Saffron Iguana Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 I guess this means for the first time, there will be a lot of lynch discussion before 6 hours before rollover.
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, Mauve Crocodile said: Honor, Survival?, Monk, Bondsmith, Unmade It was an honest question. I haven't looked much into Shardic roles, though with the extended cycle, I will do some research.
Onyx Flamingo Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 7 minutes ago, Ivory Dragonfly said: Would you have voted for Iguana had the coin come up the other way, or did you change your flip to Axolotl vs. Chameleon? 38 minutes ago, Indigo Weasel said: It was an Axolotl vs. Saffron coin flip. Maybe I have to redo the flip for an Axolotl vs. Chameleon?
Saffron Iguana Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 xD the turn is extended and all of a sudden everyone leaves. I assume because we just realized we cant have a lynch discussion for another ~21 hours
Mint Heron Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 20 minutes ago, Indigo Weasel said: No, because during the last day cycle, Odium invested in someone, so it would pass to them. "Oh? You're misinformed. According to the rules, if a Shard fails to invest in a player during the most current Day Cycle. It passes to a random faction member." @A Joe in the Bush what happens if a Vessel is the last member of a faction? Where does the Shard go? "In any event, Axolotl has the power to decide where the Shard goes. If he invests in anyone, it goes to that player on event of his death. It's a hell of an incentive. 'Vote for Chameleon and I give you a Voidbringer.' And if he dies, that Voidbringer becomes much more powerful. Or hell, he might even be offering the Shard up at this point. And of course, everyone wants Odium's power, although few would admit it." NoReh studied the room for a moment. "So, we have a choice. We can lynch Hoid, and unleash Odium to a faction of his choice. Now I don't know about you, but I'm not sure my faction would receive that gift. So, let's consider the alternative. We spare Violet Axolotl, and lynch someone else instead, like Pearl Chameleon. So, what do we gain by this? Simple." He smiled coldly. "We stop Odium. I don't honestly believe that Violet would give up his only bargaining chip. If he does, he's very likely to get lynched for his trouble. Attacking anyone with Odium will likely bring that faction's wrath down upon him, especially if the shattered Shard is stolen. Odium's only use to Hoid is as a bargaining chip, that cannot be used. So let's keep it that way. Odium will remain tucked away in a neutral party, unable to kill anyone and anything." With that, NoReh put his arms behind his head. "It's your call."
Pearl Chameleon Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 Where the Shard ends up would largely depend on order of actions. If Axolotl has Odium, this would be their first opportunity to invest (if I skimmed the rules correctly). If the lynch takes place before investment, then it's a toss up. Have the GMs confirmed that it wouldn't go to a member of the faction who stole Odium if the holder were to die, or back to the original faction/invested person? At this point, part of my reasoning for wanting to lynch Axolotl was because no one seemed to be aligned with them. That alone would suggest some kind of neutral alignment. However, there have been several people coming out of the woodworks to protect Axolotl. That knowledge isn't enough to change my vote, but it makes me wonder why so many people are eager to save them. What kind of role or agreements do they have that make them useful, as Mouse said? For those voting on me, I ask one question. Why? I was one of five people who had a vote on Axolotl when the first vote was placed on me. If it's because you're aligned with Ax, I accept that. You're trying to save a friend. But if you aren't, what's the reasoning?
Violet Axolotl Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 I’m glad I have friends in this game. I don’t play without backups and safeguard.
Chartreuse Penguin Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) The only reason we killed Vulture is because we thought they were Autonomy. That was all. Other than that, I'm not aware of any time my faction used Odium to kill anyone. We aren't bloodthirsty at all, although we did have the option of choosing the "let's murder all the shards" win condition. We came to the conclusion that wouldn't be as fun, and chose a more benign win condition. Edited January 28, 2019 by Chartreuse Penguin
Quartz Zebra Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 Every faction or player voting on Chameleon, I presume, is currently relying on the idea that they will receive Odium, or other Shards, from Axolotl when today is over and he remains unlynched. But that still does not change the fact that Axolotl has 1) consistently lied that he didn’t steal Odium, didn’t have a Shard-stealing role, didn’t have a secret ability, and wasn’t Hoid. In various places he’s claimed all of these things, and all of them are lies. Why are these factions which are supposedly going to be granted great power trusting a repeated liar? And why isn’t anybody doing something to make them pay the price for lying? 2) stolen the most deadly Shard in the game, and is essentially making everyone dance to his tune for a chance at it. It’s true, as Heron mentioned, that he currently has little reason to use it, but that doesn’t change the fact that he stole an entire Shard from a foreign faction. Regardless of how you spin it, that indicates malicious intent, and Axolotl’s hatred for Hidden Garden seems entirely tied to that faction’s former possession of Odium. There are clearly multiple factions helping Axolotl out, but he can only give Odium to one of you, and he serves no other purpose; otherwise he’s essentially a neutral thief, and Hoid to boot, whose win conditions have never helped anybody else. Besides, I don’t want Odium safely tucked away for the rest of the game. Less kill Shards might make your faction breathe a little easier at night, but all it does is further empower foreign factions that already have one, delay the natural progress of the game, and take a fun variable out of play; at any rate, I wouldn’t trust Axolotl to simply keep the Shards locked away forever.
