Child of Hodor

Here is a likely incorrect theory based on a random connection I made while reading some WoBs. Harmony is composed of Preservation and Ruin, but it has more Ruin because Preservation was used to give humans on Scadrial sentience. Brandon has teased that Sazed is doing something with that extra Ruin. It's likely something on the planet that will be covered in The Lost Metal since that alludes to Atium the solid form manifestation of Ruin's Investiture which no longer exists due to Ati dying and Sazed picking up two Shards. BUT, it occurs to me that Brandon said Nightblood contains Ruin's investiture and that it's not just residual trace amounts that are all over the Cosmere. Did Endowment work with Sazed to put Ruin's investiture in Nightblood to give it that extra oomph? I think Endowment helped because Nightblood is her world (we're just living in it) and giving things a little extra is Endowment's whole deal. It seems like something she would do. http://www.17thshard.com/news/shardcast/shardcast-endowment-r425/?do=findComment&comment=4673 The timeline may work out OK for this as Warbreaker takes place after MB Era 1 but before Alloy of Law. Now Nightblood was made centuries before Warbreaker takes place, so Sazed may o r may not have ascended by that time, but it could work.

Accidental double post sorry please delete.

Circling back to add these WoBs to the idea of a Vessel holding Cultivation, Ruin and Preservation at the same time and whether that would result in something other that an entity that is pulled in three directions that has a hard time acting at all. Some Vessels would meld together easier than others and Cultivation is most compatible with Ruin.

Yeah, it's a different way of accessing and manipulating the same 10 fundamental forces. It would likely manifest differently in the specifics, there wouldn't be lashings because that's Honor's way of thinking about gravity manipulation, but a different mechanism for manipulating gravity and so on.

The payoff to their arc is one of the best things in all of all Brandon's works. Also the scene close to the end where Llarimar finally lashes out at Lightsong "You were an ACCOUNTANT ... you were one of the greatest men I've ever known. You were my brother". "you are a god, at least to me." I get teared up thinking about it and I'm not the type to very often. I have to choose Nightblood even though it feels like a cheat. Brandon does magical companions really well, I love all the radiant Spren we've met. Nightblood's cheery optimism about dark deeds plays well against Vasher's world-weary cynicism.

Agreed. The personality traits were inherent to Adonalsium. Frost states Rayse wanted to become Odium, but he also implies that by choosing to become a Vessel for Odium he was made into what he is. "He Bears the weight of God's own divine hatred" means to me that the hatred was preexisting his picking it up. Given that Hoid was offered a specific one and that Frost said Rayse wanted to become Odium it seems they knew which one they were getting in advance. It may have been the case that the Vessels each got one that they had significant connection to. Although, that doesn't really fit with Ati getting Ruin. Then again Sazed was a very nice man and he can hold Ruin. Not sure how well they understood Connection. Some may have gotten the one they really wanted like Rayse and others got ones that they were significantly connected to out of necessity.

Oooh fun topic! Jasnah would have hated Nalthis and Scadrial era 1 with the court of the gods and TLR. So many false gods being worshiped, but they are physically present and immortalish with tremendous magical powers making it harder to prove they aren't gods. Also, in Era 1 book learning in history and religion (two of Jasnah's main interests) was heavily restricted by the steel ministry and there was Ruin changing what is written. As a scholar she would be incredibly frustrated. Kaladin and his seasonal affective disorder would have had a hard time on era 1 Scadrial with the ash blocking direct sunlight and making everything gloomy. As @king of nowhere said everyone would hate era 1 Scadrial.

That should really be Kaladin's main issue "Why aren't you dead?!". Even in the revised ending he takes away Szeth's ability to fly and Szeth falls into that superstorm. Everyone should also be asking Kaladin "I thought you killed him?"

It is mostly Dalinar's call, Kaladin and the rest can complain all they want they don't get to decide who Dalinar wants as his bodyguard. Dalinar is not running a democracy. It's no more a risk than keeping Taravangian in the coalition after he admitted he sent the Szeth to kill all those people, including Dalinar twice. Now that Dalinar remembers that he was a child-killing war criminal he has learned to forgive. It's consistent with how Dalinar reacted to Sadeas' death early in OB. In chapter 2 "One Problem Solved" Dalinar gets upset at his allies seeming happy or relieved that Toril Sadeas is dead. "We needed him!" he chastised them. Sadeas, like Szeth, tried to kill Dalinar twice. I do agree it is jarring that we don't see Szeth explain himself to Dalinar and others. It was probably cut for time because there was so much to pack into the last 100 or so pages. If you've seen Dark Knight Rises:

Maybe because she is the Shard that is keeping Odium locked into the Roshar system now that Honor is dead. I would like to think she was in law enforcement before she Ascended. That would explain why Cultivation never liked Hoid very much. Hoid isn't the a strict law follower. slammer - a correctional institution used to detain persons who are in the lawful custody of the government

A few years ago Brandon dropped this nugget: there was a plot to "destroy" Adonalsium and it failed. I wonder if this is the same group of people who eventually "killed" Adonalsium and split the power. Adonalsium is mostly if not entirely made of Investiture and as the third WoB below says it cannot be destroyed. The 16 (or a subset of them) wanted to destroy Adonalsium, but they realized it was not possible, so they "killed" the sapience of Adonalsium, splitting it into pieces and picked up those pieces so it could not recombine or gain sapience on it's own again. At first I was thinking it was the same attempt. Like they intended to destroy big A, but they couldn't and the Shattering was the result. But this contradicts what Khriss told Kelsier about the Vessel motives in MB:SH. She says some did it because they wanted the power. She wasn't there, but the letter from Frost to Hoid in WoR indicates Rayse wanted to become Odium. #investiture

Yes, I would think in fighting a being that is like 99.9999999999% Investiture one would want to use a metal that resists all Investiture. Not sure if it is the actual weapon, but I would use Aluminum at least to protect myself. He RAFO'd the question in the most recent WoB I could find. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Aluminum

It's possible. The Shards desire, on some level, an intelligence or sapience to direct them and will develop one on their own if they aren't picked up. That's essentially what Spren are on a smaller level. It's possible this is what Adonalsium was before "he was killed". A massive amount of investiture that gained a mind of it's own and became a problem.

Here it is along with some others.

If the middle path Sazed found has resulted in his paralysis and adding a third shard would remove that middle path that wouldn't the result be a Shard that can act? He doesn't have the right mindset because he's reconciled them to not act. The right mindset is to justify to himself that each intent grow, kill, save can be complementary to the other two in the long run. We kill now to create fertilizer spur growth, we grow, so there is more that can die, we keep some the same to allow others the opportunity to change. We grow this thing to be strong enough to preserve itself as long as it can until it inevitably ends. If a Vessel holding just Ruin can convince themselves to agree to help create life and then to let things live for a while before he gets to kill them, then a Vessel holding these three can justify to themselves each is part of a larger process.

The WoB I quoted says they intermingled into a Shard called Harmony which is what would drop if Sazed was killed. Even without the mind of a Vessel keeping them together they would stay together. Yes, this Shard has multiple intents, but all these Shards can be used together because they were all together as Adonalsium who created just about everything in the Cosmere except Scadrial and that was created by Ruin and Preservation working together they created and kept Scadrial in existence for a long time with the idea of destroying it, but having multiple Vessels each only having one intent got in the way. I think it is possible for a Vessel to reconcile all three as part of life and see the need for all three, circle of life. It would take Vessel with the right mindset. The Vessel could see them as contradictory Intents and they could all press against each other. The Shard would not act on one because it would seen by the Vessel as counter the other two and result in a relatively passive Shard like Harmony. They Vessel could fail to reconcile them and result in an active Shard that acts in a discordant manner. Or the Vessel could understand that they are all part of the same process and can contribute to each other, like I said above. They can be reconciled as complementary components of a larger whole.

That's correct. It became Harmony because of how Sazed felt and thought about them together. Whether these three would be fighting each other within the new shards Intent, paralyzed into inaction or whether they work together as the Elton John Circle of Life Shard TM will be significantly influenced by how the Vessel thinks and feels about them. I think Discord would manifest differently as Sazed being able to act, but in a schizoid way. Discord would take a step to preserve and then a step to destroy, possibly destroying the thing he was just protecting. A very busy, chaotic Shard. Harmony doesn't take the first step. I think a third way is possible where a Shard created from these three could act confidently on all three because it understands everything has it's place. It is a wise godly perspective: Oh look an excuse to link another song! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKP4cfU28vM

They do all clash in a way, but when they are picked up they would synergize into one shard like Harmony did. It could be one that can't act or it could be something like Acceptance where it understands that growth, preservation and ruin are all natural parts of a life cycle of things (we're missing Birth). Things have to exist in order to be grown or destroyed, death can fuel growth, to preserve some lives you have to kill others. These intents can be complementary and reconciled as part of a greater whole that understands the need for each in their own time. CIRCLE OF LIFE SHARD @Leyrann @Fanghur Rahl Brandon picked 16 because of how divisible it was. There should be even numbered categories as was said above. As I said in my previous post I think the three Shards do go together, but we just haven't met the 4th one (Ingenuity) that would give us a more pleasing number.

