Thoughts on the identity of a confirmed worldhopper from Way of Kings

[+mdross81]

As part of some research for another theory, I recently found myself looking for any clues that might shed some light on the identity of a still-unidentified worldhopper from WoK. I've included the relevant excerpts and WoBs below, followed by my two theories for where else we may have seen this character.

The Short, Worldhopping, White-Robed Ardent

In Chapter 54 Dalinar joins a conversation between Highprince Rine Hatham and four others:

Quote

Of Hatham’s four companions, two were lesser lighteyes and one was a short white-robed ardent Dalinar didn’t know. The last was a red-gloved Natan man with bluish skin and stark white hair, two locks dyed a deep red and braided down to hang alongside his cheeks. He was a visiting dignitary; Dalinar had seen him at the feasts.

The lesser lighteyes are never named, and Dalinar later remembers that the Natan man is Au-nak. But it's the short, white-robed ardent that interests me because of a couple of things he says later in the conversation:

Quote

“Which devotary do you credit, Brightlord Dalinar?” Hatham asked, thoughtful, as if trying to remember something he’d forgotten.

“The Order of Talenelat.”

“Ah,” Hatham said. “Yes, it makes sense. You must find this discussion terribly boring.”

A safe out from the conversation. Dalinar smiled, nodding in thanks to Hatham’s politeness.

“The Order of Talenelat?” Au-nak said. “I always considered that a devotary for the lesser people.”

“This from a Natan,” the ardent said, stuffily.

“My family has always been devoutly Vorin.”

“Yes,” the ardent replied, “conveniently so, since your family has used its Vorin ties to trade favorably in Alethkar. One wonders if you are equally devout when not standing on our soil.”

“I don’t have to be insulted like this,” Au-nak snapped.

He turned and strode away, causing Hatham to raise a hand. “Nak-ali!” Hatham called, rushing after him anxiously. “Please, ignore him!”

Given the geology of Roshar, the ardent's reference to soil jumped out to a lot of people. So Brandon has been asked about the ardent a couple of times. There are two relevant WoBs.

First, here's one from 2016:

Quote

Argent

In The Way of Kings, Chapter 54: Gibletish, Dalinar has a brief conversation with Brightlord Hatham, one of his ardents, and a few other people. During the conversation the ardent uses the word "soil" in a way most Rosharans wouldn’t. After the conversation he tells Dalinar of "our goodwill toward you" and that "we will speak with you again." The odd use of the word "soil" combined with what could be a vague reference to the ardent’s associated with a group other than the ardentia has led some of us to believe he might be a worldhopper. Plus, we know Nazh is around in the area, or will arrive soon. Is there truth to this idea, or are we overthinking this?

Brandon Sanderson

Alethi use the word "soil" on occasion in their language to mean "dirtied" or similar. It's a holdover from an earlier time. But they don't associate it with the ground, and if you see it used instead of stone like in this quote, it should indeed raise an eyebrow.

Argent

Sooo... I mean, my eyebrow was already raised. Let's not bait the RAFO too hard, and drop the worldhopper part - is there more to this particular ardent than meets the eye?

Wait, hold up. How can "soil" be a holdover from an earlier time if Roshar was always a rocky place? Or did you mean that it's one of those words that carried over from Yolish, or whatever other language people spoke before they migrated to Roshar (like "hound")?

Brandon Sanderson

It is similar to hound, which is one of the ones that Hoid pointed out as an oddity. But people did not migrate from Yolen to Roshar. Roshar was inhabited before the shattering of Adonalsium.

Argent

Hmm. I am rusty on my Roshar history, I'll have to review what we know the topic. I know Roshar existed before the Shattering, and it was presumably populated, but I didn't think there had been humans there. They don't feel native. I've been working under the assumption that the Parshendi were native (maybe), but the humans came from somewhere - the Tranquiline Halls myths also kind of support that.

Or have I missed something?

Brandon Sanderson

Technically, what I said doesn't actually contradict anything you just said. But just to be extra safe: RAFO. I have to keep a FEW secrets safe from you people to come out in the books.

Footnote: Resolved in the OB tour. It's a worldhopper but not Nazh.
Stormlight Three Update #4 (Oct. 3, 2016)

And here's the second, from 2017:

Quote

Questioner

There's an ardent in Way of Kings who's like described as short and he's at a party and he uses the word "soil". Do we know who he is, is he Nazh?

Brandon Sanderson

That is specifically a worldhopper. I don't think I've revealed who he is. But I'm still gonna RAFO just in case that is somebody.

