Straw

Nah, I think you're correct on what stab voting is. I just personally prefer to place votes on people based on posts. If someone is persistently inactive or just makes filler posts, I might throw a stab vote on them. I'd prefer to keep my votes somewhat aligned with my reads if possible though.

Why would you want to kill a random person? Lahilt hasn't posted yet, so they have roughly the default odds of being an elim.

Personally, I'm not going to place any votes until I find someone I want to vote on. Random votes are useless since they show no intent to kill. I'd rather keep my votes for legitimate circumstances. Just something to keep in mind. Hmm, Gears, you said that the lynch would be "random chance", if I understand correctly. What makes you think that? Also, you said that "on C1 we don't have suspicions". Why do you think that? We can certainly get suspicions from posts, not just flips.

It’s also so the GM has someone to put in the writeup if you die. I usually just make something up or put Straw as my RP name.

Yeah, I very much like the consistent outed elims bit, but it's useful to have some single life people for balance purposes. In Discord, I think Elbereth recommended three spiked, and then having the rest have single lives. That would probably result in there being a few outed elims to mess around with, but not so many that it becomes really swingy. @Elbereth any thoughts/advice on this specifically? The issue with that is that if TLR joins the village, he will scan people, PM the villagers he confirmed with the full results, and then have them reveal to the thread and act as messengers for his scans. If he doesn't do that, it'd be obvious that he chose to join the elims instead.

I would probably advise having him count towards parity once he joins a faction. Some of this stuff is stolen from Elbereth/Haelbarde/me chatting in Discord so credit to them: You might want to give TLR some sort of ability if he joins the elims. As it is, the benefit from him joining the village is quite a bit greater than the benefit the elims gain. Balance would probably be easier if you made it so that Inquisitors can have a single life. That way you have a bit more flexibility when distributing, and can make the game a bit less vulnerable to random hits on Inquisitors. If you go through with letting TLR pick which side to join, you'll probably want to give some sort of buff to the side that he doesn't choose. I'm not exactly sure what kind of buff to give, since it would largely depend on how/if you end up adjusting him.

The closest thing to this would be spectating a game. That would allow you to talk with more experienced players who are watching, and also talk with dead players. Currently, LG66 is running and has a spec doc. I'd recommend joining the LG66 spec doc (I can give you the link if you're interested) and then possibly joining QF45 if you feel like you've got a good feel for the basic rules by the time it starts. QF45 has minimal rules, so it'd be a good starting game. It also has a lot of new players playing, so you'd be in the same boat as most other people.

There isn’t any list for co-GMing. You pretty much just ask around and see if anyone is interested.

Nope! Just checking.

First of all, thanks for formatting. To clarify, The Spiked applies to all Inquisitors? Is there a lynch minimum? What happens if the lynch is tied? What’s the point of having the rolescan possibly fail? It’s not that strong compared to the other abilities. Yeah, Pyro’s right about the vote manipulation. If you want resource and finance to be somewhat equal, you want them to cancel their own vote. Of course, another alternative, though less common, is letting them double a vote. Hmm, very clever having TLR give an equivalent benefit to each faction. The main issue I see is him doing the following: scan three times C1 and pick village, then claim to all villagers he scans. To fix this, I’d suggest doing a few things: -Remove his alignment scan until he picks a side. This should prevent him giving such a huge benefit to the village compared to the elims. -Think about making it so he’s always assigned to the losing side on C3, instead of letting him choose. This would hopefully remove the issue of him choosing villager C1 and then being their alignment scanner. It would also remove the issue of him tilting the game, since he’d always try to choose the winning side. -Also, remove the deepness. No matter what alignment he is, getting revealed to the thread would end with him dying. Plus, making it random just isn’t fun for him. Survivor roles are hard enough. I don’t see much point to having this be 24/24 instead of 48/0. There isn’t that much night stuff going on, so unless you feel strongly about it I’d recommend changing that. Lots of the actions are during the day anyway. About GMing experience, there isn’t really any requirement? It’s advisable that you’ve played a decent number of games, but by the time you get around on the list, you should have a decent body of games played. It’s also probably advisable that you get a co-GM for your first game, to help if you have any issues with stuff. I’d be willing to help out, assuming I’m not super busy whenever you end up running this. Also, you can always ask if someone else needs a co-GM, so you can get a better look at how a game is run. You do have to sign up to run a game, usually by pinging a mod with your request and the format of your game. You’ll then be added to the GM list. You also have to run the game by a committee of mods and a few other people once you think it’s ready. They’ll check to make sure it’s balanced and everything.

