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Ash and the Oathpact


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4 minutes ago, Truthwatcher_17.5 said:

I would bet on hours.  Certainly not days, but I find it highly unlikely it was minutes.

IIRC the prelude described a pretty small area where everything was going down.

Taln was already dead by the time Kalak walked up. So she had already technically left him the moment she decided to not go back. 

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4 minutes ago, Pathfinder said:

Taln was already dead by the time Kalak walked up. So she had already technically left him the moment she decided to not go back. 

But I think that’s what the question is? How long did it take for her decide not to go back? I was suggesting that it was hours at most.

Edited by Truthwatcher_17.5
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They left Taln behind (they knew how/where he had died) and they were prepared to leave Kalak behind if it turned out he had died too. As for time scale, I could see days, but not weeks in case he was an Oathgate hop away. Either way, I suspect it didn't take much convincing of Ash any more than it did of Kalak.

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29 minutes ago, Toaster Retribution said:

So, I wonder how much time the Heralds had to spend to make sure that Ash was with them on abandoning the Oathpact. After all, it meant that she left the man she loved to eternal torture. 

It seems that a large group of them including Jez and Ishar were in on the discussion.  We only know that Kelek and Taln himself were not.  Also I am not sure we have confirmation on a romantic relationship between Ash and Taln(if we do some one point it out to me) although I agree that they probably had one.

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14 hours ago, Truthwatcher_17.5 said:

I think that deep down all of them were so broken they went along with it pretty quick. I don’t have evidence, just a hunch. She definitely regretted it though with all her destruction of the heralds religious stuff.

It's worth noting that she doesnt destroy all heraldic religious stuff, she is specifically destroying images of herself and usually leaves the rest intact.    That could be a giult thing, but Ive seen decent theories that it is specific to her madness.  The idea is that all the herald's madness is an inversion of their associated Attributes, and she was the Herald of Beauty, known for Creativity and Honesty, who is now sneaking around destroying all records of her own appearance.  

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1 hour ago, Quantus said:

It's worth noting that she doesnt destroy all heraldic religious stuff, she is specifically destroying images of herself and usually leaves the rest intact.    That could be a giult thing, but Ive seen decent theories that it is specific to her madness.  The idea is that all the herald's madness is an inversion of their associated Attributes, and she was the Herald of Beauty, known for Creativity and Honesty, who is now sneaking around destroying all records of her own appearance.  

I was always under the impression it was guilt based because she didn't feel the Heralds, specifically herself, should be revered so much, and her insanity manifested in her destroying her likeness to remove one way that people revered her, so thanks for mentioning other options! 

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From what the Stormfather says in Oathbringer, it seems like the Heralds didn't really have much choice. They were being progressively destroyed, and the times between Desolations were shortening dramatically - less than a year gap the last time. If they hadn't done something different, Rosharan humanity probably wouldn't have survived the next decade.

Their only other option would have been to try something totally out-of-the-box, like evacuating everybody off Roshar through the Perpendicularities.


Which makes me wonder why Honor didn't do something, he was fully alive then and surely was aware of what was happening.

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