Pandora's shard Posted December 26, 2020 Posted December 26, 2020 We know that Endowment's vessel is a Dragon, and after RoW, it's almost certain that Cultivation's vessel is a dragon too. Don't you guys think it too neat that a weapon of massive power gets created in one planet, ends up in another, and is then used by a shard to fulfil her plans in the new planet? Could it be that cultivation hinted to endowment about helping create such a dangerous weapon, that could be used to kill the shard vessels? We know how far cultivation can see and how well she can predict how events can play out. We know that odium killed her husband, and even before that, came to Roshar to destroy the shards there. Could it be Cultivation's way of getting revenge? Plot for a plan so far ahead in time, that Odium could never predict it? If this is true (total seculation), could it be that being dragons has got anything to do with this possible affinity? Can dragons in Cosmere communicate with each other over far distances or being shards of Adonalsium help being able to know events of distant places? I can't help but feel that, there has been some kind of truce and affinity between endowment and cultivation. What do you think guys? Could creating Nightblood be another one of Cultivation's crazy plans (through Endowment)? Have I gone totally crazy with this one, or you guys think it is possible? Would love to know what you think.. 2
Frustration Posted December 27, 2020 Posted December 27, 2020 We know Cultivation is a dragon, not Endowment. 1
Pandora's shard Posted January 5, 2021 Author Posted January 5, 2021 Hey everyone!!! Was just listening to Nightblood shardcast and Ian made a point that, Brandon always intended for Nightblood to come from another planet. Also, it was mentioned in the shardcast that stormlight Archive was first in Brandon's mind, and then came the Warbreaker. Do you think that Brandon devised the method to kill Rayse, then made sure to place it somewhere other than Roshar, so that Rayse/Odium could not be threated or trace it to cultivation, then, the existence of 5 returned scholars came into his mind, who would be invested, but would go to Roshar, watch the shard blades, and would come back to copy it. The problem was to bring Nightblood to Roshar. Now, returned need continuous supply of investiture to survive, and what better place to come to than Roshar to survive. So, magic system of warbreaker was devised to make sure that a requirement remained for more investiture. Cultivation may have communicated with endowment, and Nightblood was made. Events happened, and eventually, Nightblood found its way to Roshar through Vasher. So, while cultivation may have initiated the plan to improve odium by killing it's vessel by forming a weapon that can do it, she initiated the next plan to attract Odium by giving the boon to Taravangium. And then, after cultivating these, she just watched the fruits of her labour. And lo, Rayse was killed and Taravangium is the new Odium!! Her one goal achieved. And while we think it's all she has planned, Taravangium is much more crafty and unpredictable than Rayse ever could. Now, it's pretty damn difficult to manipulate Odium. I refuse to believe that Cultivation did not see this. She must have seen it as an opportunity to initiate was and bring about changes in Cosmere in a way Rayse/Odium never could. What do you think guys?? Possible??? 1
Lunu’anaki he/him Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Pandora's shard said: What do you think guys?? Possible??? I would say some sort of working relationship with the two shards is more than possible. Probable even. To add to your points, we know the Five Scholars actually got the idea to create Nightblood from their worldhopping experiences on Roshar from this WOB: Spoiler Boogalyhu34 Can Nightblood be considered a Splinter and does it function like a spren realmatically, are there distinct differences is what I'm asking. Brandon Sanderson Nightblood is kind of his own strange thing. He's an attempt to use one magic to replicate something in another. He's closest to a spren, but kind of like a...robot spren, for lack of better words to use. Argent When you say that Nightblood is "an attempt to use one magic to replicate something in another," do you mean life in general, or are you referring to a specific effect in a specific magic system? Brandon Sanderson There are those involved who knew that Shardblades existed before they tried the Nightblood experiment. So, Nightblood was quite literally intended to be an imitation shardblade. We also know that Endowment has pretty tight security of some kind on Nalthis, because Hoid hid easily from Harmony, but Endowment says this: Spoiler Dearest Cephandrius, I received your communication, of course. I noticed its arrival immediately, just as I noticed your many intrusions into my land. You think yourself so clever, but my eyes are not those of some petty noble, to be clouded by a false nose and some dirt on the cheeks. This quote also implies that Endowment has some sort of way of knowing who is traveling through their perpendicularity. If that's the case, Endowment probably has a heavy hand with Nalthis Worldhoppers... particularly the five returned worldhoppers whose express purpose for existing is by Endowment's will alone, the returned seem to exist to carry out tasks for Endowment in some capacity, if we are basing anything on the Lightsong PoV from Warbreaker... All this evidence points to Nightblood being a very likely outcome of a lot of intentional moves on Endowments part. That much is certain. Edited January 5, 2021 by Lunu’anaki 7
LewsTherinTelescope Posted January 6, 2021 Posted January 6, 2021 On 1/5/2021 at 4:48 AM, Lunu’anaki said: This quote also implies that Endowment has some sort of way of knowing who is traveling through their perpendicularity Nalthis apparently has customs set up that you have to go through in the Cognitive Realm, so that's probably part of it. 2
Lunu’anaki he/him Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 On 1/5/2021 at 11:10 AM, Serack said: Great post @Lunu’anaki Thank You!! 11 hours ago, LewsTherinTelescope said: Nalthis apparently has customs set up that you have to go through in the Cognitive Realm, so that's probably part of it. I remembered hearing something of that nature. That probably pokes a bit of a hole in part of my speculation, but I'd still guess that Endowment is aware of Nightbloods travel off-world, possibly even sensing their investiture within Nightblood.
