Windrunner

I wrote a large part of the Shardblade article. I’m not sure who put in that Taln’s Blade was stolen by a Taravangian but I’ll get rid of that, as it’s incorrect. As for the issue with the Shardblade that Taln showed up with, it is unlikely to change. It’s difficult to tally and tabulate unnamed Shardblades, but this system is the best I could figure out and Taln was the last one to hold that Blade, even if it wasn’t bound to him. It doesn’t seem misleading at all to me.

Topic moved. Please be more careful with future topics.

I am certain it’s Yelig-nar. The motif that he is given is black smoke/wind whenever he appears onscreen. It’s just waiting there for Amaram to swallow the gemstone.

Very interesting theory. I particularly like the theory about where gemstones tend to collect, as that should be predictable like you indicate. We really don't know much about Rosharan mining at this point, so I'm curious if they end up digging into the actual granitic bedrock or if they're just digging around in the crem for gems like you indicate. One interesting thing I noticed from the Kaza interlude is that there are a lot of gemstones around there with the greatshell corpses, yet they seem to not have moved far from the bodies. Perhaps the location of Akinah is already near one of these barriers that the gems are moved towards? Very interesting theory!

I wouldn’t be surprised if Team Dragonsteel has developed some sort of symbol for Nalthis, like they did for the other cosmere worlds that appeared in AU. We didn’t get a story set on Nalthis, but I bet the symbol exists. Perhaps that will be what we see on the cover (although that begs the question of what will eventually appear on the cover of the Nightblood leather bound, but that’s probably 15+ years out xD)

12 hours ago, Ookla the maladroit said:

I guess there’s our answe to the perpetual “does Brandon lurk in the forums” question.

No Nightblood! 

From a financial perspective, it was a huge success. Brandon is aware of the graphic novel’s flaws and has his own issues as well.

Welcome to the forums!

My personal read on it is that Harkaylain is an ancient Bondsmith. He seems to have been wise and in a position of authority. The fact that he could potentially help with a problem with the Nahel bond (which is what I think would cause some sort of malfunction to Shardplate) also implies Bondsmith to me, that he could potentially help them get around whatever problems with a bond a person might be having. I could even see a Bondsmith having helped someone like Kaladin in book two, who was really struggling with their oaths and bond and putting their spren at risk of death.

I'm not sure how worried you are about spoilers, so I'll tag this for Oathbringer. There's nothing plot related in here, but if you're sensitive to knowing too much about how much screentime a character gets or who the book is focused on, don't open the tag.

Also, if you want to get more specific on what you're struggling with in OB, I'll have to move the topic to the spoilers board, although we can add a note that it's just through part one or something to the title of the topic.

My interpretation of the whole thing was not to assume that Adolin is going to be her crutch. Shallan's working on mastering her personas right now, and Adolin caught her in a moment where she had lost her control. While she was reasserting control, he recognized who she was at the core. My read of it was in that moment she realized that Adolin really understands her on a level that Kaladin simply doesn't and that made up her mind. I don't think this is leading to Adolin being the person that she needs to reassert her control every time or anything. I think that he'll try to help, and maybe even succeed in helping sometimes, but it's not going to be that easy. If in SA 4, Shallan is hanging on Adolin's arm to maintain her semblance of self, I'll accept that I read it wrong, but I really don't think that what Brandon is driving at here is the implication that Shallan is going to be dependent on Adolin for her mental health.

39 minutes ago, rjl said:

If you read the text carefully - it's clear that having a spren bond is a pre-requisite for being able to swear the 3rd ideal; this implies that Szeth knew he already had such a bond before they took off for the flight as he was about to swear before Nale stopped him.

I’m not sure if you’re correcting me or if you’re agreeing with me, but this is basically what I was trying to get across in my post.

My opinion is that when Szeth was still at the Purelake, he had already attracted a spren. He was at the point of swearing the Third Ideal before Nale interrupted him. Szeth must have had a spren, as he and Nale went to Thaylen City whereas the Skybreakers seem to have remained in Marat. That is far beyond the distance that his powers should have faded. We also know that Szeth can’t be getting his powers from Nale, as squires are specific, as seen when Rock does not heal until he is moved nearer to Kaladin, despite the fact that Teft, a full Radiant with his own bond was within feet of Rock. (You can make the argument that squires work doffeeently between orders, but I think that’s silly without something to indicate it.) Therefore in my opinion, when Szeth arrived at Thaylen City, he already had already attracted a spren bond, despite not having yet sworn the Third Ideal.

