manaheim

Oh and I totally got the "flaming slap fight" reference and laughed and laughed and laughed.

Finally got 10 seconds to breathe... so I read your submission. Yay. Definitely interesting, and I quite liked the Ghintor/Benham thing. They both seemed like intriguing characters. The prologue thing felt very out of alignment with the rest...but then each set of characters felt a little out of alignment with all the others anyway. That's not necessarily a problem, but I did note it. I'm with jagabond on prologues, btw. Fit it into the natural story or cut it. 9 times out of 10 the prologue is something we don't get to for so long that by the time we do I'm like "wait... who are these people?" There were several places where I wasn't TOTALLY sure who was talking, and several where I wasn't totally sure what was happening. The conflicts seemed to halt so abruptly that I had no idea how they had stopped. PARTICULARLY the last one between Benham and whomever was attacking him. I was totally lost on that one. There were also a few cases where I felt like you dropped in a name or an object (like the belaying pin) where it had not been referenced before. This led me to scan back in the chapter several times to try to see if I missed something. I'd also like a little more information on our characters. Some sort of identifying hook or characteristic. Still, very curious to read more. Some more specific comments... "When Ahma grabbed your collar, you went quietly." This confused me for a moment. I thought this was referring to an event, which made me unsure if the barmaid was ahma… or if ahma was being grabbed by an unnamed barmaid. "She snatched up two pitchers and ran at the burning man as he thrashed through tables and chairs..." Feels like some variation of this should be your opening paragraph. The real action is here. May as well start here and blend some bits in from your current P1. "Some were already moving, but her shout stung others ." I didn't understand this. “That idiot, my bill of lading is ashes. I will not stand for this!” Wasn't sure who was talking here. "Ibdal moaned as hands turned him over. Ahma stepped towards the advancing man and slapped him across the face." Might be good to give us his name a little sooner. This is the burning guy, right? "smoking quietly ." Not to be glib, but... vs. smoking noisily? "Ahma linked arms with the old man. “Maybe I’ll tame you.” Lynell didn’t say anything, but she thought that the old man paled slightly. " The latter part of this seems weak. She thought? Or he did? Slightly? "Benam had already sized up the gobby man and moved on to his friend . " I was having a hard time with this. I wasn't sure if a friend had been introduced and I just missed it, or if you're dropping the friend on us without explanation of who or what he is. "Benam’s proof of the quiet one’s ability was the lack of warning , but his old ears just picked out the whisper of steal o" I had to read this a couple times to understand what you meant. Also, "steal" instead of "steel". "His knee howled as he twisted, throwing up an arm and dropping the belaying pin f..." Belaying pin? I didn't see anywhere where he picked this up or there was even evidence of these being present. "“Your friend will need to catch you up. He’ll be spending a night or two at the duke’s pleasure.” " It wasn't clear to me who was talking here.

Extremely helpful, thank you! And that's where I was hoping you were sitting mentally, too. So win. Thanks!

Thanks for the feedback, guys. I'm 45 hours into what expects to be a 70 hour work week, so I haven't had time to really breathe and process all of your remarks, but I will before Monday. Mandamon.... answers are coming. Some of them in the very next chapter. I guess my question to you is... would you have put the book down without having been given those answers yet? Robinski- you make a ton of interesting points. One thing I thought you might be interested in... museum security. It's often pretty terrible. I actually researched this and there have been cases of a museum being robbed by someone cutting a chain on a pair of back doors. It's amazing. Also... the museum in question here is Higgins Armory Museum here in Worcester. I took some license with it, but their finances had been going down the tubes for years and just this last year they finally closed (very sad). Not arguing... just thought you might be interested. I have a couple other questions for you all that I need to mull over a bit more, but will post those soon. Thanks again, guys.

ooo... you know... tying in the couple to the whole thing would REALLY work. It would take some serious effort to stitch it in, but that's too awesome of an idea to pass up. You, sir, win the day. Thank you!

Thanks for reading!

Roger roger. Thanks!

