Quintessential

Mmm that's true lol Edit: Oh, but it appears I was already taken off : P in that case I'll just wait to sign up again until I think of something.

Ohhh okay that's a good point. I could make the execution happen before passing, I don't think that would break anything... I should probably write up a full order of actions at some point lol

I think I might just set it on the back burner for now and come back to it once I've GMd a simpler game or two... for the moment I'm somewhat frustrated with it : P but I'll let you know if I need help once I start working on it again.

Yes, they can intentionally store up vials. However, I will probably make Iron quite common, so storing up the vials of steel instead of using them would come at the risk of them being stolen. Passing vials comes before the execution, I think. I haven't decided what will happen to vials held by a dead player. I might just say that the Ministry confiscates them. Or I could say the Ministry confiscates vials that executed players had but if a player is coinshotted, the vials go to the killer. Not sure yet.

Is there a way to like... un-sign-up for a slot? If so, can I be taken off the LG list? I don't think I'll have an LG ready very soon (not that I think the list will get to me very soon but whatever). Also, can I get an MR slot?

Thank you but it isn't exactly the game I was talking about. This is more "I want to do an LG1 rerun but also I don't want to do an LG1 rerun" XD I've been trying to figure out how to put together a Twinborn game with all the Allomantic and Feruchemic abilities, or a Mistborn game with all 16 metals, but it always just ends up really... messy. So I decided something like this would work better.

I just put this together in the last hour or so: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1RFGvMNhazbccEZJY-U5Y4egsCQw-Z8xhXVVR9n_G69A/edit?usp=sharing. Thoughts?

As you say, this is more of a game-meta as a whole opinion, but I find that games with mechanics that absolutely confirm someone's alignment somewhat miss the point of mafia. It's a social deduction game, and including ways to 100% clear someone makes it less about deduction and more about exploiting that mechanic. I feel like it kind of takes away some of the complexity of the game, the process of using logic and reasoning and reads instead of roles to figure out who the elims are--that's kind of what I like about mafia, I guess? Idk, I've still had fun playing games with alignment confirmation mechanics, but I don't think I'll ever run one. And, as a sidenote, I always play Among Us with visual tasks off my family and I used to play with them on but then we realized that roughly half the group got visual tasks each game, so we could basically confirm all but one of the crewmates before the imps even got in a kill.

