Gloom

Odium is the Shard of Hatred. He is the definition of Odium, not destruction. Sylphrena hates Dalinars Shardblade. Shallans Cryptic doesn't seem all that disturbed by hers. We've seen three different types of Shardblades in TWoKs. Stone is important, this has been discussed in depth and pretty much everyone agrees. Why it is important is still in question. As far as caring about life... Kaladin cares about protecting those who can not protect themselves. In some respects this can be construed as the same thing, but I think it is important to point out that Kaladin has not taken a Hippocratic Oath, and has not only killed both human and non-human combatant, but he excels at doing so. Alethkar was appointed to be the defenders of Roshar during the period of the Silver Kingdoms. They have a long and glorious history going back thousands upon thousands of years in which their primary focus was the arts martial. This is why they are the most warlike nation on Roshar. They are not the only nation on Roshar that is covered in rock. Nantanatan is also largely barren of soil, as are many other nations. I have my doubts that the Shin are quite as peaceful as they appear. It does appear that they send agents out into the world that cause chaos and dissension amongst the other nations from time to time.

I agree with Aether. I find it hard to accept that the Parshendi require the presence of the Alethi on the Shattered Plains for any reason at all. They have, or at least had, sufficient numbers to oppose the Alethi for over five years. They lost far more warriors, and Shards, fighting the Alethi than they would have killing pupating Chasm Fiends. I would even go so far as to say that were they not at war with the Alethi on the Shattered Plains they could have been far more effective at eliminating Chasm Fiends.

My question then is this. How does having the Alethi on the Plains increase the number of Chasm Fiends killed? Wouldn't it be easier and quite a bit safer to just go to the Plains alone and start killing off all the pupating Chasm Fiends rather than instigate a war with the most powerful military nation in Roshar? I would imagine it would also be more profitable.

I'll tell you what I think, but I obviously have no proof to substantiate anything outside of what I believe to be logic. I don't think multiple types of parasites would work. The more types of parasites you have, the greater the chance for genetic diversity. The greater the chance for genetic diversity, the greater the chance that they parasites would have found a way to spread. So I think that it would be more likely to have the same parasite effect different biologicals by providing them with different powers. This would mean that even after they discover the parasites, they could still require the birds in order to survive the islands. I have my doubts about plants, but then again, the local plants are extremely aggressive, so they may be affected to some degree. I'm fairly sure that the mouse-like land mammals do indeed have the parasite which is what makes them somewhat intelligent. I'm inclined to think that they would indeed affect humans, but that they can be cooked off. This would make it unlikely that humans would easily make this discovery. Yes That sounds like a reasonable theory. At this point we don't even know what the primary effect these parasites would have on a human body. I would assume that the bird would gain powers, but I can't be certain. I think you might be able to kill the parasite, but I think they may have been doing this a while and would know which medicines would be likely to strip a bird of its powers. In this event, the bird may continue to function normally, or it may die. I don't see that the birds took any special notice of their abilities. I think you ask too many questions!

Sixth wasn't part of the planned series. Brandon brainstormed the book less than a year ago, and it will only be a novella. I believe that Brandon has, at the least, a rough outline of when and where for the relevant events of the series. I don't know how you could plan a thirty plus book series without one. We may get some cosmere info from the book, but most of that will likely be incidental. I'm still looking forward to reading it and arguing the merits of ingesting sea going parasites for the sake of a power-up.

Lets put it this way. If these men were arrested for accosting with the intent to rob and kill Jasnah Kholin and Shallan Davar by the guard, who wasn't doing their job, what do you think the sentence would have been? The only real crime here was that the watch gets off without a hitch. In fact, since Jasnah didn't take credit for it, the watch can. So they look good for neglecting their jobs. Jasnah didn't just roam a random dark alley. She was paying a debt to Taravangian through public service. The area where she was accosted was a known problem area where the victims were murdered. The criminals also stated their intent before Jasnah lit into them. In essence, she was protecting the honest people of Kharbranth.

