Rainier

Not-so-subtle dig. I'm all over the A/S/K thread but don't call me a shipper. The clues are either there and mean something or they aren't and they don't. It's either foreshadowing or not, and that has very little to do with me wanting one thing or another. Frankly I think that shipping is a slur used to diminish people who talk about it, as if we can talk about magical theories but not personal ones.

Always and forever: The Tower. The best scene of the series for me, easily, and I doubt it will get topped. The moment where Kaladin gives up his best chance at freedom to go rescue the hated lighteyes. Where he realizes that he needs to be more like his father and be the one to make the first move. And then Syl telling him what she is, and asking if she brings Honor or is just attracted to it. I get chills every time, even just writing about it here.

I get unreasonably annoyed when people come posting what to me are super obvious things, or topics that have already been discussed to death, as if they're new and revelatory. I try to avoid those threads because I'm more likely to be snarky and unhelpful. I try not to hold ignorance of common suppositions because those were news to me once upon a time, too.

You're missing the point completely. The alcoholism is not separate and cannot be separated from the man. Whether you still love the whole man, despite alcoholism, is the question. Nobody loves the alcoholism because the alcoholism isn't a discrete object for love. It's part of a greater whole, and that type of love for the greater whole is what is rare and pure and perfect.

I'm not sure why this never occurred to me, or why I've missed discussion if it's around here, but given what we now know about Cultivation and the Nightwatcher, it makes more sense than ever. Endowment can see the future, as can people after they've died but before they Return. This is a much longer game than what we saw with Dalinar, but we also know Nightblood and Vasher were originally part of this story and Warbreaker was essentially the backstory just for them.

I just got this now by saying aloud, but is the term axalacious supposed to sound like salacious? Ak-salacious? Really lusty axe-men? Obviously axes are good for getting inside someone's head. The nonsense word threw me for a moment until I recognized this pun. It's about as good as I can expect from Brandon.

I actually agree with you here: the retcon works more for Szeth than for Kaladin. Which makes it even more infuriating when Brandon doesn't even address that in his explanation: The bolded part is what he says he was originally trying to accomplish, and what he thinks he has accomplished after the revisions. Nothing about Szeth. Nothing about him giving up, nothing about him facing the lies that led him to commit atrocities. No, it's all about Kaladin, and the reason it needed to change was because Kaladin shouldn't be going around killing people with that Shardblade of his. I think it's bunk, and so do you, but I would have been more sympathetic if Brandon felt he missed out on why Szeth gave up. I still think the originally published version was great, Kaladin just needed some reflection on how a blow that should have been blocked was deliberately let through, and how he didn't expect or really want to kill Szeth, it was more Szeth letting himself die. Instead we turned this: into this: Oh, and @Subvisual Haze, @Andy92, @Jimpy, you're late. Credit where credit is due, and all that.

If this is a serious concern of his then he either needs to release these books serially and constantly or he needs to finish his arcs before release. Brandon, as a veteran fantasy fan, knows what it's like waiting between books, so he's got to accept the challenges that come with the territory. This is a characteristic of Brandon's: he always has us right up inside our main characters' heads. He loves to take us behind the eyes and show us what each person is actually thinking, mostly by giving them incomplete information and then having them second-guess themselves. The whole series is exactly this, so again, if he didn't want it this way he shouldn't have made it this way.

I agree with your entire post, and would like to address this because while I think you're right about the intention, we're both unhappy with the execution. Kaladin has already killed humans. He's killed plenty of them, either in order to protect his men or for revenge (killing Helaran, not to protect his men, but as vengeance for killing his men). He's already a killer of men and there's not much point in denying it. I would have preferred for Kal to kill Szeth (and if you ask me he did because that's what my book says) and then dwell on it later. Kaladin should have reflected on why he killed Szeth, and why it was right or wrong. He could have had some PTSD from the killing as it haunted him. This would be much more realistic than recognizing Szeth's acceptance just in the nick of time to avert the killing blow. Yes, yes, yes. I'm right there with you. Don't talk to me about Kaladin sparing Szeth, because he didn't. He ran him through with Syl and left him for the storms.

Plenty of people are calling it, especially after Dalinar's roll call at Thaylen City. He pegged Taln as Stoneward and Ash as Dustrbringer, so I'm expecting those two Heralds to bond those two types of spren and becomes those types of Radiants in addition to or despite their Heraldic powers.

I don't know why this thread isn't tagged Warbreaker spoilers, so I'll tag this, but anytime someone mentions Vasher or Vivenna you really should put the spoiler tags on there. At least OP kept the Stormlight names for them in the title, but even then their Warbreaker names are technically spoilers, too. Nobody's said anything about soulcasting so here goes:

You can pick your god, and you can pick your nose, but pray to whichever god you picked you never have to pick a god's nose.

See he can atone and pay for his crimes, or he can unite humanity and save them from Odium, but I don't think he can do both. As for me, I frankly can't stand the chessy characters: Lift and Lopen. I audibly groan when they get screentime to themselves and I really can't stand reading about either one. Both seem like cheap comic relief.

