Rhythm of War Part Two Reactions

[DeployParachute]

Quote

“To Father, I’m some pristine remnant of my mother—this noble little statue who got all of her goodness and none of his coarseness. He doesn’t want me to be me, or even him. He wants me to be this imagined perfect child who was born better than he ever could be.” “And that makes you not a person,” Shallan said, nodding. “It erases your ability to make choices or mistakes. Because you’re perfect. You were born to be perfect. So you can never earn anything on your own.”

Brandon writes without the barest hint of irony of a character who by all intents and purposes can be described as "perfect". Adolin continues to do all the right things, say all the right things, inspire the right people. Still waiting for all of these passages Brandon writes about Adolin's feelings of inadequacy to actually manifest as a real failing that is consequential to the narrative. Halfway through the book though, and it's not looking good. These POVs are starting to become a slog for me. 

[scottwo]

10 hours ago, Zedseayou said:

Danlan was a Diagram member! (I think scribe that Adolin courted once

We already knew this as she was working with Graves in WoR to kill the king.

https://coppermind.net/wiki/Danlan_Morakotha#Graves.27s_Conspiracy

[Reborn radiant]

I can't be the only one who thinks these two parts are some of the best stormlight to date right (excluding the sanderlanches)?

So well paced. So well written. And excellent and interesting story arcs.

[IcaroRibeiro]

Finished it just now

The Epigraph just revealed brand new shards WTF, never expected that 

Also loving the Spren pictures, thanks Shallan for your efforts 

Really enjoyed part 2, both groups had a very pleasant storyline. Shadesmar journey was so much more enjoying than in Oathbriger 

And Pattern lying to Shallan, who would saw it coming ? Can't wait until part 4 when the truths about her past are finally uncovered 

This book so far was very dynamic and fast paced the invasion plot in part 2 was great! I'm upset Kaladin haven't tried to hide himself among common humans, but guess it's just against his nature 

Navani interactions with Sibling was awesome. I'm not sure if they will bond just yet. I have to say that so far Sibling is the only Godspren I've liked, he/she have some kind of naive way of talking that is refreshing, naive but not silly

I'm really looking forward more Venli POVs. It doesn't quite look like her book so far, she have probably the least amount of chapters and we still not getting her flashbacks yet. Hope it changes in part 3

[FollowYourMuse]

Is it just me or other than his lying, does patterns dialogue sound "off" or different? 

Edited November 17, 2020 by FollowYourMuse

[Aither of Olumpia]

I love how pattern is a plant! Not sure how that would have worked, but I cannot wait to see where shallans story goes now, betrayed by her mother, her father, and now her spren “with whom she shares a bond more intimate than a marriage”. 
let’s go dark shallan! 

Also loving Kaladin so far. I keep expecting him to say the fourth oath in a really non climactic but personal way, but the more the book progresses the less I expect it now. 
 

i was hesitant about this book having listened to a few YouTube reviews that didn’t rave about it, but honestly this has been my favourite storm light so far. 

[Kered]

Anyone else having small strokes when they read the epigraphs? 

[YmYm]

Omg omg omg might it’s here!  Wow. All I read so far is the first three interludes (already read Part 1 from Tor) Soooo cool!  Omg!  Between Oathbringer and Rhythm of War I met and married my wife and had a baby! So whereas in the past I’d demolish the whole book as fast as humanly possible, now I have a 1 month old little girl!  So I’m trying to savor each chapter I can read!  Omg. So good!!!!!!  Wow!  I can’t even read this thread so I don’t spoil myself on Part 2 but I’ll be back!

Edited November 17, 2020 by YmYm

[DeployParachute]

2 hours ago, IcaroRibeiro said:

I'm upset Kaladin haven't tried to hide himself among common humans, but guess it's just against his nature 

The great thing about this moment was: you as the reader are left with thoughts of "oh no, did he do the right thing? He just totally tanked the progress he made with his dad. Was this progress, or the manifestations of his continuing struggles, his character flaws". You're left with the feeling that this might be a problem for him, something that has the potential to have consequences.

[acatnamedkaren]

Oh wow......Invention, Whimsy, Mercy and Valor........

I had to take a break after that, actually got physically disoriented 

[Lightspine]

Somebody else might have thought of this first, but I'm not going hunting for other posts since I haven't finished the book yet.

I am really confident that the box has a Seon inside of it.

[Honorless]

Man, flashback to Way of Kings. Shallan getting haunted by the Cryptics was so intriguing! Hmm... it's constantly being hinted that Formless might be less dormant than the Three realize, and is the one working with the Ghostbloods, a frightening notion but possibly yet another red herring. Ooh Pattern was a spren scholar of humanity! Have I mentioned I want a booklet on spren culture & society yet? It does seem odd that Cryptics, the spren of mathematical truths Bond Lightweavers who're about personal truths. Truthwatcher spren, sorry, I keep forgetting we have a name now, Mistspren, who, at least from what we've seen so far, seem to be about personal truths, bond Truthwatchers who seek universal truths.