Footnote: This expands on an earlier line of questioning.
Oathbringer Chicago signing (Nov. 21, 2017)

So, a confirmed worldhopper, and it's not Nazh.

(Bonus fun fact with a crackpot tie-in to MB Era 2: Hatham's colors are red and gold)

Back to the scene at the feast. Just after the excerpt I included above, we learn that the ardent actually insulted Au-nak on purpose, on orders from Hatham:

Quote

“Insufferable bore,” the ardent said softly, taking a sip of his wine – orange of course, as he was a man of the clergy.

Dalinar frowned at him. “You are bold, ardent,” he said sternly. “Perhaps foolishly so. You insult a man Hatham wants to do business with.”

“Actually, I belong to Brightlord Hatham,” the ardent said. “He asked me to insult his guest – Brightlord Hatham wants Au-nak to think that he is shamed. Now, when Hatham agrees quickly to Au-nak’s demands, the foreigner will assume it was because of this – and won’t delay the contract signing out of suspicion that it is proceeding too easily.

Ah, of course. Dalinar looked after the fleeing pair. They go to such lengths. Considering that, what was Dalinar to think of Hatham’s politeness earlier, when he had given Dalinar a reason to explain his apparent distaste for conflict? Was Hatham preparing Dalinar for some covert manipulation?

The ardent cleared his throat. “I would appreciate it if you did not repeat to anyone what I just told you, Brightlord.” Dalinar noticed Adolin returning to the king’s island, accompanied by six of Dalinar’s officers, in uniform and wearing their swords.

“Why did you tell me in the first place, then?” Dalinar asked, turning his attention back to the white-robed man.

“Just as Hatham wishes his partner in negotiations to know of his goodwill, I wish you to know of our goodwill toward you, Brightlord.”

Dalinar frowned. He’d never had much to do with the ardents – his devotary was simple and straightforward. Dalinar got his fill of politics with the court; he had little desire to find more in religion. “Why? What should it matter if you have goodwill toward me?”

The ardent smiled. “We will speak with you again.” He bowed low and withdrew.

The highlighted bits above add to the intrigue. Note that the ardent doesn't say that Hatham wants Dalinar to know of the goodwill. The ardent says I wish you to know of our goodwill toward you. Then, in closing, he says we will speak with you again.

Given that we know this ardent to be a worldhopper, this leaves me wondering who the we/our is referring to. The ardentia? Some secret organization of worldhoppers? Dysian Aimians? Or am I reading too much into this and he just means Hatham's people?

The other thing I wondered is whether we've seen this character anywhere else. There's not a lot to go on. He's a short, white-robed ardent who's cool with being involved in lighteyed political scheming. The only other little tidbit I picked out is from the part of the conversation where they are discussing the Emul-Tukar conflict:

Quote

“The city’s pattern is central to the Emuli religion,” the ardent said. “They claim it is their ancestral homeland, a gift to them from the Heralds. And the Tukari are led by that god-priest of theirs, Tezim. So the conflict is religious in nature.”

So add into the mix that he's at least somewhat knowledgeable about Emul/Tukar and Sesemalex Dar.

The Case for Godeke

Based on what little we know, there's one character in RoW who seems like he could be a possible fit: Godeke the Edgedancer. Godeke is a former ardent who is described as being short and having some prior experience with diplomacy. In RoW 19, Dalinar decides he can't send Lift on the expedition to Lasting Integrity. He wants someone with diplomatic experience. Godeke volunteers:

Quote

“You are excellent with healing,” Dalinar said to her, “among the best of your order. We need you here, and besides, we should send someone with practice as a diplomat.”

“I could give it a try, sir,” said Godeke, a shorter Edgedancer who had once been an ardent. “I have some experience with these matters.”

The scene where the ardent is helping Hatham with Au-nak could be read as diplomatic experience.

Given the ardent's knowledge about the Emul/Tukar conflict, another little bit of evidence comes in Godeke's ability in RoW 30 to recognize that the men in Ishar's brute squad in Shadesmar are speaking Tukari:

Quote

They spoke to him in a langue he didn’t know.

“Do you speak Alethi?” he asked. “Or Veden?”

“Gthlebn Thaylen?” Godeke asked.

“Alethi?” one of the men said. “Go away, Alethi.”

Yes, that was a Tukari accent. “We just want to chat,” Adolin said. “We haven’t seen other humans here. We thought it would be nice to talk to others.”

“Go away,” the man repeated. “We not talk.”

Adolin glanced past him, to where some of the humans had moved to fish among their goods. Though the people he spoke with carried cudgels, he caught a glint of reflected light among the others. They were carrying real weapons, but didn’t want to hold them openly.