Am I still good to submit or shall I hold off?

I saw this thread and was totally like "Oh crap, Robinski posted something last week and I didn't give him any feedback on it?!?!?! AAAAAAA!! CRAP CRAP CRAP!" Then I realized you're like 5 hours ahead of me. Looking forward to reading it.

hahahahaha... Funny, I was picturing that cup when I wrote that line and chuckling to myself.

Finally getting to this. Please forgive the delay. Crazy week at work. This was a woooooooonderful story. I love love loved it. A couple times I had to stop reading and was doing whatever I could to get back to my desk because I was really enjoying it. That doesn't happen much for me. I did have a few questions and some minor tuning thoughts, but it doesn't take away from the fact that I love what you're doing here. I hope you find these useful. I also haven't read anyone else's comments yet, so I'll be curious to see how my thoughts line up. --- The woman having a steel and brass leg was very interesting. The whole concept of the magic system was very interesting, and I love how you wove it into various elements, such as the sketch on Calum's throat. Very creative and immersive. Your characterizations of people is quick and complete. I get a really good sense of people very rapidly, and they are all very distinct. It's wonderful. I imagine you'll tell us at some point, but I find myself wondering why Iain isn't helping Lemilia. It seems like he can. It seems like he likes her. It seems like he is genuinely concerned that she will get screwed by Kinetic. So why not help her? I feel like you need to give us a little something there, otherwise he seems like a jerk. On Page 1: "In the crowded ballroom behind him, the musicians continued to play " There are a significant number of foreign names used in this chapter. A few of them in a book gives us a sense of an alien world, which is cool, but I think you have gone so far as to have enough to be distracting. In some cases, it's outright confusing... where you give us a proper name of something that flew by, but I have no sense of what it was so I find myself struggling to picture it. Specifically this line... "A charm of goylae flittered past, stony scales catching the moonlight as they zipped and squeaked through the air. " Another example... ", the higher classes of the melange of culture that was Ourzoballa" You also have quite a few proper names of things and portions of the setting and whatnot. Some of these I feel like asking "Do I really need to know the name? It's distracting and if I have to remember all of this... well.. I'm probably going to give up on the book." I actually thought he was on a ship in the beginning. Whisky and cigarettes: These things bothered me a little bit because they felt very "our world". On Page 1: "It was a feeble brew , but he would be the first to admit that his standards were" (referring to whisky) Whisky is not a "brew". That's usually a term used to describe beer. I'm not a big drinker, though, so maybe i'm wrong here. I would go through the entire section and look for weak words like "Almost" and cut them. You have a lot of "it's" where you should have "its". Example... "Catering to the higher classes of society, Lailualu Hall rarely offered it’s guests anything but wine." You use "Iain knew Calum" twice in one paragraph on Pg1/2. In the first case, I'd say just strike it. Since Iain is narrating, his statement makes it clear that he knew something. In the second case, it might be more powerful to say "That was Calum." to show the reader that Iain knew. On Page 3 you have two "as she did" in the same paragraph. On Page 4, the interaction between Lemila and Fyla was awesome and venemous and hysterical. Loved it. On Page 5, "Fyla snorted, crossing her arms, the diaphanous sleeves fluttering. “If my husbands caught you looking at me like that…” In a world where multiple husbands is apparently not that extraordinary and not taboo, her reaction to his behavior feels very much like one coming from a two-person-only relationship system (what the hell is the word for that...?) Anyway, seemed odd. On Page 5, "The corners of his lips twitched into a smirk, welcoming the change in topic " This read to me like the corners of his lips were welcoming the change. On Page 6, "“Nothing more than gaining additional exposure,” Iain said, shaking his head to banish the unease that had crept into his mind. “Build mystery, and you get people talking.” I think you covered his feelings on this already in his thoughts just prior to this sentence. I think you could strike the thoughts and just use this sentence and run with it. On Page 6, "Lailualu Theater was the largest on the southern end of Ourzoballa, and tonight it was filled to capacity" From this point on the setting starts to throw me. I had to go look back, and sure enough you mentioned it was a ballroom before... or at least I think that was the room he is now walking into. You then use these two terms (and two different names) seemingly interchangably. It just threw me off so I wasn't sure what was going on. On Page 7, Loved the interaction between Tharle and Iain. It said a lot about their characters and relationship in a very tight space. On Page 8, Iain seems to slip into something of a Sherlock Holmes style speech pattern. "“Based on this information, allow your thoughts to pierce through the haze of drink clouding your mind and make a reasonable hypothesis.” ... "“Brilliant deduction , Tharle,” Iain said" On Page 9, "Dark grey slacks held up by a pair of plain black galluses and a pair of faded, brown, thick-soled boots completed his ‘common man’ appearance. Calum believed it helped him connect with his roots, " I think this flirts a little bit with a POV issue. If you change "believed" to "claimed" I think it addresses it and says more about the characters. On Page 11, "This was what the man had meant. " I had no idea who this was referring to or what he had meant. On Page 12, Given Calum's reputation, I was a little surprised that he was speaking loud enough to be heard when whispering things to his canvas. Particularly where it seems like those things would take away from the showiness of what he was doing. Also, in a setting like that it would be pretty hard to hear a whisper unless they were forcibly making it loud. On Page 12- loved the fabric pooling at her feet. On Page 13- I was a little unsure of how specific Iain was being about how the light was sinking into her flesh. In time I deduced that he just knows how it works and was telling us, but as an observer it felt a bit over-aware to me. On Page 15- When Tharle squeaked. I thought this was BRILLIANT. Given what we know of this guy, the reaction seems a real insight into how sucked into the performance he was and how surprised he was. Very VERY nice. Also funny. On Page 15- "The audience erupted into pure noise ." This was a little odd for me. I know what you're saying, but usually it's erupted in applause... or cheering... so I wasn't entirely sure if everyone was hissing, banging pots and pans, or what... --- Oh I meant to mention (and now reading other comments, was reminded). I was a little confused by the Calum/Kinetic thing as well, but didn't realize it until later on. I thought it was a different person. I also had to reset my interpretation of what Iain was doing throughout his note-taking. I think we do need to know a little sooner what he's up to.