I wonder what the clouds pointing at the distant, cold sun of the Cognitive Realm might represent. Finally, how spren manifest stuff from the Physical! They take the souls of objects from the physical world, then make the object’s bead on the other side reflect its physical nature. The Physical object remains unaffected. So it is in fact the same as what we see in Secret History. I think Lightweavers and Elsecallers could probably do this too instead of just making the surrounding beads come together to mimic the shape of the chosen physical object. Actually, couldn't anyone, or possibly anyone who's Invested, do this?

Ah, yes the false information packet method. It's become rather famous, especially after Tyrion used it in Game of Thrones. I really hope it's not Ishnah, I rather liked her! I liked Vathah too though, on the other hand, I can't see him being a Ghostblood. Beryl seems too obvious. So... will we come back to Ishnah?

Wonder what the obsidian ground of Shadesmar is made of? I can't believe it's actual obsidian. (And the crystalline plants too) Hmm, does taking a chunk of the obsidian reflecting a river on the Physical affect the river in any way? "the stone here was eager to be something else and could easily be persuaded to change" hmm... something like pure Cognitive material? Beryl is very interesting, instinctive Lightweaving and skill with Soulcasting. "Then again, the way that Lightweaving worked for Truthwatchers seemed different—even if one disregarded whatever Renarin was." okay, we need to see (standard) Truthwatcher Lightweaving. Also, once again, how do the Windrunners deal with the Skybreakers that have Division?

Formless... is a he?

The hurry up and wait mentality that soldiers can get stuck in... I really like the character study thing that Rhythm of War is doing. I don't think anything's stretched out at all, like some of the reviews said, at least so far. I'm really liking this book, it might take the place of my most liked Stormlight book! I'm absolutely loving Shallan and Kaladin in this book, as much as I'm loving Navani and Venli, who's book this one's supposed to be.

Oh my, wonder where the Reachers went off to *thinks back to Venli's chapter* hehe

Hmm... using Szeth in a situation like this. I mean, we as readers know enough about Szeth to be relatively comfortable with their decision, but how could Dalinar and Navani be comfortable making this decision?

Ah, one is never too old to find themselves! Also, Navani ships again, this time Sebarial x Palona! (it totally counts as shipping, and by "again" I'm referring to Jasnah & Wit rumours. Hahaha, nah I'm just trying to annoy people who're annoyed by shipping!). Navani and Jasnah's relationship is quite interesting. A sealed-off room with the Tower's replica, which itself has this very room and miniature replica (how cute), it seems Navani comes to the same conclusion as many Sharders, that the Tower structure was malleable. The answer could simply be the Surge of Cohesion of course but the living Tower hypothesis can also be supported by this. I did suspect Navani's critic was more likely to be a spren than one of the Sleepless (minor Dawnshard spoilers)

Spoiler

Despite the Mother of Machines title that made many think that the Dysian Aimians were Navani's critics. They seemed fine in the backcover blurb and narratively it would've went against the Dawnshard plot resolution a bit, imo, to have them oppose the coalition.

Their thinking is quite al bit inhuman and they sound resentful of humans too. But most spren were fine with what Navani is doing. So, my suspicion is still on Odium's forces a bit, the timing is just too convenient. Navani seems to have come to the same conclusion.

Hmm.. Jasnah's worry makes sense. There are far too many secret societies on Roshar who probably knew of perfect gems. Some are with the spren as well in their banks.

Hah, Adolin is bringing back Maya closer and closer

Recap of what we know of spren society so far: Honorspren and Stoneward spren, sorry, Peakspren have their own cities, as do Highspren and Inkspren I think. The Peakspren apparently have different nationalities, with completely different views towards resurgence of the Knights Radiant. Cryptics only have one city iirc. Cultivationspren and Reachers seem to not have their own cities, often wander around or live in mixed spren cities, Mistspren seem to be the same imo. No idea about Ashspren but them and Peakspren do seem to live in mixed spren cities sometimes, we saw them in doing so in Celebrant, Inkspren and Highspren do that too but they're usually more reclusive. Honorspren and Cryptics are not well liked, because the former tried to conquer Shadesmar and the latter are considered weird. Honorspren don't like Highspren or Inkspren. It seems Ashspren are the angriest at humanity, actively seeking revenge. The Reachers are trying something different. Honorspren and Peakspren are divided, many are still angry but quite a few are Bonding, the rest are determined to isolate themselves from humanity, Inkspren are also isolating themselves. Cultivationspren, Cryptics and Mistspren have been trying to initiate Bonds for a while. Highspren never stopped Bonding.

Pattern is still a cutie! Mraize is still a creep! The cube is alive!

"someone ought to tell that one what a protective cup is used for on our side.…" oh no... 

A new Deadeye, from Nale and the Skybreakers' killings? It's a Cryptic... could it be Tien's?

Shallan's memories from before her mother's death! She's handled a cube like this before.

So is Beryl the spy or did Mraize see through the ploy? Ah, Veil also thinks Mraize might be feeding them wrong info and misleading them. Veil and Radiant open up to Adolin about Shallan's fear of being fake and being abandoned when people find out the truth about her! Shallan (the facet, one of the Three, not the whole person) is retreating. Formless is getting closer to the surface.

