cometaryorbit

I really hope we'll get an explanation of how the Shinovar culture survives. I don't see how they can possibly keep the warriors from rebelling against their low place in society and taking over - if no one else is allowed to learn how to use weapons, it would be super easy. No human society is so strongly culturally constrained that they have no rebels - even the most conformist. And the Shinovar culture seems old, so it must be relatively stable.

I'm sorry, what's TEM? I can't get any of the book titles out of that acronym... EDIT: Oh, The Eleventh Metal short story?

I'm actually not 100% sure that godmetals are necessarily automatically super-Invested. Unless I misunderstand, all of Scadrial was created from Investiture by Ati/Ruin and Leras/Preservation. In the HOA Epigraphs, Sazed/Harmony says "Atium, then, was an object that was one-sided". I think that could imply that it's simply "100% Ruin" matter, whereas normal Scadrian matter is "50% Ruin/50% Preservation". In the Cosmere, Investiture is convertible into matter and energy, like matter and energy in RL. But the quantity of Investiture represented by 1 gram of atium might not be any greater than the quantity of Investiture represented by 1 gram of water. Atium being Pushable might be an early quirk, but that's not necessarily incompatible with it fitting into the later system, IMO.

I actually wouldn't be surprised if TLR did try to freeze language change, and possibly even succeeded to some degree, at least among nobles in the Inner Dominances. By controlling the education system, he could create a standard for "formal, proper" speech, from which "common" dialect might diverge sharply. We don't, IIRC, know much about dialect differences within the Final Empire. Spook's dialect is called "Eastern street slang", so some differences exist. We never see the Outer Dominances in Era 1 at all (except Kelsier walking through the Cognitive version after they're already well into Ruin's destruction). They might be more divergent. I'd kind of expect more difference between skaa and noble dialect in Luthadel, but maybe it's just not focused on in the books since all the viewpoint characters are able to do both.

I wouldn't call Kelsier atheist in the usual RL sense, but non-religious. When he sees the Spiritual Realm in Secret History, I read that as a realization that there is something "transcendent" about the Shards. But he certainly doesn't worship any of them. He may have heard of the idea of the God Beyond by now, but I doubt he'd take it very seriously. (BTW, I find it rather ironic that Kelsier set up a fake resurrection to be viewed as a god, and then did briefly Ascend and later return to physical life...)

Oh, hmm! OK that makes TLR allowing aluminum to be known far more sensible. I'd thought an aluminum blade in a really vital spot would still kill him, and so he was stupid to allow it to be used by the nobility.

You know, I never wondered about this before, but that's a very good question. Vin needed to be "selfless" to free Ruin. If she'd adopted Zane's "we have the powers, we should use them!" viewpoint, she'd have taken the power for herself as TLR did. But maybe Ruin had another "branch" of his plans that we just didn't get to see.

Depends on situation. I picked Copper (for mental/emotional protection), but that assumes an environment with other Allomancers. If the question is "add a power to your real-world life", probably Tin for super-senses. Zinc or Brass would probably be the most useful but I find them ethically uncomfortable. Using just Iron or just Steel to move around, without the full Mistborn set or a Twinborn f-Gold to deal with hard landings, is too scary for me.

Sure there are. There are Koloss-blooded as well, but full Koloss totally exist in Era 2 (they live as tribes out in the Roughs). "Pure blood" isn't exactly the right term though, they are born as Koloss-blooded (humans with some extra strength and bluish-tinted coloration) and don't become full Koloss unless they actually get the Hemalurgic spikes (which the Koloss don't know how to make, so there are a limited number available).