Going through these comments again as I edit Ch2... Robinski... you dead-on nailed the JB reference, which was surprising. The only other person who got that was the guy that suggested I put the signature on the poster in the first place. You also caught the cup and the shroud, which I don't believe anyone else has figured out (or at least they didn't comment.) Nice eye. Anyway, thanks again, everyone. Off to work I go...

Been thinking about this... and it occurs to me the problem you guys are calling out is exactly why I didn't go into this before. It's a Pandora's box... I'm struggling to determine how to... 1> Show she's bad. 2> Not open Pandora's box. 3> Not severely alter the story. (The story really isn't about her as a criminal... it's about her turning away from and dealing with having been one.) Any thoughts here would be much appreciated.

I hear what you're saying. Thanks for the comments.

That's cool. I'll check here before I submit. Thanks, Silk.

Finally getting to this... crazy week at work. I haven't read the other folks' comments yet, FYI. (taking a page from Robinski's book) Some of the interactions between the characters is great. I loved... “I was just letting the Krytian know how short a time we’d be enjoying his company!”, though I did want to know what a Krytian was. Also the part where he's talking to Byrth about the 5,000 soldiers. Nice moment there. However, most of the read-through I was confused due to lack of information about setting Also some blocking issues that come out of it. One minute he's addressing Tillian on the field (or something), the next minute he's reading documents. You also drop characters on us without any real description of them, any sense of who they are or why they're there, etc. You have a couple POV issues where someone knows something they shouldn't be able to... "Solomon’s heart sank, his arms limp at his side. “Wha…five thousand!” He whispered fiercely. Some men turned to look at him, wondering what was being said ." Also, and just being honest, a lot of this is pretty rough. I don't know how much editing you have done yet, but there is a fair bit of awkward phrasing, confusing sentences, vague pronouns, incorrect use of possessive, etc. Having someone read it to you might help significantly. Just keep a pen and printed copy of the work on hand and mark anytime the reader looks confused or hesitates. Those will be the areas you need to address.