Marat or Tukar? Is Marat still occupied by Odium? Tukar is under Tezim aka Ishar's rule. Not good. How did they get into Shadesmar? Does this relate back to Dalinar and the Mink's plan to advance on the occupied Emuli front, which hinges on Tukar to also oppose Odium's forces, which is really dubious as Ishar's crazy. How did Ishar send them here, did he get back his Honorblade? No, they seem off, some other method. Uh-oh, they're following them.

Hello again, Notum. Oh, they exiled him. I agree with Adolin here, they're simply ignoring anyone who's trying to argue differently and there's a lot of words I'd have liked to have with them. They're being very stubborn and unreasonable. Many Radiants died for generations to protect all of Roshar from Odium, the Recreance too was done for the same reason. Most of it is fear, rather than hatred, imo: spren were rather unaccustomed to the concept of death applying to them, plus many seem to believe that they just linger to slowly wither away into nothing whereas rather than going into the Beyond. You can argue against the hatred: these are not the same people, they did nothing to them, why the Recreance happened, what Odium might do to them after winning but that fear, how do you argue against that? Also, I'm starting to suspect that Restares has their ear.

Another Brand of the Fused: the Deepest Ones, Stoneward parallel, these ones use Cohesion to treat stone like malleable liquid. "The Deepest Ones had smooth skin, no hair, and barely any carapace—just shells over their heads and genitals. This put their vibrant patterns on display across the full lengths of their sinuous bodies." Carapace protecting genitalia, the Parsh are really starting to remind me of the Turians from Mass Effect. Venli is fascinated by them, as she also has access to Cohesion as a Willshaper. Another Brand of the Fused: the Flowing Ones: Edgedancer parallel, use Abrasion to reduce friction to slide around, we saw them in Oathbringer. Hmm... the description of Cohesion from Raboniel: "The Surge of Axial Connection—the Surge that binds the smallest pieces of all objects to one another. The Surge that holds us together. The makay-im can meld their essence into the essences of other things, intermingling their axi. All things are mostly emptiness, though we cannot see that it is so. A stone, like a mind, exists to be filled by thought and Investiture.” sounds like Physically, they manipulate molecular bonds. If that is true then they are joining Illumination as a potentially OP ability when they gain more scientific knowledge. If they can mess with molecular bonds then they can potentially chemically alter substances and transfer energy between molecules. (quickly, someone create a topic in RoW lore & mechanics ! ) Also, Raboniel is pretty cool. She confirms that Adhesion is the missing Surge but says it's not a "true Surge" as it's only of Honor and not both Honor and Cultivation. Her views on Honor, Cultivation and Odium are reminiscent of what Odium claimed in Oathbringer: a god of the people, that he alone feels.

Kaladin's chapter "Understanding" is a small one in size, but big in heart.

Edited November 18, 2020 by Honorless

[Baryy]

Crackpot theory but i think the deadeye cryptic in the little town was Shallan's old spren who died and Pattern was the ghostblood replacement.

[Kingsdaughter613]

53 minutes ago, Honorless said:

Man, flashback to Way of Kings. Shallan getting haunted by the Cryptics was so intriguing! Hmm... it's constantly being hinted that Formless might be less dormant than the Three realize, and is the one working with the Ghostbloods, a frightening notion but possibly yet another red herring. Ooh Pattern was a spren scholar of humanity! Have I mentioned I want a booklet on spren culture & society yet? It does seem odd that Cryptics, the spren of mathematical truths Bond Lightweavers who're about personal truths. Truthwatcher spren, sorry, I keep forgetting we have a name now, Mistspren, who, at least from what we've seen so far, seem to be about personal truths, bond Truthwatchers who seek universal truths.

I wonder what the clouds pointing at the distant, cold sun of the Cognitive Realm might represent. Finally, how spren manifest stuff from the Physical! They take the souls of objects from the physical world, then make the object’s bead on the other side reflect its physical nature. The Physical object remains unaffected. So it is in fact the same as what we see in Secret History. I think Lightweavers and Elsecallers could probably do this too instead of just making the surrounding beads come together to mimic the shape of the chosen physical object. Actually, couldn't anyone, or possibly anyone who's Invested, do this?

Ah, yes the false information packet method. It's become rather famous, especially after Tyrion used it in Game of Thrones. I really hope it's not Ishnah, I rather liked her! I liked Vathah too though, on the other hand, I can't see him being a Ghostblood. Beryl seems too obvious. So... will we come back to Ishnah?

Wonder what the obsidian ground of Shadesmar is made of? I can't believe it's actual obsidian. (And the crystalline plants too) Hmm, does taking a chunk of the obsidian reflecting a river on the Physical affect the river in any way? "the stone here was eager to be something else and could easily be persuaded to change" hmm... something like pure Cognitive material? Beryl is very interesting, instinctive Lightweaving and skill with Soulcasting. "Then again, the way that Lightweaving worked for Truthwatchers seemed different—even if one disregarded whatever Renarin was." okay, we need to see (standard) Truthwatcher Lightweaving. Also, once again, how do the Windrunners deal with the Skybreakers that have Division?

Formless... is a he?

The hurry up and wait mentality that soldiers can stuck in... I really like the character study thing that Rhythm of War is doing. I don't think anything's stretched out at all, like some of the reviews said, at least so far. I'm really liking this book, it might take the place of my most liked Stormlight book! I'm absolutely loving Shallan and Kaladin in this book, as much as I'm loving Navani and Venli, who's book this one's supposed to be.