Square cube law means, assuming equal proportions, x2 height = x8 mass. So if a 6' man is 200lb, a 12' man would be 1600lb. Koloss are bulkier and heavier than average humans, so I would suggest around 2500-3000lb for a 12' koloss. Probably not several tons. Still, being bipeds would put more stress on their legs, but that stress is fairly 'localized'. Leg bones would be thicker than direct scaling would imply -- but there's no reason to think the skull (which is no more stressed than a human one) would be extra-tough. And the leg bones probably don't need to be as extreme as all that -- human bones have more strength than they minimally need in the direction the weight is applied, and koloss probably don't scale exactly like humans -- also, koloss gait might be different from human, which could help a lot. Koloss are very strong, but nowhere near Shardplate strength. Dalinar uses a hammer in Shardplate that is difficult for two strong men to carry, so probably 150lb plus. Real-life warhammers were more like 5 pounds, so I'd argue Shardplate is about x30 normal human strength. Allomantic Pewter seems to be too comparable with Koloss strength for them to be on that scale. Pewter is about x2 strength for a normal Allomancer, x3 flared.r... likely a bit more for Vin and significantly more for Elend, but not x30. As for durability... well, in Well of Ascension Elend kills one (before he becomes an Allomancer) with a knife, and while he's had some training he's hardly a full-on warrior at this point. Admittedly it's a small one, but ... Koloss can be more resilient than default humans, and ignore pain in berserk rage, but I think there is a tendency to overstate their durability.

Well, but falling speed doesn't qualify for storing Feruchemical speed, so why should it qualify for tapping? https://wob.coppermind.net/events/352-miscon-2018/#e10297 There's also this, which suggests that feruchemical speed isn't as much of a "personal time bubble" as other WoBs might suggest... https://wob.coppermind.net/events/361-skyward-pre-release-ama/#e11520 similarly, https://wob.coppermind.net/events/36-arcanum-unbounded-chicago-signing/#e1505 But there is also this: https://wob.coppermind.net/events/402-starsight-release-party/#e13501 Which seems to be flatly contradictory to 'it's not really temporal, just physical' so... I am not sure all these interactions have really been worked out...

I don't know - "you are thinking along the right lines" might just mean "this is the right question to be asking to understand how this works", not necessarily "it really is accelerated". If it is not that goes a long way towards resolving some of the issues with feruchemical speed being the best power ever. Also, having it accelerate that stuff has really big implications. Not that there aren't other things like that in Feruchemy (iron feruchemy perpetual motion, etc.) but - if it does, what happens if you Steelpush while speeded-up x20? If the x20 applies to your speed of motion for the Steelpush, either Newton's laws of motion are horribly broken, or the Push strength applied to the anchor is also multiplied x20. And I don't think "physical speed" should also be "Allomantic strength multiplication". I think it is much cleaner if "physical speed" is just physical body motion, reaction time, etc.

I don't think it happens fast enough to be obvious, but weren't there references to ruins being buried in crem? If so, scholars might have some idea... but it wouldn't tell them anything about how geology works on a sane planet! I'm not sure if anyone really knows what is going on with that even in RL... I've seen somewhat-contradictory explanations for the lack of plate tectonics on Venus...

Right, but a 10 or 15 pound object shouldn't be literally swinging a human around with equal and opposite reaction (especially if the weight is largely closer to the hilt; I don't know how koloss blades' width or thickness vary along their length). It would be impractical - too impractical for swords that size to have been used in real battle in RL history - but not physics-impossible for a normal human to use, I think - and pewter's grace can fix the former. I think that's more of a measure of the strength of the swing than the size of the blade; a human's not that wide front-to-back. (I think Vin cut from Straff's head or shoulder downward, not using the whole length of the blade lined up with the body foot-to-head.) That doesn't happen with RL swords because there's a ton of bones in the way, also, the sword would probably break - koloss blades are probably single-edged and wedge-like.

