The Oathgates (Spoilers)

[Zenith]

So, let's talk about the Oathgates, more specifically, Kholinar's Oathgate (kept out of the title to avoid spoilers). I think we've seen this Oathgate on screen, in Lhan's interlude.

On the very first page, they pass through a room called the "Circle of Memories".

 

 

They passed into the Circle of Memories, a round room with ten lamps on the walls, one for each of the ancient Epoch Kingdoms. An eleventh lamp represented the Tranquiline Halls, and a large ceremonial keyhole set into the wall represented the need for ardents to ignore borders, and look only at the hearts of men...or something like that.

 

We also know that the dais upon which Kholinar's palace and royal temple were built was an oathgate

 

 

Now that he saw those pillars from this perspective, he recognized that there was one of them in Kholinar. It made up the dais upon which the palace and royal temple had been built.

 

 

So, it's very probably that the "Circle of Memories" is actually an Oathgate, and I'm willing to bet that the keyhole has something to do with unlocking the Oathgate. The eleventh lamp might also mess things up, but we don't know enough about the Oathgates to know how much it would affect one.

 

Thoughts? Additional quotations for/against this theory are welcome.

 

Quick edit: According to the Coppermind, there's a Kharbranthian oath that goes "Vedeldev's golden keys". This may or may not have relation do the Oathgates...

Edited April 28, 2014 by Zenith

[A Joe in the Bush]

THe living Shardblades were the keys. And good catch! I agree with this Idea. Have an Upvote.

[RShara]

Yep, the entire royal palace and temple are on the Oathgate's dais.  They're locked somehow, though and can't seem to be opened from the Urithiru side for sure, and probably from the Kholinar side (I believe Jasnah tried).  Shallan's Blade didn't open it from the Urithiru side, and we don't know if Jasnah had a Shardblade at the time that she tried the Kholinar side.

[Zenith]

I'm personally of the opinion that each gate takes a certain herald or order to open, but the thing about Vedeledev's keys has me thinking...

[Meg]

Yep, the entire royal palace and temple are on the Oathgate's dais.

This is obvious once one finished WoR.

 

They're locked somehow, though and can't seem to be opened from the Urithiru side for sure, and probably from the Kholinar side (I believe Jasnah tried).

This sentence I don't fully understand.

From Jasnah's notes (iirc) we now that the Oathgates are locked somehow. We don't know whether Jasnah figured how the Oathgate works (and if yes, if she was bound to Ivory that strong that he would have served her as Shardblade). So we don't know whether the Oathgate in Kholinar could be used.

I reread the last chapters of WoR and didn't find a explicit statement that there had been tries to use the other Oathgates. It's strongly implied that this happened (why else should Dalinar ask Kaladin to go to Kholinar when returning from Hearthstone, if the Oathgate there were to use).

 

I'm personally of the opinion that each gate takes a certain herald or order to open, but the thing about Vedeledev's keys has me thinking...

I don't believe that there were such a restriction, but that's only my gut feeling.

And as for Vedeledev's golden keys: I don't see any connection. Kabsal used that when he asked Shallan whether her skill with the pencil was taught by Jasnah. Aside from this: we never saw any golden Shardblade and the keyhole seems to be of the same material that the Blades.

[A Joe in the Bush]

I reread the last chapters of WoR and didn't find a explicit statement that there had been tries to use the other Oathgates. It's strongly implied that this happened (why else should Dalinar ask Kaladin to go to Kholinar when returning from Hearthstone, if the Oathgate there were to use).

 

Dalinar mentioned Shallan attempting to use the Kholinar Oathgate, and failing. it seems likely that the KR in each city locked their Gates on the Recreance, but the Order that didn't leave left their gate in Stormseat open.

[Aleksiel]

I wonder why the gate on the Shattered Plains was opened. Szeth seemed to know about it, so did he somehow opened it with the Honorblade? Perhaps it will be the key to opening the rest of the gates when regular Shardblades have failed to do so.

[hoser]

This is obvious ...

I reread the last chapters of WoR and didn't find a explicit statement that there had been tries to use the other Oathgates. It's strongly implied that this happened (why else should Dalinar ask Kaladin to go to Kholinar when returning from Hearthstone, if the Oathgate there were to use).

...

In Chapter 89:

Shallan hoped to figure out how to use the others, though their tests right now showed them to be locked somehow.  If she managed to make them work, the world would become ...

I don't know how you test them without trying, but they do seem to have explicitly tested at least some of the other Oathgates in addition to reading Jasnah's notes. 