Hmm... using Szeth in a situation like this. I mean, we as readers know enough about Szeth to be relatively comfortable with their decision, but how could Dalinar and Navani be comfortable making this decision? 

Formless being male was actually on the SA game cards. Which had several spoilers hidden in them. The Nine were another.

[shadows]

6 hours ago, Baryy said:

Crackpot theory but i think the deadeye cryptic in the little town was Shallan's old spren who died and Pattern was the ghostblood replacement.

The timeline would line up right? 10 years or so?

My other thought is that Pattern's bond to Shallan was to the part of her that she locked away and as such he's fundamentally most in line with what formless wants.

--

Loved the epigraphs although sometimes I do worry I'm getting more excited about the tidbits there than the chapter contents hah

[mariapapadia]

16 hours ago, FollowYourMuse said:

Is it just me or other than his lying, does patterns dialogue sound "off" or different? 

I’ve had the same feeling and i think it was for 2 reasons: 

1. It’s odd how few interactions of Pattern & Shallan we’ve had in this book so far. It seems that their talks have been replaced with conversations between her alters & he wasn’t present for a lot of moments that broaded the subject of how she’s feeling. I don’t know if it was intentional or not but I clearly Felt a disconnect there. 
2. He uses “haha” a lot in His dialogue. It feels so stiff. At first i didn’t noticed, but the more he talked, the obvious it became. 
 

I do hope all this Pattern story is a confusion & will be explained as right now I feel it’s not only something that will break Shallan, but me as well

 

I’m incredibly surprised how well part 2 worked for me. From the previous books I expected it to be a bit of a slog, but I was invested in every character. I’m a bit worried I’ll dread the upcoming Dalinar POVs as he’s never been one I connected to a lot.

[Asrael]

This part blew me away. The stuff happening here is the stuff I was expecting to happen in Part 4. So. HOW THE HECK ARE WE GOING TO SPEND 700 MORE PAGES?!

[Honorless]

Zu, Godeke and the Stump are being well-characterized, as are their spren, same goes for Beryl. The Mink was well-characterized too, from what we saw of him in Part 1. We are not as familiar with them, as they are new. Adolin and Shallan feel the same about them and the dynamics between the characters work. Vathah and Ishnah got greater depth here too. I think the large host of new characters is being managed quite well, contrary to some reviews. All of the Three feel like real people but she/they? are beginning to acknowledge that they are all one person, a coping mechanism, especially Veil and Radiant. Kaladin's chapters are completely character-focused in Part 2 but don't feel unnecessary at all. No parts of the plot feel stretched. It's all on point. The pacing is excellent.

Only thing is it feels different from the other three books, more equally shared between different characters: it feels like it belongs to Kaladin, Shallan, Adolin, Navani and Venli. Way of Kings felt like Kaladin's book: past & present, sure he shared it with Shallan and Dalinar & Adolin but it was his. Words of Radiance opened up the can of worms that is Shallan but also felt like a continuation of Kaladin's book, with a bit of Dalinar and Adolin. Oathbringer was very much Dalinar's book but shared with Kaladin & Shallan, sprinkled with bits from the other characters. Here, no one person dominates. And that fits with the theme too, because of course it does.

It's hilarious how loftily Shallan, Adolin and Navani think of Jasnah. Wow, the Starspren look absolutely gorgeous on the Cognitive side... but not as gorgeous as Adolin *wink* . Gallant is best horse. Adolin is best boy. Maya is best girl. Why are the Tukari fanatics attacking... Honorspren? Adolin can be terrifying, just like his father. Excuse me, what the-? Pattern is the spy? Please tell me Formless is the spy, that would be more comforting at this point! No, Pattern can't be the spy! I think Pattern was just going along with Shallan there. Pattern knows Shallan, he was there when Re-Shephir tried to separate them, he offered to let Shallan kill him so she could Bond a different Cryptic! What if it's one of the Edgedancers? Godeke's beliefs sounded very close to Adonalsium.

Ah, challenging the honor of the Honorspren, I did see this one coming as the opening move.

I have to say, this is Navani's second experience in nation-building. She's just as worthy, if not more, of being a Bondsmith as Dalinar.

Urithiru's tunnels are protected by... Ralkalest. The Fused call aluminium Ralkalest? Did they learn of it from the Selish? The Sibling sleeps, as reported by the Midnight Mother (whom I look forward to seeing again!). The Sibling's protection still affects the Masked Ones' illusions at least. I don't think the Sibling is quite a Deadeye but even if they were, after seeing Maya... 

Hesina is quite multi-talented, I must say. Lirin is appreciating his son's pioneering into mental illnesses. Kaladin realizes doctors need to be able to read, without upsetting social mores, and he might just be able to bring that change too. Revolutionize medicine entirely. Kaladin also realizes and acknowledges that he himself is also getting better.