Well, it's more than that - when an Allomancer is in the air their speed is set by Push/Pull strength, mass, and air resistance - Feruchemical speed won't do anything relevant (IMO) since their own physical movements has no effect on their flight speed. Their arms and legs can still move way faster, but it's no help. So as soon as they Push off the ground (such as to fight a flying Windrunner/Skybreaker) they lose any real advantage from Feruchemical speed. Sure, all I mean is that one can't necessarily assume the Bands by themselves (without other sources of gold) would be enough to survive having a Shardblade in one's spinal cord for several seconds (while Leeching a Surgebinder). They might be - but IMO we don't know enough about how Spiritual healing costs compare to regular damage. I don't know. The Bands are extremely Invested, sure... but I think Leeching is not instantaneous even for normal Allomancers. A Returned, possibly; a Divine Breath is equal to 2000 Breaths apparently. But they can't actually use that Investiture without dying. It would keep someone with the Bands from Pushing/Pulling on metal in the Returned's body, but otherwise it's kind of useless. Elantrians, I am skeptical; but we haven't seen them much at "full power", so who knows. They get a constant "feed" rather than having to inhale Stormlight, but I don't know if that really equates to more power at one time. I think the Rosharan System essay in Arcanum Unbounded suggests Surgebinding is uniquely powerful compared to any other 'normal' magic system (i.e. not the Well of Ascension or whatever). (Re Investiture level in general, the Bands are not as Invested as a Shardblade per WOB...) Do we know that's efficiency, and not power? I think Allomantic stores last longer because the power level is low... the really high power metals (atium and anything+duralumin) do burn fast, much faster than Stormlight.

Do you have evidence for that? It certainly speeds up physical movement and reaction time, but accelerating Investiture processes seems outside its scope.

I don't think so, really, for a couple of reasons. Bone strength is funny, and is very different in compression vs tension vs bending. Bones are very strong in the direction they are "supposed" to be stressed (barring disease states like osteoporosis). Doubling a human's weight wouldn't just break their leg bones (otherwise it wouldn't be possible to lift another human being without breaking your legs). But breaking a leg in a bad fall is pretty common (since bones are weak in bending). (I also don't think a 12' koloss is as heavy as an elephant. They're more robust/bulky than usual humans, with massive muscles, but I don't think a 6' koloss would weigh 700-800+ pounds, which is about what you'd need for a 12' one to be in the 3+ ton range of usual elephants.) Allomantic pewter gives general physical improvements, not just strength, and I think its added grace helps here. And the action/reaction effects wouldn't be that bad - koloss blades probably aren't all that heavy. Koloss start at 5' tall, so at least some blades are probably no longer than that. Even impractically huge, ceremonial two-handed swords on Earth were more like 10 pounds, and they could be six feet long (or more, including hilt, IIRC).

Me too - it's not just that Kaladin was focused on other things, but I am not really sure that he has the background to understand what Zahel/Vasher was talking about. Vasher did say he was from a different world but Kaladin likely is thinking that means something more like Shadesmar than another planet - does Kaladin even know Roshar is a spherical planet? Is that common knowledge for the Alethi? Certainly the discussion of being from an older vs younger world would be way outside his scope - I don't think that Rosharans could have any way of developing geology as we know it, given how messed up their continent is.

Yeah. Small metalminds have a huge storage capacity compared to what a normal Feruchemist would have/use, but we do know that Marasi and Wax pushed the Bands pretty close to exhaustion in a few minutes. So once supersonic Feruchemical steel and healing from Shardblade wounds etc. gets brought in, I think those stores get used up pretty fast. I think the difference in general "Investiture level" between Rosharan and Scadrian magic is being undervalued, both for this, and for Leeching - theoretically you could Leech a spren but with how much Investiture is in a Radiant-Spren/Shardblade... But most importantly - "physical speed" shouldn't accelerate other uses of Investiture. Leeching would still take whatever time it takes (and since it requires touch, you can't dodge effectively with super-speed). And it doesn't boost Pushes/Pulls. So in the air a Fullborn is going to be fairly comparable to a Crasher like Wax (with the slight advantage of being able to use Ironpulls as well as Steelpushes) and will likely still have inferior maneuverability to a Windrunner or Skybreaker.

For normal Windrunners/Skybreakers, sure. For "live Honor era" Jezrien/Nale, they just use their essentially-infinite Stormlight feed to do a x100,000 Lashing and accelerate at 1,000 km/s, hitting escape velocity in a hundredth of a second. OK, not that much, they'd crash into a mountain and die unless they were aimed up. But I think they could. I don't think Feruchemical steel speeds up the Leeching process though. It's "physical speed" not "Investiture speed". So they have to actually touch for a second (maybe quite a bit more - I think a Radiant "full of" Stormlight has much more Investiture than anybody on Scadrial) while they can't use Feruchemical steel to dodge the Blade.