Serack he/him Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 @Lunu’anaki, @LewsTherinTelescope I love when people share insightful quotes to back their insightful posts. Having built a website for Jim Butcher that is a lesser version of the Arcanum (and that i've fallen off of updating), I'm in awe of what those guys have accomplished and how it contributes to this community. 1
SerpentLord Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 It could be cultivation working through the Nalthis peoples, but what i found interesting was I believe what Vasher implies in rhythm of war is that the returned are returned to their own body out of convenience, not necessity, so in theory Nightblood COULD be a returned himself, and with the obvious use of them copying shardblades, it could be Endowments god metal as well. But this is just a fever dream I had last night, If I messed up my details or if this has already been debunked please LMK.
Frustration Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 3 minutes ago, SerpentLord said: It could be cultivation working through the Nalthis peoples, but what i found interesting was I believe what Vasher implies in rhythm of war is that the returned are returned to their own body out of convenience, not necessity, so in theory Nightblood COULD be a returned himself, and with the obvious use of them copying shardblades, it could be Endowments god metal as well. But this is just a fever dream I had last night, If I messed up my details or if this has already been debunked please LMK. Nightblood is steel, and Endowment could care less about what goes on outside of Nalthis.
SerpentLord Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 1 minute ago, Frustration said: Nightblood is steel, and Endowment could care less about what goes on outside of Nalthis. as it turns out I am indeed illiterate, thank you
Ixthos Luke/Luke Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 I think the shards are each playing their own game, but all on the same board and you can sometimes move your opponents' pawns. They likely use whatever resources are on hand, and can see which resources are likely to come into their area of influence, but can also potentially hide some things from one another. So it could be that Cultivation and Endowment both have plans for Nightblood, and both those plans coincided, or that Endowment intends for Nightblood to be in a certain area for a while and Cultivation is taking advantage of it. It could be them cooperating, but I think it is more likely each is simply selecting the futures that are more advantageous to them, and while Endowment seems to want each shard to do its own thing, she likely set Nightblood up as insurance for this, while Cultivation saw in possible futures Nightblood would be a useful tool. Whose future sight is better though is the question, and who can better leverage futuresight. Also, I like to think Endowment's "I see you!" was actually her bluffing. "I totally know when you're here! I am definitely not pretending!" 2
Leuthie Posted January 7, 2021 Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) On 1/5/2021 at 2:48 AM, Lunu’anaki said: I would say some sort of working relationship with the two shards is more than possible. Probable even. To add to your points, we know the Five Scholars actually got the idea to create Nightblood from their worldhopping experiences on Roshar from this WOB: Reveal hidden contents Boogalyhu34 Can Nightblood be considered a Splinter and does it function like a spren realmatically, are there distinct differences is what I'm asking. Brandon Sanderson Nightblood is kind of his own strange thing. He's an attempt to use one magic to replicate something in another. He's closest to a spren, but kind of like a...robot spren, for lack of better words to use. Argent When you say that Nightblood is "an attempt to use one magic to replicate something in another," do you mean life in general, or are you referring to a specific effect in a specific magic system? Brandon Sanderson There are those involved who knew that Shardblades existed before they tried the Nightblood experiment. So, Nightblood was quite literally intended to be an imitation shardblade. We also know that Endowment has pretty tight security of some kind on Nalthis, because Hoid hid easily from Harmony, but Endowment says this: Hide contents Dearest Cephandrius, I received your communication, of course. I noticed