He's referring to a post I made earlier in the discussion. here In that post I theorized that if the Heralds existed before Shards were created, and were competent swordsmen and women, that they would be most comfortable using blades similar to those they had used previously.

Hmmm, another spren like Cusicesh the Protector, possibly even bigger, that blasts large volumes of water back into the atmosphere? A spren that may also create the whether conditions necessary for that water to remain airborne and create a highstorm? Yeah, I could buy that.

Every Shardblade is sharp enough to cut stone. This could simply indicate observation. We have no solid basis upon which to judge the durability of a soulcaster fabrial. The fabrial Jasnah wears isn't a heavy steel gauntlet, it's a large but delicate piece of jewelry. I'm pretty sure that if I stab you in the heart and while your wearing a light shirt of silver chain, I'd still kill you. If the fabrial is no more durable than silver, it could be cut with a steel knife or dagger when it was being thrust into her fathers chest or back.

Actually, if the premise remains the same from the writing excuses think tank they used to develop this world, the investiture is in an aquatic parasite that the birds eat. The parasite is localized around the island chain which is why the birds have to be captured on the island and tamed. Those birds born away from the island chain lack the parasite, and as a result, the investiture found in those captured from the wild. It will be interesting to see how these parasites affect humans. I'm not going to argue with Chuck Norris. Fear of spiders is arachnophobia, fear of tight places is claustrophobia, fear of Chuck Norris is called Logic.

I was clarifying. You did mention volcanoes. I also brought along a friendly quote.

The point being that either Shallan didn't have the Shardblade before she killed her father, or she doesn't consider killing her father her sin. So for those of you who believe that Shallan was in possession of her Shardblade prior to her fathers death, please enlighten me on exactly what act she committed to obtain the Shardblade, and what she would consider to be more horrific than killing her own father. Please take into consideration that their is plenty of evidence that suggests that Shallan was deeply disturbed over her fathers death.

In regards to Roshar If I'm not mistaken, that would mean that most tectonic activity like earthquakes and volcanoes would not be naturally occurring. I'm leaning towards a very porous crust that causes pressure to build from drainage on the Pangaea resulting in a semi weekly super geyser at the source.

I'm glad I don't live there. I liked the story, and look forward to the novella, but it seems like a rather hostile place.

You make some good points. Her having a problem with the memory, if it is one. The fact that she doesn't react to it in the same way she reacts at other times when she considers her fathers death for another. I would argue that we have no idea how durable a soulcaster is. For all we know, her father could have been killed with a knife to the heart which severed the Soulcaster. We don't have any empirical evidence which points to a Shardblade being used to in the actual death. I would even say that it is unlikely that Shallans father was killed with a Shardblade. For him to be killed by Shallan with a Shardblade, she would have to have the Blade prior to his death. This would then require an explanation of how she attained the blade, a blade she considers her secret shame. But was it her shame because she used it to kill her father, or because she claimed it after she killed her father?

I did say that they appear to be barren of investiture. I didn't say they were completely barren of investiture. I based my statement on the lack of highstorms and spren. There may be trace investiture in Shinovar, and there may be invested items in Shinovar, but it appears that Shinovar lacks stormlight, which is usually required for Surgebinders, Soulcasters, and soulcasting.

House Davar was a noble house of enough repute and influence that the Ghostbloods felt that Shallans father could claim the throne. I've seen stranger theories than the possibility that House Davar had been in possession of a set of Shards that were lost with Nan-Heleran. If Shallan felt the Shards were inconsequential compared to the loss of her brother she may not have even considered them. It may not be likely, but I feel it's at least as likely as the Shin wearing Shardplate for farming.

As you noted, we have no evidence at all to base this assumption on. It is more likely his wardrobe is merely Shin custom. I believe that were he wearing armor under his robe it would have been somewhat obvious. I don't recall ever reading that Shardplate was so form fitting it could be easily hidden under your clothing.

