Tamriel Wolfsbaine

Now I have to follow up in this thread with a question of my own. What exactly can these spren trapped in gemhearts do? If it is all RoW stuff I will be a while getting the answer (spoilers welcome) as life is preventing me from good reading time. I think it is a really interesting concept I had not thought of. I love Kandra and am always looking for a way to boost one a bit beyond the typical tool kit. Do you think there is a combination of spren in a gemheart that could bring a kandra without a blessing of potency near that level of physical power? Or would it at most augment them in a way that would negate some disadvantages that a non potency kandra would have against a potency kandra?

I watched The Bourne Legacy and it made me think of making a spy in the cosmere with enhanced mental and physical. I know there are lots of ways to do this though mixing of magics or feruchemy but I wanted to put it together with a bit of a specific kit. Kandra with the blessing of presence and the second part of the equation boils down to how eating and wearing a kolossblooded bones would work. Would a kandra gain any benefit from wearing a kolossbloodeds bones? I know Kandra can train up and make themselves stronger. I know they can make themselves a bit more dense or cause their muscles to be stronger. But would they gain any anatomical benefits from taking a kolossblooded body aside from the larger frame? Would a Kandra who ate a Kolossblooded learn whatever it is that makes them what they are faster? Would they be able to reproduce it in normal smaller frames? Would eating a kolossblooded give a similar benefit to a kandra as a blessing of potency or is the strength and speed increases from potency far greater than what a kolossblooded possesses?

I love Copper. I think copper is one of the strongest allomantic metals out there and I think it will have uses that stretch far beyond what we are used to as the cosmere opens up. I also think it gets a bad reputation sometimes. In my mind I like to think of copper as a sliding bar for use. I would love to imagine that someone practiced with copper would be able to shrink and grow their coppercloud focusing its power on smaller areas or spreading it more thinly over larger areas. But does copper really kill the other metals uses? I think I remember part of one of the books where it talked about not using copper all the time because then you can't seek and you can't manipulate people as much. But does it really? We see that every metal is a sliding bar. We see every metal can be flared for greater effect or barely burned at all for the most precise touches. Why not copper? Can a mistborn flare bronze and tone down their copper burn to seek outside of their cloud? Can a coppercloud be focused with more strength directly around the user while still having a smaller effect outside of that area? Could a mistborn make a coppercloud that is just big enough to cover a room or home and, though it may make seeking in that home impossible, still be able to hear and feel pulses outside of the home? As for zinc and brass, can a coppercloud focus a strong enough cloud to keep themselves immune while titrating the cloud enough to still be able to get some effect through it ending in slight manipulation of those near them while still causing a cloud? But I also think that it is easy to slap this false idea that copper is all or nothing and while using it you cant use half of your other abilities. I agree there should be some play around with it but titrating up and down and flaring vs keeping a low burn should really allow a lot of wiggle room right?

Yeah I am sure growing it under all of the soft tissue would be quite an unpleasant experience. As for the bendalloy... with the other aethers I had in mind I am sure it will be messed up more than anything. As for creating a roseite armor and weapons I feel like the bendalloy would be a perfect compliment for it. All of the benefits of growing as much aether as you can fit inside of the bubble while you are safely in the defensive position that is having a speed bubble. Youre enemies are starting up the rotary gun pointed at your position? You can throw up a bubble and grow up a wall of roseite. Not only are the bullets going to deflect randomly but you can really take your time repairing the wall as needed between them crossing the border. You just took a large hit or want to use a different weapon? Again, the bubble affords you the time to recuperate while you decide on any changes to strategy if needed. I would say a bendalloy compounder with roseite might be more dangerous in a scrap than Wayne even. Wayne had a chance of running out of health. The Aetherbound would likely be able to regrow nearly infinite amounts of armor as it is being damaged and the speed bubbles give as much time as they need. Instead of Wayne popping out of a bubble with another chunk of his gold reserves missing you would have this person coming back out with reset armor and a new weapon style of choice. I agree some Aethers would be a bit OP with the bendalloy bubbles being in play but I don't foresee it being the levels of bonkers that we get from swearing oaths. I dont see Aethers as being some massive offensive powerhouses. I see a ton of utility there for sure, but I think the system without some infinite juice hack like compounding is borderline underwhelming and existing more just for added flavor.