Magenta Albatross Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Quartz Zebra said: 1) consistently lied that he didn’t steal Odium, didn’t have a Shard-stealing role, didn’t have a secret ability, and wasn’t Hoid. In various places he’s claimed all of these things, and all of them are lies. Why are these factions which are supposedly going to be granted great power trusting a repeated liar? And why isn’t anybody doing something to make them pay the price for lying? Where has axolotl claimed that he stole Odium (or was hoid, or had a shard-stealing role)? that's basically the big clinching point for me. if someone could tell me why people think he did that, apart from him maybe having a secret role, I'll happily join to lynch axolotl, but so far I've only seen people claim this as if its a self-evident fact, and I don't see it. Edited January 28, 2019 by Magenta Albatross
Quartz Zebra Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) He has apparently claimed it himself, as Dragonfly, who looks to have allied with Axolotl to gain Odium (as evidenced by their vote), let that slip. And so has Heron, looking back at things. So by the admission of two people who are presumably allied with Axolotl, he definitely has Odium. Edited January 28, 2019 by Quartz Zebra Added a thing
Magenta Albatross Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Quartz Zebra said: He has apparently claimed it himself, as Dragonfly, who looks to have allied with Axolotl to gain Odium (as evidenced by their vote), let that slip. And so has Heron, looking back at things. So by the admission of two people who are presumably allied with Axolotl, he definitely has Odium. Dragonfly just seems to be running with the assumption everyone is making, but Heron actually seems to know more. Does anyone know where Meerkat was when he died, and where axolotl currently is? Apparently Ruin attacked Axolotl, so that leaves either a Dakhor monk or Odium as Meerkat's killer, and I happen to be fairly certain Dominion was on Silverlight for the past two nights (assuming Weasel's clam of having been redirected during the previous day can be believed). Edited January 28, 2019 by Magenta Albatross clarity on the first sentence.
Violet Axolotl Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 1. SE is full of lies, were I even to be lying. 2. Maybe I don’t hold Odium and there’s another reason they’re choosing to ally with me. Factionmates maybe? I don’t see why multiple factions would continue to ally with hoid in your scenario because they’d know that they weren’t the only faction promised Odium and so wouldn’t support that.
Fuchsia Ostrich Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Violet Axolotl said: 1. SE is full of lies, were I even to be lying. 2. Maybe I don’t hold Odium and there’s another reason they’re choosing to ally with me. Factionmates maybe? I don’t see why multiple factions would continue to ally with hoid in your scenario because they’d know that they weren’t the only faction promised Odium and so wouldn’t support that. 1. That doesn't mean lying can't be frowned upon. 2. Maybe the factions are all hoping the other factions think like that and so no one's leaving. Withdrawing support guarantees a lack of odium. Maintaining support enables a chance at odium. or at the very least, escaping your crosshairs, if you do indeed possess Odium. I don't know whom to vote for, because I'd like to see Ax dead, if only for confirmation. But, I think they'd be more forthcoming with info and stuff if they were alive rather than dead (in PMs if not in the thread). I'd agree with Zebra about Axolotl's lies, especially regarding the "Hoid" secret role and such (if it is even called that). That combined with the sudden support Axolotl seems to have this turn in the lynch is rather telling of a bargaining chip (which may or may not be Odium. Funny how things seem to be fitting, eh?) That's all I think? Edited January 28, 2019 by Fuchsia Ostrich Slight rephrase.
