Satsuoni

Well, it is quite likely that the Shadowblaze things are just counterparts of Forgotten, that also possess people and are sentient. Maybe they thought that Joel would be of more use as non-rithmatist for any number of reasons, including the fact that Nalizar seems to have trouble concentrating on non-rithmatist. I find coin unlikely for a variety of reasons, including the fact that the creature lives in a place surrounded by gears, and should have acclimated. As for the Muns - one possibility that occurred to me is that they have their own family chamber. As long as it attracts even one Shadowblaze, they can present only their own children until it chooses one. Or maybe they'd have the means of forcing one, then.

Heh, yes. My theories are largely in the "Power of love" category. Something like "If you love him and consider him to be a good hero, and wish to protect him, he becomes vulnerable to you. Now shoot him in the face." So... it might be a little early, but what kind of Epic would you like to be? Powers, vulnerabilities, flavours of evil? No real limits Mine would be: Power: My body is a 3D portal, perfectly controlled. (Not that I can make them, but that I am a portal, so no physical body to hurt). Normally it automatically maps to nearby matter to make me look human. Distance limits: solar system Can stretch and move, teleporting stuff whole or in pieces. Size limit: 1 square kilometer. Senses are limited to the stuff passing through me and worldfeel. Vulnerabilities: Yes, I'll go with cliche on this one Love is a twisted, incomprehensible emotion Somebody in love with me passing through me will close that part of me. The larger the area closed, the harder it gets to reopen. After some limit, I die. Flavour of evil: Benign I'd only kill/maim people who annoy me, stand in my way or accuse me of lying. I'd probably have little interest in actually ruling or subjugating them. I'd probably have some fun working with them against other Epics - not like they can refuse me

Ah. I see. I only know your first name, so I probably confused you with Eric James Stone.

"Plans. Yes. " - I poke at bandages on Alfie's torso - "We better find some time to implant this spike properly. Same goes for me." I sigh, the action causing a temporal to shift slightly. Uncomfortable. "Except I won't have the benefit of anybody supervising the operation from outside. This spike is fine, but there are other placements that are very hard. Ah well." "After that, I expect I'll be busy with common work. I think Terrisman is going to visit again today. He'll probably have that guard with him. You should be careful..." - I yawn. Still not enough rest, it would seem. "In the meanwhile, there is a thing that concerns me. These two days, we engaged in very noticeable operations. By now, the rumours are probably all over the city. It would help if you were to investigate, maybe find a way to either quiet those rumors down or at least direct them. Otherwise... Well, take a look anyway. See if somebody connects the strange happenings with this place. Before that, however, I suggest you eat. Or would you prefer operation first? Though I am afraid there won't be any time for that before breakfast."

Huh. Could you point me to any source that explicitly tells that it is an error, Kurk? It seems clunky, but technically valid (you could also add "had to be" before Rithmatist).

It was a good book indeed Also, it is on Amazon, hence available in digital form anywhere, though I don't blame those who want to wait for a physical book. Curse be to you and your peers! Seriously, though, I am envious. Your name might even be in the afterword, like Chaos's and Rubix's (ok, not sure about Chaos, but I think that was his name.) I must say that I would have liked Scribbler better, too. Also, what's the deal with the exercises after afterword? It is the first time I have seen such in an actual fantasy work... (So no, no complaints. That means perfect enough. )

No worries. I was afraid I was unclear is all. Overclarification is my bad habit

Well, dead, yes. The thing is, I am pretty sure there was no scene of somebody trying to hack a single limb off a living human - after all, if he can't use it, there is not much point of working on that during battle. Also, we don't know what happens to the limbs after - are they dead enough to rot, for example, or just kind of paralyzed, etc. Hence, doubt. (pretty sure, though)