I don't know that the golem is out of the question for a compounder. I think that bendalloy compounding is the perfect combo for something like this because it allows both allomancy and feruchemy. Even if there is a timing issue where the aetherbound is limited in their ability to grow past a specific rate, the bendalloy bubble will over come that. Not only do they have a nearly infinite source of water to spend on what they make, but they also have the luxury of slowing down time to grow it and make it work. Initially I was just thinking that faster growth would take exponentially more water in comparison to something gradual and that A bendalloy would allow you to save water by slowing down the growth. I do think, now, that in addition to all of that you can make changes in combat no other aetherbound could. Where I am not sure how it would work is crossing the bendalloy bubble. I think growing aether in the bubble is the best option and least likely to have unintended consequences. It would be interesting to see what happens when so other aethers are being used from in a bubble but the part of them being used is outside the bubble. The golem is cool and fun but I am far more interested in the ways to use roseite to enhance things on the DL. Roseite linings around bones and limbs. Rosite weapons growing along arms and in hands. (The ultimate concealed weapons). Even roseite crystals just along the surface of the skin. Might be cool for some added durability. How well it works against certain magic swords is to be determined. I would pay money to see the look on a light eyed shardblade users face as he swings into a kandra and his blade stops mid swing on some aluminum truebody... in my mind I like to think that an aetherbound could reproduce this act given enough water to maintain the encasing of their skeletal system to an extent.

I sort of have this theory that what makes the shardblade do what it does is not just the investiture but also the intention and sentience that the weapon has. I think that Nightblood is so powerful because he exists as a thing on all 3 realms that was built for and exists for only 1 purpose. He is even better at being a shardblade than spren blades because he has nothing else that he exists for.

No joke. I just like starting these threads because it is interesting to see how others think. Honestly, I feel like I know who will be on what sides of each conversation as I am posting it but I do like getting suprised sometimes. I am very obviously biased against shards and am always hoping to figure out alternatives to standing up to the tyrannical Rosharan's who hold those shards to themselves! Joking aside I love Roshar. I think Roshar is a fascinating setting for a story. I even love shardplate and shardblades. But everything is more fun when there are viable counters to it. Roshar and the shardbearers might be liked by me so much for the simple reason that I see them as a huge hurdle to overcome. I really want to see something beat them. I have given up on the fight against radiants. I think overcoming the invulnerable plate and insta kill blade is step one.

I know we are in the wild land of speculation here but I really am curious about this for my own head cannon. Prasanva is sort of the only example for an Aetherbound we have. He makes creating smaller objects trivial even when much precision and exactness are needed (working glasses are pretty dope). He created a 3D map... but how big was it exactly? And he created a 12 foot tall golem of roseite. I am curious how people think this works. Does the water level share some relationship with the mass of the item created? I dont think Brandon made much fuss about how much water was being used other than Prasanva took a Scadrial equivilent to a Camelbak on his adventure. I dont remember him running it dry or even really sipping from it. I do remember him grabbing a jar of Dor and growing a golem. Now we have this scenario where it is thought that only a jar of Dor could make that happen. And liquid investiture is surely the best option out there right? I dont think so. The ghostbloods have a fairly decent tie to the southerners and I am shocked that Kelsier hasn't provided Twinsoul with a bendalloy medallion. But how much is that worth? I would say that pewter feruchemy is a pretty good example of how the magic can remove mass and keep it for later so I dont think that there would be a huge hookup on how fast you could store water. The world record soda chug was 1 liter in 6.8 seconds. That is a gallon in under 30 seconds. Our stomachs would usually be the limiting factor but I think that feruchemical storage should solve that issue. I will say people should take a breath but I dont think it is out of reality that someone could drink 3 gallons in 2 minutes if they had a literal bottomless stomach. 45 gallons in an hour. My garden hose spits out 15 gallons a minute so just standing in my house that 45 gallons in an hour should be well and possible. A gallon of water everyday is a solid amount of water and most people dont even get that much. In 1hour Prasanva could store a month and a half worth of water. Make him a compounder and that turns into more than a years worth of water once compounded a single time. So how much water do you really think it took to create that Golem? I know he grew it via liquid Dor but knowing how fast it could be stored up and then compounded does this make any sense? I guess that growing it rapidly might lead to some diminishing returns. I guess that the mass difference between the golem and the 3D map could be hundreds or even thousands of times greater. But with how fast you could store years worth of water via compounding I am really struggling to think that the aetherbound would be better off with a jar of dor than they could be with some access to compounding. I'm not saying that this is a viable strategy in terms of how accessible it is. Odds are even liquid jars of investiture will be easier to come by soon than having the ability to make compounders in bulk but I am curious what this says about metalmind capacity and the potential there. We already know that 1/16th of the bands is worth 2 seconds of sound barrier breaking. What could a jar of Dor offer an Aetherbound that a couple bracers full of water not?

I have a question about Aethers and Shards. How much do they bother eachother? It would seem the Aethers are not fans of the Shards but do the Shards even bat an eye at the Aethers? Can an Aetherbound be hidden from shardic notice via the power of their Aether? If an aetherbound were to aquire a spike of sorts could his Aether hide him from Harmony? Likewise could Harmony hide a person who is being searched for by an aether?