None of this stops Amaram from casting suspicion on Shallan. I would also find it unlikely that Dalinar is unaware of the Ghostbloods. Amaram knew enough to identify the Shardbearer as a Ghostblood and he is one of Sadeas nobles. Dalinar and Sadeas may not be close, but they do work together to ensure the security of the realm. I would find it highly peculiar if one of the two men who was responsible for the safety and security of the crown was unaware of a secret cabal that was intent on interfering with international politics while the other not only knew about them, but knew enough about them to inform his sworn men how to identify them. Dalinar isn't an idiot, and while it was never explicitly stated, it isn't a huge leap to assume he knows about them, and is wary of them. It has been assumed that either Thaidikar or Restares is affiliated with the Ghostbloods. Gavilar knew of both of these people and was suspicious enough about them that he assumed they were the ones who sent Szeth. We know that Amaram is aware of who sent the assassin in Shards to kill him. If that assassin was a Davar, and if Amaram has any influence with Dalinar then it wouldn't be a huge leap to warn him of the affiliation between House Davar and an assassin that was sent against him. Especially with a Davar in Dalinars camp. Heck, it would be common courtesy to do so. As far as Jasnah goes, I already said that she should be able to offset some of the suspicion, but Jasnah is also a very careful person. I find it unlikely that she will be comfortable giving Shallan unrestricted access to her family. Jasnah knows that Shallans family has been mixed up in the Ghostbloods. A group that Jasnah was also capable of identifying through their symbol. She knows that House Davar is in a tenuous position due to the death of Shallans father. She may keep Shallan from being ejected from Dalinars war camp, but I don't think she will do anything that could potentially be harmful to her kin. I'll agree that it isn't as likely that Amaram will out Kaladin as the man who killed Shallans brother, but it wouldn't necessarily stop Shallan from telling Kaladin that she hated Amaram for killing her brother if indeed he was the Shardbearer and Shallan recognizes the Shards.

It's easy, if Kaladin is killing them they are the enemy. If they are trying to kill Kaladin, they are the enemy. If neither of the above is true, then they may be the enemy, but aren't actively being the enemy. I hope that cleared it up for you

I'll answer this quote with a quote. I'm not sure that the earrings Sazed has distributed to his faithful are actual spikes, or something based off the spikes. If they are invested directly by Sazed rather than ripping the investiture out of humans, are they still Hemalurgic spikes? Does it say anywhere that they are spikes, or are we just assuming they are because they are so similar to what Vin wore. As for the Kandra, we don't know that Sazed has allowed for the creation of more Kandra. He may be working off the premise of what's done is done. Sazed himself neither claims to be a god or a moral compass for his followers. His philosophy is leave the world a better place than you found it, and that's about as far as he goes. He even encouraged people to look elsewhere for their moral guidance by listing out religions and their tenets in the founding. I really can't see Sazed ordering his Kandra to go kill people so he can talk to his faithful. Where would you put such a spike in someone in order to allow communion with Sazed?

I'm more inclined to believe that the Herald Shalash spent an inordinate amount of time in Shinovar and helped shape their culture after the fall of the Silver Kingdoms. If the Shin are protecting the Honorblades, then something along these lines would be necessary. The Shin do not follow Vorinism, so it's possible that they know a different version of history than the rest of the world. I'm not inclines to believe that the Shin had access to Surgebinders while the entire rest of the world went without. Especially since the Shin lands appear to be barren of investiture.