Navani's critic was taking advantage of Dabbid, that's just wrong. Wait, is Raboniel Soulcasting type Fused then after all? A spear turned to dust upon touching her. Hmm we need to see red eyes of Radiants to compare them to the red eyes of the Fused and Singers with Voidspren in their gemhearts. Wait, Red who's a Lightweaver now, his eyes are now violet instead of red... garnets, the Lightweavers' associated gemstone, do come in many colours

Raboniel successfully reached the pillar of a thousand gemstones at the heart of Urithiru and began Corrupting it. The Sibling would not just be of Honor and Cultivation anymore, but of also Odium. The Sibling's own light: white-red-green tried to resist but violet light still entered eventually into the garnets. Lots of rubies (for conjoined fabrials) and garnets in this book. The Tower's suppression effect was turned against the Radiants, making them collapse. Navani's critic was the Sibling all along... not dead, not asleep. The Radiants who're still conscious can apparently still take in Stormlight but not use the Surges. Adhesion still works. It affects the spren too, making them fade a bit. Kaladin and Syl fought through it due to how similar it felt to the darkness in their own mind. It affects spanreed too somehow. The invasion now begins.

Did the weird Voidlight sphere explode? Or were they attacked by the Fused?

Veins of garnet along the strata of Urithiru allowed communication with the Sibling. Spren-Radiant distance limit has shrunken with the spren starting to fade sooner. Stormlight isn't healing at full capacity, spren can't assume Shardblade forms (or change forms between spren and blade in general perhaps). Kaladin seems to think there's a mental aspect to the suppression, and yeah, I think he's right. The last time too, with Moash, it seemed similar emotions overwhelmed Kaladin.

Huh, I bet Lift wouldn't be affected by the suppression effect! Maybe Renarin too! But they are oft forgotten. Hmm... more meritocratic promotions in the Alethi army. Haha, can't call a Darkeyes "Brightlord", they're not Lighteyes. The Soulcasters aren't working either but that was expected. I imagine the Darkeyed battalionlord is not gonna survive this but he's cool, there will be a price to pay in men's lives if they want to retake the pillar room. Hmm... crisis is when social mores are forgotten, the masculine and feminine arts and eye colour caste might come back again in peacetime though. Momentum is very important, so I agree with the decision, barricading themselves wouldn't work with the Fused powers and who knows what the other Fused would do to them if they surrender, not all are as honorable as the Heavenly Ones?

"You were supposed to think I was dead. Everyone was supposed to think I was dead ..... No, the voice said. I really was asleep. Until … a Bondsmith. I felt a Bondsmith. But the tower is not functional, and I have not the Light to restart it."
A Bondsmith! Is he referring to Dalinar? Or...

The Sibling chose to go dormant? Light... Syl said Urithiru was filled with a strange Light. It glows differently in the Cognitive and in the crystal pillar. It's own Light? Cultivationlight?  
"You know too much, the Sibling said. It makes me uncomfortable. You know and do things that weren’t possible before ..... What you do is dangerous and evil, the Sibling said. Those ancient Radiants gave up their oaths because they worried they had too much power—and you have gone far beyond them.

Hmm... I'm starting to wonder about the Sibling's role in the Recreance.

The Sibling is afraid of Raboniel! She did invade Urithiru before. And she had also apparently unleashed a deadly plague with little regard for consequences to even the Singers. The Sibling confirms that those more Invested like Radiants with higher Ideals, like the Unmade in the past, could get past it's defenses. He calls Adhesion "Honor's truest Surge, the Surge of Binding and Oaths" and confirms it might still work. What would be the Surge closest to Cultivation? Progression? Would that Surge still work? Or is it perhaps Transformation? "Long ago, before I banished men from these halls, my last Bondsmith made me something. A method of protecting me from the dangers I saw in men. He thought it would help me trust again. It did not" so Melishi was Sibling Bondsmith confirmed. He was the last Bondsmith, during the False Desolation, when the Sibling was withdrawing from humanity. Later confirmed by name, "Melishi I have hated you, but now I bless you" when Melishi's fail-safe protected the Sibling from Raboniel.

Lezian the Pursuer wants to kill Kaladin while he's weakened but as we saw before, Kaladin can still fight. Raboniel has been granted her own Rhythm... What are the Rhythms? In Sja-Anat's interlude, she mentioned the pure notes of Roshar, of the Rhythms of the three Shards. The Everstorm also has a Rhythm. She wants to... take over the Coalition's Artifabrians. Kaladin is still protecting those who cannot protect themselves, whether he fights or not. Kaladin was also himself a slave and as a Darkeyes never owned Parshmen. He never benefitted from the system but it's an entire people's anger. Heh, people are taking the chance to steal some spheres, of course they are, lol. Hah! Lightning rods and water to counter Regals in Stormform!

Hmm... a topaz, is it going to mimic one of the Stonewards Surges, Cohesion perhaps? We need a table on which gemstones are used in which manner within fabrials. "An infused gemstone touched to an uninfused one could be made to lend some of its Stormlight—assuming they were the same variety, and the uninfused gemstone was much larger than the infused ones. It worked a little like a pressure differential. A large empty vessel would take Stormlight from small full vessels." Heh, you tell em Navani! Keeping trade secrets at a time like this! So the Thaylens make the gemstones vibrate at a certain frequency using a tuning fork (Rhythms again?) to bypass the gem size limitation in transferring Stormlight. Hmm... it looks similar to a Radiant sucking in Stormlight? Do Radiants have a Rhythm too? Is that why specific Orders were associated with specific gemstones. (minor Dawnshard spoilers)

Spoiler

The Lopen did mention Stormlight from different gemstones tasted different to him.