I don't doubt that it would break with hits from a shardblade. If only there existed a list of how much investiture certain things take to do certain things... Shardplate shatters with a few hits from a shardblade. Shardplate doesn't necessarily grow back right away though (living plate is a different story perhaps). But Roseite could theoretically continue to be regrown as fast as needed so long as a fuel source existed for it. Doesn't that make someone with access to a bunch of water and / or investiture more protected from blades than even someone in plate?

I am always on the hunt for life goals on how to save myself from a shardblade attack to my spine. I am curious to hear folks rank these and defend why you put what where. Kandra with aluminum bones (I have pictured some porous metal bone structures with the nerves woven carefully through them... perhaps each bone is an aluminum tube that the kandra can fill with the parts of them that would be considered spiritual in nature...) I know there is a WoB that says kandra can heal back and regrow shardblade killed limbs so I feel like this has to be near the top with aluminum truebodies being a possible thing. Shardplate... obvious. A stoneward who has used his surge to create a stone carapace or armor. Roseite aether golem or armor. Gold compounding Stormlight and an oath or two or five... Awakened armor Aluminum armor Others you can think of.

I have always had that same beef with shardplate as it cracks and then shatters. That is honestly a part of why I had posed the question in the first place. Invested armor that acts more like a rock than metal... A sort of new question to pose. How would roseite armor stack against a rock armor perhaps created by a stoneward? Would the investiture act differently and protect one more than the other?

I'm a total moron when it comes to this stuff. What about a sponge soaked in liquid dor? If the form that the investiture is in matters wouldn't a smaller amount of investiture hidden inside a more solid object be more capable against a shardblade? If the jar of liquid is that much more invested than the amount of water that could be crammed into a metalmind wouldn't something saturated in that liquid create a repelling barrier? I feel like I have seen WoBs indicating that cloth with enough breath will block a shardblade. Wouldnt liquid dor soaked into a sponge be more than that? But clearly softer materials need more investiture to defend against a shardblade. Clearly a metalmind, which is often looked at as having very little investiture, is still capable of blocking a shardblade when it is moderately to heavily full of an attribute. If you are using investiture to grow a crystal and maintain its existance wouldn't it continue to keep the connection to the spiritual realm that let it grow in the first place? Meaning it is at least invested enough for that. Unless the argument is that investiture comes from Adonalsium and aether comes not from investiture but then why would the dor work to power the suit in the first place?

I am curious about how investiture works against a shardblade. If a full metalmind is able to withstand a blow from a shardblade would a waterballoon filled with liquid dor resist a shardblade? I heard that the investiture might act sort of like magnets repelling eachother but I am not sure how convinced I am. If I take a quick bath in liquid dor would it be a protective layer against a shardblade?

This is interesting. So it can be used to stop bleeding and offer stability like a splint and tourniquet all in one. Its something. Not healing similar to gold and stormlight. I imagine the heat and light aether could be used to cauterize wounds as well perhaps great tools to be used in place of many instruments we see in hospitals today but no magical healing. I can definately see a surgeon using roseite in their practice. You can clamp and seal off vessels with roseite. I also imagine that roseite as it is grown would be considered sterile. If you had some form of the light and heat you could even cauterize and clean wounds with that as well. I wonder how difficult it would be to use Zephyr aether to create suction or blow precise puffs of air for cleaning areas as well? While there may not be much magical healing properties I do imagine that aether powers and future tech could replace a large portion of what we use in hospitals even today... instrument wise.

I wish this thread got more traction than this. A question that has stumped me is this. Are there any aethers that could fuel some sort of spiritual or physical healing?

I just feel like the WoBs provided by @Underwater_Worldhopper sort of crush that theory. I would be more inclined to believe that the Roseite was treated as uninvested if it wasnt for the fact that investiture is directly needed to sustain it even after it is formed. Is Wax not invested when simply using the minimum steel needed for steel sight since he isn't actively pushing? The need for investiture to maintain it proves that it is invested even after grown. I can't speak for how invested it is but I was under the impression that the roseite was still an extension of the Aether through the Aetherbound as more of a catalyst which would lend it to being highly invested even if it only requires a small amount of water / investiture to maintain. All that and I really don't think it would be a bad thing for the cosmere to see some more armor options that can stand up to the instakill machine that trivializes 140 hours worth of fantasy reading that is shardblades.

