Coppermind internet

[ShardEye]

Is it possible for there to be a coppermind internet in Mistborn era 3. If you had a network of copper pipes which are unkeyed and so can be used by anyone regardless of whether or not they're feruchemists, surely you could use it like an internet. You could have instantaneous uploads and downloads and anyone could add to it. 

[Honorless he/him]

58 minutes ago, ShardEye said:

Is it possible for there to be a coppermind internet in Mistborn era 3. If you had a network of copper pipes which are unkeyed and so can be used by anyone regardless of whether or not they're feruchemists, surely you could use it like an internet. You could have instantaneous uploads and downloads and anyone could add to it. 

Such a repository of knowledge does seem possible as well as narratively probable.

I'm going to say yes.

 

It'll probably be a bit more complicated setup though 

Edited November 1, 2019 by Honorless

[EddyJ he/him]

This would be interesting, since with every "download," the data would become slightly more corrupted as the memories fade.

[GoWibble he/him]

As Brandon would say,

Not instantaneous, but you are on the right track

[Karger he/him]

I theorized about something similar on another page a few months ago.  Someone else pointed out that the Oathbringer reacher ship had a bunch of copper wire the the crew touched to communicate.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Karger

[Honorless he/him]

13 minutes ago, Karger said:

I theorized about something similar on another page a few months ago.  Someone else pointed out that the Oathbringer reacher ship had a bunch of copper wire the the crew touched to communicate.

Roshar being a "nexus" seems to be working out for the inhabitants of its Cognitive Realm then.

They also learnt of BioChromatic Awakening of Type IV from Vivenna in OB

[Lunu’anaki he/him]

9 hours ago, Honorless said:

 

They also learnt of BioChromatic Awakening of Type IV from Vivenna in OB

Well, she promised them that but who knows how much she gave away. Command phrases might not have been part of the deal and with that much breath involved the commands make all the difference.

[Friendshipspren he/him]

13 hours ago, ShardEye said:

Is it possible for there to be a coppermind internet in Mistborn era 3. If you had a network of copper pipes which are unkeyed and so can be used by anyone regardless of whether or not they're feruchemists, surely you could use it like an internet. You could have instantaneous uploads and downloads and anyone could add to it. 

I don't think anyone can access it tho. You still need to have terris blood to tap an unkeyed metalmind. 

VanDell specifically says so.

Quote

“Create an unkeyed metalmind?” Marasi asked. “One that another Feruchemist could access?”

“Possibly,” VenDell said. “Or is there another possibility? Most people living right now have at least some Feruchemist blood in them. Could it be that such a metalmind as I describe, one that is keyed to no single individual, might be usable by anyone?”
 

So it seems you must have terris blood to access the Coppernet.

It might become harder as the Terris elders continue to condense the bloodlines and reverse the diaspora. 

It would be impossible for ppl I other planets.

Southern Scadrial , hmm , idk. Depends on whether they are trying to condense the feruchemist bloodlines too.

Edited November 2, 2019 by PrinceGenocide
A little polishing

[Aon Tia she/her]

2 minutes ago, PrinceGenocide said:

I don't think anyone can access it tho. You still need to have terris blood to tap an unkeyed metalmind.

Is it? I don’t think so. I think anyone can tap into an unkeyed coppermind..

[Lunu’anaki he/him]

5 minutes ago, PrinceGenocide said:

I don't think anyone can access it tho. You still need to have terris blood to tap an unkeyed metalmind.

So it seems you must have terris blood to access the Coppernet.

It might become harder as the Terris elders continue to condense the bloodlines. Impossible for other planets.

True but add a little Nicrosil in the mix and its suddenly usable by literally anyone.

2 minutes ago, The traveller said:

Is it? I don’t think so. I think anyone can tap into an unkeyed coppermind..

If it's just copper and has the identity removed then it is unkeyed and only usable by another ferochemist with the ability. If it's mixed with Nicrosil in some unknown way like the souther scadrians coins then it is considered "unsealed" and it is usable by anyone.

Edited November 2, 2019 by Lunu’anaki

[Friendshipspren he/him]

1 minute ago, The traveller said:

Is it? I don’t think so. I think anyone can tap into an unkeyed coppermind..

I don't see why VanDell would specifically mention the dilution of terris bloodline in the general population then 

[Aon Tia she/her]

Let us check.. because I am not very clear on era 2 stuff anyway.. 

I might need to read it a third time! And pay more attention to all this stuff and not the action parts!!

[Lunu’anaki he/him]

3 minutes ago, The traveller said:

Let us check.. because I am not very clear on era 2 stuff anyway.. 

I might need to read it a third time! And pay more attention to all this stuff and not the action parts!!