Hm? Did someone invoke my name in vain? ... Ah, I see, not in vain. Carry on Anyway, to topic: Your theory is ok, but it does not seem to address the issue at hand: why does Shardblade work differently on living and dead things? If the Identity is cut off, shouldn't the limb also fall off, like a rock cut in half? What is the difference? In both cases, Identity (not realmatically) would be cut, which should reflect as separation in the physical realm. Soulcasting, for example, doesn't seem to be affected by the small fact that the target happens to be human - a rock is a rock, organics soulcast into rock is still rock. Now, I have a theory about that (and I do believe in Shardblade being Spiritual weapon). I'll try to be brief. First, Cosmere gravity is Spiritual. It is quite possible that electromagnetic, etc forces are too. They are, to an extent, what forms Spiritual component of a common rock. They are also, compared to human Spiritual presence, relatively weak. So the Shardblade, which has a strong, blade-like presence in Spiritual realm, would shear through those connections, cleaving rock in half. Something like Shardplate, however, is too dense. It will rebuff Shardblade and shatter after several hits. Living things, however, have additional Spiritual layer which corresponds to the same physical location as the body. The Shardblade damages that, and, in Spiritual, gets stuck/rebounds without reaching physical connections. This looks like a blade "fuzzing", as its Physical/spiritual components dissociate for a moment. A few more hits would probably shear the limb off.

[ooc] Bah, life got me all distracted. I shall try to update the repercussions for now. Felendwyl (I am relatively sure she wasn't named yet) has spotted us and reported to Sindred her suspicions. She is not considered quite stable, but he is more on his guard now. He will probably continue dealing with me, but will launch a discreet investigation at the same time. Felendwyl herself is ever more suspicious, of course. She knows that I am not a Coinshot, and wonders about cats. As mosy people in Elendel, she is not aware of Hemalurgy (otherwise she would have used it to fulfill her dream of becoming a Ferring). The rest of the Harmony's gang has dispersed, carrying with them rumors, one more wild than another. Rumors or not, however, for many smarter people it is obvious that something killed Harmony and driven crazy several of the gang members. The Kandra are aware of my (our) intervention. Likewise, some of the criminals have figured out the connection between that event and confused stories of a cat luring patrons of Inquisitor's spike to a trap leaving several mangled dead bodies and a critically wounded Seeker that clucks unceasingly. The cat has been seen here, though the description of either cat are not clear enough to show similarity between them. [/ooc] I could see Alfie asleep in the corner. Well, now was not the time to bother him, though I'll have to implant the spike properly soon. I call for Finnar. He enters, seeming somewhat annoyed. Apparently, my excursions and subsequent sleep played havoc with my appointment schedule. I apologize, as he informs me that Lord Sindred have arranged for another meeting this day. He then leaves, leaving a large stack of paperwork behind for me to work through. Nya... Well, appearances are important. I sit and get to work. Unless something happens, it doesn't seem like I'll be able to leave the house today.

I slept. It was a heavy, dangerous sleep of somebody recovering from pewter drag. My body burned pewter, but the damage was extensive. My reliance on my investiture grew, and even in my sleep I continued to tap my metalminds at a steady rate. I slept, and I dreamed. Dreamed once again of the heavy, twisted metal machinery, covered with grease that could seemingly eat even the soul. Twisted and warped, broken yet whole, it threatened to consume me as I fell though it, through and towards an endless abyss. I was not alone. My cat was with me, as always, old, silent, enigmatic, my normal perception of her more of reflection of my desires. She knew life and death, and she cared not. On the edge of my perception were others. Humans, ripped and screaming silently. Threads of shadow connecting me to the cats carrying splinters of my soul. The metal twisted around me, almost touching, devouring Investiture leaking from the holes in my spirit. Inside the metal was light, bipartite, grey and blinding. It watched me, with amusement and faint distaste, a remnant of mortal age. Harmony saw me, and I saw it. The Shard was vast, by Investiture barely enough to comprehend the vastness. It was in the metal, in the mists, in everything. But it rarely interfered, and that was a great boon. And still the great abyss beckons, but for this day, I have enough power to be. Slowly, my dreams become normal ramblings of sleeping mind. I wake up in my bed, disoriented, my head pounding and my body aching. I become aware of Health in my bracer. I also become aware of bruises surrounding it. Sleeping with jewelry on was apparently not the best idea. Still, liberal doses of Health and Investiture clear my mind. I glance at the timepiece in the corner. Apparently I slept for the rest of the day, night and until midday again. I stand up and look around, wondering what Alfie was up to all this time.

This one? I think, in this context, "Trailman" mean a traveling minstrel or storyteller.

