Requiem17

I am in line with this theory too, that the Fleet story is more than foreshadowing Kaladin's Book 2 arc but also Kaladin's whole 5 book arc. Except my brain keeps thinking he won't become Honor but rather the Wind and send out windspren shardplate like a Rosharan Oprah. Now I'm wondering if The Girl Who Looked Up is foreshadowing more than just the Book 3 reveal or Herald stuff. Maybe it's supposed to signify Shallan worldhopping. Looks up and sees the rest of the Cosmere or something. Hmmm.

I agree with what some others are saying that it wasn't explicitly stated in the books. Do you perhaps listen to the 17th Shard podcast? I listened to their recent B-A-M episode and they referenced an earlier Recreance episode where they'd all concluded and agreed that the spren were willing participants in the Recreance. Perhaps that's where you heard it, or enough commenters in the forum had heard it for the idea to spread.

I savored every chapter. Every moment with these characters was delicious. So glad the 17th Shard exists and is so active to give me something to hold on to until the next Brandon book! Some stand out moments for me besides the part 5 insanity: - Wishing Kaladin would fight during the beginning of the occupation. Then when he did finally fight back and I realized how bad it was for him mentally... I felt so guilty. - When Formless took over I seriously thought Shallan was a fake persona for a moment. - I can't get the image of the cryptic in Ishar's spren experiment out of my mind. So disgusting and horrifying. - Venli's scenes make me want to go make ceramics by hand.

I can get behind this theory!

I think Moash is due for a good ol' GRRM satisfactory death. I am liking the idea of he loses Odium's favor and can't live with the guilt. I don't hate him though, I agree with what was said earlier, that I understood and agreed with his initial anger. He called Navani out on the Roshone thing which I appreciated. Dalinar didn't learn from his mistakes - literally sent the abusive ex-highprince to live a luxurious, if mostly imprisoned, life in Azir, where I'm sure Dalinar assumes he can't hurt anyone anymore. And for the purposes of the books he probably won't. Still it frustrates me that Dalinar hasn't had to learn from that mistake. Doesn't mean I forgive Moash though. Just wish there were more characters saying some of the caste-system things he says.

1. Journey before destination, you bastard. - I likely won't forget that line ever. Too badass. 2. I will seek freedom for those in bondage. - I've been hyped for a Willshaper Oath ever since I found out it was my order.

I've been anticipating this thread all book and I love that I can finally jump in and comment! Everyone's ideas are awesome. I agree that it's probably something simple, three or four words. 1. I can see a general Windrunner Fifth Oath being "I will protect... Myself" where myself is interchangeable. 2. Kaladin and Teft have called themselves the watchers on the rim a few times. I could see another version being "I am the shield" or something similar. 3. I think Kaladin breaks the mold though. I think he does something insane like "I am the Wind". > He talks about an affinity for the wind his whole life > Fleet started his race in the West, nearly fell in the Azish mountain range like Kaladin in RoW, and ultimately dies in Shinovar, where Kaladin goes Book 5. He then rises as part of the storm / the wind. > The idea of Kaladin Stormblessed is becoming mythical even to people who know him as a man. > Syl hints at the sadness she'll go through when Kaladin eventually dies. Kaladin also mentions how falling isn't quite the same as Syl's flight. I think these things are foreshadowing that Kaladin and she will get to ride the winds together forever. > I personally think this will be the way to escape the chemical imbalance he deals with and finally be happy. But I think it was really important for him to (invent?) therapy first, because it's definitely important to see that as an option. Had there not been a war I can see him taking therapy far. I still believe the research / methods will continue on after him. This is my way out on a limb theory but I'm going all in on it. My issue with my own crazy crackpot theory is how does being the wind even help the war effort at all. Unless he can become shardplate for everyone.

I'm enjoying how much of a mystery this is and how terrifying Teravodium is. Taravangian as Odium terrifies me more than any Shard ever has. Of the theories I've seen Gavilar has my vote too. I can't imagine who else would be a better character growth moment for Dalinar, besides the foreshadowing people have quoted from the books. My one issue is I don't know if I can believe that Gavilar would win. But that would align with y'all's "tie" plan, or some other Taravodium plan, and he is just using the Champion as a feint the entire time. The only thing I disagree with is a tie would allow Taravodium to be free of the Rosharan system. I can see back five Taravangian getting free, but not front five. My mind is going in circles and everything seems possible though. Great setup by Brandon.

I had been operating on the theory Rlain had found the Listeners that fled, but it sounds like he's back with the Windrunners and no mention of a Listener tribe. I'd like Venli to have started a correspondence with the Listeners that escaped, or be with them already, I very much like the idea of her leading a resistance by the end of this book.

https://www.tor.com/2014/08/06/stormlight-archive-scene-after-words-of-radiance/ I had a lot of trouble dealing with Jasnah being so experienced a soulcaster, and doing nothing to help Shallan escape, but then I found the above "missing scene". It answered most of my concerns with what happened there.

Oh man I totally forgot about that. So much happening week to week! I guess I'll revise and guess a "both move to the next place" chapter.

Agreed, my bet is a "heading back to Urithiru" for both teams chapter. Then a Venli chapter after. And then just to have fun predicting: Kaladin and Laral will see / talk to each other when he tells the news of Roshone Some Kaladin guilt when faced with Navani and how he didn't kill or apprehend Moash Kaladin turns his brain off by going to help the villagers get settled. Shallan is super hard to predict, lots of mysteries on her end. But I'll guess mostly Shallan fronting, and maybe a thought about talking to Szeth who is currently in jail when they get back to Urithiru.