To be honest, it's kind of hard to help balance at this point until you start to nail down the core mechanics and stuff, but I'll try. The first issue I see is the Arbiters. They're a confirmed good bloc of five people with a doc and scan. The easiest way to fix this would be to give them some kind of opposing win condition. With the Emperor, I would indeed recommend making him a NPC, probably with no abilities. In my opinion, I don't see much of a reason to have the additional win conditions for the Striker and the Bloodsealer. It seems best to just have a classical village vs elim setup, with the Arbiters and the Forger being extra elements to the game. With the Forger, I don't see much reason for them to not just use Restoration four times, and then wait until the very end of the game to use Restoration to bring back the Emperor.

@A Joe in the Bush some rerun questions: -In the dead doc, I believe either you or Elbereth mentioned giving Bleeder a one shot assassination ability that would be immune to extortionists/escorts. How do you feel about this idea? If implemented, should it also bypass bodyguards so they can also use it on Flogs? What should happen if it hits a tycoon? -The impersonator role was added due to the size of the game. How do you feel this role ended up doing? Should it be included in a rerun? -Does the current tie system make it so the elims pretty much have to have vote manipulation? How would you feel about making it random on ties? -This game had some activity issues near the end. In a rerun, would you recommend putting in a two or three cycle filter in addition to the sleep mechanic? -How well did the minimum of three votes on cycle one end up working, in your opinion? Could it be extended to other cycles (adjusting for player size, of course)?

I'm in. Glad to see someone running a fully vanilla game. Also glad to see required voting making a comeback.

https://bit.ly/LEARNASECRET

Funny note: this was my first time ever being lynched as an elim. I found it very amusing that Fura and I still got to tunnel each other, despite being on the same team. It's too bad that that attempt at distancing never paid off, since we were both outed D2. Some players also played very well this game: First of all, @Orlok Tsubodai played very well, and had perfect reads on D1. I will note that I really do disagree with infolynching. @The Young Pyromancer did a very good job being an outed elim and derailing the thread. It was quite fun to watch from the dead doc. @TJ Shade had a very good first game. @Coda and @Mist won the game for us at the end, and had some awesome discussion in the dead doc. I like how they chose to end the game at noon. Glad to see someone looking into Quantum Werewolf.

If you add Szeth, the main issue would be if he got lucky and hit Dalinar early, instantly winning the game. To fix this I would recommend buffing bridgemen, maybe to 50% each. If that sounds OP, you could make the bridgeman protection all or nothing where if two bridgemen target someone, they defend against all attacks, but if only one bridgemen protects them, all attacks hit. These two changes would essentially make it so Szeth's win condition would be to kill all but one of the bridgemen and then attack Dalinar. This adds opposition to Moash's goal of keeping the bridgemen alive, and discourages the bridgemen from claiming. It also gives the traitors a choice between keeping bridgemen alive and taking the risk that their attack will be blocked vs killing bridgemen and bringing the game closer to a win for Szeth. Also, on the topic of Dalinar, I'd recommend making Dalinar an outed NPC who doesn't count for parity. Being confirmed good and unkillable isn't particularly interesting to play, and he works better as a NPC. I think past games have done similar things (Ex: Elend Venture in LG41). It also helps prevent mayoring from Dalinar, especially since if he could talk, Renarin and Adolin could just PM him with results. I'm not sure about how balanced it is to have Adolin be able to dodge kills while visiting someone. It basically removes any consequences to him outing himself in the thread. All it does is it stops him from saying who he is going to visit, and not much else. By one PM per cycle, do you mean one PM channel with unlimited talking? Or do you mean one PM message, like MR42 has?

Maybe do the same thing as you're doing with this thread? I don't see much point in keeping it if it's not getting used, unless there's any sudden interest. I'm not sure if Joe mentioned it, but there's a MR42 spec doc as well. I think that if you ask Joe he'll give you a link.

Uh... the traitors want to kill Elhokar. Why would that fix it?

