What if the Lord Ruler had weilded Nightblood?

[Mat he/him]

The title. Would he be able to, or any other Mistborn/Full Feruchemist? What would happen if he did? How destructive would that get and how incredibly awesome would that be?  

[Frustration he/him]

Let me guess era 4.

[Halyo_Alex he/him]

Well, you can feed Nightblood by burning metal or tapping a metalmind, you won't receive the effect but Nightblood won't devour your soul, so... That's good.

[Dancer]

with the amount of Investiture TLR can generate he would probably be able to wild Nightblood and still use his powers like Szeth does. 

[Karger he/him]

Nightblood would eventually kill him but in the meantime he would be one of the most destructive entities in cosmere history.

[Mat he/him]

27 minutes ago, Karger said:

Nightblood would eventually kill him but in the meantime he would be one of the most destructive entities in cosmere history.

Yes! That's what I was hoping for!  

[+robardin he/him]

23 hours ago, Karger said:

Nightblood would eventually kill him but in the meantime he would be one of the most destructive entities in cosmere history.

Does Nightblood actually increase in power the longer you wield it, or is it simply that TLR could wield Nightblood the longest of anyone we've seen due to his Compounding in sixteen different metals?

Actually, would TLR be powerful enough to Push and Pull on Nightblood, with sufficient Compounding? Because then he could "wield" Nightblood as a flying sword at a distance. That is truly terrifying. Brandon's emphasized multiple times in WoBs that Nightblood is the single most difficult thing to Steelpush in the Cosmere, but also never said it was flat out impossible - and if anybody could do it at all, surely it'd be Rashek.

Related thought experiment: let's say he decided it wasn't worth the cost, what would be the most efficient way for him to prepare to use Nightblood personally (by hand) for a long time? What's the lightest Allomantic metal... Tin? That's also one of the slowest burning Allomantic metals, so it's perfect. He could fill a giant tinmind as full as possible with Compounding, powder the tinmind, and then swallow the saturated tinmind dust just before drawing Nightblood - burning it as slowly as possible (but at a 10x release of the Feruchemical attribute) to fuel the Blade.

And now you have a wielder of Nightblood who can fly with Steelpushes, and run around with sonic boom levels of speed with nigh infinite F-steel.

[Mat he/him]

47 minutes ago, robardin said:

Does Nightblood actually increase in power the longer you wield it, or is it simply that TLR could wield Nightblood the longest of anyone we've seen due to his Compounding in sixteen different metals?

Actually, would TLR be powerful enough to Push and Pull on Nightblood, with sufficient Compounding? Because then he could "wield" Nightblood as a flying sword at a distance. That is truly terrifying. Brandon's emphasized multiple times in WoBs that Nightblood is the single most difficult thing to Steelpush in the Cosmere, but also never said it was flat out impossible - and if anybody could do it at all, surely it'd be Rashek.

Related thought experiment: let's say he decided it wasn't worth the cost, what would be the most efficient way for him to prepare to use Nightblood personally (by hand) for a long time? What's the lightest Allomantic metal... Tin? That's also one of the slowest burning Allomantic metals, so it's perfect. He could fill a giant tinmind as full as possible with Compounding, powder the tinmind, and then swallow the saturated tinmind dust just before drawing Nightblood - burning it as slowly as possible (but at a 10x release of the Feruchemical attribute) to fuel the Blade.

And now you have a wielder of Nightblood who can fly with Steelpushes, and run around with sonic boom levels of speed with nigh infinite F-steel.

WOAH yeah. Someone should ask this at a signing...

[Karger he/him]

2 hours ago, robardin said:

Does Nightblood actually increase in power the longer you wield it, or is it simply that TLR could wield Nightblood the longest of anyone we've seen due to his Compounding in sixteen different metals?

He increases.

Quote

Just another guyn

If a Shard were to wield Nightblood more directly, like Odium's champion and Odium channeling his power through Nightblood, would we see a lot of world ending stuff from that?

Brandon Sanderson

That-- What you just described would work no differently from a Knight Radiant wielding Nightblood

Just another guyn

Okay. And that would be scary powerful?