Ah, true that. I meant personally. Emotions and memories are indelible parts of cognition, memories providing patterns of behaviour and emotions weights necessary to reach a decision, so they kind of have to be on the same level, in my opinion. I am relatively certain one cannot think without emotions (in case of computer programs, the programmer provides a set of fixed "emotions"). If you can control Koloss completely by overwriting their emotions, that is a kind of mind control, just more flexible than normal Rioting. In the end, it is an unresolved question: are Cosmere emotions cognitive or Spiritual? I myself prefer mind/body/life division at the core. What, did you never have a fight with a friend? A reconciliation agreement is a mutually agreed way to even the score. Complicated. However, one thing came to mind: in Ars Arcanum, Feruchemy and Hemalurgy were specifically mentioned to have Spiritual component, "feelers" for Feruchemy, and primary impact for Hemalurgy. However, Spiritual Allomancy was not mentioned, which leads me to be more convinced that it is largely constrained in Physical and Cognitive (in effect, not method of action), though Enhancement quadrant is somewhat confusing.

OK, color me confused Now I no longer understand cognitive-sprititual distinction. Let us see - emotional manipulation allows perfect control in case of Hemalurgic creations. Once again, I can't find the quote, but it has to do with, essentially, overwriting most emotions of the target with your own (where is that quote?) Emotion controls memory access and vise versa (for me, anyway). Memories seem cognitive. Skewering is a sure sign of willpower, IMO The amount of willpower necessary to simply punch a guy as per reconciliation agreement was tremendous (once again, I can only judge by my experiences) But that is probaply different for different people. Next, Social interactions - based on Connection which we know to be Spritual (no connection, no socium. If you don't care about somebody's actions, he can't do much, if you don't care about anybody, well...) - are Cognitive? How we view ourselves is part of our Identity, which is Spiritual, yet it is also part of our Cognitive aspect... As I said, I am pretty confused.

Hm. Well, Vin might have been influenced by Ruin, who wanted her to find the place (she couldn't use mists with her earring in). In any case, in game, Willpower is reduced on mental attack (though it is wits+spirit, which is.. not intuitive, considering that Inquisitors, with their spirit near zero and possibly not too smart still had plenty of willpower). If mental is not cognitive... could you describe what you consider to be Cognitive attacks beside Soulcasting? [EDIT]

There is a possibility that one would become a Mistborn that is particularly weak in all but two metals. As in " burns, but can barely push a coin in his hand" weak.

I did, didn't I? Thanks! Well, the only case I can remember offhand is Vin hearing the Well without burning anything, but that was a special case. Still, unless her attunement or spike grew her a new sense (possible), it is still the sense other people have, just far, far too weak to notice. True that. Doesn't mean that those connection can't have endpoints in Cognitive, rather than physical. Hmm... I've read that now. All stunts either protect you or others from Emotional Allomancy (mental), or give you willpower, which I'll also argue to be mental presence. Also, they have the following "gem" on the same page: Resistance to all and every investiture seems a bit too much... Have to run now, more on this later!Ok. Well, as mentioned, Investiture resistance is resistance to every power. That would imply that, for example, metals in Coppercloud will be harder to manipulate by Iron, and they'll be less visible, delineating a Coppercloud to any coinshot. As such, I think a complete resistance is a bit overmuch. @phantom : I doubt that. A tinmind serves to store the same senses Tin increases, if in a different way, and that does not include mental sensitivity.

I climb onto the roof and wait.

Disclaimers: This thread is a spin-off of the thread "Why are Bronze burners able to hear The Well of Ascension?" I am relatively sure this idea haven't been expressed in this way before (in OP), but I may be wrong. If so, please direct me to correct thread. Theory: I consider the Allomantic effects of Bronze and Copper. Despite the discrepancy of Pushing/Pulling, I think they are similar to the way Tin and Pewter work, but for different Realms. Tin and Pewter are Physical, and affect (primarily) Physical realm. Bronze and copper are Mental, so it would make sense that they affect primarily Cognitive realm. Now, Bronze and Tin similarity is obvious. Both enhance senses, though Bronze enhances the sense that is too weak for normal humans to notice - the sense of "ripples in the fabric of reality". A person can sense it without Bronze, if his sensitivity is high enough. (This leads me to theorize that you could steal those "Mental" senses by some metal, and, in theory, become a permanent seeker through Hemalurgy). It is also quite probable, that those senses are limited to Cognitive pathways, which will become important later. As all realms interact, it is possible that the change in spiritual, for example, would leak onto Cognitive and be detected, though. Now when we compare Pewter and Copper, the similarity is not obvious. Pewter makes you stronger and more agile, makes you heal faster and makes you body denser. Copper does not seem to affect one much. One can say, though, that Copper makes your Cognitive aspect stronger, no longer as affected by Emotional Allomacy (you can still be affected if the allomancer is strong enough). That does not explain copperclouds, until one considers what exactly is "Cognitive aspect." Here, however, I should refer to the curious aspect of time bubbles - namely, that it is affected by the perception of "object" and perception of "closeness", both Cognitive. If we consider one's cognitive aspect to be also part of intertwined cognitive aspects of things that perceive it and are perceived, in some way, by it, and assume that "ripples" heard by Bronze seeker propagate in cognitive realm along those connections, then increased strength and decreased "elasticity" of Smoker's cognitive aspect would dampen those pulses that happen to share the same connection. The results would be as follows: mental effects not affecting Smoker as much or at all. Things that direct power through non-Cognitive channels will not be affected. A Seeker inside coppercloud would be "deaf". Mental Allomancy affecting a person inside coppercloud (not Smoker himself) over a direct mental connection will be somewhat weaker, but not as much, possibly not significantly. And also, Coppercloud has an edge similar to time bubble. Thoughts?