I'd like to double-back to the idea that each Herald is associated with one of the Unmade. Let's start. Taln is exempt. He is the greatest and never broken. Odium has no hold on him and he is unrelated to the Unmade. Ishar, as patron of Bondsmiths and creator of the Oathpact, is connected to Ba-Ado-Mishram. Like Dalinar refilled the gemstones with stormlight so does BAM provide stormlight. Jezrien, as patron of Windrunners, is associated with Nergaoul and the Thrill. The blubbering mess he's reduced to is similar to what happens when the Thrill recedes. Nale, as patron and member of Skybreakers, is associated with Ashertmarnn. His lack of emotions are found in the wild and base emotions of The Heart of the Revel. Chanarach, as patron of Dustrbringers, is associated with Chemoarish because it's called the Dustmother. I've got nothing else. Vedel, as patron of Edgedancers, is associated with Re-Shephir, the Midnight Mother. As Vedel was known for the essence of Light, so is Re-Shephir made of blackness. Pailiah, as patron of Truthwatchers, has to be connected to Moelach. Her powers of foresight are corrupted and distributed as the soul splits in three. Shalash, as patron of Lightweavers, is associated with Sja-anat, Taker of Secrets. Where do you think those secrets Lightweavers tell go? They get taken in by Sja-anat. Battar, as patron of Elsecallers, is associated with Dai-gonarthis, mysterious and mythical. Kalak, as patron of the Willshapers, is associated with Yelig-nar who engages his host in a battle of wills over who will control the vessel and the power of the Unmade. Reading back through, there are some stronger connections (Kalak/Yelig-nar, Pailiah/Moelach) and then there are some stretches (Battar/Daigonarthis, Vedel/Re-Shephir). I'm reasonably pleased how well they line up, but I recognize how much reaching I had to do to get here, and must admit that with as little that we know of the Unmade all of this could be nonsense.

We know he's stealing invested items and investiture from every shardworld he can reach. I wouldn't put it past him to try to steal a Herald's investiture for himself in a similar fashion to what we saw with Jezrien.

Not curiosity, creativity. She hates the artistic depictions of her specifically because they depict her as artistic, which she views as a sham and a lie. If her artistry and creativity was taken from her, I could understand how it could have wrought the effects we see in her compulsions. Yes, they're all cognitive shadows, whatever the hell that means. Your description is as good as any I've seen, but Returned, Fused, and Heralds are of a kind and you've got that right. I'm not as willing to discount this theory as we don't know exactly what happened to the Heralds, how the Oathpact came about, what it entails, or the nature of the Unmade.

The Heralds are lairs and cannot be trusted. What they are saying is simply not true. Do not believe it.

Mraize says that the Heralds are only maybe human, and definitely not the local type, so I'm taking that to mean that the Heralds were not originally from Roshar. That's the bare minimum Realmatically aware they could be. Of course who knows what Mraize knows, and it's possible this is instead referring to the exodus from Ashyn that the Elia Stele records.

I'm not even going to try to find the page, but it's a reference to one of Brandon's writing classes about how to write a romance. The braided roses indicates that when the characters first meet it's all about the thorns before eventually becoming intimate. Here's what I found for the video, he says braided rose at around 5:50. There may be more, but this is where it comes from.

I kinda forgot about this on previous reads, but on my re-read before Oathbringer it stood out strongly to me. The scene where Shallan finally steals the soulcaster is preceded by a lot of description of Jasnah's naked body. Then when she creates Radiant she specifically makes her bustier, like Jasnah. In between are enough side remarks about her beauty. I don't know if it's envy or sexual attraction or both, but Shallan is inordinately interested in Jasnah's figure. Jasnah is slightly out of scope of this thread (as much as anything can be 77 pages deep), but my personal theory is that her trauma from childhood left her asexual, and her logical and rigorous mind (stripped of emotion and passion) attracted the Inkspren in the first place. They seem to value reliability and find humans unpredictable mostly due to their emotions, which explains a lot of Jasnah's peculiarities. I don't see their relationship changing in that way, but I am interested in how their relationship changes. We've already seen some of it, as Shallan is stuck is this weird place where she's a ward but also a Radiant, so in some cases she's subservient and in others she's equal to Jasnah in being superior to others. Now Jasnah is the Queen, and Shallan is her cousin-in-law, so we've got yet more roles for them to play around each other. I didn't much like Shallan's chapters in TWoK, but I was hoping for more Shallan/Jasnah scenes. Obviously WoR did not deliver, and while OB gave us some, I still feel more than a book behind.