Ah, Vyre, that answers the question of who's operating the Oathgates.

Poor Rlain, a part of both worlds but belonging to neither. Other Listeners did survive, Rlain! Hah, a Listener remembers what the Fused seem to have forgotten, Odium came with humans and attacked the Singers first before humanity turned to Honor and Singers to Odium. Syl is falling to depression too...

Sapphire and glass sphere (quartz aka smokestone? Hmm.. probably not, gemstones are encased in glass spheres to be used as currency after all, so this one is probably... neutral) and cage of unknown metal, what was this failsafe fabrial? The Sibling confirms that it's the colour of gemstones that matter, though we already knew from WoBs. Ah, they also just confirmed that the Unmade were other spren before they were Corrupted, though Sja-Anat's comment of "we were made, then Unmade" already hinted at it back in OB. Hmm... Raboniel needs to fill certain types of gemstones with Voidlight in a certain pattern. Where did she learn of this?

Heh, I called it, the Darkeyed battalionlord was gonna die here. He and his men fought tenaciously and skillfully in a suicidal charge. They'd have made truly worthy Stonewards.

I do not like the Sibling, he's as callous as the Stormfather was.

Ah, the Stormlight is countering the Voidlight. So the Stormfather distributes Stormlight / Honor's Light, the Nightwatcher must produce Cultivationlight and the Sibling produces their own Light, Sibling's Light: a mix of Honor and Cultivation. Raboniel is a treasure trove of information! She thinks the Sibling is still asleep. Ah, Melishi's failsafe created a solid Stormlight barrier, the Corruption could still continue if they reached the sapphire that Navani infused with Stormlight but breaking the gemstone apparently takes care of that, just weakening the shield. Navani now surrenders. I don't think Dalinar and Jasnah would be able to come to their aid, I think Navani would have to somehow reverse the effects on the Radiants, and come to theirs.

Oh hello again Ulim. Curious to see if you Bond and grant Voidbinding! Raboniel is eager to meet Navani. It's unsettling how often dead soldiers are younger than I am now. Hmm I think this section was well-handled. The philosophical weight of lives. Balancing honoring sacrifices, acknowledging the existence of national pride at said sacrifices and not glorifying war.

This section reminded me of Goradel in the original Mistborn trilogy, and the execution lines & Karata in Elantris.

Navani compares the Fused and the Alethi in war.

Raboniel tempts Navani with just the right words.

Lirin once again compares living under Lighteyes and the Singers and says it makes little difference. He's got a point but without fabrials, Urithiru isn't going to stay habitable for long. Without Urithiru and the Oathgates, the Coalition is not going to last. It'll be a divide and conquer. How is Kaladin still conscious? Willpower? He's still not a Fourth Ideal Radiant. Since he isn't unconscious, the Singers won't be able to identify him as a Radiant unless Lezian or Leshwi or Vyre see him. Kaladin is starting to see Lirin's point and not happy about it. He's been helping, healing, doing good and it felt good to do so but he also wants to fight for what he believes in. Lirin is just as stubborn as Kaladin. Hmm... Teft is much less insensate than the other Radiants like the Stonewards and Edgedancers. One of the Windrunners' Surges is working so Kaladin is starting to wonder about that. All the Stonewards, Lightweavers, Edgedancers, presumably Dustbringers and the few Truthwatchers were all knocked out. Oh, almost forgot to notice, the Stonewards (predictably) also have Squires. Kaladin can't help but be the big, damn hero! So many of the poor Singers were drafted into this war with no other options. This scene hammered it home better than the Kholins' talk of unblooded Singers & Regals, just as well as Venli's talk of Fused propaganda which worked because everyone is familiar with that irl, and this one worked because of how personal this scene was. Heh, Lirin could be a Windrunner or Edgedancer too, always trying to save everyone, even those who try to hurt him. Kaladin thinks how killing a Fused just means they'll take over a new body. Lirin can do triage but can he prioritize? Is it just his integrity for swearing an oath as a healer or is healing is his sanctuary... curious, what's Lirin and Hesina's past? Did he just call his own son a monster?! Does he not see? Screw this guy!

 

This book is beautiful so far. I was expecting a book of consequences, a mix of an after-the-war and prelude to another war, of rising tensions and race to have the most resources. And it is all that but it is also a full on war book. I really don't see what the mixed reviews suggested I would see.

And everything is moving so fast! Things I was expecting to see in Part 5, things I was expecting to see in Book 5, things I was expecting to see in the back 5 books and things I was expecting to see in the next Mistborn era are all already right here! 

My only complaint is that, at least so far, Rhythm of War feels as much a Listener's book as Words of Radiance or Oathbringer. It still works, especially working with the foundations that those books set but it doesn't feel as weighty in their focus character yet. Hopefully that would change soon, as we haven't even had a flashback chapter yet. And that changes in Part 3.