Thanks, Robinski. It's hard to have her say or do much without opening a can of worms. *chuckle* There's a lot of stuff that leads up to what she's doing, why she's here, etc. I'll think about it though and see if I can make it work better. It's the first pass of a pretty tough thing to inject, so... likely plenty of room to tune. Thanks again.

Hey folks... working on some Ch1 edits and wondering what you all think of this. Speaking to the bad-girl thing, does this bring it out more? (I'm trying to find ways to make it clear without being too heavy-handed) "Her body tensed as two of Boston’s finest stepped onto the black and white tiled floor. While confident that the police had a sketchy profile of her at best, overconfidence could mean jail time, and there was no way in hell she was going to jail. Particularly not now, hours away from a seven-figure job that would allow her to live comfortably for life." Also added this... "She took a deep breath. She needed to keep her wits about her long enough to get away from this man. Then she could do the job, fence the goods, and quit the thieving game forever. The take from this one hit would be enough for her and her father to live comfortably for the rest of their lives. Sure, it would ruin the family, but the bastards deserved it, and their insurance would probably cover it anyway. And yes, the risk was extreme, but so was continuing to live as a wanted woman with a coffee addiction."

I'd like to submit, if possible.

Oh... Roibinski... On the vinyl points... lol. Fair enough. On Paul and his boundaries. You basically said it. It's fantasy. He does absolutely have some boundaries and there is a magic system surrounding all the characters in the novel, but yes... his boundaries are not entirely clear, and my working assumption is they don't need to be, only because he's never the one solving any problems. He's Gandalf... only he does actually have some limits. (now please erase the image of Paul as Gandalf from your mind)

Thanks for the feedback, guys. Super helpful and insightful as always. A question for you, though... The contract.... Candace's crimes... etc. There is an awwwwwwwwwwwful lot of information there, and I've been trying very hard to glance off of it initially because you've already had QUITE a bit of info rammed into your gullets. More of these things DOES get explained as we carry on in the book, but from right about now on, it turns pretty significantly to more action and far far less explanation. So... I guess I'm just scratching my head over balancing between more info-dumping and trying to keep folks from being bored? Would love some thoughts. [minor spoilers in the next paragraph...] Endurant... I appreciate your perspective and hope you'll keep giving me feedback, but I don't think your reaction is likely to change much here. I'm taking religious characters and basically casting them in roles where they very matter-of-factly go about their day, fingering the bad guys to get whacked, and forcing some poor girl to do it. It's sort of one of the fundamental elements of the story, and totally intentional. I don't know what you do for work, but I'm basically playing with the ways big corporations operate... and then draping that over Christianity. I guess the only thing I could suggest is to ask yourself what your reaction would be if Paul were an HR manager in a corporation that was in the middle of layoffs... or possibly a federal agent of a secret government branch that assassinates serial killers who cannot be proven guilty.... because those are essentially what I'm riffing off of. Thanks again everyone!

Robinksi, thanks very much for taking the time and providing this feedback. I appreciate it. I'm going to stew on your comments a bit before doing anything more specific to the chapter (as I always do), but thanks much.

I'm donning my thick skin. Have at me. Thanks for reading, folks.

I guess I have something to submit this week, though I tremble in fear at doing so. lol

Totally get the reader reaction thing, and I appreciate it. I was just thinking along the lines of "If these guys have this reaction to the book, then odds are good they're not in the target audience... mainly because no one else has reacted quite this strongly." (or the book sucks... whichever. lol) It'd be like making my wife watch Star Trek and asking her what she'd do differently. Her answer would be "Everything." Anyway, I'll mull it over. Maybe I'll post up to Ch5 and see if anyone's head explodes before that point. Thanks again.