Ah, yes I've found a first mention of this here, by Comatose himself. That was the one I remembered, actually. Ok, I have formulated a crude theory of Bronze/copper, which I think is outside the scope of this thread. I'll make a spin-off.

Technically maybe possible, but very dfficult. All Coinshots can learn the trick that allows Inquisitors to see (possibly by becoming Savants - or maybe simply becoming very good with metal, these are two different things). Inquisitors could eventually see well enough to distinguish colors through metal lines, and partially read emotions. So it is plausible that a particularly good, probably Savant, and preferably blind Coinshot could learn how to distinguish metals by, say, their lattice structure. So far, however, nobody except Inquisitors in the books, to my memory (admittedly failing), have learned even to see metal bits inside bodies. So,my opinion: possible, but very rare and hard to train.

[ooc]Man looks at the cat with increasing puzzlement. Apparently, the cat wanted him to come out of the bar. The man vacillates, but in the end, curiosity prevails. He stands up, shouts a few rude remarks to his companions, and approaches Alfie. Other patrons look on with curiosit, too. One other man, a Brute (pewter Feruchemist), stands up and joins the bloodmaker. "'Tis got me interested. What is with this cat? I'll go with ya." [/ooc]

A possibly relevant quote from the book: This is how Preservation (probably) is felt. For most people, copper-like pulse would jam everything else. By the way, do we have confirmation that all Seekers heard the well? I know Vin could hear them without burning at the end: But she was attuned and groomed for power since her birth. Could any random Seeker hear it and decide to take a dip? As for Feruchemy, I once had the theory that it didn't produce pulses per se. I likened Allomancy to AC power, and Feruchemy to DC, so that the seeker would feel more of constant pressure rather than a pulse. Brandon did say about it being "different", but I can't find the quote (the same one Kurk refers to above). [Edit] : As for absorption... maybe. I still think of it as jamming, but I've been wrong before, as my title can attest. I think that is what Aluminium does though - unlike all or most other metals, instead of giving Investiture it sucks it away, flaring all metals like duralumin, but backwards, into Preservation, so you instantly lose your ability to feel the metals - including Aluminum, until it burns away. Other question is why it also instantly disappears, but that can be explained in many ways - like for example, that it doesn't, it just keeps burning until it runs out, Allomancer no longer capable of feeling or controlling it. Likewise, its ability to protect one from emotional Allomancy, etc.

And with all Feruchemy, it probably also shields you from oxygen poisoning... But yeah, as above, I have always read that quote "you can get rid of breathing, or tap even more/keep breathing while tapping to over-oxygenate your blood."

Here, in the Q&A, and later in that thread. So, well, yes. And perhaps some of the greatshells, like those islands, are already sentient. As for I have always assumed them to be Truthspren: beings that only appear in perception of others, that do not interact much with anything, and possibly exist solely as a sentience coupled with ability, lacking even power to use it. Though I may be wrong on that one. As it were, I do not agree with Winrunner's theory - it seems to make Cognitive realm somehow secondary and derivative, while I hold all Realms to be equal, but that is just my bias, and I don't have anything factual to counteract it with. Except maybe the fact that Syl without bond can apparently think in Cognitive realm but not on Physical? (bolded parts mine)