Edited November 21, 2020 by Honorless

[supersmith]

Ok three things stood out to me. 
“Surgebinding savant” got mentioned. I doubt Shallan knows what one of those is or if it’s even possible but I think it was a nice little tickle for us.

Nomon was referred to as “honors moon” by Venli. This is more support for the honors perpendicularity theory that was floating around awhile ago. 
 

And finally, Lift doesn’t actually use stormlight. Very interesting and we probably could have guessed that, but it’s whatever. So that makes me think that they will have too infuse stormlight and (growthlight?) cultivation’s light into the sibling 

[Menderbug]

I made a bunch of notes throughout this part. I'm afraid some of it will repeat what others have already noted, but I'll try to clean it up a bit for the most noteworthy things. Overall though, wow what a part. It really feels like I've already read more than a full novel's worth of story, and we're only two parts in.

Shadesmar map

- "Something weird here, will report in person", what a tease!
- Judging by later chapters, the thing in the top left is a starspren and then thing below Nohadon's Stairway is a gloryspren.

Chapter 20

- Epigraph from Harmony to Hoid!
- "the final truth"... Confirmation that Shallan is already at the fourth ideal?
- lol @ all the cryptics being called Pattern
- what's that nausea Shallan is feeling? Is that just Veil taking over?
- hmm, what's that cell phone Mraize gave her? Apparently off-world technology. Possibly Southern Scadrian via Iyatil? [Someone else suggested a Seon, that seems kinda likely especially with the recent WoBs on them being unique and Mraize saying how valuable this is.]

Chapter 21

- Adolin is a gem
- Does Shallan not know about Wit's cryptic? Apparently Pattern does?
- Huh, Nalthian coins. What's the engraving on those again?
- I suspect that Mraize's agent is a fourth persona of Shallan, but Beryl replacing Stargyle certainly plays into the idea of Mraize making sure his agent comes along
- What's the loss Adolin is dealing with? Still the fact that he learned about Evi? The worsening relationship with Dalinar? Not being Radiant? Elhokar?
- Ah, finally a hint why all the dead blades are these massive swords instead of other shapes and types of weapons. Because that's their most showy form!
- Spren speaking several languages... Might be a Connection thing?

Chapter 22

- Sibling is parent of oathgate spren. They call them dead.
- Ryshadium have a similar after-image effect to what Lift sees when she looks at Szeth
- Godeke's deformity? Did I miss something?
- More evidence that Shallan is the spy, though it's interesting that her fourth persona isn't careful enough here. Unless she's trying to tip herself off?

Chapter 23

- The coughing illness is probably the off-world common cold that has plagued the Purelake before?
- Oh wow, Phendorana is Teft's spren?

Chapter 24

- Whooooooop a new Shard! Invention! Is this the one that's hiding/not on a specific world if they're hard to locate?
- Nale and Kelek were at the binding of BAM

Chapter 25

- Hooooly storm, Brandon dropping the Shards left and right. Whimsy, Mercy, Valor. Valor is female.
- "Giving up on one to save two others?" This is definitely what the fourth ideal will be about
- Nice, Kaladin shifting his focus to treat mental illness!

Chapter 26

- "feel something, below in the ocean"... Huh. Like a big spren? Or a bead representing Roshar?
- How does Soulcasting in the cognitive realm work. Where is the bead representing its soul?
- Pretty strong hints that Shallan is not her "true" persona
- Formless is "he"?!

Chapter 27

- Huh, Mercy was involved in the clash between Odium and Ambition?
- Lightweaving, unsurprisingly, doesn't stick to aluminium
- Hmmm that model of Urithiru is interesting. My first thought was that it's the "other half" shrunk down, but that doesn't really check out with the model containing itself. Also sci-fi sliding doors!

Chapter 28

- "standard violet ink", I had no clue. What's it made from?
- I initially assumed the person at the other end of the spanreed was Sja-anat, but now my money is either on the Sibling, or an honorspren.

Chapter 29

- Adolin and Maya performing a kata together <3
- "a tall willowy spren of a type he didn't recognise" ... Don't think it can be a type of Radiant spren since those are accounted for? But it seems to be of the intelligent/sapient/humanoid variety?
- Hmmm a recent deadeyes. Lots of possibilities here. Could just be a random unknown lightweaver breaking their oath. Could be Wit's? But then Pattern wouldn't be so interested in him. Maybe Shallan had an earlier spren and broke her oaths, which is why she has to say the truths again?

Chapter 30

- I feel like it's still more likely that Shallan has been played by herself than the super obvious seeming Beryl being the actual spy.
- Weird Tukari humans. I guess Ishar could've brought them into Shadesmar, but what's with them being shrouded in shadows?

Chapter 31

- Honor's Moon. Have we heard it called that before? Wonder if the others are Cultivation and Odium, or Cultivation and both/Sibling
- huh, Adhesion is of Honor alone?
- furry creatures? Actual mink maybe?

Chapter 34

- Shadesmar description of joyspren (a cyclone of colour, which is pretty cool, because in the physical realm they are fluttering leaves)
- Spren horse sounds really cool. Can't wait for fan art or a Shallan sketch of that.
- "not all spren were imagined by men". Not sure if he's saying the horse spren were imagined by Ryshadium or the weird spren were imagined by whatever
- unnamed spren: tiny, shadows of swirling smoke with large eyes

Chapter 36

- Huh, Pattern as the spy? Somehow I genuinely didn't consider that. I suppose it's possible. But could he have killed Ialai?