In Words of Radiance, I believe the traitors wanted to put Dalinar on the throne? I assume the traitors are Graves' group?

The first main issue is Dalinar. Dalinar is a confirmed good role that no one wants to kill. As you said, Dalinar can claim right away and then lead the village as a confirmed good. If multiple people claim Dalinar, they can be cleared with Renarin or Adolin. Another issue I see with Dalinar is if the elims are about to lose, they can threaten to kill him, since they'd lose either way. All in all, I don't see much reason for people to lose if Dalinar dies. If you want Dalinar to be unkillable, just make him unkillable. Another major issue is the threat of a mass claim. Adolin, Renarin, Dalinar, and Kaladin can all claim right away, as they are unique roles that are confirmed good. The the bridgemen can also all claim, since they all know each other. This massively reduces the pool of possible elims. For example, let's say there are 20 players, with four bridgemen and five traitors. A mass claim would leave a pool of 13 players with four elims in it. There would also be four confirmed good players, and three bridgemen with one traitor among them. Adolin and Renarin would be outed to the thread, so the village could work together to clear three people in the pool each cycle (lynch and two scans). The traitors can try to kill Adolin or Renarin, but will run into the issue of bridgemen protection. To avoid the traitor bridgeman revealing the protection target, the three good bridgemen would likely want to choose randomly between Adolin and Renarin. This means that the eliminators would have to risk wasting a kill in order to kill one of the scanners. Once the pool of 13 is cleared, there would be a maximum of three bridgemen to clear. I'll think a bit more on what you could do to balance this, and I'm sure others will have ideas, but I would recommend having some kind of mechanic that punishes people for claiming. As I said before, I would also recommend changing Dalinar, probably by removing him from the game. Unkillable players who are confirmed good are not particularly interesting or fun to play with. It'd also be nice to give the traitor bridgemen the ability to vote for the traitor kill. That way, if all the true traitors die, they have a better chance of winning. Questions: If Adolin is protected by four bridgemen and he visits a traitor, does he still die? Does this also apply to Kaladin? If Kaladin kills someone before using his extra life, does he still die? Are PMs open or closed?

Uh could you do some formatting for that? I think this is correct: Factions: Roles: I'll give some balance thoughts soon, I just need to read through everything again.

Recently, I created a small thread activity counter in Python, and thought I'd share it here. I also made a post transcriber, and I'll get instructions for that up soon. Let me know if there are any features that you'd like me to add. Also, if you're curious how this works, I've commented the code. Instructions for use: Download Python from this link, if you do not have it already. Scroll down to the bottom and choose a version to download. I don't believe it particularly matters which open you choose, as long as it's for Follow through the Python installation. At the start, make sure to check the box to add Python to PATH. Other than that, you don't need to do anything special while installing. If you forget to add it to PATH, uninstall and reinstall Python. Open up Command Prompt (Windows) or Terminal (MacOS). You will now have to download two libraries for Python using the Command Prompt/Terminal. You will use the "pip install" command. If you are on MacOS, you will use the "pip3 install" command instead. Type "pip install bs4" and press enter. Type "pip install requests" and press enter. Do not include the quotes for either of these. Remember to replace "pip" with "pip3" if you are on MacOS. Download my program from here. The download button should be right before the code itself, in the gray row. Double click on the downloaded program to run it. The program will request a "base url". For this, you will be entering the page one url of a thread, minus the page number itself. Ex: https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/57663-quick-fix-game-21-the-names-smith-john-smith/. Make sure to include the / at the end. The program will also prompt you for a "start ID" and "end ID". These are optional parameters for getting activity counts of thread sections. You can get an ID by clicking on the share button on a comment, scrolling until the end of the link, and then copying the number. For example, the ID of the post above me is 990686. The program should output an activity count for the given section. Example of use: Getting full activity count of QF21: Getting activity count for page four of QF21: The IDs in the image above are the IDs of the first and last posts in that page: https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/57663-quick-fix-game-21-the-names-smith-john-smith/?do=findComment&comment=531391 https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/57663-quick-fix-game-21-the-names-smith-john-smith/?do=findComment&comment=532966

Could I get a spec doc link?

Now is when I reveal I’m the Truthless from QF25 and I’m about to nuke everyone voting for me.

Lies! That was a typo.