Kaladin was in Alethkar, fighting per orders against an enemy. The identity of the Shardbearer is only important because he was a Shardbearer. If he was a any other light-eye, the identity of the man who killed him would be of little note. Shallan has not been searching to find out who killed her brother. In fact, when she was told her brother was dead, she just took it at face value and carried on with her life. Now this could get interesting in two ways. Amaram has done his homework, and knows that the Shardbearer was a scion of house Davar (if this is indeed the case). In this scenario, Amaram could confide in Dalinar and inform him of the attempt on his life by a member of House Davar that was positively identified as having ties to the Ghost Bloods. In this scenario, Dalinar becomes highly suspicious of Shallan, and may even implicate her when an assassination attempt occurs either against himself, or Elhokar. In the above scenario, Jasnah should be able to diffuse the situation somewhat, but even she may be somewhat suspicious of Shallan do to their history. This would force Shallan away from the Kholin family and likely put her in Kaladins company (as in he'd have to watch over her to ensure she stayed out of trouble). Another scenario is that Shallan recognizes Amarams Shardblade. In this scenario, Shallan would attempt to quietly gather information on how Amaram came to be in possession of the Shardblade that Helaran carried. At some point it is likely that Amaram would become aware of the investigation and expose Shallan as a potential spy and assassin. If in the course of the investigation she found out that Kaladin was the one who actually killed the Shardbearer and was then exposed, it is likely the results would be similar except now Shallan would know the man keeping an eye on her was the man who killed her brother. Exactly how things would play out from there is anyones guess, but it wouldn't necessarily mean that Shallan would have to hate Kaladin. He was fighting in a war, and her brother was on the other side. Her brother had a distinct advantage, and his purpose was to assassinate Kaladins lord. There are real world war stories where men kill enemies and try to make good with their wives, sisters, or other relatives with a mixed bag of results, so the results of this situation are not a fore gone conclusion.

I agree with marianmi. The theory as proposed had something to it. The idea that the Shin have Shards and have warriors capable of wielding those Shards is plausible. The idea that they use them in their day to day life is less so. If the Shards are pseudo religious in significance and only wielded by the lowest caste members of their society, it could work for a time, but eventually, over 4500 years, a group of these Shard bearing warriors would get fed up with their lot in life and flip the tables. Now, if they are protecting sacred relics of the Heralds, and these Shardbearers understand that those relics are of even greater power than the Shards they carry, then they may remain content with their role in life. To suggest that the Shards are being used for farming is far from plausible. For one, every field has stones in it. I get that their is soil in Shinovar, but soil contains stones. Cutting stone is taboo. Shardplate requires stormlight, and stormlight is holy. Using stormlight for something as inane as farming would likely be considered sacrilegious. It isn't like they can't farm without the Shards. Religious governments are almost always about maintaining the status quot. So progress usually isn't high on the agenda.

I don't. I think he felt he over stated it, and felt the need to go back and calm his statement down a little bit, but I feel he was being quite candid in what he thinks of it on a personal level. I look at Hemalurgy as theft and murder. You steal a power and it kills the victim. Killing someone for personal gain is considered harmful to the human psych by most experts, so killing them and then injecting a piece of another persons soul into your own can only be more harmful. I used cannibalism as an example in the last post, and I see this was avoided, but this is what Hemalurgy is. Hemalurgy is spiritual cannibalism. If it was verifiable that you could gain the strength of your father by eating his heart, would you do it? Would that make it okay? Would it be okay if you just bought someone elses fathers heart and ate it? would this make you any less the despicable cannibal? Lets say someone murders and robs a loving family. A Rolex watch was part of the loot. It's got the dead fathers name engraved on the bottom. You recognize the name and that this person was murdered. It's got traces of blood in a couple of the grooves. He'll sell it to you, a $20,000 watch, but he'll sell it to you for $20 because he doesn't know how valuable it is. Would you buy that watch and profit off of it knowing that by doing so you are not only profiting off of the death of a family, not only allowing a man who murders children to escape justice, but are actually encouraging this man to go out and kill another family just so you can profit? I don't see a difference between this and Hemalurgy...actually, I do see a difference between this and Hemalurgy. Hemalurgy is worse because it violates not only a persons body, but their very soul.