little wilson

It looks like Tuesday was discarded. So do we want to meet up on Thursday or Friday? Either works for me. We did get a larger turn-out when we held it on Friday though, so that might be good to do again. Does that work for everyone?

Well, since I've already mentioned it on Nalthis, I'll mention it here: one of my win cons involves a Lifeless. This is why I went to Nalthis in the first place. I was hoping a Lifeless would be on the ground. There was no Lifeless on the ground, so now I'm searching for a Lifeless. If a Child can get me a Lifeless, I'll be glad to scan Bard. If GOH gets me a Lifeless....then I'll scan whoever they want me to scan. Please note that this doesn't mean that I will only help the first faction to get me a Lifeless. I believe that as a neutral, I should help all factions equally if I'm going to help anyone. I would expect help from the other faction with a different win con (which are actually far more difficult than the Lifeless one, which is why my priority is on the win con that I at least have a chance of completing). So yes. A Lifeless is what I would like. I don't even have to have it permanently, so if you want it back, I can totally give it back. I just need a Lifeless.

I could, but--and I hate to sound so mercenary (actually, I don't)--what's in it for me? I mean, let's say I scan you and prove you to be a CoA. Then GOH won't be happy with me because I'm helping you guys. So then I give them a bit of help, and then you guys get upset at me because I'm helping them. Or I decline scanning you, and either you or someone on your team threatens to kill me if I don't help the Children. I don't really see any benefit from this for myself. And this is why I've been saying that I'm not going to go out of my way to help anyone unless there's something in it for me.

No. I'm not sure I'm going to use it at all on living players unless I need to for one of my win cons. Or if the GOH or CoA give me a reason why I should help them (my living scan sees Splinters and Shards as well, so I know if someone is a Vessel). I was worldhopping and doing other things last night that didn't cost investiture. That's the other thing: the Investiture cost on that action isn't something I want to pay every turn right now. Maybe later in the game, but not right now.

I can't speak for Bard, but I can see name, alignment and homeworld. I would assume Bard is the same. I can also target living people, local only, and learn the same info.

Well, I'm on Nalthis right now, and I don't have any opinions of anyone there, but I know you were suspicious of Lopen, so.....

I also was not attacked. I would guess that if multiple people are attacked, the writeup would indicate that, but this writeup only indicates one attack. And that attack is highly likely to be Joe towards PK. If GOH made an attack, they got blocked somehow, but not from protection, since this writeup shows that a kill that's blocked due to some type of protection is shown in the writeup. I don't think GOH made a kill though. They're probably a fairly small team, and kills probably cost a decent amount of investiture, which means that they can't just go and kill without any discretion, particularly not if the kills are local, as I suspect they are. Why does the lack of a kill indicate local targeting? Because local targeting means that they're at risk of getting caught, and if they have a small team, they can't risk getting caught this early in the game. Much better to hold off on killing and hope for the daily lynch and any vigilantes or independents with kills to weed out a number of players, while they build up investiture and gather information, so they can make much more informed kills later on. I could tell you where to start looking for GOH in that strategy, but I'm independent so I don't really need to look for them.

But how would he have information on Kaladin before Night 1 ends, unless he is Kaladin himself? We haven't gotten any results back from actions, so no one knows anything about anyone else, outside of what's been said in the thread or world PMs, and I guarantee that livinglegend doesn't know about Kaladin because of the world PM. He's on my world.

Maybe because I have one too?

It's not part of any primary investiture system to my knowledge. Doesn't mean it's not an ability.

There is an ability that can target dead players to learn role and alignment, but you have to be on the world the dead player died on to target them.