This is what bothered me too. Adolin has already let Shallan go. He's already given her up. This might be him resigned to something he feels is beyond his control, but I agree with your questions. If I were Adolin, and I actually liked my betrothed and wanted to marry her, I'd be pissed if I caught her making moon eyes at the bridgeboy. Confrontation of some sort would be inevitable. Instead it seems like Adolin knows the betrothal isn't really serious and can see the writing on the wall. He's protecting himself from getting hurt. Unfortunately Shallan pushed past his hesitation and I think Adolin is going to get hurt because of it. I'm going to second this recommendation without following the link because I know what it says and I agree. I think the rock is the figurative weight of the people who Kaladin has failed. The weight of his failures and the deaths on his conscience. The lightening of that burden is what he felt with Tien, and it's also what he feels with Syl and with Shallan. It's all connected.

I've never read this version and choose to believe it never happened. First edition book sitting in my room says Szeth died from a Shardblade and by god that's how he died. I would be disappointed if Elhokar survived. It was clearly meant to be a death, and a brutal one at that. Let it be what it was meant to be.

For all the lack of consequences to Adolin for his murder of Sadeas, I could absolutely see Ialai exacting her revenge upon house Kholin by havin Adolin assassinated while retaining plausible deniability. We know she has assassins, and we know Jasnah has played the same game for years. Covert assassinations are typical enough for Alethi. I don't know if it will involve Radiants or Skybreakers, as I think Ialai would be more covert than that. It would also force Dalinar to deal with internal strife as he wrests with his thirst for vengeance for his son against his desire to unite all humanity in the face of the Desolation.

I actually listened enough to hear the Nightblood talk. I'm heavily Invested in Nightblood, and I'd love to speculate on his chain of custody. There's not much we absolutely know, and what we do know we know from Nightblood itself, Vasher, and Vivenna. We know from Nightblood that Vivenna held it, but never drew it. That's the only new person we heard him mention as holding it. Given Cultivation's association with foresight, I imagined that the offer to bring Dalinar Nightblood would through be some sort of precognition. She could predict an outcome where Dalinar would seize Nightblood, and offered Dalinar that possible future. I think Nale was holding Nightblood when Dalinar was visiting the Nightwatcher through nothing but supposition save it could make sense. In terms of Nightblood Chain of Custody, we've got Vasher/Vivenna/???/Nale/Szeth. I doubt Vivenna had Nightblood when the Nightwatcher offered it to Dalinar, so it's either the ??? or Nale. Shout out to the Oxford comma.

This is absolutely correct and also a damnation shame, mostly because Amaram needs to work as a villain. Without the page time he looks one-dimensional and bland. Brandon being cagey with his backstory hurt Amaram, and as he gets more pages (flashbacks exclusively, of course) I expect I'll like his character more. Until then... I would like to believe this is true, and it sounds plausible enough, but Brandon's aforementioned caginess means that the juiciest bits have yet to be revealed. Namely: Gavilar. He was a member of the Sons of Honor, and on the road to being a Bondsmith concurrently with Dalinar. His death is the pivot that starts our main story and there are so many questions left unanswered. Amaram suffers from these unanswered questions, as we would have appreciated him as more than the Big Bad, specifically Kaladin's Big Bad. Here's the thing: while I'm willing to accept betrayal from Moash due to his earned contempt for the species, Amaram doesn't get the same leeway. He was supposed to be the hero and failing doesn't mean you get to turn traitor. This was more that was offscreen, but if Amaram knows Honor is dead, how does he think it happened? I doubt Odium would tell him but it seems pretty obvious, especially to us. He's in-world Benedict Arnold. I vote to christen a breakfast dish Eggs Amaram. It is a base of lavis flatbread, a slice of cured pork, poached chicken's egg (what a delicacy), covered in pork gravy. Serve with yellow wine in the late morning. At yet I don't think Amaram was nuanced enough, mostly due to lack of screen time. This line was like a breath of fresh air but it was too little too late. When reading it felt more like a deserved shot at Dalinar than justification for himself. This moment was about Dalinar and his hypocrisies. Even when delivering a devastating blow we're left with a moment that services our main character more than Amaram, who is left looking petulant and resentful of Dalinar's success. As for my own thoughts on Amaram, I mostly agree with @ICanDream. He hit the points I would have hit quite nicely. The most galling part about Amaram's character came at Thaylen City when he succumbed to Odium. It was epic in the moment, but it subsumed the character completely. He's always been Kaladin's villain and I was really hoping I could see him as more than that. Brandon did a little bit in WoR but I wasn't satisfied by what came in OB. I'm talking myself into more Amaram scenes in flashbacks due to his proximity to Gavilar, but I'm not holding my breath that he'll get the screentime he needed to become a true villain. He needed the amount of attention Sadeas commanded in the previous two books to accomplish that, and it turns out Taravangian was the one to take over for Sadeas. He'll probably carry the role for another two books, or until the Diagram collapses around him, but I wish Amaram were more of the villain in this book. This was his moment, his chance to justify himself and endear him to the readers as a villain convinced of his own righteousness. It never really happened for me, but @Toaster Retribution's essay I responded to was the first thing I've seen that persuades me to reevaluate Amaram rather than simply curse his name. I hoped Amaram would be the next Sadeas but instead Moash is the next Amaram.