Violet Axolotl Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 12 minutes ago, Fuchsia Ostrich said: 1. That doesn't mean lying can't be frowned upon. 2. Maybe the factions are all hoping the other factions think like that and so no one's leaving. Withdrawing support guarantees a lack of odium. Maintaining support enables a chance at odium. or at the very least, escaping your crosshairs, if you do indeed possess Odium. I don't know whom to vote for, because I'd like to see Ax dead, if only for confirmation. But, I think they'd be more forthcoming with info and stuff if they were alive rather than dead (in PMs if not in the thread). I'd agree with Zebra about Axolotl's lies, especially regarding the "Hoid" secret role and such (if it is even called that). That combined with the sudden support Axolotl seems to have this turn in the lynch is rather telling of a bargaining chip (which may or may not be Odium. Funny how things seem to be fitting, eh?) That's all I think? 1. Fair enough. But it is a requirement to the game. Intrinsically you have to. Also, I’m not sure when faction wars became so much of an inquisition rather than an actual faction war. 2. Also a valid point. I’ll say though that there is no Odium as a bargaining chip. That is in no way the reason I have support. Last cycle, did I jot also have support? That would’ve been before anyone but Lion had Odium Also, you’re right concerning PMs.
Fuchsia Ostrich Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, Violet Axolotl said: 1. Fair enough. But it is a requirement to the game. Intrinsically you have to. Also, I’m not sure when faction wars became so much of an inquisition rather than an actual faction war. 2. Also a valid point. I’ll say though that there is no Odium as a bargaining chip. That is in no way the reason I have support. Last cycle, did I jot also have support? That would’ve been before anyone but Lion had Odium Also, you’re right concerning PMs. 1. It is still a faction war, I think. There'd be far more votes on you if this were a typical elim vs village game, I think. The "inquisition" as you put it, is simply a convenient reason to vote for you, I think. Especially considering certain faction relationships that I suspect. 2. Then what is your bargaining chip? You needn't have the same chip twice though. I'm right? Well, that'd be a first.
Violet Axolotl Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 11 minutes ago, Fuchsia Ostrich said: 1. It is still a faction war, I think. There'd be far more votes on you if this were a typical elim vs village game, I think. The "inquisition" as you put it, is simply a convenient reason to vote for you, I think. Especially considering certain faction relationships that I suspect. 2. Then what is your bargaining chip? You needn't have the same chip twice though. I'm right? Well, that'd be a first. Just in general, this game has been a lot more Inquisition-y than normal, votes for me aside. You needn’t worry about any bargaining chip. The simplest answer is most often the correct one, I have faction mates.
Emerald Falcon Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 I'm a little lost, but my sources tell me that you tried to kill me, Axolotl. I don't appreciate the effort...
Melon Dingo Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 16 minutes ago, Emerald Falcon said: I'm a little lost, but my sources tell me that you tried to kill me, Axolotl. I don't appreciate the effort... If that’s true, and with what other people have said Axolotl
Taupe Gecko Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 1 hour ago, Emerald Falcon said: I'm a little lost, but my sources tell me that you tried to kill me, Axolotl. I don't appreciate the effort... Wait, then who killed Salmon? I am confused.
Indigo Weasel Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 Probably a Voidbringer/Dakhor Monk/Mistborn.
Violet Axolotl Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 2 hours ago, Emerald Falcon said: I'm a little lost, but my sources tell me that you tried to kill me, Axolotl. I don't appreciate the effort... Um I didn’t? I have literally no way to kill anyone. 40 minutes ago, Indigo Weasel said: Probably a Voidbringer/Dakhor Monk/Mistborn. I take that as implicit confirmation that Ruin attacked me?
Indigo Weasel Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 Yeah, sorry about that. We attacked you because we got word that you stole Odium, and we wanted to get it back to hidden garden before you had a chance to invest in someone and make it pass to them instead. Now there's not as much of a reason to kill you anymore. A shardstealer is still scary though.
Jo and the Bush all/any Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 13 hours ago, Mint Heron said: @A Joe in the Bush what happens if a Vessel is the last member of a faction? Where does the Shard go? It would go to anyone who previously held the shard. If all players who have held a shard, shared an alignment with a shard, or been targeted in anyway by the shard are dead, then the shard would be given to a random faction.
Violet Axolotl Posted January 28, 2019 Posted January 28, 2019 2 minutes ago, Indigo Weasel said: Yeah, sorry about that. We attacked you because we got word that you stole Odium, and we wanted to get it back to hidden garden before you had a chance to invest in someone and make it pass to them instead. Now there's not as much of a reason to kill you anymore. A shardstealer is still scary though. Understandable. Not appreciated, but understood. Like I’ve said, I didn’t steal Odium.
Recommended Posts