Haha Heres a quote from coppermind on the subject:

Quote

Special Metalminds[edit]

Unkeyed Metalminds[edit]

An unkeyed metalmind is a special kind of metalmind that anyone with the relevant Feruchemical ability can access. They are created through manipulation of Identity, such as through aluminum Feruchemy. Whereas a conventional metalmind is keyed to the Identity of the Feruchemist who created it, unkeyed metalminds are not attuned to any specific individual's Identity.^[11] Due to the nature of Intention in the cosmere, an individual must be aware of an unkeyed metalmind's nature before they can use it.^[21]

Unsealed Metalminds[edit]

An unsealed metalmind is a special kind of metalmind that anyone can access.^{[22][fn 2]} The exact method of their creation is unknown, but it involves nicrosil Feruchemy and something referred to as an Excisor. Unsealed metalminds are formed of nicrosil and one or more other metals. The nicrosil grants the user the ability to use the other metals.^[23] Unsealed metalminds see widespread use among the Southern Peoples of Scadrial, but perhaps the most famous example are the fabled Bands of Mourning.^[11][24]

 

Edited November 2, 2019 by Lunu’anaki

[Friendshipspren he/him]

5 minutes ago, Lunu’anaki said:

True but add a little Nicrosil in the mix and its suddenly usable by literally anyone.

If it's just copper and has the identity removed then it is unkeyed and only usable by another ferochemist with the ability. If it's mixed with Nicrosil in some unknown way like the souther scadrians coins then it is considered "unsealed" and it is usable by anyone.

Well I'm not sure. Maybe that works but wouldn't you require terris blood to tap the nicrosil too ?

I mean it too is a feruchemival metalmind after all 

[Aon Tia she/her]

Thank you @Lunu’anaki you saved me some time. 
so they are accessible to everyone as long as they know they can..

@PrinceGenocide you are forgetting that Marasi rapped the bands of mourning even though she had no Terris blood. Also the medallions work on all southerners because they are unkeyed irrespective of their blood..

Edited November 2, 2019 by The traveller

[Lunu’anaki he/him]

4 minutes ago, PrinceGenocide said:

Well I'm not sure. Maybe that works but wouldn't you require terris blood to tap the nicrosil too ?

I mean it too is a feruchemival metalmind after all 

It's not clear how they are made in Bands of Mourning. It's been awhile since I read it last as well. But any person, even someone with no metalic arts can access the unsealed ones.

If I'm not mistaken they were taught to create the Unsealed metalminds by "the sovereign". Either that or he gave them a stockpile of them.

 

4 minutes ago, The traveller said:

Thank you @Lunu’anaki you saved me some time. 
so they are accessible to everyone as long as they know they can..

Anytime 

Edited November 2, 2019 by Lunu’anaki

[Friendshipspren he/him]

3 minutes ago, Lunu’anaki said:

Haha Heres a quote from coppermind on the subject:

 

Hmmm ok but Brandon hasn't really specified it. 

VanDell assumed anyone can use it since  terris blood is widely disseminated. 

His definition of anyone more specifically meant anyone with an ounce of feruchemical blood.

He didn't say anyone with or without Terris blood could use it.

I like this. It limits the OPing the medallions provide to the Terris again. And I have my theories that the Terris elders are actually racist and evil , which is supported by this .

Unless I see a WoB saying otherwise , I have my doubts. 

 

[Lunu’anaki he/him]

1 minute ago, PrinceGenocide said:

Hmmm ok but Brandon hasn't really specified it. 

VanDell assumed anyone can use it since  terris blood is widely disseminated. 

His definition of anyone more specifically meant anyone with an ounce of feruchemical blood.

He didn't say anyone with or without Terris blood could use it.

I like this. It limits the OPing the medallions provide to the Terris again. And I have my theories that the Terris elders are actually racist and evil , which is supported by this .

Unless I see a WoB saying otherwise , I have my doubts. 

 

Well, thats definitely possible, but it would mean that all the southern scadrians have terris blood as well, otherwise they wouldnt be able to use them.

Also, I just looked up how they are made "The Sovereign" gave them devices called "excisors" to make the medallions. https://coppermind.net/wiki/Excisor

[Aon Tia she/her]

10 minutes ago, The traveller said:

you are forgetting that Marasi rapped the bands of mourning even though she had no Terris blood. Also the medallions work on all southerners because they are unkeyed irrespective of their blood..

Edited 6 minutes ago by The traveller

@PrinceGenocide so your argument is that Marasi might also have some terris blood? Well I guess it is hard to argue on that..

[Friendshipspren he/him]

53 minutes ago, The traveller said:

 

@PrinceGenocide you are forgetting that Marasi rapped the bands of mourning even though she had no Terris blood. Also the medallions work on all southerners because they are unkeyed irrespective of their blood..