Brandon Sanderson

No. No, they'd feed off the Investiture and eventually would either run out or be drawing it so quickly that it would dissolve the person's soul.

Just another guyn

So souls are made of Investiture?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, in the cosmere, souls are. So you'd have a little while, but eventually the person would just die and get eaten.

BYU Writing Class Wrap-up 2017 (April 25, 2017)

 

2 hours ago, robardin said:

Actually, would TLR be powerful enough to Push and Pull on Nightblood, with sufficient Compounding? Because then he could "wield" Nightblood as a flying sword at a distance

Maybe.  I personally doubt it. 

[+robardin he/him]

35 minutes ago, Karger said:

He increases.

 

Maybe.  I personally doubt it. 

Well we do see from Vasher's POV of wielding Nightblood in Warbreaker that it was eating his stockpile of Breath faster and faster the longer he wielded it. But was Nightblood also getting more powerful as a result, or is Nightblood's strength simply a matter of all the Investiture already sucked into it? I guess that's kind of the same thing, in the end.

As for whether or not Rashek could Push/Pull on Nightblood directly - how about simply putting Nightblood in a fisted steel gauntlet? And if Nightblood would simply destroy any non-aluminum encasing touching it... How about steel-wrapped aluminum around the grip?

[Karger he/him]

1 hour ago, robardin said:

As for whether or not Rashek could Push/Pull on Nightblood directly - how about simply putting Nightblood in a fisted steel gauntlet? And if Nightblood would simply destroy any non-aluminum encasing touching it... How about steel-wrapped aluminum around the grip?

That seems workable.  Although given f speed a bit unnecessary. 

[+robardin he/him]

6 hours ago, Karger said:

That seems workable.  Although given f speed a bit unnecessary. 

The point would be that he wouldn't need to expend ever increasing amounts of Investiture to remote control Nightblood. Heck, give Wax a medallion or spike for A-iron to add to his A-steel and he could do it, too.

[Halyo_Alex he/him]

38 minutes ago, robardin said:

give Wax a medallion or spike for A-iron to add to his A-steel and he could do it, too.

Or an F-Steel. That'd work too.

[Karger he/him]

1 hour ago, robardin said:

The point would be that he wouldn't need to expend ever increasing amounts of Investiture to remote control Nightblood. Heck, give Wax a medallion or spike for A-iron to add to his A-steel and he could do it, too.

That would not work.  Nightblood requires investiture to be used. 

[+robardin he/him]

17 hours ago, Karger said:

That would not work.  Nightblood requires investiture to be used. 

Really? Where is this explained or mentioned? Because I would think the "severing on all Three Realms" bit would be a property of the Blade, not a facet of its use driven by Investiture (NB certainly has absorbed plenty already). I would imagine an unbonded (deadspren) Shardblade left lying around exposed and blade side up, like after its previously bonded bearer died, would still be a threat to anyone's limb (at least) who might accidentally fall upon it, even without it being wielded by a living person?

[Karger he/him]

3 minutes ago, robardin said:

Where is this explained or mentioned?

I guess it is just supposition but why would he absorb investiture that he does not need?  It is not part of his intent.

[+robardin he/him]

29 minutes ago, Karger said:

I guess it is just supposition but why would he absorb investiture that he does not need?  It is not part of his intent.

I think it's just an aspect of how NB functions, and of course its Identity as a Blade. There is a double-edged blade, and a hilt with a crossguard and a pommel. Anything that makes contact with the blade is severed on Three Realms; anything gripping it by the hilt has Investiture drained out of it.

For example, in Warbreaker when Vasher was wielding Nightblood and cast it aside just before it could drain him completely:

Quote

Gasping, he threw the sword aside and fell to his knees. It skidded, tearing a rip in the floor that puffed away into smoke, but hit a wall with a pling and fell still. Smoke rose from the blade.

While "skidding" from being thrown clear from Vasher, the unwielded naked blade still puffed parts of the floor into smoke. So I assume it hit the wall hilt-first, and balanced on the floor by the point and crossguard?

What's not shown is how Vasher manages to get Nightblood back into the sheath without picking it up again. After defeating Denth with his little Breath-donating trick, we next see Nightblood back in the sheath when he goes to free Vivenna. Maybe he brought the sheath over to where Nightblood was against the wall, and kind of wiggled it on?