I'm trying to decide how much effort I want to put into this... last time I did really long analyses in an SE game I ended up burnt out afterward and didn't even care that I was up for the exe, so I'd rather avoid doing that... but on the other hand, I don't know what I think. Ideally I'd be going back through all the posts that Liranil and Bard have made to try to get a bead on them--and probably the posts by Dannex, Gears, and Ash... and the posts by everyone else? To try to figure out what I think because as it is I don't know anymore. I still find Bard's voting on but their recent analysis feels vil to me--especially the fact that they marked way more people as elim reads than could actually be elims... for some reason, that doesn't seem like an elim thing to do... ahhhh I don't know. why does it feel like Gears' analysis is trying to pocket me??? .......if so it's working. Okay, so I think I'm gonna revise my elim guesses again... I've decided that I don't want to experience burnout so I'm not gonna do any hardcore ISOs. But this is... my thought-process, more or less. Of these people, I know that I'm village, so pool of suspects becomes Much as my tinfoil brain keeps shouting at me to look more closely at Liranil ("It could have been a bus!" "Notice that Illwei never had a final vote on Liranil!" etc.), I'm just gonna remove her for the moment because I read her as vil and she did have a vote on Illwei. Some might not agree with me on this, but I'm removing Gears from the list for the moment. My tinfoil brain is even more appalled at this one, given that I've been pocketed by Gears before, but he really truly does seem normal to me. Especially with his recent analysis of all of Illwei's posts ("in which he didn't actually say anything we didn't know already!" "That's just easy village points" etc.). I'm also removing Bard for the moment--their analysis felt village, especially the fact that more people were listed as elim reads than could actually be elim... which I feel because I currently mildly suspect everyone XD so that seems vil to me. From here it gets harder. If I assume that none of Bard/Liranil/Gears have pocketed me, and if I'm assuming a 4-person elim team originally, that means half of this pool is elim... but I don't actually know whether that's the case... I'm just gonna assume it is. To do otherwise would make things way too complicated and make room for way too much tinfoil. Next off the list is Connie. This is a really dumb reason, but Connie has yet to actually lie in a game--and notice, while she's said multiple times that she's claiming elim, she's never said she is one. Also, having seen elim!Connie, she's usually... more subdued, if that makes sense? Less engaged in the game. I think. Of course, at this point I've broken the assumption that all of the exe trains on villagers had elims in them--but that could very well have been a poor assumption, especially in a game where most of the elims are probably inactive (if they weren't, I'd guess they'd have tried to create a counter-train to Illwei--there were only three votes on her, after all). So. Uh. I think I'm gonna address Dannex next, but as of starting to write this I have no idea what my conclusion will be. Because Dannex seems... basically normal. Dannex frequently proposes crazy ideas and plans and such, but then I think he's done that as elim too... like, the one time that we were both elims, that is. vil!me has never played with elim!Dannex before so I'm not totally sure what that would look like. But... okay, look. I think. So, looking at Liranil's summary post (or looking at the actual thread, it's evident there too), Illwei really never did seem to make up her mind about Dannex? Like, she read him as vil C1 but then sussed him C2 and then defended him C3... I... that doesn't feel e/e to me? It draws too much attention to Dannex in connection to her, something that I'd think Illwei would avoid... I'm not sure. If Dannex seems to be the best exe option at the end of this cycle I'll vote for him, but otherwise I'm looking elsewhere I think (even though my instincts are currently screaming at me that this is a terrible idea...) Great, okay, so I know at least one of the people in that box is vil (unless there really was a 5-person team? But that seems... really excessive lol--also would note that if it was 5 people then we're at exe-lo right now... jeez just thinking about that reminds me of QF48 XD but it's probably a 4-person team so probably not something we need to worry about... right?) but I don't know which one. Or two or three or four, if I screwed up somewhere already (who are we kidding, I probably did : P). Uhhh okay.... of these people I suspect Reading the least for some reason? Or maybe not... Illwei poke-voted them twice, and the second time she asked if they were even in the game... idk, that could be genuine or faked and I have no idea which : P I do still think Kings is weird... and Ash. So I guess if I had to remove someone it'd be... Reading. Illwei's vote on Random last-minute there could have been an IKYK but... idk. I just don't know. So I guess my new guess(ish) for the elim team is Illwei/Ash-Books/Kings/Random. But I'm. Not sure. I don't know what I thought I'd get out of this oof. I suppose I should also list the people I'm pretty(?) sure aren't elim... that would be Liranil, Connie, Gears, and Bard in order of certainty (Liranil being most certain). Sooo yeah. Uh. How about Random Bystander, huh? I'm gonna end up changing that vote like ten times this cycle aren't I...

Oh. Well I'd started a kind of ISO thing on Illwei last night but then I had to go to bed before I could finish it... oof. Yours is better/more concise anyway lol. Crazily enough, this is what first made me sus of her. It was so small that I didn't think it was worth pointing out in and of itself, but... well, she theorized a team of five and then state firmly that she didn't think there was one on the next page, without even referencing that she... had thought so before? Other than that, things I noticed from your very helpful summary: Illwei's interaction with Dannex was... weird? Like, first cycle she read him as vil, second cycle she started saying he was sus for his thing about Bard, third cycle she defends him again... yeah that's real odd. I have absolutely no idea whether that means they're e/e or whether Illwei was just busy and kept forgetting what her opinion on Dannex was? But then Illwei also said she takes notes as elim so that wouldn't be it, right? : P idk. I looked at the people that Illwei tagged in the first two posts--the three people that were in the first post but not the second were you, Mat, and Gears. I understand why she left you and Mat off--you were both voting for her and I assume she gave up hope that that would change--but why Gears? Maybe I'm reading too much into this and she forgot to tag him or something XD but it still seems odd. Since he hadn't voted and all. Right? Okay so there really aren't that many things I got out of that. Hopefully Liranil will have more thoughts I'll probably post on ISO on Mat (and maybe on you, Liranil?) later.

This is the same sort of analysis as I did last cycle, but extended a bit (by which I mean a lot lol). Will do an ISO later. Busy now.

Here you go! I'm not sure what your analysis will include so I'll hold off on even starting mine saying anything until after it's posted.

Would like to note: I just went back and looked at a couple of the games I played in where vil!Illwei got exed or almost exed and she... uh... never reacts like this? idk, typically she's basically just kinda resigned, and throws a bunch of random votes out there but, like, not super seriously? idk. Could be nothing. But that does strike me as odd. Won't be on from now until rollover.