I tend to agree with Calderis as well. I don't wish to put anyone down or anything, but I think it's highly unlikely that these are oaths, aside from "I will take responsibility for what I have done." Brandon has really ratcheted down on giving out oaths lately, wishing to save them for the books themselves. "You cannot have my pain" and "My Glory and my Shame" are both really significant lines in the book, which are things Brandon tends to use as personalizations by default. They don't read like Ideals in my opinion. Still very cool though, congratulations on getting to meet him!

I think it’s sntirely possible that this was a test of loyalty. I’m not sure why the Fused didn’t do it, but I saw someone point out once that this would be an uncomfortable reminder for them that they too are mortal and potentially vulnerable to that weapon, which I think is an interesting idea.

Well, I mean the Lord Ruler creates them for the specific purpose of spewing ash, so if there were a way to optimizing that, I’m sure he did it. And the ash isn’t typically a meter deep. That was only after Ruin had been freed to influence the world. Before that there was some, but not too much. They were raking it away from the crops but it wasn’t burying the entire surface like it does in HoA.

From conversations I've had, the general feeling that I've seen is that this Blade is Nightblood 2.0. It seems to lack some of his more terrifying effects and function more like a regular Shardblade, except for the summoning. Perhaps she got it from Yesteel, or learned to craft it from him.

Also, please refer to the spoiler policy that can cleary be seen in the announcements. You failed to use the [OB] in the topic title and you put a major book spoiler in the topic title, which are both not allowed. I'm sure you didn't mean anything by it, but please try to be thoughtful and respect those that have not yet finished the book. Thanks!

I think Eshonai is dead. The spren at her corpse is a lightspren that was in the process of bonding with Eshonai that Venli inadvertently picked up. Timbre mentions her grandfather being killed by the Radiants, that doesn't make sense for her to be Eshonai. I want Eshonai to be dead, we've had enough lucky breaks for our characters.

On 11/15/2017 at 9:42 AM, Pagerunner said:

Ba-Ado-Mishram provided Forms and Voidlight during the False Desolation, as referenced in the stormlight archive epigraphs. (Or is that not a good name for the gemstone library in Urithiru?) Odium normally provided both, but Ba-Ado was able to fill in for a period of time, resulting in the war that was happening during the Feverstone Keep visions. With Odium returned through a proper Desolation, they can take on forms without Ba-Ado. But she still has a big role to play as a commander,

Exactly my thoughts as well!

1 hour ago, Aleksiel said:

Are you saying that sphere is another perfect gem then? Because otherwise the voidlight should have evaporated already. Well, that and regular spheres don't seem to hold voidlight judging how the everstorm passed Kaladin in the beginning and his spheres remained dun, but that's inconclusive, we didn't see anyone attempting to charge spheres in the everstorm. Still, it's suspicious it glows dark after so much time.

I would point out that we don't know how long the Voidlight was in those spheres. Gavilar has them on hand and gives them away casually. We've not seen Szeth's or Eshonai's since. It's possible that they've gone dun in the intervening period. In my mind, if they were perfect gems or Unmade trapped in a gem, Gavilar would not be handing them out like party favors, in my opinion. A regular old sphere full of Voidlight is much less valuable. 

1 hour ago, KidWayne said:

The Stormfather sends visions to whomever he wants, it doesn't require a bond and Odium told Dalinar that he is the first to bond the Stormfather in his "current form" (i.e. since the Recreance / Death of Honor).

The Stormfather specifically mentions what the visions are for.

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I was given this leave: to choose those who would best be served by the visions. He paused, then grudgingly continued. To choose a Bondsmith.

Oathbringer chapter 28

Gavilar may not have gotten as far along in his bond, he may not have sworn any oaths yet, but there is no doubt in my mind that he was a nascent Bondsmith.

Unfortunately Brandon has confirmed many times that any of his stories that touch on Earth at all are not a part of the cosmere, as he doesn’t want Earth to exist in the cosmere. Sorry, good idea though!

I think that this very clearly indicates that the Nightwatcher is a Bondsmith spren. The Stormfather could be letting Dalinar come to his own inaccurate conclusions, but I don't think so.

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You do not remember. But normally, [Cultivation] hides. Cowardice.

“Perhaps wisdom,” Dalinar said. “The Nightwatcher—”

Is not her.

“Yes, you’ve said. The Nightwatcher is like you. Are there others, though? Spren like you, or the Nightwatcher? Spren that are shadows of gods?”

There is . . . a third sibling. They are not with us.