I'm actually going to head to Nalthis. I don't really care about discussion the world PM. When it comes to PMs, the only time I use group PMs are when I have reason to trust everyone in them, which I don't in this case, so I'm not going to use it unless absolutely necessary. I'd prefer to use the thread. I've thing I forgot to mention in my other post: Why in the world are people targeting Stink? I've seen arguments for lynching him because he's playing differently and I've seen arguments for lynching him before he's playing the same. I've even seen the argument to lynch him because he's independent. How can someone be playing the same yet playing differently? Bridge Boy? Care to explain? How is Stink playing the same? His past playstyle was nonsensical. He's not being nonsensical right now. He's actually making a great deal of sense and caused a ton of good discussion. Which I can't say is often the case on day one. His playstyle is shifting. He's being more sensible and he's a good player with good ideas in his own right. But you want to lynch him because he's being different? Or is it because he's being the same because he jumped around in votes (which a lot of players have done in past games)? If it's because he's changing, that's not a way to tell people it's okay to change their playstyle to be more intelligent. And to make it worse, when you try to lynch him simultaneously for being the same as he always is, you basically tell him "we don't like you no matter what you do." He'd damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. That's super great. Nice way to keep players playing. I'm impressed. I'm tempted to throw a vote on Mage but I don't really want to. I'm also tempted to vote on Bridge Boy for saying that Stink is playing the same when he's clearly not. At the same time, I want to vote on Silverblade because he accused Joe of trying to save Stink when that's not what Joe was doing at all. Ah heck, why not. I'm not sure going to be able post again today, so Silverblade.

First, let me clarify what I meant about this being an elimination game and not a faction game. It's about emphasis. MR7 was a faction game that was played like an elimination game, with the discovery faction getting ganged up on and they couldn't do anything to defend themselves. MR 10 was an elimination game that was played like a faction game for the first half and the eliminators slaughtered the village because of it. MR 12 was a faction game with eliminators, and there were players who pushed for it to be played like an elimination game despite the fact that each individual faction only had to kill the eliminators in their own faction. This game is a mix that we haven't seen before. On first glance, it seems most like MR12 , because there are (probably) some factions who don't have to worry about eliminators. But the factions in MR 12 had to worry about 2 eliminators, so that doesn't really work. But saying it's a pure faction game isn't exactly right because what about God's Own Hate? I would bet that they have a team kill. They can target anyone with that, regardless of alignment. So independents and/or non-Children still have to worry about potentially dying to this team. To the Children, this is an elimination game. To non-children, non-independents, non-God's Own Hate, it's a faction game, since everyone else is just on different factions. To independents, it's a free for all. It's all about your perspective. But if we have to choose anything, it would be an elimination game with factions, because that eliminator team, even if you only view them as a faction or separate players, can still (probably) kill. Sure, their faction goal is likely to kill specific people, but do you really think their kill only works on those particular people? I highly doubt it. So you really think they're going to luckily kill only the people they have to kill? Again, I highly doubt it. This makes them a threat to everyone, even if your win con doesn't include killing them. I'll be honest: I'm not a child. I've no idea what the Child win con is, but I would imagine it's something to do with killing all of God's Own Hate, which is another faction I didn't know about (as in, know the name of) until it was revealed in the thread. I'm independent. I don't plan on helping either/any faction with their win con unless they want to help me with mine. But I do worry about that eliminator kill, since I have an 80% death rate to eliminators when I'm not one and I'd rather prefer not to die in the first couple cycles to a faction I don't have to deal with. Also, my world PM is deader than dead. The conversation has basically just been asking people how they are and about SE. Needless to say, I'll be worldhopping elsewhere come the night.

Holy discussion, Batman. O.o About that quote (sorry about the placement of it. Mobile makes it difficult to move quotes and stuff around). A faction win would just cause a loss for those not in the faction who didn't complete all their won cons. You can only win the game if you complete all of your win cons. I'd bet that everyone has between 2-4 win cons (I think that number is actually 3 for everyone though), so any faction member who hasn't completed all of their win cons would also lose. I would not call this game a faction game. Does it probably have multiple have factions? Yes. But I'm reasonably sure that it has at least one of what can be called an eliminator faction (Rayse+cohorts). There will be the people directly opposing Rayse that would be the village faction, even if they're not labeled villagers. And there are likely a fair number of independents. That's not a faction game. It's just a complex elimination game. Let's not start calling the game something that it's not. That led to problems in MR 7, MR 10, and sort of in MR 12 as well. Let's not add LG 26 to that list as well. This is an elimination game.