Chapter 37

- Fused use "ralkalest" for aluminium, which means it's probably not an originally Selish word
- I'm sure Teft's headache is significant somehow

Chapter 39

- Yeeep, it's the Sibling talking to Navani. Actually also further indication that she might bond them eventually. I hope Raboniel didn't do permanent damage to them.
- Ah, Adhesion still working because it's of Honor?

Chapter 42

- First time someone talks about Cultivationlight (or whatever it's called)... but it seems to be somehow less important because later on she explicitly (and only) mentions Stormlight and Voidlight again?
 

Final thought: I wonder whether Kaladin didn't go unconscious because he's getting close to the fourth ideal? What else could it be? Something related to the weird "Child of Tanavast" thing? Is there anything else that would make him more heavily infused than Teft?

[Knight of Iron]

On 11/17/2020 at 1:33 AM, Parallax said:

Is there anyone else beside Wax? It also makes sense given what Sazed put him through. 

This book takes place before Sazed puts Wax through anything.

[WhiteLeeopard]

I've gotten as fed up with Kaladin in this book so far as I was on the previous one with Shallan. At this point if a Fused killed him at least I wouldn't have to read him again complaining about doing nothing while doing nothing. At first I was shipping Leswhi and Kaladin, at this point I want him to evolve or die. Unfortunately I fully expect crying 

I'm a bit annoyed about how incredibly predictable in a bad way everyone is been so far. Shallan shattering apart and allowing herself to be played by the Ghostbloods like a fiddle. Kaladin moaning. T crying while continuing his plans. Venli wringing her hands while continuing as she always has been as a good little pawn. 

Pattern...yeah, really nasty surprise there. 

The only pleasant surprise in this book of a character so far rising above my expectations is Navani. I was ready to give her a lot of love after reading the prologue. But not only has she gone past her pain of her past choices but she is evolving like crazy and becoming a true Queen! Before she was a queen as that was her job, but in this book she is becoming a Queen. And Navani was always a character that didn't run either hot or cold for me, she simply existed. 

Btw, good thing they took Gavinor away! Poor child doesn't need to experience this rust again.

Edit: The Ghostbloods are so mind-numbingly stupid that they make me wish Odium would win so the poor dears could realize their plans are worth rust if their gold mine is taken over an evil controlling god, because they are so busy thinking of their future corporate profits that they keep tripping the defenders of roshar just to feel important. 

Edited November 18, 2020 by WhiteLeeopard

[StormingTexan]

Just finished part two and went ahead and read the next interludes because I was not sure where those are spoiler free. Wow more Shard names! Did not expect that! I really liked the pacing of part two. Felt like we had just enough POV switches between the two plots even though one was kinda a cliffhanger.  So much stuff to unpack but thought it was really cool to get more details on the Sibling and Cultivation's investiture. Always knew there was a third but this just confirmed it was separate and unique and part of what actually powers Urithiru/Sibling. Looks bad for the home team right now. 

Edit: One small observation. This is the first SA book I cannot tell who's book it is this far in. I did cheat and look at the character list for part 3 and see this may change soon but it is not obvious at all like it has been in previous books. Of course those have all been people that are still alive..

 

 

5 hours ago, Mender said:

Final thought: I wonder whether Kaladin didn't go unconscious because he's getting close to the fourth ideal? What else could it be? Something related to the weird "Child of Tanavast" thing? Is there anything else that would make him more heavily infused than Teft?

Yes my initial thought because he is close to the 4th ideal. There was a lot discussion about this at the meeting of the 9 deal and the reason they wanted Dalinar and Jasnah out of the way. It is interesting though since he hasn't actually sworn it you would think it wouldn't count so maybe it is the "Child of Tanavast" thing. 

Spoiler for interludes AFTER part two. 

Spoiler

Lift is also conscious and can also use one of her surges like Kal could and we all know there is weird things going on there so maybe a connection?  

 

Edited November 18, 2020 by StormingTexan

[+Oltux72]

On 17.11.2020 at 10:44 AM, Zedseayou said:

• 29. A Cage Without Bars
  • How would Jasnah know the expected distribution of gemstone quality??

She gives a few gems to artisans and has them turned into spheres. Then she has the results measured.

On 17.11.2020 at 10:44 AM, Zedseayou said:

• 30. The Betrayal
  • Goddamnit, Beryl is the spy? Not sure that feels very satisfying.. it just seems too obvious. I'm still expecting a double-fake somehow.
  • It's still unclear what happened at the Recreance. Notum does not seem to make a promising case for the envoy
• 31. Daughter of Traitors
  • Hoid is hoping to maintain Odium's prison? That is a more specific goal than I think we have explicitly known before

I see a clash coming in the second arc. Would Jasnah really sacrifice Roshar to keep Odium captive?

 

[Kingsdaughter613]

20 hours ago, Knight of Iron said:

This book takes place before Sazed puts Wax through anything.

This book takes place around the time Wax and Lessie meet.