[Meg]

In Chapter 89:

I don't know how you test them without trying, but they do seem to have explicitly tested at least some of the other Oathgates in addition to reading Jasnah's notes. 

 

Many thanks! and an upvote for you!

[Swimmingly]

It seems like the room has been highly ornamented, what with the extra lamp and the gold on the keyhole. However, I'm wondering if something made of the same material as the Blade-guards blocks the Oathgate keyhole?

[Meg]

Uhm, what a golden keyhole?

[A Joe in the Bush]

The Keyhole in Kholinar, where you put the Shardblade in to activate the Oathgate. They Gilded it probably.

[Zenith]

And as for Vedeledev's golden keys: I don't see any connection. Kabsal used that when he asked Shallan whether her skill with the pencil was taught by Jasnah. Aside from this: we never saw any golden Shardblade and the keyhole seems to be of the same material that the Blades.

To be fair, the context in which it's used has no real bearing on the meaning. You do bring a good point with the keyhole, and I say I have no real answer to that except that we haven't seen all the honorblades

 

It seems like the room has been highly ornamented, what with the extra lamp and the gold on the keyhole. However, I'm wondering if something made of the same material as the Blade-guards blocks the Oathgate keyhole?

Ooh, that's a good thought. I wonder what it takes to break some of this stuff...I don't think it'd be very easy, or at least much harder than breaking Shardplate.

[potato]

I wonder why the gate on the Shattered Plains was opened. Szeth seemed to know about it, so did he somehow opened it with the Honorblade? Perhaps it will be the key to opening the rest of the gates when regular Shardblades have failed to do so.

I'm assuming that Stormseat was Taln's, and thus unlockable when he died and his Blade went with.

[Meg]

I don't see any connection between the Heralds and (the functioning of) the Oathgates. Though the Oathgates were made prior to Aharietiam the Knights Radiant continued to exist and apparently made "good money" with those Oathgates, as the following Epigraph from Chapter 46 from The Way of Kings implies:

 

“Though I was due for dinner in Veden City that night, I insisted upon visiting Kholinar to speak with Tivbet. The tariffs through Urithiru were growing quite unreasonable. By then, the so-called Radiants had already begun to show their true nature.”

Anymore -- just to be said, even if it's not directly connected to this topic -- this complaint hints at the upcoming event of the Recreance.

On the other side I can see the Orders blocking "their" Oathgates as part of the Recreance. And if really one Order didn't leave their duty, this might have been the Order in charge for the Oathgate in Stormseat. Then over the centuries this Order died out and the Oathgate was forgotten.

[potato]

Perhaps Vedel's branch of the KR had taken the Honorblades and used them to control the Oathgates and trade. That would explain the phrase about golden keys. Idk, I'm just convinced that the Heralds, the Dawncities, and the Oathgates are connected. Sorry if I'm getting of topic with my suppositions.

[Zenith]

On the other side I can see the Orders blocking "their" Oathgates as part of the Recreance. And if really one Order didn't leave their duty, this might have been the Order in charge for the Oathgate in Stormseat. Then over the centuries this Order died out and the Oathgate was forgotten.

There's another good though. What if Stormseat was the Oathgate for the Bondsmiths, and for some reason that has to do with the Recreance, the Bondsmiths were all dead, and unable to lock their Oathgate? Or, a step further, what if the Recreance was a direct result of the Bondsmiths all being dead? I'm really grasping at straws here, especially because I find it suspiciously likely that Taln's death had something to do with this...

[A Joe in the Bush]

We know that one Order, the Skybreakers Presumably, Didn't disband. So they never locked their Gate. Or, the Gates are only open During Desolations, so when Taln came back, the Stormseat gate opened, but none of the other heralds have opened their's because they don't want a desolation.

[Lumen]

Besides the golden keys swear, why do folks believe the Heralds have something to do with the Oathgates?  Heralds are not around that much, only during desolations, and I am not sure they are much involved in Fabrial "science".  I am more inclined to think that the oathgates were created by Fabrial designers, probably within the Knights Radiant.  And this was, after all, their seat of power.  Not the Heralds.

 

What have I missed?

[Aleksiel]

Besides the golden keys swear, why do folks believe the Heralds have something to do with the Oathgates?  Heralds are not around that much, only during desolations, and I am not sure they are much involved in Fabrial "science".  I am more inclined to think that the oathgates were created by Fabrial designers, probably within the Knights Radiant.  And this was, after all, their seat of power.  Not the Heralds.

 

What have I missed?