I'm on mobile and at a convention until Sunday morning (mountain time), so don't expect much from me until then. I also disagree with Aman/Victor's plan, but others have already broached my qualms with it: people who cannot go to their home world, people who can go to their home world but cannot access that world's primary investiture, and independents who may or may not be able to travel to their home world but have no incentive to help the village regardless. I'd also like to comment that Rayse may have followers that are not obvious. After all, Nyali did say that the powers and abilities of a role may not match canon. For all we know, Eshonai could be good and Vasher could be evil, for the purposes of this game (though that specific example is unlikely the case since it's highly unlikely that Eshonai is anything other than working with/for Rayse). We also don't know how many open or hidden factions are in the game. Rayse may well not be the only evil faction. LG 24, anyone?

Hey, now. I'm completely innocent. I have no plans for the sword. Yet. And anyway, even if I did have plans for Cuddles, it wouldn't involve killing Len. In this purely hypothetical situation, I would have much better targets for it. Like my fellow Gods. I believe it was just "Kill with cuddles," though I'm looking through the Pahn Kahl doc right now and I'm actually not seeing any specific Command, so I'm not sure.. Huh. I feel like this should be mildly concerning.

!!!! Yay! :D ^^Basically my real reaction to this.

Cuddles was created in LG4 by the Pahn Kahl, a team consisting of myself, Jason Penguin, Tulir, El Warko, Aspren, and Joe. Peng held the sword. Unfortunately, before we could even use it, it was stolen by Dainard and used to kill Aspren and Tulir (I was also killed by it, but that was flavor because I was actually lynched). Dainard never played a game after LG4, so Alv claims that he found it in a dusty cupboard, even though Original Wilson had been in the sword and was (somehow) extracted out of it by Nale (who she used to work for....sort of). Which leads me to my next question. Len, can I have Cuddles? I helped create it, I didn't reveal your kill when all strategic sense should've led me to at least tell my teammates about it, and I formed the ASA, which is the only reason Nalthis won. I'd like Cuddles as payment. Do you accept?

Question though: would you rather be killed by having your throat slit/dagger in the back/run over by a car or by a butter knife to your back? Or a shovel to the head? I'd go with the second category, personally. Sure, it's lame, but it's different. It's memorable. And it's pretty freaking hilarious. I mean, you can't really tell stories about that time you got stabbed in the back or had your throat slit while you were sleeping. But that time someone tried to spike you but slipped and ended up spiking you straight through the neck, killing you? Or that time a hoard of crazed people drowned you in other peoples' blood (which, side note, is not lame, but horribly disgusting)? Yeah, those you remember. Those stick with you. So, yeah. Those "lame" deaths? They bring that amused ire that keeps you talking about it months or even years after it happened. Much better than being killed by a common dagger.

Well, to be fair, that's in the SE General Rules, and all games go off the same format. EDIT: Here. I would also highly recommend the new players read the General Rules and Etiquette Policy so you kind of know how the games work.

*whistles innocously*

So if we want to do this every other week/twice a month, when shall we meet again? Next week, but what day works best? I believe Alyssa said Tuesdays work best for her and I know Tuesdays don't work for Slowswift (or they didn't at some point in time; is that still the case?), but what about everyone else? I'm good any day next week. Also, perhaps if we have a lower number of people coming (for example, only me, Slowsift, and Sunbird were at the last meeting), we could still have the pizza. Because I do like the pizza contributions and stuff, but it's not really practical if there are consistently more than 8 people. But less is completely do-able.

Twice a month. And yes. I like this idea.

I'm actually not sure, though I might not have been the one to put the age in there. There are about 20+ people with editing permissions on that spreadsheet. Though if you mentioned it in a different thread, I could've gotten it from there. Maybe. I don't know. I don't remember putting your age in, so I'm guessing it wasn't me but that it was Elbereth.

I assume the creepy bit is due to the locations? There's actually a game-play reason for that too. Not only is it good to know when you can reasonably expect someone to be online from a rough timezone estimate, but also, if you're going to GM a game, you probably don't want to have your evil team consist of players from Australia, the US, and Britain, because that team will never all be online at the same time to coordinate. Which means they'll be at a disadvantage.