuresight from ordinary Truthwatchers if it is a natural part of their powerset. And he can't now anyways beening dead. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NameIess Posted August 5, 2022 Report Share Posted August 5, 2022 9 hours ago, bmcclure7 said: And he can't now anyways beening dead. Yes, although given that we haven’t really seen many normal Truthwatchers on screen that doesn’t prove much. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmcclure7 Posted August 5, 2022 Report Share Posted August 5, 2022 3 hours ago, Nameless said: Yes, although given that we haven’t really seen many normal Truthwatchers on screen that doesn’t prove much. We do in rhythm of war. And it sepacifically says That his illumination is different from their's. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NameIess Posted August 5, 2022 Report Share Posted August 5, 2022 2 hours ago, bmcclure7 said: We do in rhythm of war. And it sepacifically says That his illumination is different from their's. I agree with you. I’m just stating @Frustration and the other’s arguments. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Stormuncle Posted September 27, 2022 Report Share Posted September 27, 2022 Do we know exactly what spren corruption is, and the extent to which Sja-Anat corrupts spren? I just view it as her changing them to be more attuned to Odium. Do they fully become Odium Spren? Could they stop somewhere in the middle, and become the first War Spren? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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