@Calderisis correct that the Shards like Cultivation apply their intent to more than the physical. I would argue Ruin did this as well, destroying people's sanity by talking in their heads and making them think they are insane like with Zane. Ruin damaged Vin's character and personality by talking in her head as her brother telling her she can't ever trust anyone over and over again. Reinforcing the terrible lessons of her childhood and helping sabotage any potentially positive relationships. Hemalurgy, which he covertly taught TLR during his Ascension, damages the spiritweb. Ruin also perverted the sacred texts of religions causing Sazed to lose his faith. Ruin was causing physical, cognitive and spiritual decline. Yeah, these Shards are part of a set of 4. I look at it as part of the life cycle of all things: Things come into existence, they grow, they plateau, they decline and end.This can be applied to tangible and intangible things, our bodies, our religions and our Cosmere theories can go through all these phases of the life cycle. Relationships too. We've got three of the four represented in the known shards. We're missing birth, Ingenuity could be this. Brandon cheekily mentioned Ingenuity in a Bulgaria signing and has been coy about it since then, but Ingenuity or a synonym would fill out this grouping of 4 shards. All the shards can create things if it is in service of their larger purpose, but a Shard like Ingenuity would represent a desire for novelty, newness, originality that would fill that Birth slot quite nicely.

Brandon has confirmed it was getting harder to maintain the same level of youth and that it could only work for so long.

It is saying the Stormlight doesn't make everything cold on it's own. Stormlight condensing to form the blade is what causes the cold. The other WoB I quoted Brandon says Stormlight is gaseous form of investiture and the horneater lakes are liquid investiture on Roshar. He says there is a third one. It's the metal that makes up both the plate and the blade. Another WoB where he directly compares the investiture in a shardblade to stormlight that people breathe in.

I love them just as worldbuilding short stories. Some of them are very important like Szeth's in WoK & WoR; Taravangian; Ym & Lift show off Nale and Lift is important. Rysn is an important side character and has the delightful Chiri-Chiri . Brandon has said Rysn may get her own novella Wandersail. Other interludes tease at future events. The Ardent who was executed in Kholinar in WoR hinted at the bad things happening at the palace. I think between the lightkeeper Puuli talking about people coming from the Origin "with light in their pockets" and Rysn getting a ship called Wandersail we are getting hints that something out there on the sea will factor in later. Likewise, the Kaza interlude where she goes to Aimia and is killed to protect whatever secrets are there.

The One splitting itself up on purpose could echo what happened to Adonalsium, but it also definitely echos what Autonomy is doing with it's avatars. I would argue that Taldain was one of the previous worlds of the Iriali. They have three Monarchs, each with complete control (or Autonomy) over a different aspect of government. The Queen that Dalinar speaks to in OB has total authority over foreign policy. It's not a committee of monarchs it's three separate yet equal rulers all working independently, but on behalf the same whole. It is such a weird setup, I get extreme autonomy vibes from this. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Iri That's not to say Adonalsium isn't an influence on their religion, but Autonomy could be the more recent influence Brandon is hinting at. For what it's worth I think the prior 3 words were Sel - Elantrians have metallic silver hair, Iriali have metallic gold.;Taldain for the reasons stated above; and Nalthis because Evi uses a weird color metaphor like Vasher in one of the flashbacks: Notice also the reference to odd day night cycles which could also point to Taldain. Evi's comment is like Vasher's White on Black color metaphor from Nalthis mixed with a dayside nightside reference from Taldain. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Taldain

I think he's searching for answers to the nature of the Cosmere and the Shard conflicts. In MB:SH he learned how little he knew and how his killing TLR led to disaster. I agree he could be getting frustrated with humanity. I think he wants a way off of the planet which he hasn't found yet. That will lead to greater understanding. Speaking of doing the same thing over and over he does keep establishing religions based on himself.

This new WoB may be relevant to this discussion. If the realms are closer then it's easier to be close enough to the spiritual realm to hear the voices. Very few people hear screaming victims, so there is more going on with Szeth and Dalinar.