I... ahhhh I'm sorry I would actually sit down and think about this but I have this stupid virtual lab that's taking like 3 times as long as I thought it would so I can't and I'm just gonna Illwei and then leave to finish it because I don't even know at this point but Liranil so does not read elim to me and Illwei's comment about having no resistance is... like, really odd...

: P Liranil I went back and looked at the stuff you pointed out in my own analysis and you may have a point. Besides that, I really don't like this association between me and her because while I can see where it came from, I also... like, happen to know that it's wrong? lol so I'd rather just get this out of the way. If she flips elim then we've got ourselves an elim to analyze, and if she flips vil then maybe you'll all leave me alone about the connection between us or something. Though actually, voting on her would probably get me voted off anyway... whatever. But on the other hand... Little resistance? Yeah that just changed. : P problem is, that change seems to be stemming from Mat (who I can't imagine being elims with you) and myself (whom I know to be vil). Ughhhh something here doesn't make sense and I have too much hw rn to sit down and figure out what.

End of this post, in the edits. Edit: To be clear, I didn't realize it wasn't obvious I was joking until people kept bringing that post up this cycle, otherwise I would have explained it earlier : P

*rubs eyes* I... was... joking.. how many times am I gonna have to say this smh.

I mean, I suppose that's fair. Normally I'd argue that the elims could vote-manip to change the result but there's no vote-manip in this game so that's not a concern : P

Current VC, because why not : P Quinn (1): Illwei Connie (1): Dannex Kings (1): Random Illwei (2): Matrim, Quinn Random (1): Connie So uh... can we condense a bit? @Dannex@Random Bystander@Condensation would any of you consider moving your votes to Illwei?

*cough* QF49 *cough* ...okay please make up your mind, was my read on him wishy washy or was it pretty solid? I will say that I don't think it was (or even still is) at all solid. I don't know where you got that impression. I listed him as null elim, not even mild. I had Kings as null because when I composted that reads list, they had done exactly nothing to distinguish themself. I've never played a game where Kings has been active, so that didn't feel off to me. I'm voting on them now because as of this cycle, they've demonstrated that they've been paying more attention than their participation would otherwise suggest.

That's... not the question you asked? You asked me why I didn't address the Ash/Liranil/Matrim thing on its own. To clarify, I find it interesting because A. there are only two of you, not three, so that's easy enough to analyze and B. both of your votes the previous cycle were odd too (imo that is). Sorry if I didn't make that clearer. In this post. You only acknowledged the last thing I said, and not the rest of it. 1) yes and there were four other people voting on him, three of them vil. Besides, I guess my point is that he did act that way in QF50, even if it wasn't why he was exed. 2) This isn't actually relevant to anything so idk why I'm responding to it but the cycle ended in a v/v tie? : P k so I'm gonna assume you talked about it with TJ but I definitely never saw anything about Ash. Ever. And yeah, my point is that suspicions have to come from somewhere, and yours on Ash doesn't seem to have from what we mere mortals can see in the thread. Actually, I'm curious about your suspicion on Gears too? You mentioned Ash by name and no one else (in that post that I was responding to with the post I linked to). That's why I'm fixating on him. : P And, cool, all my reads are flimsy. I still intend to vote someone, since I can't imagine anyone else's reads are all that much better than mine--except for the elims, we're all working off the same source material. ...also isn't it kind of a contradiction to inform me that all my reads are flimsy and then tell me I should have voted on my (wishy washy) elim read at the start of the cycle, all in the same breath? I know Ash and Mat have posted since I started writing this so I'll edit in responses if I think they're necessary ig Edit: @Ashbringer can you explain to my why everyone thinks that I was being serious in my response to Mat's vote on me halfway through C1? Since apparently this hasn't been obvious to anyone, allow me to clarify: the next to me saying I was going to die was supposed to indicate that I happen to be aware that votes usually shift dramatically between 24 hours into C1/D1 and the end of C1/D1 (unless it's a QF ig?) and that I was not overly concerned about having the most votes, especially since one of them was a joke vote that I'd put on myself? I mean. How is that not clear to everyone. Further, my vote on Bard was never intended to stay there--it was just me moving my joke-vote off of myself in a way that created a temporary tie. So can we please just drop that? I was literally not being serious in any of that post. And yet people keep bringing it up over and over and over again. Also yes I've since realized that I did vote on Bard but at the time that I said Bard must have been thinking of Mat, I genuinely didn't remember that I had voted on Bard too, because it was a joke.