I'm pretty sure marasi has terris blood. VanDell says that most of elendel population has some Terris blood. I assume that applies to the nobility too.

As for the southern Scadrians , I'm pretty  sure all of them have terris blood.

Tlr didn't persecute the terris in the south. 

I'm assuming feruchemists or atleast terrismen existed in the south as well , they were put there by tlr .

It would make sense , he needed a untampered sample population and he wouldn't neglect his own race.

Also remember Sazed saying in TFE , that before the first Ascension , Feruchemists were more common than Lerasium bloodline mistings in the final empire.

So I guess there were lots of feruchemy genes .

Also unlike Allomancy , feruchemy doesn't lose potency through generations , it can keep on spreading forever. It simply splinters into ferrings .

 

 

For a thousand yrs they interbred with the general populace and now everyone in the south has some terris blood. Anyone without would have died out during the ice death.

Due to the genetic dilation ferrings , most notably the firemothers and firefathers became the norm along with a much smaller number  of non-lerasium based mistings.

I guess they interbred too much and full feruchemy became impossible to manifest.

 

Edited November 2, 2019 by PrinceGenocide
A little polishing

[Halyo_Alex he/him]

May I weigh in with my take on the way a Medallion is accessible by anybody?

The secret ingredient is Hemalurgy.

Step 1: Have Nicrosil and Aluminum Feruchemy. (any method)

Step 2: Spike someone's feruchemy out of them. (optional: have them also store their Identity while spiking them to get an 'unkeyed spike', but this may be a moot point later)

Step 3: Store your Identity and then store the Spike's fragment of spiritweb inside the Nicrosil of the medallion. This is the key difference between a normal Soulbearer Ferring and a Medallion. This Nicrosil doesn't just contain "ability to tap x metal", it contains an unkeyed fragment of spiritweb which was used as a hemalurgic charge.

Step 4: Fill the other metal of the Medallion while storing Identity, if needed. (e.g. not copper or iron, probably)

And done! One functional Medallion useable by anyone, due to the stored Spiritweb wanting to "Latch on" due to being an unkeyed hemalurgic charge, temporarily binding to whoever attempts to use it.

[Friendshipspren he/him]

3 minutes ago, Halyo_Alex said:

May I weigh in with my take on the way a Medallion is accessible by anybody?

The secret ingredient is Hemalurgy.

Step 1: Have Nicrosil and Aluminum Feruchemy. (any method)

Step 2: Spike someone's feruchemy out of them. (optional: have them also store their Identity while spiking them to get an 'unkeyed spike', but this may be a moot point later)

Step 3: Store your Identity and then store the Spike's fragment of spiritweb inside the Nicrosil of the medallion. This is the key difference between a normal Soulbearer Ferring and a Medallion. This Nicrosil doesn't just contain "ability to tap x metal", it contains an unkeyed fragment of spiritweb which was used as a hemalurgic charge.

Step 4: Fill the other metal of the Medallion while storing Identity, if needed. (e.g. not copper or iron, probably)

And done! One functional Medallion useable by anyone, due to the stored Spiritweb wanting to "Latch on" due to being an unkeyed hemalurgic charge, temporarily binding to whoever attempts to use it.

That's possible but doesn't take into account hemalurgic decay. 

[Halyo_Alex he/him]

2 minutes ago, PrinceGenocide said:

That's possible but doesn't take into account hemalurgic decay. 

Well the charge is stored inside the Nicrosil using Feruchemy. Feruchemical charges don't decay (see: copper, for a big example). At the very least it could be GREATLY slowed, but might be altogether preserved due to how Feruchemy is the mixed magic of Ruin and Preservation together.

[Friendshipspren he/him]

29 minutes ago, Halyo_Alex said:

Well the charge is stored inside the Nicrosil using Feruchemy. Feruchemical charges don't decay (see: copper, for a big example). At the very least it could be GREATLY slowed, but might be altogether preserved due to how Feruchemy is the mixed magic of Ruin and Preservation together.

Ah ok. Yeah that makes sense. But I wonder if that will really work. I mean , hemalurgy works by splicing ur spiritweb. Can u splice ur spiritweb just by tapping ?

Also if u can , does that u are immune from external influence and control ?

Hoid would love that.

[Friendshipspren he/him]

U know @Halyo_Alex. Ur theory is sound. But I wish it not be true.

The medallion tech and bands makes it too easy to access the metallic arts. U could even access other magic systems equally. 

Limiting it to the Terrismen seems like a good limit. Otherwise it's just overpowered beyond belief.

Or atleast that's what I think. 

Sanderson could have different , better ideas. Let's see