 

Here:

 

“The Oathgates were a symbol,” Shallan said, continuing to walk. “The Vorin Right of Travel, given to all citizens of sufficient rank, is based on the Heralds’ declaration that all borders should be open.

 

It doesn't really say the Heralds created them though.

 

Can Oathgates have something to do with oathstones like the one Szeth carries? The names certanly have similarity and with Brandon everything ties up eventually. In the myth of the origin of Makabaki there's mention of seedstones touched by the Heralds themselves.

[Lumen]

Here:

 

 

“The Oathgates were a symbol,” Shallan said, continuing to walk. “The Vorin Right of Travel, given to all citizens of sufficient rank, is based on the Heralds’ declaration that all borders should be open.

It doesn't really say the Heralds created them though.

 

That quote implies that the Heralds did not create them.  The oath gates were "based on" the Herald's declaration.  Or at least, the Vorin Right of Travel was.  

 

[Aleksiel]

That quote implies that the Heralds did not create them.  The oath gates were "based on" the Herald's declaration.  Or at least, the Vorin Right of Travel was. 

 

 

I didn't say it meant anything, you just asked for the source of the speculation that the Heralds made the Oathgates 

Nonetheless, I disagree. The right of travel is what's based on the Heralds declaration. The quote itself does't provide any grounds for speculation whether or not the Heralds were involved in the making of the Oathgates.

[Meg]

They passed into the Circle of Memories, a round room with ten lamps on the walls, one for each of the ancient Epoch Kingdoms. An eleventh lamp represented the Tranquiline Halls, and a large ceremonial keyhole set into the wall represented the need for ardents to ignore borders, and look only at the hearts of men...or something like that.

(my emphasizes)

Sometimes I'm really sloppy while reading (even if I should know better when reading Brandon Sanderson ).

I read the description of the Oathgate in Stormseat again and further until the lamps there are mentioned and there's a difference: In Kholinar are eleven lamps, in Stormseat only ten (but eleven segments on the floor). Unfortunately there's no description of the floor of the Circle of Memories in Kholinar.

I could imagine that the eleventh lamp in Kholinar had been put there during or after the Recreance and that the appearance of the whole Circle of Memories has been "adjusted" to Vorin tenets (for example the eleventh lamp as a symbol for the Tranquiline Halls instead of Urithiru) after the Recreance.

Given that the Oathgates in Urithiru all look(ed) (and work?) the same, may be the discrepancy of the Oathgates in Stormseat/Urithiru and elsewhere is the reason that only the one in Stormseat works.

I apologize for rambling along.

[Zenith]

(my emphasizes)

Sometimes I'm really sloppy while reading (even if I should know better when reading Brandon Sanderson ).

I read the description of the Oathgate in Stormseat again and further until the lamps there are mentioned and there's a difference: In Kholinar are eleven lamps, in Stormseat only ten (but eleven segments on the floor). Unfortunately there's no description of the floor of the Circle of Memories in Kholinar.

I could imagine that the eleventh lamp in Kholinar had been put there during or after the Recreance and that the appearance of the whole Circle of Memories has been "adjusted" to Vorin tenets (for example the eleventh lamp as a symbol for the Tranquiline Halls instead of Urithiru) after the Recreance.

Given that the Oathgates in Urithiru all look(ed) (and work?) the same, may be the discrepancy of the Oathgates in Stormseat/Urithiru and elsewhere is the reason that only the one in Stormseat works.

I apologize for rambling along.

That's a lot of what I'm thinking as well. The KR disbanded, no one could use the Oathgates, and eventually the knowledge was lost and changed, a d they did some stuff to mess up the gates, perhaps leaving Stormseat open simply because no one wanted to go out there to re-establish the city, and corrupt the Oathgate in the process.

 

Of course, perhaps it wasn't the KR that locked the Oathgates. Perhaps the Sunmaker, in his whole changing of Vorin theology, did something to the Oathgates?

[GeneSedai]

This is a tenuous correlation, but I think it's worth merit if you will all humor me...

 

The term Oathgate has something very much in common with another term often used by/about the heralds. At some point in the conflict between Tanavast and Odium, his Heralds were part of the "Oathpact" that bound Odium (and the heralds) into their cycle of desolations.

 

I find it interesting that 9 out of 10 Oathgates are no longer functioning after 9 out of 10 heralds broke their Oaths. Additionally the formation of the shattered plains has always been an interesting point. I assume it occurred because of Aharietiam. And since 9 cities were not destroyed upon the breaking of oaths, I would assume that the one that was destroyed belonged to or represented Taln.