True, it can eventually be broken through by regular weapons, but... ...that's not a good example, as that is a huge amount of kinetic energy, a couple hundred thousand joules. The Parshendi warform weapons would probably be better examples - I still think they're significantly more than demonstrated non-Duralumin allomantic steel shots, but it's not completely out of scope. I strongly disagree here. Sure, that was non-Duralumin, but I think you are greatly overestimating the toughness (as opposed to strength) of koloss. Elephant guns had to be crazy powerful to stop a charging elephant because the front of an elephant's skull is really reinforced. Koloss skulls are probably just human scaled up (and we know koloss don't scale well - square-cube law issues with their hearts eventually kill them - they may not even be 2x thicker than human skulls).

For that matter, does Feruchemical steel even speed up your motion on Allomantic Pushes/Pulls? I'd think not - that would be a simple Newton's Laws thing - but Feruchemy can be weird. If not, then any fairly experienced Windrunner or Skybreaker would have a very good chance. They'd actually have superior mobility in the air.

What about Nale and Jezrien? They have Gravitation. At "full power" (IE back when Honor was alive) that should give them pretty much unlimited speed (especially Jezrien - he can probably use Adhesion to mess with pressure to keep from burning up like a reentering spacecraft) as long as they stay in the air. Gravitation Lashings would give better maneuverability than Iron/Steel Allomancy since they're not limited to metal, IMO. Though Vin is uniquely good at flying using metal (horseshoe trick). If the Bands wielder were any other Mistborn I'd say this would be a major advantage. Actually, a high-Ideal Windrunner might have a chance, because... ...It's not quite that bad if you have Stormlight healing; nothing kills a full-healing Radiant immediately except something that disrupts Investiture. Which the Bands allow, with Leeching - but IIRC Leeching isn't instantaneous, and given that Roshar is much higher Investiture than Scadrial this might be a problem. Steel speed shouldn't actually accelerate the Leeching process, and if it takes say 5 seconds of contact, that's a lot of Shardblade hits. Compounded Gold should work against the Blade, of course, but how much gold did Vin bring? The amount in the Bands metalminds themselves might not be enough, given how fast they burn out in the book.

With Vin's instinctive/intuitive awesomeness at Allomancy plus the raw power of the Bands, not much could. TLR had basically the same powers* and much more experience, so he could, assuming his overconfidence didn't lead to him being killed before he realized what was going on. One of the more combative Heralds in their early days, with direct Investiture-feed from Honor (IE basically unlimited), maybe. I'm not really sure what their limits were - the battle Surges (Gravitation, Division, etc.) with unlimited Stormlight is a pretty terrifying concept. A Honorblade is essentially a Splinter - it might be Invested enough that even Bands-strength Pushes would have trouble. OTOH, their Stormlight healing was imperfect; a thunderclast could kill them with a blow to the head per the Prelude - thunderclasts are likely hundreds of times human strength, but compounded Pewter can do that. Nightblood in the hands of a Knight Radiant with huge Stormlight supplies (thus really good healing), possibly. *Although I'm not sure TLR was quite on par power-wise, he wasn't exuding mist when he did major Allomancy things.

I think they will hit other issues with the wind/friction long before burning up, though. Goggles, leather protective clothing, etc. will *help* - but there is a pretty huge difference between "being able to survive conditions while passively sitting down" (eg airplane ejection seat) and "being able to take demanding actions successfully while exposed to those conditions". "Normally" a 100-120 mile per hour wind would be pretty much totally impairing for a human (IIRC that is about the limit at which you can't lean into the wind to successfully move against it, you will just be blown off your feet). Since the Steelrunner is in better control, the effective "wind" is created by their own movements, they can do better than that... but how much better? 200 mph? 300? I really don't think it would help that much. I am not sure what 1900-ish firearm muzzle velocities were like, probably not quite as good as modern ones, but if we're talking 600-800 m/s... even 300 mph is only 135 meters per second, that's a fairly "marginal" improvement.