Edited June 19, 2020 by robardin

[Karger he/him]

1 minute ago, robardin said:

I think it's just an aspect of how NB functions, and of course its Identity as a Blade. There is a double-edged blade, and a hilt with a crossguard and a pommel. Anything that makes contact with the blade is severed on Three Realms; anything gripping it by the hilt has Investiture drained out of it.

Right but why would it bother draining if it did not need to?  Also considering Vasher knows about this why would he not get some kind of aluminum glove that lets him use the blade safely?

[+robardin he/him]

12 minutes ago, Karger said:

Right but why would it bother draining if it did not need to?  Also considering Vasher knows about this why would he not get some kind of aluminum glove that lets him use the blade safely?

An interesting question about why hasn't Vasher invested in making an aluminum glove or gauntlet. Probably because walking around all the time with an unsheathed Nightblood is a terrifying experience for all involved?

I did a bit of WoB-digging (normally your bailiwick :)), and there is definitely something about Nightblood being wielded by hand and draining Investiture from its wielder versus simply doing whatever it does as a physical property.

...when [Nightblood] is fully consuming Investiture he can do some really freaky things, and Nightblood requires constant input of Investiture in order to realize his full destructive potential. So yes, NB does have a "poofing" effect even when not wielded that goes beyond an ordinary Rosharan Shardblade's "severing on all three Realms" bit; but, when he's feeding off of a wielder's Investiture is when he goes fully into Beast Mode.

And what would happen if Nightblood was blocked by a Shardblade (or vice versa) is still a RAFO as of right now.

And, if an aluminum lined steel gauntlet would allow a Mistborn or Wax-with-his-winching-claw-gadget to swing around an unsheathed Nightblood at a distance, that still seems pretty scary. (I guess it'd better be an aluminum chain on Wax's winching gadget, too, to avoid accidentally cutting Nightblood free!)

Edited June 19, 2020 by robardin

[Mat he/him]

I didn’t expect this to generate this much conversation 

[Karger he/him]

1 hour ago, Matrim's Dice said:

I didn’t expect this to generate this much conversation 

I refuse to apologies.  This is an intriguing discussion.

2 hours ago, robardin said:

An interesting question about why hasn't Vasher invested in making an aluminum glove or gauntlet. Probably because walking around all the time with an unsheathed Nightblood is a terrifying experience for all involved?

He still should.  It would allow him a kind of cheat mode when necessary(like in his fighting Denth situation).

2 hours ago, robardin said:

...when [Nightblood] is fully consuming Investiture he can do some really freaky things, and Nightblood requires constant input of Investiture in order to realize his full destructive potential. So yes, NB does have a "poofing" effect even when not wielded that goes beyond an ordinary Rosharan Shardblade's "severing on all three Realms" bit; but, when he's feeding off of a wielder's Investiture is when he goes fully into Beast Mode.

Maybe he acts a lot more like a normal shardblade when not being fed?  He withers bodies but does not completely destroy them.

[Mat he/him]

1 minute ago, Karger said:

I refuse to apologies.  This is an intriguing discussion.

No need, I agree.

Might want some boots, though 

[Comatose he/him]

I'm assuming that the Lord Ruler, compounding nicrosilminds filled with investiture, could probably last quite a while wielding nightblood with proper preparation.  

[+robardin he/him]

17 hours ago, Karger said:

Maybe he acts a lot more like a normal shardblade when not being fed?  He withers bodies but does not completely destroy them.

Well NB still poofed a section of the floor when cast aside, unless that was a residual effect from having recently been held (he was thrown by hand, after all). And maybe that explains why no further parts of the floor or wall got "puffed away" and he just rested quietly, if unsheathed, in the corner. 

[Karger he/him]

10 hours ago, robardin said:

Well NB still poofed a section of the floor when cast aside, unless that was a residual effect from having recently been held (he was thrown by hand, after all). And maybe that explains why no further parts of the floor or wall got "puffed away" and he just rested quietly, if unsheathed, in the corner. 

That is what I assume.