I really appreciate all of this. When asking about shrinking and growing, I must misremember the cave scene in TLM. I thought the golem was growing and shrinking both to fill in the space and create a wall of roseite for the prisoners to escape behind. I appreciate this indeed. I kind of assumed that the water was funneled and changed into the investiture form until it turned to dust. I agree that it probably won't act like a shardblade but I do think Roseite should be able to block attacks from one. Cracking and loosing chunks seems like a good balance but the beauty of a bendalloy compounder getting ahold of that power would be the potential wealth of hydration to continue repairing and replacing the spaces. Furthermore, does Aetherbinding drain water at the same rate based on size or is it a combination of size and growth speed? A bendalloy compounder could stretch their stores further if it is based on speed of growth as well since they could put up a bubble and take their time growing their aether slowly while having a near instantaneous appearance to the world outside around them.

This is a jump far into the theoretical, but what if an aetherbound were to gain access to bendalloy compounding? With as much metal as Miles had do you think that is more or less fuel than what that jar of Dor provided? With the advancements of hemalurgy and medallions I don't think it is out of possibility in the future. It is utterly impossible to know how well a jar of Dor compares to many metalminds being compounded but I am a fan of speculation. With the ghostbloods on the hunt for unkeyed investiture I am sure Kelsier has already started to speculate himself... why can't we on the shard?

I am trying to figure out what bonuses and benefits being an aetherbound can provide given the hydration is not an issue. It seemed the Twinsouls golem was capable of moving and a 12 foot high chunk of rock and crystal would be a significant amount of weight. So I am guessing that the invested roseite is offering a good portion of additional strength. I am curious if the golem would be capable of lifting any size mace or if the mace he created had to be sized proportionally to the golems size. I am also curious how the golem could be stopped given the hydration to maintain it. It is highly invested while being fed. Would it be able to be soulcast easily? Would the CC abilities from so many orders make a difference? If sunk down into the earth and then the earth hardened around it could it just grow and break free? Could vines or awakened rope hold it or could it just shrink and grow at will to escape them as well? How large could it get? Would a roseite aetherbound be able to grow a golem big enough to face off against a chasmfiend or a Thunderclast? I know the answers here are dependant on hydration and fuel. We already have the possibilities of bendalloy compounding and the unkeyed pure investiture that the ghostbloods are chasing. In a different sort of vs battle I would pose this match up. Rosite aetherbound vs shardbearer. Feel free to combine what limitations you want such as a water pack or some limit of spaces. I am very interested in this... Twinsoul walking down the caves and turns the corner to find a full shardbearer. Does size of the cave matter? If he can only become as big as the shardbearer who wins? If he can become twice the size of the shardbearer is that going to make a substantial difference in outcome? I figure there is a limiting time that both parties are facing. Once cracked plate will eventually drain. But I imagine it costs an amount of hydration to continue repairing chips and chunks that are taken out of the roseite golem by shardblade hacks and slashes. I don't think a shardblade will pass through it like stone as it is still an invested object.

Does Prasanva require constant water to keep the roseite in the world while touching it? Or is the water only a requirement while growing it? Did his golem suit continually drain investiture or was it only draining while being grown and regrown?

I am curious which planets are invested enough or have the right atmosphere or whatever to allow aetherboind creations to exist more long term? Is it simply a matter or the investiture on the planet? If an aether bound such as twinsoul were to get trapped in a field far away from shelter when a highstorm comes through and he decided to create a roseite shelter... Would he dehydrate himself maintaining it throughout the storm? Would Roshars native investiture levels allow it to be maintained in definately once created? Would the high storm fuel it and allow it to be maintained only while in the storm and then he would have to let it go or risk being dehydrated? Side question. How do you think aetherbinding would work in shadesmar / other cognitive realms?

Thank you for this. Very interesting. Regardless of color a body that was killed via her shardblade would probably produce some of the best lifeless due to being fully intact and having no real trauma to overcome with the breath.

I was thinking more in terms of how her shardblade might work. We know color is more than just color. I feel like her blade draining color is different that a withered up dead arm. I am not saying it couldn't be the case. I am just thinking color is a key theme and WoBs have been offered up to suggest that it is not just important to awakeners either. I also think there is a large difference between a gray squirrel having its color drained and trying to drain color from something that has already been drained of color. That said I now think I may remember instances of lifeless being too broken and being fed more breath again? Perhaps not but if that is the case then it would disprove a potential theory of Vivenna's blade ruining bodies from being able to be turned into lifeless.

I think the key is having 2 different metalminds. Tin is a great example for something that can be tapped and stored in at the same time... but it is not the same metalmind. Tapping your sense of feeling while storing your sense of pain would be a great use. Tapping hearing while storing sight because its dark in a cave could also be a good example. In the case of aluminum minds... to have an identity in one metalmind and tap it while storing yours fully into another metalmind should be possible. I can fill up one bottle of water from the faucet while dumping another down the sink. Its hard to dump and fill the same one at the same time.