“Fine,” Adolin said. “Suit yourselves.”

He and the others retreated to the town. The Tukari watched them all the way.

“Those were Tukari," Godeke said.

Although we know that the ardent in WoK was supposed to intentionally offend, Au-nak, I think it's fair to say that another small piece of evidence in favor of Godeke being that ardent is the particular comment of Au-nak's that seems to set him off. The ardent insults Au-nak right after Au-nak dismissively refers to the Order of Talenelat as a devotary "for the lesser people." Very Edgedancer-like to be concerned about the lesser people.

The last bit of evidence is the reverence that Godeke seems to have for Dalinar - which I think can fit with the ardent's comment about wanting Dalinar to know of his goodwill toward him. Here's Godeke talking about Dalinar (and frankly sounding kinda cosmere-aware/worldhopper-y) in RoW 22:

Quote

“You … continue to follow the Almighty then?” Adolin asked. “Vorinism and all that? Despite finding out that the Heralds betrayed us?”

“The Heralds are not God, but his servants,” Godeke said. “Storms know, I’ve failed Him more than once myself.” He adopted a distant expression. “I don’t think we can blame them for eventually wearing out. Rather, I think about how remarkable it is that they worked for so long to keep us safe.”

“And the fact that they confirmed the death of the Almighty?”

“The death of Honor,” Godeke said. “One aspect of the Alighty.” He smiled. “It’s all right, Brightlord. I can understand someone questioning now, of all times. Remember though, the church taught that we are all aspects of the Almighty – that He lives in us. As He lived in the being called Honor, who was tasked with protecting men.

“The Almighty cannot die. People can die. Heralds can die. Even Honor could die. But Honor, people, and Heralds will all live again – transformed, Soulcast through His power.” Godeke glanced back at his packhorse, which his spren was riding. Stuffed into the saddlebags and peeking out were several books. “I’m still learning. We all are. The Book of Endless Pages cannot be filled … though your father made a very nice addition to the text.”

“You’re okay with a man writing then? Adolin said, frowning.

“You’re father is not simply a man, Adolin,” Godeke said.

“He –”

“Your father is a holy man. As I was before taking up this new role.” Godeke shook his head. “All my life I lived with a deformity – and then in an instant I was transformed and healed. I became what I’d always seen myself as being. Your father has undergone a more vibrant transformation. He is as divine as any ardent.

So that's the case for Godeke being the worldhopping ardent from WoK 54.

The Case for Tukks

The only other character that I considered was Kal's old sergeant Tukks. There are three pieces of evidence in favor of Tukks beings the ardent. One: he's short. I know, I know, lots of characters are described as short, but bear with me.

Two: Tukks gets the worldhopper red-flag description of having features that are "off." From OB 91:

Quote

Sergeant Tukks walked to one of the bunks and settled down, the wood groaning under his weight. Younger than the other sergeants, he had features that were … off somehow. Perhaps it was his short stature, or his sunken cheeks.

The third, and most compelling, bit of evidence in favor of the ardent being Tukks is the fact that Tukks is the only other character in SA who ever uses the word soil as reference to the ground (as opposed to something being "soiled") that isn't a reference to the ground in Shinovar. From WoK 27:

Quote

He closed his eyes, remembering days as a boy holding a quarterstaff.

Words spoken by Tukks years ago returned to him, words spoken on that bright summer day when he’d first held a weapon in Amaram’s army. The first step is to care, Tukks’s voice seemed to whisper. Some talk about being emotionless in battle. Well, I suppose it’s important to keep your head. But I hate that feeling of killing while calm and cold. I’ve seen that those who care fight harder, longer, and better than those who don’t. It’s the difference between mercenaries and real soldiers. It’s the difference between fighting to defend your homeland and fighting on foreign soil.

So that seems like a pretty solid connection.

As for Tukks supposedly being dead, first: it didn't happen on-screen; and second: see the below WoB:

Quote

gurgelblaster

Where's Kaladin's old sergeant Tukks from? Is he still around?

Brandon Sanderson

I'm keeping more stories about Tukks in my back pocket, in case I need them, so this is a RAFO.

Dawnshard Annotations Reddit Q&A (Nov. 6, 2020)

So ... that raises my eyebrows for sure.

Anyway, what do y'all think? Any other solid possibilities on where else we may have seen this ardent?

Also, I realize I haven't even touched the question of which other planet the ardent might be from. If it's a planet we already know about, and we go by usage of the word "soil" as a reference to the ground, best bets are Sel and Scadrial. The word soil crops up with that usage in Elantris and MB Eras 1 and 2. "Soil" is mentioned in Warbreaker, but only by Vasher and Hoid, who we know have been on planets other than Nalthis. The word soil isn't used in the stories set on Threnody or First of the Sun. Not sure one way or the other about Taldain becuase I don't have the patience to scour the graphic novels.