“In hiding?”

No. Slumbering.

“Tell me more.”

No.

Oathbringer Chapter 111

Well I also kind of don’t think that Taln will need to be replaced, I’m hoping he will recover in some way. So we may not need a modern Stoneward to be the Herald, although I’m sure we’ll see some modern Stonewards before long.

I'm curious if the Stoneward spren might be named keenspren? Wyndle made a garden for some of them, and there has been no indication that there are conscious spren aside from our nine types and then the larger spren like the Stormfather. It'd be odd to me if there were fully self-aware spren that are not associated with an order of Radiants.

One of the things that has been clear throughout the course of the Stormlight Archive is that the Heralds will play a crucial role in this series, particularly in the back half of this story, when they begin to get POVs. A longstanding theory has been that the Heralds need to be restored and returned to their former glory. Without the Heralds, there seems to be no hope of preventing an eternal Desolation, as the Fused are no longer held back when they are killed as they once were. However, with the final death of Jezrien the hope that the original Heralds will all return to their former roles is dashed. So the question remains now, what is the significance of the Heralds now that we know they will not all return to the Oathpact?

The primary goal of this theory is to reconcile a few odd facts that appear unconnected but in actuality stem from the same issue. The first is Nale's assertion that Radiants will cause a Desolation.

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“Others may be detestable, but they do not dabble in arts that could return Desolation to this world.” His words were so cold. “What you are must be stopped.”

Words of Radiance Interlude 9

We now know the way that a Desolation is triggered. When any one the Heralds on Braize in the past yielded to the torture of the Fused a Desolation began. If they died during the fighting they returned to Braize instantly. Those who survive are required to return to Braize in a short period of time, otherwise the Voidspren and the Fused would no longer be held back and the Desolation would begin again. When the Heralds abandoned the Oathpact, they quit being Heralds and gave up their Blades. This trick worked since they all did it. Now there was only one Herald and he was in Damnation, so the Oathpact held barely, since technically all the Heralds were on Braize like they were supposed to be. Taln's eventual break is what allowed the Voidspren to return. But what does any of this have to do with regular Surgebinders? How could they have triggered a Desolation? Luckily, Nale gets a little more specific.

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Unfortunately, no,” Darkness said. “I once thought as you, but Ishar made the truth clear to me. If the bonds between men and spren are reignited, then men will naturally discover the greater power of the oaths. Without Honor to regulate this, there is a small chance that what comes next will allow the Voidbringers to again make the jump between worlds. That would cause a Desolation, and even a small chance that the world will be destroyed is a risk that we cannot take.

Edgedancer Chapter 9

My belief is that this evidence indicates that "which comes next" to a Radiant is ascending become a Herald. In order for this to happen, it would require that person to take up a Herald's Honorblade. This is the danger that Radiants once posed. If one of them had reached the fifth Ideal and somehow gained access to an Honorblade, they could have inadvertently taken that next step and become a Herald. The second that occurred, the Oathpact would have been violated, because not all the Heralds would have been on Braize like they were supposed to be. This would instantly trigger a Desolation. In the past, when Honor still lived, he prevented this from occurring. But now he is no longer around to mediate this. For this reason, Nale has been hunting down Surgebinders so that they cannot take this final step.

This brings us to another oddity, the Skybreakers themselves.  Nale's explanation does not explain why the Skybreakers are exempt from this campaign of murder. What prevents them from accidentally doing something to trigger another Desolation once they reach the power of the higher oaths? Well, no Skybreaker has gotten there in a while.

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There are five Ideals,” he said. “Nin told me of this. You have spoken them all?”
“It’s been centuries since anyone mastered the Fifth Ideal,” Ki said. “One becomes a full Skybreaker by speaking the Third Ideal, the Ideal of Dedication.”

Oathbringer Chapter 90

 

With the notable exception of Nale, no Skybreaker has gotten to the Fifth Ideal in quite some time. This is either a coincidence, or something is going on here. It is also worth noting while we are on the subject, that Nale has retrieved his Honorblade.

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He stopped at the top of the steps and looked down at his hand, where a glistening Shardblade appeared. One of the two missing Honorblades. Szeth’s people had care of eight. Once, long ago, it had been nine. Then this one had vanished.