lol yeah no I looked at it a little more closely and was like hmmm wait that could work. For now I don't think Liranil's elim but I wouldn't be averse to looking back at her later on. Well, or me and Liranil : P since I have no way of proving I actually intended to exe her C1... but yeah. That makes sense. I ended up not using that section for any of my final conclusions but I stuck it in there in case someone else found it helpful or something : P Because green's a color that actually means something when used on living players (such as myself). Wasn't sure it would be alright to use it. But would they have realized it would end up that way? They were voting on me, indicating they intended me to die and not Brighteyes (whether as elims or village is still in question obviously). And if they'd chosen TJ as the kill early on in the cycle, then they might not have noticed that he also had a vote on me. Besides, the conclusions of that are dependent on me being vil, which you seem to have forgotten is still technically unknown for everyone but me. Yeah, and Gears as well. Though. Idk. I don't see that being a thing tbh XD but it could be.

Right, I could, and if you flip elim I'll certainly look into him as well! Thank you for reminding me to write that down but my point with emphasizing Ash is that A. I'm currently reading Gears slight vil for some reason (though who knows how trustworthy my reads on Gears are...) and Ash slight elim and B. Ash voted for Brighteyes last cycle, and is the only person to do so whom I think could be elim at this point. I have a hard time seeing either Mat or Liranil as elim right now, and I have a hard time seeing the Brighteyes train as entirely vil. Also, why didn't you put it in order? That's just... really confusing : P and I assumed it was in order since you put the person you're voting for (me) at the top. Okay I'm... very very confused by this. You just asked me why I didn't consider the [Ash, Liranil, Matrim] thing more carefully and then immediately gave me reasons why it wouldn't be very useful? I agree, on its own it's not useful, which is why I didn't look at it on its own. I didn't say Brighteyes' posts had nothing in them? That wasn't why I was sus of her. I thought a couple of timing things were odd--her asking for a VC out of nowhere and then not saying anything about it or voting, her choosing to vote someone who hadn't been talking a lot immediately after a bunch of us started saying that "hey, maybe none of us are elim!" and so on. A. I've already explained this, which by the way you didn't respond to at all : P and B. obviously I'm not ignoring him this round. Not anymore, at least. Given that he's said so little I wasn't going to start the round off with a vote on him--I intended to go back and look at him more closely first, which I've now done. The problem with me just solid elim-reading him from that is that he does that in vil games too. He got exed for it in QF50, in case you've forgotten that. Hence the null elim read originally. Also, if you've found it so sus that he's been popping in and out without saying much, then how come you haven't mentioned it before now? Iirc your post 2 hours ago was the first time you ever even mentioned your suspicion of him, and before that I had the impression that you were vil-reading him, and sussing me in part because I had him down as null elim for what you considered flimsy reasoning? Maybe I'm remembering wrong, but that's what it seemed like to me. Also, I know I get called out for assuming other people play elim the way I do--in a similar vein, Illwei, please stop assuming that I play vil the way you do, because I don't. I have far less exposure to forum mafia than you do and this site is far chiller than some of the ones you play on, so I'm still a little new to what I'm supposed to do with reads, or what counts as a wishy-washy read, or at what point I should just make up my mind and vote on someone.

*rubs eyes* okay so I just read back through the past two cycles and this one (sort of) focusing on votes. I don't know how useful my analysis of it actually is but I figure I'll post it here. Please don't yell at me for mostly assuming myself vil : P you can just omit that from my analyses if you want. Okay, so people I'm currently suspicious of: Illwei and Young Bard for voting patterns. Kings for the (admittedly kinda small) reason that I'm voting them for. Ash for... idk I still read him null elim XD there's nothing much to go off of... except for A. what I said about him last cycle and this cycle and B. he actually... makes a lot of sense as e/e with Illwei? I mean, he and Illwei have studiously ignored each other up until now--or rather, Ash has been mostly inactive and Illwei has ignored him completely except to call me out for my read on him being wishy washy?--but then Illwei lists him third on her list of people-I'd-be-down-to-exe-today? Before Matrim, whom she's been sussing this entire game? (edit: even though she doesn't want to exe inactives, and Ash basically is one?) I'm kind of confused by that, and I find it hard not to see as distancing. But y'know what, @Matrim's Dice? I think I'll vote on Illwei after all. Let's see how this goes... (in case it wasn't clear, I'm currently theorizing/tinfoiling an Illwei/Bard/Ash/Kings elim team. If Illwei flips vil that basically dismantles the Ash part, though I'd still look into Bard and maybe Kings more closely)

Pretty sure they'd have won by now if that were the case XD