From the one line we have of Dai-Gonarthis I'm inclined to agree! Shallan's father seems to be constantly stewing in his own pain.

I wrote these down in a document before preview chapters released so I could mark if I was right or wrong as I read! I tried to write down only ones that weren't already common beliefs, like the Sibling being half Honor half Cultivation etc. This will be fun to see everyone's: Adolin heals Maya so that she becomes a Sprenblade again. He does not become an Edgedancer though. Navani has spent the past year trying to figure out Urithiru as a giant fabrial. Navani bonds the Sibling by the end Kaladin swears the fourth ideal and it's on the lines of "the one you can save" Dalinar cannot make perpendicularities at will, that was just an oath powerup, similar to what Kaladin gets when he says an oath. We visit another Spren city - I guessed this before I knew about Lasting Integrity happening. Szeth was in jail on a mission, not because of being imprisoned for his crimes Venli becomes a Willshaper officially. Rlain found the Listeners Gaz heals his eye, but it always sees into Shadesmar. Voidbringers are in the black spheres They've collected another perfect gemstone, or know where to find one by the beginning of the book, and are on their way to get it We'll see at least one more Herald die. The big reveal will be how the Shattered Planes were created We'll see the last Unmades. Adolin and Shallans relationship will be going okay, they'll have some rough spots but no risk of divorce Venli will trap a Fused in a gemstone We'll figure out what Unmade influenced Shallan's family, and it'll be one of the two we know nothing about. & That & Pattern are her last secret. Shallan hit fifth ideal as a child and gained the Memory ability. The Oathpact will be broken in Book 4 or 5, and this will be the Heralds' last lives.

I love the idea of manifesting plate right here! I'm torn between, how can Veil kill Ialai without finding out who the spy is first, and Ialai is too smart to let that skip, so 1. Ialai has to live and get captured. Or 2. Veil totally does kill Ialai, the spy remains a mystery, and this all happens right before the Moash surrendering scene. I can't decide whether Brandon would go with a parallel plotline there - both assassinations happen - or something opposite.

This just gave me a vision of future Roshar with huge underground malls/shopping centers/subways, where when Highstorms are coming, people just hop into the underground version of their city and continue life as normal.

There are quotes back in WoK where Kaladin sees the Listeners fighting with more honor than the Alethi. The first example I remember is when Bridge Four holds the bridge at the end; Kaladin realizes the Listeners didn't attack his wounded men, and came at them one at a time. My two cents is this is the Singer's original culture, and other Fused have just moved away from it. I don't think it always has to go back to the Shards. Sigzil mentions a people that are more about posturing. And we know the Reshi do something similar. I guess we could say Honor told them to do that too, but it feels like a cop-out to me. A people can't be good enough to decide to minimize death without a Shard instigating that thought?

Agreed, makes way more sense. I'll go with Restares is that other man that talked a lot. If it's not, then hopefully Restares is the spy near Dalinar, and we just haven't figured out who he is.

I didn't think of Ruthar, but it would make sense for him to stay loyal to Ialai. Ultimately replacing Ruthar and Ialai and getting two more loyal people in their places would deal with some of that lingering drama, and close that plotline too.

This WOB bothers me. Why would a darkeyed person have a drastic eye color switch to the order of the blade, and lighteyes don't? Even though this WOB makes it untrue, I was much more comfortable with the thought that darkeyes are like Moash was initially described in WoK - just a really dark shade of a color, like green. And when they're really invested, like when bonding a Shardblade, it causes a temporary/permanent brightening of their eyes. This eye color switching and retroactively changing Moash's description just bothers me. I concede defeat though, and trust in Brandon to explain this better via Moash in RoW (fingers crossed).

My problem with this is who exactly is Dalinar's inner circle - his family + Kaladin + the Coalition right? I hope Jasnah has wrangled the highprinces and we don't have to deal with them much. I also want to be as surprised by the "spy" as Shallan, so that makes me hope it's not Taravangian. But Taravangian is the only person I can think of that has plans in place to benefit if Dalinar is ousted. Or what if it's someone else from the Diagram, Androtagia maybe? Now I'm really off in the weeds, but it might be interesting to see Taravangian have to denounce her, his last real friend.

Great summary. What about this tinfoil that I've decided to go with because why not: Perhaps Restares was one of the people in this group. I'd guess the man who keeps talking to Shallan alongside Ulina, maybe even this strangely tall guy.

Yup, and likely also blaming himself for everyone else not swearing higher ideals.

We were pretty close! I thought we'd see at least one from Bridge 4, and it was much better to get a glimpse of nearly all the named ones. The Kalalyn closure was great too. I had thought Shallan would wake up in a dark room. Having them be in the chasms was much more interesting, that's a smart author for you! I'm seriously starting to wonder what Renarin is up to. Now for Chapter 6 predictions... S/V/R: We'll see Adolin on screen. Shallan will get a message to him subtly and run off with at least one of the SoH. I so badly want her to end the SoH, that'll be a great emotional payoff for me. Kaladin: Likely leaves Leshwi to chase the new Fused. Kaladin keeps dropping so many other wild bits of information, I can't imagine what else he'll tell us. I'd like to know Kaladin's musings on why no one else has sworn the fourth ideal.

Ugh so much interesting stuff this chapter, waiting for the book is so hard! Kaladin usually fights like a force of nature, and I think this is why his team kept coming up to him during the fight. We of course know he's depressed, but they must have seen him fighting as if he were just going through the motions, and it worried them enough to ask after him. I think that's partially what's going on with Leshwi. He respects her and doesn't seem to really want to kill her, or any of the flying Fused, on top of being depressed.