Oathbringer Chapter 106

The reason he excludes the Skybreakers from his purge is that he is there to personally run that order. No one has reached the fifth Ideal in centuries, which is odd to me. I believe that Nale has either secretly come to some sort of accord with the highspren that they will not allow the bond to progress that far or he has been quietly ending the lives of Skybreakers who have approached the Fifth Ideal. Nale's other safeguard is that he himself holds the Honorblade of the Skybreaker Herald. He went back for it to be doubly sure that no one will be able to inadvertently take up the mantle of a Herald. Note though, that Nale has not taken up the burden of a Herald again fully, otherwise the Voidspren would have returned long ago, since Nale has been on Roshar. However, despite having access his Honorblade, Nale has also seen fit to bond a highspren and become a Skybreaker himself.

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Nin held out his empty left hand. A Shardblade appeared there, dif­ferent and distinct from the Honorblade he carried in the other hand. “I am not just a Herald, but a Skybreaker of the Fifth Ideal. Though I was originally skeptical of the Radiants, I believe I am the only one who eventually joined his own order.

Oathbringer Chapter 106

Jezrien is dead now, and it is clear the Heralds must rise again to trap the Voidspren and the Fused (although hopefully they come to a more permanent solution this time). I believe that our heroes, Kaladin, Shallan, Dalinar, etc, each one more or less from one order will eventually be the ones to take up their respective Herald's mantle. The only oddity here is that we have two Lightweavers in Shalash/Shallan and no Dustbringer, but perhaps that will be resolved in some other way. The reason that Brandon chose to have Nale have his Honorblade and a spren is to foreshadow that a Herald may also be a member of their own order, so we don't have to worry about our main characters losing their spren when they become Heralds.

There is one more thing I'd like to touch on, but it's ranging into the speculative for me. I feel very strongly about the theory as presented so far, but this last corollary of sorts is a little out there. The final oddity I want to point out has to do with the death of Jezrien. When he is killed, something strange and very specific happens.

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The man trembled for a moment more, then jerked once, going motionless. When Moash pulled the yellow-white knife free, it trailed dark smoke and left a blackened wound. The large sapphire at the pommel took on a subdued glow.

Oathbringer Chapter 121

And now we see his death from Shalash's perspective.

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Ash stopped in place as something ripped inside of her.
Oh God. Oh, Adonalsium!
What was that? What was that?
Taln whimpered and collapsed, a puppet with cut strings. Ash stumbled, then sank to her knees. She wrapped her arms around herself, trembling. It wasn’t pain. It was something far, far worse. A loss, a hole inside of her, a piece of her soul being excised.
“Miss?” a soldier asked, jogging up. “Miss, are you all right? Hey, someone get one of the healers! Miss, what’s wrong?”
“They . . . they killed him somehow . . .”
“Who?”
She looked up at the man, tears blurring her vision. This wasn’t like their other deaths. This was something horrible. She couldn’t feel him at all. They’d done something to Jezrien’s soul.
“My father,” she said, “is dead.”

Oathbringer Chapter 121

The Fused are doing something very specific here. They do something to Jezrien's soul, which allows them to kill him fully. However, at least some portion of the Oathpact must have remained attached to his soul, because the bond between the Heralds was still intact, as evidenced by Shalash and Taln's reaction to Jezrien's death. That there is still something supernatural about the Heralds is certain, as they remain immortal (or close to it) and ageless as well. I think perhaps in this moment they stole whatever that characteristic of "Heraldness" was and trapped it in that strange dagger (there may be some variant of Hemalurgy at work here, or perhaps not). Now Odium both pieces, an Honorblade and the quality of "Heraldness" and maybe can now craft something new. I think it possible that Odium intends to craft a new Herald, one that is on his side. If one Herald were to intentionally refuse to return to Damnation, a Desolation could never end. So if Odium were to somehow make one of his supporters a Herald, he could ensure his troops could never be trapped again. Moash is the obvious candidate for this role, holding the Honorblade himself, but we have yet to see how the dagger will play into this. Perhaps Moash is not ready or perhaps they are waiting to prove himself yet again before entrusting such a responsibility to him.

Edgedancer is fully optional. It's helpful in understanding one particular sub-plot, but Oathbringer was written with the fact that not everyone will read Edgedancer in mind. Book rights are weird, it's entirely possible that eventually it will come out in your market but it may take more time. If you're so frustrated by being unable to read it that you're done with Brandon's books entirely, I guess that's your prerogative. Arcanum Unbounded is awesome, and contains additional art and essays on every planet as well as Edgedancer, so I think it's quite a good deal and bought it myself, even though I already had access to all the other stories in some format. Some of the other stories were previously only digitally available, so I enjoyed a chance to get them in print. I'm sorry for your frustration though.