[Frustration]

Godeke was deformed before becoming a Radiant

[+mdross81]

3 minutes ago, Frustration said:

Godeke was deformed before becoming a Radiant

Yeah, I know. Wasn’t sure where that fits in though given that we don’t get any description of said deformity. 

[apepi]

What if Tukks was deformed because of the battle?

[+mdross81]

5 hours ago, apepi said:

What if Tukks was deformed because of the battle?

So Tukks = Godeke? I like the thought, although Godeke does say he lived with his deformity all his life.

I actually considered the possibility that all three are the same person. But I don’t think it works because Kal, who seems fairly familiar with Godeke, would recognize Tukks right?

[mathiau]

9 hours ago, mdross81 said:

Although we know that the ardent in WoK was supposed to intentionally offend, Au-nak, I think it's fair to say that another small piece of evidence in favor of Godeke being that ardent is the particular comment of Au-nak's that seems to set him off. The ardent insults Au-nak right after Au-nak dismissively refers to the Order of Talenelat as a devotary "for the lesser people." Very Edgedancer-like to be concerned about the lesser people.

Godeke is of the Devotary of Sincerity, otherwise he wouldn't talk about the book of Endless Pages

[+mdross81]

45 minutes ago, mathiau said:

Godeke is of the Devotary of Sincerity, otherwise he wouldn't talk about the book of Endless Pages

I know that’s the general view and I agree.

But Dalinar is in the Order of Talenelat and the ardent doesn’t seem to like it when Au-nak dismissively calls it an order for lesser people. That just seems like a reaction that a future Edgedancer might have. 

[mathiau]

22 minutes ago, mdross81 said:

I know that’s the general view and I agree.

But Dalinar is in the Order of Talenelat and the ardent doesn’t seem to like it when Au-nak dismissively calls it an order for lesser people. That just seems like a reaction that a future Edgedancer might have. 

I disagree, I think an Edgedancer would answer something like "yes and we're proud of it"

[RedBlue]

13 hours ago, mdross81 said:

Given that we know this ardent to be a worldhopper, this leaves me wondering who the we/our is referring to. The ardentia? Some secret organization of worldhoppers? Dysian Aimians? Or am I reading too much into this and he just means Hatham's people?

I think the ‘we’ is probably some organisation of worldhoppers. If it were Hatham or the ardentia, they would have better ways to cosy up to Dalinar than to throw him a political tidbit he won’t appreciate the value of. They know he’s not got a head for politics, and his dislike of it is pretty clear. If it were the Dysian Aimians - well, why would a worldhopper posing as an Alethi ardent be speaking for the Dustin Aimians? By process of elimination, I think it’s got to be a worldhopper organisation. And I do wonder where they’ve been, and why they haven’t contacted Dalinar since.

 

I don’t think the case for Godeke being a worldhopper is strong. His backstory, behaviour and language all line up with him being what he appears to be. Also, his opinions about Vorinism are a cool insight into the impact the Radiants have had on Alethi culture, so it would be a shame if it turned out that it was just a worldhopper faking it. 

I think you have a strong case for Tukks being a worldhopper. Not sure if he’s the same worldhopper as the short ardent (at a glance, the timeline would work, I think?), but something is going on with Tukks.

[+mdross81]

52 minutes ago, RedBlue said:

I don’t think the case for Godeke being a worldhopper is strong. His backstory, behaviour and language all line up with him being what he appears to be. Also, his opinions about Vorinism are a cool insight into the impact the Radiants have had on Alethi culture, so it would be a shame if it turned out that it was just a worldhopper faking it. 

I agree that I like it better if Godeke is genuinely who he says he is. Plus the deformity thing doesn’t really seem to line up with the ardent.

 

53 minutes ago, RedBlue said:

I think you have a strong case for Tukks being a worldhopper. Not sure if he’s the same worldhopper as the short ardent (at a glance, the timeline would work, I think?), but something is going on with Tukks,

Yeah, if nothing else, I definitely ended this research thinking there’s some more going on with Tukks and that he’s possibly a worldhopper.

I had actually gone down the rabbit hole of cross-referencing what we know about Tukks with other characters as well. But it didn’t really lead anywhere productive.  The only thing that really came of it was me side-eyeing Bashin (who calls everyone lad and refers to the Parshendi as shellheads like Tukks) as a likely worldhopper too.