its arrival immediately, just as I noticed your many intrusions into my land. You think yourself so clever, but my eyes are not those of some petty noble, to be clouded by a false nose and some dirt on the cheeks. This quote also implies that Endowment has some sort of way of knowing who is traveling through their perpendicularity. If that's the case, Endowment probably has a heavy hand with Nalthis Worldhoppers... particularly the five returned worldhoppers whose express purpose for existing is by Endowment's will alone, the returned seem to exist to carry out tasks for Endowment in some capacity, if we are basing anything on the Lightsong PoV from Warbreaker... All this evidence points to Nightblood being a very likely outcome of a lot of intentional moves on Endowments part. That much is certain. Endowment is more focused on her thing... Quote Questioner What is Endowment’s long term plan? Like just even in general, is she just like “Keep Nalthis safe” like Sazed is or is she like, does she have a plan for... Brandon Sanderson Nooo, um... Questioner You don’t have to tell me but like, does she have a plan that involves the cosmere... Brandon Sanderson Not really. Questioner ...or is it just to stay on... Brandon Sanderson She’s more focused on her thing. Calamity Philadelphia signing (Feb. 20, 2016) I don't think Nightblood was some combined plan by Endowment and Cultivation. It doesn't seem to fit Endowments Intent or personality through the letters to Hoid or other WoB. But I can definitely see Cultivation deciding to put its use into motion with purpose. She had direct control of it at some point as Nightwatcher offered it to Dalinar. A few years later, Nale has it and gives it to Szeth, who was an indirect creation of Cultivation through her direct creation, Taravangian. Quote Also, I like to think Endowment's "I see you!" was actually her bluffing. "I totally know when you're here! I am definitely not pretending!" That's exactly how I interpret Endowment's blustering. And I'm sure Hoid took it the same way. "Sure ya do. I'll keep that in mind next time I'm there!" Edited January 7, 2021 by Leuthie 3
Lunu’anaki he/him Posted January 8, 2021 Posted January 8, 2021 10 hours ago, Leuthie said: Endowment is more focused on her thing... I don't think Nightblood was some combined plan by Endowment and Cultivation. It doesn't seem to fit Endowments Intent or personality through the letters to Hoid or other WoB. Okay, maybe Endowment is just focused on "her own thing" we don't really know what that means though. Someone else getting rid of Odium for her after their planet is "endowed" with a god killing weapon could easily aid with Endowments thing though, right? Idk, Endowments letter screams "If I need to, I could kill Rayse without lifting a finger." and it seems to me that is exactly what she did.
LewsTherinTelescope Posted January 8, 2021 Posted January 8, 2021 On 1/6/2021 at 9:58 PM, Lunu’anaki said: That probably pokes a bit of a hole in part of my speculation I don't really feel it does. In fact, I was intending me bringing it up to be in support of what you were saying, by suggesting part of the way she might be keeping an eye out, lol. 1
Lunu’anaki he/him Posted January 9, 2021 Posted January 9, 2021 (edited) 15 hours ago, LewsTherinTelescope said: I don't really feel it does. In fact, I was intending me bringing it up to be in support of what you were saying, by suggesting part of the way she might be keeping an eye out, lol. Certainly! but it also gives her a number of opportunities to keep an eye on things without being directly involved in the "oversight" which might lend weight to the idea that Nightbloods presence on Roshar was her direct doing, rather than a happy coincidence. That was my reasoning atleast. Idk. I'm definitely overthinking it at this point lol Edited January 9, 2021 by Lunu’anaki 1
LewsTherinTelescope Posted January 9, 2021 Posted January 9, 2021 5 hours ago, Lunu’anaki said: I'm definitely overthinking it at this point lol Lol, welcome to the club
StanLemon Posted January 10, 2021 Posted January 10, 2021 On 1/7/2021 at 9:10 PM, Lunu’anaki said: Idk, Endowments letter screams "If I need to, I could kill Rayse without lifting a finger." and it seems to me that is exactly what she did. I viewed that as simply supreme arrogance on her part. He managed to kill 4 Shards, 2 of them at the same time.
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